Dare I say it... Parelli?

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RIDMagic

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At the risk of being bombarding with negative comments, I am contemplating starting Parelli with my 4 year old mare. I’m interested to hear if anybody has any positive experiences with Parelli.

I know there are a lot of people that have bad things to say about it, for various reasons. I know it’s expensive. I also know a lot of it has been cleverly marketed, but if it helps people to understand concepts, that can only be a good thing, surely? And I know there are a couple of not very nice videos online of demonstrations that maybe haven’t gone to plan. I haven’t watched them fully myself and I don’t want to, but I also don’t want to write off the whole thing based purely on those videos, as there seem to be a lot more positive outcomes then negative. Some people write off Parelli because traditional methods have always worked well for them, so don’t fix what’s not broke. That’s fair enough. And some people appear to try it for a couple of weeks then declare it doesn’t work. I am willing to accept it takes a lot of commitment, time and perseverance, and I am willing to put that work in.

My number one aim is to build a bond with my horse. I want her to trust me and to want to work with me and spend time with me. I want life and work to be fun for her. At the moment I don’t know an awful lot about the stages of Parelli and how far you can progress. I’m interested to hear about the ridden aspect of Parelli as well as the groundwork. I’m not interested in Western riding, but I understand there is a dressage aspect of Parelli? Anyway I would really appreciate any comments, hopefully some positive ones from people who have done Parelli with their horses, but also negatives as long as they are genuine, and not just “a friend of a friend of my mum did Parelli and it ruined her horse…”!

Thanks very much :)
 
My friend does Parelli she's either level 3 or 4 parelli certified and her and her horses are brilliant- I swear I've never seen a cleverer horse than her mare! I've 'dabbled' for years and enjoy some of it. However I think any empathetic approach to training would give you a similar level of bond with your horse if that's what you're after. If it's to train towards high levels of Parelli then go for it but see little point in people doing level 1 for years. I think that's when the relationship breaks down.
 
Don't ruin a good horse.
I have seen a few parelli trained horses over the years and I have yet to come across one that didn't have issues, or was actually ridden.
Watched a few demo's at horse shows and found it quite disturbing. If you haven't seen it already, watch the catwalk video on utube and make up your mind if its the sort of method you want to be associated with.
There are better ways to build a bond with a genuine horse.
 
My number one aim is to build a bond with my horse. I want her to trust me and to want to work with me and spend time with me. I want life and work to be fun for her.
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This is exactly what I've always wanted with my horses too.

It didn't take waving a stick at them or asking them to bounce a ball around to achieve it.

Sorry.............
 
A friend of mine became a parelli instructor and I've seen her develop and work with her horses. I would suggest that before you start parelli-ing your horse, you should attend a couple of clinics as a spectator. Be aware that if this is what you chose and you do it well, this is all your horse will understand.

If you decide to start, take the bits you like and leave the bits you don't, you'll be doing your own thing and NOT parelli. Parelli itself is a very definite system.

Before you start, if you have some spare cash, and I'm assuming you have a bit as you want to do parelli, why not have a look at Kelly Marks, Richard Maxwell and Jason Webb and Ben Hart (I think that's the clicker bloke, someone correct me if I'm wrong). They all have very valuable techniques and will give you a horse that enjoys working with you and other people. Whereas a properly parellied horse is tricky for other people. I know because I was sent to catch my friend's horse (the parelli instructor's horse). What a pallava. I did catch him, I employed some very strange tactics and didn't reveal them to my friend. She was surprised I managed it though, I think she thought I'd fail. Good luck and have fun whatever you decide to do.
 
Life and work can be fun for your horse without doing Parelli. IME and IMHO Parelli is just a v expensive, cleverly marketed cult. If you really want to do "natural horsemanship" type stuff then look up Kelly Marks Intelligent Horsemanship. I'm not a particularly fluffy bunny and like to think I'm quite down to earth, but I like her work. I had a session with one of her Recommended Associates a few years ago for a horse who wouldn't lead or load, and it was great. Used to do a lot of the exercises in KM's book Perfect Manners which that particular horse, and have done some with the horse I have now on the odd occasion. However, current horse doesn't spend his time learning how to climb on boxes or kick balls around. He works, and he works fairly hard (schooling, XC, SJ, DR, hunting, hacking), and if he could talk I doubt he would say his life would be perfect if only we did Parelli together.

