day of 2 halves:Swallowfield BD

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Prince33Sp4rkle

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:rolleyes:

many many positives, but a fair few laugh or you will cry moments too....

......warmed up bang on for AM85, the trot felt super, best its been at a show for ages, even the medium trot took a good strong pull and took me all the way across the diagonal, really up to the contact.
Did a super test, trot work easily best its been all year, so i really feel i'm getting on top of that particular issue now and as we gain in confidence in our new improved *show trot* it should hopefully be more consistent........ hopefully.
Judge is a very firm but fair sort, so thrilled with 65%, 1st open sec (only out of 2!) and 2nd overall (only out of 4, and although 1st was waaaay ahead on 70%, 3rd was a good chunk behind on 60% ).
completely agree with her comments too.

for some reason i then dared to think positively, he felt really on side, really forward, really happy and all i wanted was 60% at PSG....

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ahem, thought too soon........although warm up for PSG was equally fluid and on side, and it started well with the same lovely trot work, that all went out the window, because instead of doing a canter piri, we did this:

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repeatedly.....in fact we did 180, and then walked a good 10m in such a position......and thus the seal was broken and the entire canter work was punctuated by kung fu ninja antics, ^&&^%$$%^^^ turd of a horse!

really truly no idea where it came from, as he's been foot perfect for ages now. I HAVE changed feed recently (to saracen re-leve) so wondering if thats upset tummy, as he is only on the maintenance dose of omeprazole now.
in any case, all i can do is monitor it this week, suck my teeth and see. He only had saddle and chiro done recently and feels in fine form at home.

still, perversely pleased, as got my trot (its the small things eh!)
 
blimey that really is a day of two halves! On the positive side, the third picture down is lovely - your face says it all, you look thrilled with him (to me, anyway!)...

Shame about his kung fu ninjaness though!
 
no more upwards i hope! lol!

it shouldnt, but it makes me laugh (a little bit, i can scowl and laugh at same time!).

will see how he feels this week re tummy/feed. I do think the saracen has given him a bit more energy but its obv no good if upsetting ulcers.

:brainstrain:
 
Arrrgh! Horses! Just as you thought you had him sussed too!

Hmmm.

One thing i would cmment on....and it very well MIGHT be the camera angle, but he looks a *smidge* weaker at the base of withers and just behind the saddle than your last set of pics...?? Or at least, that's how the pics look...and by that I don't mean he looks weaker, but last few sets of pics he has been REALLY stacked, and these don't quite look like he is to such an extent? You''l know better than me from seeing him in person though. (particularly the second pic?)
 
He's also doing the pinched nostril thing he was doing a few sets of pics back, when he wasn't on such form....just before you seemed to have him sussed?
 
i can see what you mean, but haven't noticed it in the flesh, so will have to pony prod tomorrow when i ride.
its just a never ending cycle of what to try/do next isnt it.
am inclined to think it way a bit yee ha/naughty as in the ext canter was napping and trying to fall out right shoulder, which is his naughty thing but will prod with abandon.
he had saddle done and then back checked last week and she was happy with everything and she is VERY fussy (in a good way!).
Teeth are not due and feels fine in contact.

if its anything physical im guessing its feed :( which would be a PITA.

eta-yes can def see the pinchy nose too.hmmmmmm.no idea what to do for best, back on old feed, or stay on saracen and up the omeprazole in case its just the actual change (rather than feed) thats upset him.
 
Yeah it's not massive, the change, and could just be the angle....but I wouldn't see these and think...wow stacked! whereas in previous few i have...make sense?

I'm mega over analytical though, after having Snip....so tend to look for things!

I'm having a nightmare too at the moment...Baby R has suddenly got no oomph, and also seems to have gone weaker behind and in front of the saddle....I DID have a saddle fit issue that is now fixed, but he's surprisingly sensitive and it's still affecting him!
 
Well done on the AM! He looks great, but I do think he has also lost condition over his quarters and behind the saddle... he looks very TB at the moment which is the first time I have ever thought that about him...I am sure you will get to the bottom of it, as know how coscientious you are! Good luck with the next outing, I am sure the PSG scores will come in no time :)
 
I know one issue I'm having is he's so full on grass, that he's not so keen on eating hi feeds etc...but the grass isn't actually too full of goodness right now!!
 
Im not keen on Saracen re-leve- Im sure that it was full of peas- which is rocket fuel and not that great for their tummies!
 
Hope you don't mind me asking, as I'm def not a dressage expert and apologies if this is a stupid question.

If I look at this like he was a jumper, and go with the thought that he is a young horse and say the level he is doing if it were jumping would be 1m30s(?) I would think that he was just saying he can't cope with the push for that extra bit of work at a show - if he were a jumper he'd be napping in the ring but probably work perfectly well at home in his comfort zone environment.

Do you think this could be it? rather than being sick/ulcers/back/etc etc??

