Copyright enforcement - A new approach

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mikedpe

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I have tried many things, my images have the words "copying is theft" emblazoned across them a number of times at a level that still makes the image viewable. Just covered the BE event in Bovington and within a couple of hours a rider pm's me that another rider has a complete album of images stolen from the gallery. What I find strange is that all the riders that comment say things like awesome, great picture but nobody says "have you stolen those?"

So the idea that a rider has supported me gave birth to the following idea which I posted on my Facebook page

Thank you to all those riders that are supporting me. I have chased down a number of stolen images, some have been removed and some have been purchased. I have made the decision to start passing on profits received from these recovered images to the Air Ambulance, something that is great to know that it is there for all of us involved in equestrianism in Dorset.
So if you know of others who are not doing the right thing for the Dorset Equestrian Community please let me know.
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The fund for the Air Ambulance currently stands at £30 and as other riders point me towards other miscreants I hope to grow the fund.

Mike
 
I must say I hate seeing copyrighted photos on Facebook but have recently adopted a policy where I refuse to comment or like a photo if it has been stolen - perhaps this is something that others could follow. Perhaps we could start a Facebook campaign where those concerned by copyright theft could share a status - something along the lines of "I enjoy seeing everyone's photos on Facebook, but I hate to see watermarked photos that have been stolen from photographer's websites. If you like a photo please buy it and support our professional photographers. I am now adopting a policy of not commenting on or liking any stolen photographs. If you support this stance, please like and share."

I'm sure someone can word it more eloquently than me! I'm afraid I'm too much of a coward to actually accuse someone of theft though! And I think your idea about donations of reclaimed profits to the Air Ambulance is a good one!
 
From experience the reason people don't comment is because of the barrage of abuse they get for doing so! Nice idea though, hope it works for you and the Air Ambulance.
 
6 dealt with since my first posting on this last week, 3 have removed and 3 coughed up - 4 of those reported by fellow riders which shows me the majority of riders do not like this anymore than we photographers do.

Mike
 
I now comment with simply a link to a copyright article I wrote for another website. I've even taken to doing so on random ads in groups as I can't believe people have the audacity to advertise their horse with a photo they haven't purchased!!

I will also often tag the relevant photographer in the ad!

It's a great idea Mike and I do hope it gets more riders to report images and in turn educate riders and make some money for the air ambulance :)
 
Hmm, a FB 'friend' has just done this with their sons Bicton pics, they were done by Jayphotos I think. I would like to say something but know I would come across as a miserable ol' cow.
 
Mike welcome to the long hard road of rider re-education. All efforts applauded, like the approach. Good luck with your enforcement efforts. Love the idea of a Facebook campaign TGM, will mull on that when walking the hounds shortly :-)
 
jrp204 said:
Hmm, a FB 'friend' has just done this with their sons Bicton pics, they were done by Jayphotos I think. I would like to say something but know I would come across as a miserable ol' cow.
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If you wish to pm me details I will happily pass on to Carol.

Mike
 
Name and shame?

I had a photograph stolen by someone for use on a web page many years ago. When asked to take it down, I was given two fingers. I found out who his web presence provider was through whois. A German firm. So I phoned them up and told them about the problem. Whois gave several names and telephone numbers. The girl who answered my call said not to call Mr X as he was the managing director, so of course I did! The picture was removed after I had emailed a photo copy of the negative strip -- which tells how long ago that was! I suspect part of a high definition print might also do. A very satisfying outcome and my power was confirmed! Wish I had been there to see the web site owner's face when he saw the picture had disappeared! Copyright theft is simply theft and should not be tolerated.
 
Great idea, and a worthy cause. I've got a bunch of heavily watermarked photos that were sent gratis for online use when I purchased prints. I never challenge people who use watermarked images as I don't know if they are stolen or were given in the same way my watermarked photos were.


I have been quite surprised though, to go onto a forum and see one of my personal unwatermarked photos posted there, which someone on my FB friends list has taken without permission from a restricted album. I didn't call her on it though, I just internalised my anger and let it fester in a healthy way :biggrin3: Guess I need to start watermarking my personal happy snaps!
 
I joined the forum only after being told that one of my watermarked photos was on here with the poster asking if anyone could remove the watermark for her. She then went on to tell me, when I joined and queried it, that it was ok as the photographer had told her she could :(
 
Nugget La Poneh said:
Out of curiosity - is sharing a picture from the source acceptable?

Just because sometimes I see pictures I'd love to share, but always feel cheeky!
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It really depends on the permission granted by the photographer, whilst many do just take as they want and there are rules for more academic sharing in general the answer is no where you can not find it stated as OK.

Mike
 
If genuine attempts have been made to find the copyright holder and they can't be found, I think it is alright to publish/use the picture BUT, if the owner turns up, the user must be prepared to pay a fee. If the copyright owner took the user to court, I think it is fair to say that is what they would be awarded anyway. The National Union of Journalists publishes acceptable rates which could be taken as a fair guide. But if someone stick up two fingers, so far as I am concerned, that is a red rag to a bull and it is open season!
 
I've messaged a few people who have used my watermarked photographs to advertise their horse. I've had apologies and a couple have bought their images. I refuse to get stressed when if they liked it that much, they would buy it and at least it has my name all over it if they are sharing my watermarked version.
 
So far on this campaign I have been told "oh I did not realise" - sorry but the message in big letters saying "copying is theft" is something you do not understand?

Then we have the "well I was going to buy them" - well why didn't you? and the "they did not do it deliberately" - what they ended up on their facebook page without them doing anything?