You don't need Parelli to build trust and a bond with your horse. Just be consistent, firm and fair. Horses don't want you to be their friend.

I school my horse from the ground (in hand schooling) and I did do some of KM's exercises first to establish ground rules and space/boundaries. He didn't understand the concept of in hand schooling (basically dressage in hand!) so we spent some time establishing the basics using "natural horsemanship" type exercises because although he is nice to handle, he was downright rude when I first tried IH schooling. Those exercises aren't the end for me though, they are simply a means to an end. Said horse now work nicely in hand (in a lunge cavesson or in a bridle), he's learning lateral movements, becoming stronger and more supple, and this all contributes to my end which is to have a horse that is a nice ride. So I think this sort of work has its place but it isn't (and IMHO shouldn't be) the end towards which you are working; they are simply tools in the box.

My experiences of people doing Parelli... I have yet to meet one who has a horse which is well mannered, a nice, polite ride, or does anything besides walk through poles in the arena. They are all either rude and/or not nice (or sound enough) to ride so the owners do Parelli to get them out of doing anything else, or the horses are downright confused. I watched a Parelli demo at the British Open a couple of years ago and it was awful. All the horses (belonging to the demonstrators) were completely shut down and robotic. If you want to spend time on the ground with your horse, try Kelly Marks Intelligent Horsemanship instead. IME they are far more pragmatic.
 
I think there is good to be had from various methods. Monty Roberts Join Up, parelli etc, just take a good look at different demos on YouTube etc, and try methods you think will work for you and your horse. I am a huge fan of Buck Branneman personally, and would love to meet the guy if he ever came to England.
You've already indicated that you are prepared to put in the time and effort with your horse, and that can only be a good thing, and will help to build the bond between you. Some people have successfully trained their horse using the clicker, maybe you'd enjoy trying that method?
 
There is a yard near to me specialising in Parelli training. My farrier tells me the horses are well mannered on the ground but are rarely ridden.

Any horse is only as good as the trainer that teaches him regardless of the methods. The two horses I have known that were Parelli trained, one was very dangerous to handle at the tender age of 3, the other was an old horse who just put up with being messed with, totally ignoring what was being asked of him.
 
I don't think there's any reason that parelli would help you build a bond with your horse, I think that's a separate issue. There are many things that are MORE likely to help you bond with them (including clicker training as Superhot suggested) since they are not based on drilling movements and proving you're boss over and over again....
 
chestnut cob said:
You don't need Parelli to build trust and a bond with your horse. Just be consistent, firm and fair. Horses don't want you to be their friend.

I school my horse from the ground (in hand schooling) and I did do some of KM's exercises first to establish ground rules and space/boundaries. He didn't understand the concept of in hand schooling (basically dressage in hand!) so we spent some time establishing the basics using "natural horsemanship" type exercises because although he is nice to handle, he was downright rude when I first tried IH schooling. Those exercises aren't the end for me though, they are simply a means to an end. Said horse now work nicely in hand (in a lunge cavesson or in a bridle), he's learning lateral movements, becoming stronger and more supple, and this all contributes to my end which is to have a horse that is a nice ride. So I think this sort of work has its place but it isn't (and IMHO shouldn't be) the end towards which you are working; they are simply tools in the box.
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very similar for me too :)
 
A good close friend of mine who kept her horse at my yard decided to do parelli work with her youngster, she went to all the displays got in an instructor etcetc,3 months down the line she had a nasty unhandlable youngster, now whether she did something wrong i dont know but the horse really didnt take to it. she had to turn him away for 6 months and start again, this time she went down the monty roberts , richard maxwell method and actually it really suited the horse and she went on to have a fab relationship with him. Each horse is different so obviously different techniques work for some but not others.

Personally i have always had a great relationship with all my horse whereas they want to be with me and will follow me anywhere no rope required but i havent needed 'special methods' to get this it just happens from time, love and trust :)
 
I freely admit that I know nothing about parelli, so not sure if my following comment is relevant, happy to be corrected!
But, for fun my horse likes to be out in the field, mooching with the other horses, rolling in mud and eating grass. When he's with me he's expected to work at something (not that I'm a competitive or expert rider!!! :) ) and when he's good doing that something, he gets a pat after, and back out in the field to get to do HIS idea of a fun thing, as the reward.
Does that make sense?
 