As I said, I'm not an expert at Dr so have to look at it like a jumper, and i don't know him so please don't think I am being narky or getting at you in any way, I was just wondering :)
 
KatB said:
Well done on the AM! He looks great, but I do think he has also lost condition over his quarters and behind the saddle... he looks very TB at the moment which is the first time I have ever thought that about him...I am sure you will get to the bottom of it, as know how coscientious you are! Good luck with the next outing, I am sure the PSG scores will come in no time :)
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Echo this, this is exactly what I just thought looking at the pics. I never pass comment on any stuff on here, but I know you try sooo hard to get things right for him, but sometimes when you are with someone/thing all the time you never notice the changes.
Horses are great at 'you win some, you loose some' but to do it all in the same day is good going :D
 
Well done for the AM, thats a good solid score :)

Its a shame about the PSG.

Can I make one little comment, in the picture sixth one down (which I think you are going into a canter piroutte by the looks of it?) dont pull the hand back across the withers as you are restricting the movement (and you can see him tensing in his head and neck), the hand should almost be more forwards (following the rein/bridle/head) and open to allow the forehand to come round and the hindlegs to step. Especially when first starting the pirouettes and in the test etc so that they can gain confidence from the movement.

With regards to the Omeprazole - i've just bought some Protexin Quick Fix (in a tube), am going to try it with Bloss to see if it works for our next time out (as she will have had about 6 weeks off competing as been giving her a bit of a break from it). If it works i'll give it to her everytime we go out.
 
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the omeprazole makes a BIG diff, so safe to say he had ulcers, he went from full dose (3 sachets for a month) to 2 sachets for a month and is now down to 1 sachet and in all other ways feels very happy and hasnt reverted to his pre-omeprazole levels of grumpiness etc so i think its clear that his stomach has been helped by it.
so in that respect i dont think a scope is going to help now particularly, am i going to scope before and after every feed or supplement change? of course not, if had been scoped, gone on GG and id had this issue id still be asking same question-should i up the dose to counteract the feed change for a week or so?
and id still be wondering if i should go back to original feed etc too.

re his condition-ive been on hol for a week and although NMT kindly worked him a few times, it wasnt the same level of work, and he does drop muscle quickly so that could be it. will be more pics this weekend,when he will have been back in full work nearly 2 weeks so will do a comparison :)

AF-can see what you are saying (an no doubt many others are muttering same) but he ate the first PSG for breakfast and i made more stupid mistakes than he did and he felt very happy, so i guess i could be forgiven for expecting him to feel same yesterday. Again, i guess all i can do is see how he feels at home this week and see how he feels in the AM next sun and if he's not right, drop out the PSG. he's so tricky and so quick to try and intimidate his rider its really hard to tell what he saying. it could as easily be "get stuffed" as "eeek"!!!!!

seabiscuit-interesting..............will google..................can i ask what your choice would be :)

tempi-can you let me knowhow you get on please :) also agree re naughty hand, bad bad habit :blush:
 
Prince33Sp4rkle said:
tempi-can you let me knowhow you get on please :) also agree re naughty hand, bad bad habit :blush:
Click to expand...

Yes definitely, not out until 11th August but will let you know how we get on with it :) Its meant to settle and relax their stomachs - I think SpottedCat uses it on her horse (I could be wrong though) and he previously suffered from ulcers. I know someone on here uses it with sucess!
 
I think you have the physical issues covered, and do a LOT more than most would. I am similarly obsessive as you know with Flow's history and it is soul destroying sometimes! I have to say I think there is an element that he just IS a bit like this - not because he's pushed too hard, or sore, but he has the swagger and attitude that make him special and sometimes he will just say f-you for no apparent reason (like madam does - I think for them to be sharp enough to do the twiddly bits they are going to sometimes boil over). Most of the time he doesn't do it now - compare to when you first had him, and it was an established party trick long before you had him too, but I think you are doing enough to make sure he is comfortable and healthy and there isn't a lot more you can do.

Up the omeprazole for a couple of weeks and see if that helps (btw is it omeprazole direct? Are there customs issues - I had some before for Flow and would like some again) but personally I would chalk it up to one of those days, as bloody frustrating as it is.

Well done for the AM :)
 
Is it always in the second test you tend to have issues? Is that just too much hard, stressful work at once for him just yet (so better to stick to one per outing)? Two tests at home for practice doesn't carry with it the travelling and comp atmosphere. Two tests at that level ARE hard work, and you've got the rest to add. Just a thought. Otherwise, yes check the feed, and maybe think of upping the ulcer stuff for a few days before each comp.

As a normal person, who has horses who have had issues and now are lovely, I always thought the sign of a happy, well trained horse was one that didn't need to throw all its toys out of the pram to signal to the rider that there was an issue. By the time they feel the need to rear/buck/leap about, there have always been plenty of little signs that there's something wrong. Perhaps if you could use video footage etc to help you spot these in time, you won't end up wasting money on tests that don't go so well, and if he IS feeling a little off, he might give you the benefit of the doubt and try to keep going.
 
have had two lots with no customs issues :)

thanks hun, i sometimes feel like my head is on fire, and exchange umpteen emails with NMT a day hummming and ahhhhhing over what to do/try etc.

