Debate - what vices are a no no for you?

dogatemysalad said:
Rather than teaching my hard to catch, won't tie up horse, he has taught me to be patient and calm when frustrated. Although he's still not 100% in these areas now, he's most of the way there and it doesn't cause any grief.

Without the problem horses, I would have learnt nothing. I'd prefer to have a perfect horse but working out solutions and compromises has been an invaluable teacher.

If I had to chose one no-no, it'd probably be the horse that doesn't care whether its rider stays in the saddle or not. I love horses that although they have melt down moments, basically want to keep you safe and on board even if you do end up hitting the dirt, they're endearingly perplexed by your departure.
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Totally agree.

Problem horses do teach you a lot, but I have done my time with them and now I have a family and limited time, I want to enjoy that time and not spend it sorting problems.
 
Kicking, rearing, bucking and biting are a definite NO. This is mainly due to the fact i keep my horses at home and i have kids, a non horsey hubby and dogs. Aything else is a possible yes.
 
I wont entertain the idea of horses with no self preservation, who have seperation anxiety, who don't allow you to catch them (really irritating!) and who rear. I also wouldn't bother looking at any that are advertised with a history of cribbing/weaving or really any form of 'vice'. There are that many out there which don't do any of this why bother buying one that does? If I bought a horse who developed any of these traits then I would learn to cope with it/try to sort it before thinking of selling if it really put me off. The filly I bought beginning of June has reared in hand about 5 times. Not little hops but the show your belly & wave at people kind. She is 3 and, although it put me off a bit, there were reasons behind why she did it. Also once she went up, did her thing, came back down she walked on as if nothing had happened! Must admit the thought of it happening under saddle is a concern but she has shown no signs of doing it so fingers crossed!

Not keen on horses who bite either and a mare who acts 'marish' wouldn't entice me either. The more I think the more my list could get longer so I'll stop here!
 
Well having experienced a wind sucker that is now on my NO NO list and having reaseached Gastic Ulcers and the link its is on the stear well clear list, same with box walking and weaving mostly stress related IMO so ulcers are also a risk. I wouldnt not buy a bucker but would consider deeply the reasons behind the behaviour.... a rearer would avoid like plague!
 
Have previously had: Two serial hard-to-tie-ers (would break baler twine, pull screwed in metal rings off walls, snap headcollars/leadropes/metal clips on either)
One bolter (would spook at something, bolt, and then start broncing whilst flat out... whoever says a horse cant buck whilst flat out LIED)
One major spooked (a spook, spin, buck and twist type)
One I could spend an hour trying to catch
Two very bargy, one of which would just pull the rope through your hands and run off if you confronted him about it (Hence my love of stallion chains... very useful piece of kit sometimes)
One door-kicker (had had a roaring op so couldnt neigh, learnt this so he had a new method of making noise)
One very sharp to ride
Two proper brutal bronc-and-twist-ers (one being my current one... *sigh*)

Have also worked with proper bite-and-kickers, run-you-over-bargy, a windsucker, un-stableables, and two vertical rearers, one of whom very nearly came back on me on two occasions...

Much as I love my current one, and he is sweet, he is hard work!!! I am coping with the sharpness and the bouts of mad bucking/taking off because he is super talented and it will be worth it when he knows what his job is (he is getting there!), but next time round I am getting myself something I can just RIDE and play about with!!!
 
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There are degrees and reasons that mitigate certain things. Experience also changes things.

My old boy would rear when excited but it was always very controlled, he knew exactly how far to go, never even close to going over, so I could deal with that. I always said back then I'd rather a rearer than a bucker as it was what I knew and I knew how to deal with it. Now, Monty will put in the odd excited buck (normally when galloping uphill the dozy donkey!) which make me laugh more than anything so I don't really mind a few bucks, but having not had rearer for 8 years (11 really as he more or less stopped by the age of 24 as he didn't jump any more so wasn't getting so excited!) I'm not so sure I'd be as confident dealing with it now. Likewise a tanker, I would have hated this 10 years ago but I've learned to deal with it now as Archie has his strong moments.

These things are very different though from a horse going vertical (or worse) through fear, a malicious broncer and a true blind-panic bolter.