I do & really, really enjoy it - as does my horse :)

I didn't have any intention of ever doing Parelli, but my 'green but safe' youngster I had bought turned out to be just green! He actually had a history of a long list of previous trainers, owner & trainers in hospital & just a nightmare.

I tried lessons with a BHS instructor, EE instructors, Monty Roberts & IH to absolutely little or no avail & he was becoming increasingly difficult & frustrating & it was a matter if time before one of us got hurt.

We haven't looked back since beginning Parelli - I was skeptical at first but I've found a great instructor who comes as often or otherwise as I want her to. I think having someone at the start is Important to keep an eye on you & the horse ... We could have run into all sorts of trouble!

I now learn lots from DVDs, clinics & books but in the very early days help on the ground was so important - and still is, but I've got the confidence/skills to play about a bit too on my own.

We now do a real mix of groundwork & ridden stuff & have a great relationship which is growing everyday. I couldn't be happier & lots of people - including traditional types have commented on the difference in him.

It doesn't need to be as expensive as people assume either - Lessons for me work out no more expensive than they did with non-Parelli people. A lot of my equipment is either second hand or non- genuine & members discount gives you 25% off Parelli website too.

My only regret about Parelli? I didn't try it sooner!

X
 
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Thanks everyone for all your replies. It is a bit concerning that there are so many people who seem to know somebody that has done Parelli and ended up with a nightmare on their hands. It's hard to know whether this can be totally blamed on the Parelli methods or whether they did something wrong and haven't shown their horse a clear line that they can't cross. Blurr, I agree with you that it would probably be sensible to attend a clinic as a spectator and make a judgement from that.

I do like Kelly Marks and have one of her books. In fact I am going to watch a Monty Roberts clinic in a couple of weeks. I think one of the things that attracts me to Parelli is that there are some clear steps and activities to do with your horse, whereas a lot of other trainers are more about the general mindset.

My horse is far from a problem horse. She is not disrespectful on the ground in the sense of being bargy or strong, she never bites, kicks, rears etc. She can just be a little stubborn and lazy, and she is easily bored in the school. She can also be nappy when hacking out alone, and in the school when she's had enough (which I've posted about on here recently), and I wondered if Parelli might improve our relationship, which might have a knock on effect on these small problems. Some people say working on Parelli with their horses gives them a new interest in life and they start to have fun.

I've heard about the Parelli games involving a horse standing on a box or bouncing a ball alongside... some people think that's ridiculous. I think if the horse doesn't dislike it and it engages his mind onto something different, what's the problem?

Incidentally, I have called one of the Monty/Kelly Recommended Associates and they were ridiculously expensive. So that was a no no.

There also seem to be a lot of people saying that most Parelli horses they know are not ridden. I'm sure this can't be because doing Parelli has made them unrideable! Maybe it's because the horse can't be ridden so Parelli is a logical thing to do with the horse to keep its mind active.

Either way it's obviously a contraversial subject. Thanks again for everyone's views. I'll keep thinking before I commit to anything.
 
I ride Pete a number of times a week - which is more than I could do pre-Parelli, in all honesty! I'm limited more by daylight hours, time & energy more than anything else.

I'm sure some people think the games are odd, but to be honest - including a ball, pedestal and other weird & wacky objects or ideas help increase Pete's confidence, our relationship & keep his interest in the otherwise ' boring' school.

It's not the only way, but it's helped more than anything else has so far!

Whereabouts are you? If your local to Sussex/Surrey you are more than welcome to come and see us - although we are by no means experts at it & still very much learning every day. X
 
Because they were too scared to ride before? If so then Parelli can't be blamed for that. Or that Parelli has turned their horses into something they are too scared to get on? In which case I'm sure they must be doing something wrong. I don't think a method that makes a horse unrideable when done properly can be so popular. Or at least you would hope not.
 
RIDMagic said:
There also seem to be a lot of people saying that most Parelli horses they know are not ridden. I'm sure this can't be because doing Parelli has made them unrideable!
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No. But then it hasn't made the owner think they can get up there and ride, either, has it?

Getting help certainly can be expensive and whilst you can certainly do parelli from the dvds (which are not exactly cheap) I think getting the parelli instructor out is going to be a similar type of price if you want hands on help. Have a look at some of their websites for price comparison. Whatever you decide, I would recommend that you learn from someone who is 'qualified' in whatever it is as second hand information can be a bit like chinese whispers.
 
