Cushings - what are the symptoms?

3Beasties

3Beasties

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As title, what are the most common symptoms of Cushings?

Also if a horse is diagnosed with it what is the best way to manage it? Is the medicine enough or is a change in management needed to?
 
A horse of mine once had cushings. It is normally a tumour on the pituitary gland.
Their hair becomes long and wavy which is the most noticeable symptom. Although they also tend to urinate more and drink a lot more than a normal horse would as their immune system is being affected. :)
 
what symptoms is your mare having? I think sweating and recurrent infections that wont heal are symptoms as well as lami and hoof abscesses.
 
Hirsutism (failure to shed excessive hair), weight loss, fat pads especially over the eyes, recurring laminitis, drinking, sweating and/or urinating more than normal (that's the accompanying Insulin Resistance) - one or more of the above. Responds very well to Prascend if the dose is right, you may need to remove sugars and/or cereals from the diet if IR is also present, but that is easy enough to do with a little thought. THT
 
It's not my mare, it's my 18 year TB old gelding.

I asked my vet if he could have it a few weeks ago and her response was 'not with a coat like that' but she was out again today and I asked her to test him anyway as I just have a 'feeling' that he may have it, will get the results in a few days.

His coat is fairly normal I would have said and he's never had lami (and touch wood never will have!). I wouldn't say he sweated excessively either although he does sweat (gets clipped when in light work).

Things I've noticed -

Peeing more regularly
Poor doer
Lacks muscle tone
A bit flat, verging on lethargic at times

I just wasn't sure if I was on the right track with my thinking hence the thread....
 
a horse that cannot manage barefoot.
Poor immune system, does the horse need antibiotics for something the others can shrug off.
at this time of the year a horse that is hot and sweaty just from walking exercise. Mine suffered badly from this and I didn't realise it was an early sign.
Skin problems
muscle wasting. For me the most serious problem.
Lethargy.
Pot belly, ribby.
weight loss and overeating yet not putting weight on but in fact struggling to maintain his weight.
Drinking and peeing more.

a high test result.

laminitis and hirsutism are way down the line.

What are the symptoms and why do you think it may be a problem? has the horse been tested? how old?
 
paddy555 said:
a horse that cannot manage barefoot.
muscle wasting. For me the most serious problem.
Lethargy.
Pot belly, ribby.
weight loss and overeating yet not putting weight on but in fact struggling to maintain his weight.
Drinking and peeing more.
Click to expand...

Will also add this to my list of possible 'symptoms!'

Paddy I've replied up the page with a few more details :)
 
3Beasties said:
It's not my mare, it's my 18 year TB old gelding.

I asked my vet if he could have it a few weeks ago and her response was 'not with a coat like that' but she was out again today and I asked her to test him anyway as I just have a 'feeling' that he may have it, will get the results in a few days.

His coat is fairly normal I would have said and he's never had lami (and touch wood never will have!). I wouldn't say he sweated excessively either although he does sweat (gets clipped when in light work).

Things I've noticed -

Peeing more regularly
Poor doer
Lacks muscle tone
A bit flat, verging on lethargic at times

I just wasn't sure if I was on the right track with my thinking hence the thread....
Click to expand...

My old arab mare never did have hirsutism, she just had the IR symptoms and my vet diagnosed on her age (30 then) and clinical signs. Your vet needs to read up on the subject! Not a lot have the hairy coat symptom, by the time they do it is fairly advanced as far as I know.
 
See this is confusing my mare has fat pads above eyes she drinks quite alot gets a thick coat its curly on the legs and she tested negative for cushings a few weeks ago, I was convinced she had it and so was the vet, I am having her tested for EMS in a few weeks when he comes back, can a test be wrong and what if the EMS test is negative something is not right so then what, sorry for hijacking your post OP I would have the test its free at the moment on the laminitis website just download a voucher.
 
Pinkvboots said:
See this is confusing my mare has fat pads above eyes she drinks quite alot gets a thick coat its curly on the legs and she tested negative for cushings a few weeks ago, I was convinced she had it and so was the vet, I am having her tested for EMS in a few weeks when he comes back, can a test be wrong and what if the EMS test is negative something is not right so then what, sorry for hijacking your post OP I would have the test its free at the moment on the laminitis website just download a voucher.
Click to expand...

Yes, the ACTH results can show false negatives (and they fluctuate a different times of the year), I know someone whose horse had it and was really really hard to manage for years, eventually in desperation the vet agreed to prescribe Prascend and he has been a totally different horse ever since. Sometimes you should try and persuade your vet to do a Prascend test - prescribe it and if there is huge improvement then the diagnosis is clear.
 