MAS-generally no pattern, not always the 2nd test, but you make a good point re doing 2 tests at that level. am going to try a much shorter AM warm up on sun and see if that makes any diff and may even try just doing a PSG at next show, thanks :)
 
The warm up pics look amazing. If its any help we put my mums late ex-racer on re-leve one winter as he had started to drop off. I know it's meant to be safe slow release energy but it turned my mums normally quiet angelic horse into a total nutcase. He really was so full of beans and any calories it seemed to give him was burned off with his plonk head antics.
Took him off it and put him back on outshine and fibre nuts which he was on before and he went back to his normal self.
I always thought the re-leve seemed quite sticky with mollasses, it does have mollasses in it and interestingly they don't state how much on the website.
 
All of that brand of feed is loaded with molasses- even their feeds like shape-up which is supposed to be for laminitic ponies. A number of raceyards and TB studs around here which fed it have switched feed brands, after continual bad blood profiles in the horses. They never ate the feeds up well and you had to feed so much of it to meet their RDA's. Now theyve switched brands the horses are all winning!!

P_S- what i would feed- you probably wont agree, but would feed half a scoop of soaked whole oats,( soaked for 24 hours) a double handfull of unmolassed alfalfa, a high-spec vit/min supplement and plenty of linseed oil. Some unmolassed chaff or readigrass to bulk it up more. No soya based feed or soya hulls, or oil.
 
Sugar content of Re-leve is listed at 5-6%. I don't find it sugary at all, no smell of it and it doesnt have that 'stickiness' that molassed mixes have IMO.

Mine took 2-3 weeks or so to really settle onto the Re-leve, I wasn't sure it would suit him initially but now I'm very happy with how he feels, no more ulcer symptoms, much better mover, more forward etc. At the end of the day it's horses for courses, what suits one doesnt suit another. TBH though if he was good in the first test then it doesn't sound like it's feed related, surely? Wouldn't he be the same throughout?

Might be worth trying soaked oats - though they are a faff - if you think the feed isn't working? My worry with oats though is the starch content but I believe soaking them reduces that? I did try them on another horse to give her more oomph and it worked but not as well as feeding just oats which eventually caused more problems that it solved.

Or maybe it was just one of those days... whatever it was I hope you find a solution.
 
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seabiscuit-can i ask what brand they swapped to? pm if you pref :)

scarlett-i tend to agree that is it was feed the first test would have been a disaster too...ok not as pressured as a PSG but enough in it to set him off if he felt that way inclined.however im well used to him being weird in the extreme(!) so will keep an open mind.

can i ask what probs the plain oats caused?

thanks :)
 
The plain oats made her quite fizzy eventually, it was great while she was in hard work but if she had 2 days off I'd have to let her gallop on the lunge for 40 min before getting on, and I do mean gallop. I put it down to the starch as you can pump low starch energy feed into her with no reaction.... bloomin' TB's.
 
@Seabiscuit - Would be interested which stud/yards those are as one of the top yards here (Stoute or Prescott can't remember which off the top of my head) has just swopped to Saracen and are getting much better results, they also go into Godolphin and the majority of the top consigned horses at the Yearlings sales are all on it. I don't doubt that changing the feed might have caused a little issue but think that Re-Leve is a fantastic product and worth perservering with. Or maybe look into Saracen Bio Life.
Well done on your AM and you both look great together.
 
Wasn't really thinking you had pushed him too hard, just know from previous horses that they go really well the first couple of times before saying 'aargh'. However it might be that he is trying to take the mick so def worth trying again.

What about going along and just doing PSG first? would this be a possibility? could he be tired after the AM (which is def much higher than I could go with Dr!), doubt you can do it that way round. And there are more experienced people here who can advise.

I'm not advising btw, def not in any position to criticise but just my own wonderings comparing to SJ/Eventing.

Cx
 
Great AM score well done.

Do you ever ride a complete test at home? We have started this with Blitz as he would go into the ring and it was like he was saying: "ner ner ner an you can't make me!"
Now we drill test ride at least once a week and it's made a huge difference.
 
W1-i dont, but def think thats worth a try this week, so he knows there are no escape routes/corners he can drop me and nap in.good idea :)

AF-am going to try a short AM warm up, but warm up like im going to do the PSG, so do all the tempi and piri work, then do the AM, then just walk before the pSG, 2/3 quick fire transitions and then go in. see if that works. if not, next step will be to do just the PSG.
 
As others have said, well done on the AM result, that's a solid score to be proud of (& I'm pretty sure that this time last year you'd have been :p if someone had told you 'in a years time....').

Without meaning to cause offence, I too agree that he's lost some musculature, particularly behind the saddle. I'm sure it'll build back up pronto and I am definitely not getting into the feed debate (firm believer that everyone has to play with what's available until they find the right thing for their individual horse), but maybe just a little bit of weakness, plus a less intensive week when NMT rode just made him a tad knackered. I think perhaps the tempi/piris before AM then PSG with very short session is a good idea - I will wait with baited breath to see if it is! The other thing (forgive the epic post) is, presumably, because you're competing at a reasonable level, are your tests quite close together time-wise? Two 'advanced' tests in quick succession would be knackering for most, plus if he's new to the level.......

Sorry - stop wittering, not said anything others haven't already! ;)
 
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