I know someone who does parelli, it's not for me at all but she has a nice all round pony who she hacks about on and h daughter jumps and stressages etc!
The only thing I don't understand is the bitless barefoot thing, the horse can't walk properly on rough ground and th mum rides bitless but the daughter rides in a gag and hangs off his mouth, no idea on that one!
 
NativePonyLover said:
My instructor rides up to Intermediate eventing - not bad for a training programme for people too scared to ride.
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Indeed.

However, my experience of Parelli is middle aged women who have decided that parerelli is the only way to go to make their (perfectly sane and rideable horses) rideable. Yet never get on board because they remain **** scared.

They'd be better off with a cat.
 
RIDMagic said:
My number one aim is to build a bond with my horse. I want her to trust me and to want to work with me and spend time with me. I want life and work to be fun for her. :)
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If this is the aim, you can achieve it without Parelli or any pre set programmes of training. The easiest way to make your horse want to trust you and work with you is to make all of your interactions positive. That includes making things clear. So...letting her know what behaviour you like from her and what behaviour you don't. Be consistent with these so she knows where she stands all the time and then she will trust you. Let her get away with barging you one day and reprimand her for it the next and she won't trust you very much because she won't know what to expect from you.

If you want her to want to work for you, make the work enjoyable for her. Don't make or tell her to do something. Ask her to do it in a way that she can understand and wait for her to do it the way you want and reward. She'll quickly learn what you want from her and as she gets rewarded for it, she'll want it too.

Obviously that is a very simplistic way to look at it and I am not one to ever jump on a bandwagon, but I have not felt inspired by any of the Parelli trained horses I have known. I have always found them to be horses that have learned to conform rather than horses who choose to behave well. I like a horse to still have a bit of heart and soul and personality...I have found that lacking in Parelli horses in my experience.
 
dogatemysalad said:
I have seen a few parelli trained horses over the years and I have yet to come across one that didn't have issues, or was actually ridden...........There are better ways to build a bond with a genuine horse.
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amymay said:
This is exactly what I've always wanted with my horses too.

It didn't take waving a stick at them or asking them to bounce a ball around to achieve it.

Sorry.............
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amymay said:
my experience of Parelli is middle aged women who have decided that parerelli is the only way to go to make their (perfectly sane and rideable horses) rideable. Yet never get on board because they remain **** scared.

They'd be better off with a cat.
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All of the above.

Plus, even if Parelli could train my horse to poo out golden eggs I still wouldn't partake, as I'd feel nauseous lining that awful man's pockets.
 
There are some horses who do just fine using Parelli methods. Generally working cattle horses. And then there are some who just would not do well at all. I look at my AQHAs and know exactly which ones would do well and which ones would do poorly. The ones who are independent thinking, who work pretty hard at times would do great, the ones who are total sucks and who like being cuddled and are more sensitive and need/enjoy human interaction would turn into total wrecks. There are some aspects of 'further down the road' Parelli methods which I think are superb for some horses, my main criticism is the earlier stuff that most Parelli-ites are taught to do. Some of those things do not sit well with me. I've had a fair amount of 'Parelli-trained' horses come here for retraining and an awful lot of them have something missing. The spark. I take a different approach with those horses and help them find their spark again. Others I've had in just love that sort of approach (although I don't do Parelli, I do use some bits that have always been a part of training but didn't have someone's name previously attached to them).

To have a bond with a horse isn't about the type of training you do IMO. It's about being.
 
Spring Feather said:
There are some horses who do just fine using Parelli methods. Generally working cattle horses. And then there are some who just would not do well at all. I look at my AQHAs and know exactly which ones would do well and which ones would do poorly. The ones who are independent thinking, who work pretty hard at times would do great, the ones who are total sucks and who like being cuddled and are more sensitive and need/enjoy human interaction would turn into total wrecks. There are some aspects of 'further down the road' Parelli methods which I think are superb for some horses, my main criticism is the earlier stuff that most Parelli-ites are taught to do. Some of those things do not sit well with me. I've had a fair amount of 'Parelli-trained' horses come here for retraining and an awful lot of them have something missing. The spark. I take a different approach with those horses and help them find their spark again. Others I've had in just love that sort of approach (although I don't do Parelli, I do use some bits that have always been a part of training but didn't have someone's name previously attached to them).