Of course the classics "I didn't have any more money" - strangely neither do I because people are stealing images instead of buying them and lastly the "I am not the only one or others do it" - so you know its wrong but if more people do it then it is OK?

To think that this is a problem linked to young riders as some do is totally wrong, one of these comments came from the owner of an equestrian centre. Wonder if I should just turn up and take a horse whenever I want?

Mike
 
I do sometimes share the watermarked versions - but only of the ones I have purchased and ordered!! The 5 days wait on photos then loses the immediacy, and I'm not paying double to get a jpeg as well for quick use on social media, so I do share the watermarked ones. I do sometimes also link to the page with photos on if I haven't purchased those shots.

When I was younger I'd have albums full of watermarked photos - but on growing up I've realised that this, along with illegal music downloads etc is just stealing and now I'd only do it for images I've purchased and am waiting on.

In a way, once I've bought the images, the watermarked versions are advertising the photographer when a scanned copy of a photo/purchase jpeg wouldn't be.
 
khalswitz said:
I do sometimes share the watermarked versions - but only of the ones I have purchased and ordered!! The 5 days wait on photos then loses the immediacy, and I'm not paying double to get a jpeg as well for quick use on social media, so I do share the watermarked ones. I do sometimes also link to the page with photos on if I haven't purchased those shots.

When I was younger I'd have albums full of watermarked photos - but on growing up I've realised that this, along with illegal music downloads etc is just stealing and now I'd only do it for images I've purchased and am waiting on.

In a way, once I've bought the images, the watermarked versions are advertising the photographer when a scanned copy of a photo/purchase jpeg wouldn't be.
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Sorry but that is just wrong, you are not advertising the photographer, you are stealing from them - ordering prints in no way gives you permission to copy anything else and is as much an infringement of copyright as just taking them when not paid for.

You have however given me an idea.

Mike
 
mikedpe said:
Sorry but that is just wrong, you are not advertising the photographer, you are stealing from them - ordering prints in no way gives you permission to copy anything else and is as much an infringement of copyright as just taking them when not paid for.

You have however given me an idea.

Mike
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Personally, I wish the option of 'buy a print, get a very low res jpeg for Facebook for an extra £1/2' was an option, as I'd do that. The social media aspect is what motivates me to even buy the prints.

I really hope my regular photographer doesn't feel as offended as yourself by my sharing, as I respect him a lot and don't want to upset him. I will refrain from doing so again - although I will still link to the website to show images on social media as there is no other viable option.

Also you can;t just say I;ve given you an idea and not tell what it is!!
 
I do wish more photographers sold low-res images for social media use, with a watermark in the corner saying 'purchased from X Photographer'- several times we'd willing pay £2/3 per image straight off the camera so we could have a set of photos to share. In the interest of honesty, I do still screenshot images because I want a reminder of the whole day, but don't upload them to any social media- they're there for me to look at when the tog takes them down.

The upshot of not being able to buy many photos due to the lack of digital copies is I have a reasonable camera and take the photos myself.
 
Unless it's a teenager I always think it makes you look a bit ***** to have a copy right emblazoned image, unless of course you are posting it whilst you wait for the real image to be delivered!
 
Until photographers figure out that people want to be able to buy LO-RES images suitable for social media use, for prices of £2-£3 per photo, this problem will continue.

There are a few photographers that do - there are huge amounts that don't. Photographers that offer this service, I will always buy 3 or 4 images in lo-res. If they don't, I don't buy anything.

Its easy to point the finger, but if people are 'stealing' images, then try and work out WHY rather than getting righteous and angry!
 
khalswitz said:
When I was younger I'd have albums full of watermarked photos - but on growing up I've realised that this, along with illegal music downloads etc is just stealing and now I'd only do it for images I've purchased and am waiting on.

In a way, once I've bought the images, the watermarked versions are advertising the photographer when a scanned copy of a photo/purchase jpeg wouldn't be.
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Again, I want to point out that the watermarked images I have ARE NOT stolen :p but came from the photographer, legally. I can only think the photographer left the watermark on for the reason you say, advertising. These were free low-res ones, that I got when I bought the prints, I wonder if they sell low-res watermark free ones? I never asked, didn't think of it. I know I'd be irritated if some random accused me of stealing them though.


I would buy so many more photos if there was more opportunity to buy a low res digital image for £2-3. As it is I don't often buy photo's anymore.
 
Maybe an enterprising person could buy a stock of dongles and for the price of a on-site print, you get all the photos taken of you on the dongle, possibly with a watermark somewhere to say it's been bought and paid for. I would far rather pay for that, than a print.
 
We have plenty of local photographers who have lo res jpgs available at very reasonable prices, but people Still persist in stealing them!
 
TGM said:
We have plenty of local photographers who have lo res jpgs available at very reasonable prices, but people Still persist in stealing them!
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This is the issue I have, with early bird discounts a customer can have 5 facebook images for £10, system is automated so they just download after paying and yet still they steal.

Mike
 
RachelFerd said:
Its easy to point the finger, but if people are 'stealing' images, then try and work out WHY rather than getting righteous and angry!
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People steal all sorts of things, not because they can not pay, but because it is cheaper to steal them.

I have spoken to Ferrari and pointed out that at their prices I can not afford to buy so I will be stealing one, do you think other car owners will post on Facebook saying "Awesome" or "Love the stolen from messages on the paintwork"?

They steal because they can and there is only 1 option to stop them stealing which is to stop offering online sales, trust me, in my other line of work we have looked at just about every other way to stop them.

Mike
 
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