JillA said:
Yes, the ACTH results can show false negatives (and they fluctuate a different times of the year), I know someone whose horse had it and was really really hard to manage for years, eventually in desperation the vet agreed to prescribe Prascend and he has been a totally different horse ever since. Sometimes you should try and persuade your vet to do a Prascend test - prescribe it and if there is huge improvement then the diagnosis is clear.
Click to expand...

Thank you the vet is coming back in a few weeks time so I will speak to him about that.
 
Pinkvboots said:
See this is confusing my mare has fat pads above eyes she drinks quite alot gets a thick coat its curly on the legs and she tested negative for cushings a few weeks ago, I was convinced she had it and so was the vet, I am having her tested for EMS in a few weeks when he comes back, can a test be wrong and what if the EMS test is negative something is not right so then what, sorry for hijacking your post OP I would have the test its free at the moment on the laminitis website just download a voucher.
Click to expand...

my horse had most of the symptoms I listed earlier in this thread and 2 tests both came back negative. He was screaming cushings!!
It didn't take very long on prascend before it became clear that the symptoms were responding to it.
I think you need to look at both the test result and the horse's symptoms together especially if your vet was anticipating cushings.

Having just watched the talk about laminitis webinair they were stressing Autumn ie now was the best time to test because of the high levels so another test may be a good idea. Alternatively why not trial prascend for a period of time and see if you can see a response.
 
Our pony was also tested for Cushings yesterday so will watch for an update post. I called the vet because of lethargy, she's 17. She's perfectly willing, just has no exercise tolerance and hasn't had for some weeks. Otherwise seems happy and healthy.
 
every horse with cushings (or PPID to give it its proper name!) can display different symptoms, or none at all. the ATCH level is what to go on for diagnosis. Interestingly, my gelding had no symptoms other than developing laminitis which i could not control despite the usual measures. Having read up on i, i can now see that he was displaying some of the more subtle symptoms such as drinking more (and so urinating more frequently) and a swollen/fatty mucky sheath. Every horse is different there are no hard and fast rules so getting ATCH and Insulin Resistance measured are the best actions in my opinion. Prascend has worked wonders for us also, good luck!
Please do also have a look at this group as i have found it a mine of useful, and correct information!
https://www.facebook.com/groups/475349259169277/?bookmark_t=group
 
Rjd84 said:
mucky sheath.

Please do also have a look at this group as i have found it a mine of useful, and correct information!
https://www.facebook.com/groups/475349259169277/?bookmark_t=group
Click to expand...

how could I have forgotten the mucky sheath. Anoher one for the list of symptoms. LOL

mine also had this, I was constantly cleaning under his belly. 1 year on (on prascend) and it is a distant memory. Really important symptom though and I have seen it reported on many occasions.

thankis for the link, will have a look.
 
Got results back today and they were low, 46, so vet doesn't seem keen to take it any further. I was so sure he had it as has so many symptoms!
 
There are a lot of false negatives - as your vet if he is prepared to put him on a months trial of Prascend, that is a much more reliable diagnostic tool if they respond to it.
 
3Beasties said:
Got results back today and they were low, 46, so vet doesn't seem keen to take it any further. I was so sure he had it as has so many symptoms!
Click to expand...

I'm afraid that I would see it that your horse has scored the very basic pass mark of 46 when the pass level was 47. :rolleyes:When the accepted normal level is 29 ie outside the Aug/Nov period there is a grey area. That is from something like 19 to around 40.
Anything in that area is not necessarily conclusive. I don't know what the grey area is around 47 but I am sure you can make a guess.

Mine scored 11 out of an acceptable 29. Vet assured me he had no symptoms. By then I had really learnt to look for the symptoms, losing one horse already to the side effects of it it does rather galvanise your mind. :(

I decided there were enough symptoms to make the test result questionable asked for a prascend trial. I detailed each of the symptoms to the vet. They were evident.
He has been on prascend for a year and it has undoubtedly saved his life.

I would suggest you look very closely at his symptoms. Cushings is not an excuse for every symptom that ever existed, Decide if you are satisfied with the result of the test. Does it tie in with the physical symptoms you can see. Look at his history, can you see lethargy has increased, muscle tone has been lost yet he has been well fed, kept fit etc etc

I asked my vet if there were side effects for prascend and if a trial would damage my horse. No. Seemed to me no reason not to go along with my instincts. My money after all.
If you decide to leave it I would retest before too long and keep a detailed record of his symptoms to see if they worsen.
Good luck with whatever you decide.
 
I think I will ask for a trial but maybe not straight away. He's currently having cortafen (sp) injections so don't want to add two new things at once as then I wouldn't be sure which one was improving him, or not.
 
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