To have a bond with a horse isn't about the type of training you do IMO. It's about being.
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You just said what I was trying to say in one word. Spark!
 
I have been to a demonstration.

Even though I wanted to walk out after the first 15 mins I forced myself to stay - sad to say it didn't get better.

The horses were, without exception, switched off. They stood there like brainless dummies waiting to be told what to do, they had no spark, no personality and they didn't look to be enjoying themselves.

If I put one of my horses on a halter and line (and yes I do use rope halters and 12ft or 20ft lines) and didn't give them any direction at all they would not just stand there like a zombie - they would come over to me or start fidgeting - their way of asking what is going on.

None of the horses at the demo did that - they just stood there totally switched off until they were told what to do. I found it quite disturbing, a bit spooky but most of all - sad.
 
amymay said:
Indeed.

However, my experience of Parelli is middle aged women who have decided that parerelli is the only way to go to make their (perfectly sane and rideable horses) rideable. Yet never get on board because they remain **** scared.

They'd be better off with a cat.
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What have you got against cats?
Parelli trained cats actually I am likeing this idea.
 
I know people that chose to do parelli because of 'dangerous horse' to help bond, some done well others not so,
Also know someone who is a parelli instructor who needs to have her head surgically removed from her backside (met a few like this actually)
And others who hated it,

I looked into it many years ago and was put off by the prices, I mean £30 for a stick with a rope on it, to wave in my horses face, I had no issues with my horse just was interested in doing something different,
Im glad I didn't since having read and watched videos, I mean with holding horses water because you are the 'master' pfftt

Good luck whatever you choose!
 
saddlesore said:
However I think any empathetic approach to training would give you a similar level of bond with your horse if that's what you're after.
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This..

Interestingly I visited a yard recently, and witnessed my first real life Parelli sessions..two of which were nicely sympathetic, the horses lunging but without the handler moving. To be honest I wasn't quite sure what the point was, and why this was perceived to be better than normal lunging? The other two were training young horses, who were recently broken, waving sticks with flapping cloths over the tacked up horses. This simply seemed to result in a terrified sweating horse breaking loose and running off bucking around the field where it refused to be caught!

However a friend of mine used this method to effectively cure a horse who wouldn't load...
 
My one and only experience of Parelli was an instructor who was hired to come and do some extra hours at our yard to give me and the YO some time off teaching to ride and school our own horses.

On said yard, we had a riding school pony that was infamous. He was a Highland pony, about 10 years old, and he was a little snot. He did RDA and was great with the disabled riders, but in the riding school he just evaded everything - either by not moving, or moving as slowly as possible with the younger riders, or by spooking and bucking with the older riders when they asked him to work. He was also the type that would lean on the farrier, bite the vet, and squish small children against walls. God forbid you tried to hose him.

He had vet checks, saddle checks, back checks, physio, and had been broken and schooled by us as a four year old, and had been ridden only by the yard staff for the first few years and had been well schooled - on his well-behaved days I had him working uphill into a mature outline, collecting and extending paces, SI/HP/changes, could jump 3'6" despite being 14hh (only reason he didn't jump bigger was because the riding school wings only went that high). I remember taking him out and winning prizes with him - on other days he just would evade every way possible. And he wouldn't hack, despite having had no bad experiences and hacking since a baby, he would spook, buck and/or bolt with less capable riders, and whilst I could make him go lead file when necessary he fought you all the way.

He even went off on loan to a local very talented Pony Clubber who eventually gave up and said that he just wasn't interested in working with you at all. Interestingly, all the other horses hated him too, he was the annoying one that started fights and irritated everyone else but was way down the pecking order. Unfortunately, just a little snot.

Now, the instructor I mentioned? She arrived on the yard, took one look at the Highland, and decided that he was misunderstood and needed Parelli to guide him home. She worked on him for months - most she ever got out of him was the day he noticed the horses in the field opposite the school cantering across the field and he spooked, took off across the school and nearly took the instructor with him at the end of the bloomin' rope.

Eventually he went to a pure RDA centre where apparently they love him, and call him 'quirky' rather than a total snot. He was just a horse that didn't want to engage with you, and didnt like to be pushed AT ALL - switching off in an RDA session was his one strength. And Parelli unfortunately was no use, and certainly didn't encourage him to bond with anyone.
 
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