Aggression and malice are the two things that have no mitigation for me and would be an outright no. Everything else you can work on. Of course the ideal horse would have none of them though.
 
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Bucking and spooking/jumping about is not really problem for me. never experienced proper rearing so don't know - bolting is the big no-no for me. Never experienced a headlong dash through the countryside and never, ever want to :(
 
It depends a bit on whether it was to keep or sell.

If to keep then wind sucking/weaving wouldn't put me off.

I'm not opposed to something that rears/bucks depending on why/how. If it's excitement then that's 1 thing but if it's a massive no I don't want to do this and you won't make me then its an issue.

Main thing is they MUST be a nice person. I don't want anything that wants to bite or kick me. Oh and must be good to catch.
 
Rearing, kicking and biting would be deal breakers for me.

Also anything that had serious issues about being in a stable as mine have to be stabled some of the time or anything that was deliberately nasty.

Bucking/napping/cribbing are OK, I would avoid wind suckers and weavers.
 
I will and have tolerated most things on the ground (bad to catch, shoe, load, clip, rude, bargey, agressive horses) and have had horses that weave, crib and box walk and would continue to do so for the right horse as I find them fairly easy to overcome with time and consistent handling.

I would never have something that bolts, rears, broncs although I have previously had horses which have done this. I wouldn't have something that is bad in traffic, a bit of nervousness or the odd shy is fine but not something that is likely to go over on the road with me or put me under a lorry.
Again pretty much anything else I would be happy to work to resolve for the right horse.

However ideally I want something that's vice free, easy to handle and bombproof but responsive to ride :D
 
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don't like bad to catch, box walkers, cribbers/windsuckers/weavers-drives me insane.
Now I am older I can do without buckers (although can cope with whoopee type bucks, just not I'm-going-to-use-you-as-a-lawndart- type bucks). Can't be doing with horses that are bad in traffic, bargey, have no sense of self preservation etc etc but I mainly seem to bring my own on now and none of them are the above :)
 
Proper rearers and something you can't catch. So frustrating. I had one that learnt to pull back and break the string when tied up and wander off. Solved it by putting lunge line thru the metal ring and hiding round the corner. When he pulled back my OH cracked him on the bum with a lunge whip and he never did it again.
 
Bolters, rearers and buckers, - in that order would be a defo no-no for me. Kickers, biters, would rather not entertain, but if they were exceptionally talented I might turn a blind eye. I personally think a lot of 'stable vices' can be overcome with time, patience and proper management. Some gripes you'll just have to live with, but why buy a horse with these known issues in the first place? There will always be other similar horses for sale without these problems. My Daughter's horse is proper bitch to clip and has to be sedated, but is a real sweet angel with the most sought after temperament in every other area! We are working on this and I feel in time we will overcome the problem.
 
No windsuckers, weavers or fence walkers. I can't bear a busy horse.

Rearers I would take a second look at and it would depend if it was a breed that had a naturally light front end.

Any horse that pinned its ears down the moment it saw a human and then double pinned them down when you spoke would be a no no too.
 
I wouldn't look at a horse that windsucked, cribbed or doesn't hack alone. I'd also not buy if the horse was a chronic rearer, bucker or bolter, but would still be interested if the rears and bucks were small excited ones.
 
I would never have a horse that was difficult to catch or a bolter, those are my two biggest no no's.

My horse can be a kicker in certain situations (it is rare for him nowadays but he did give me a nice fracture a couple of years back) and although I am fine with him I would never again have another known kicker as its just not nice when they connect!
 
I have a horse who windsucks and one who weaves (both did it before I got them!)
I dislike both but put up with it and try to manage it. I wouldn't want a box walker, that drives me nuts.
 
Absolutely no bolters, no serious 'going over backwards' rearers, nothing that is seriously aggressive (ie. aimed malicious kicking, biting etc) - unless there is a particularly good reason for it. Also nothing without a sense of self preservation, having experienced a horse like this I wouldn't ever want to go there again, although I don't think that counts as a vice! Everything else I would totally consider for the right horse, it would have to be something special for me to take a windsucker/cribber though.
 
My mare is a walking catalogue of vices, she wind sucks and cribs. During the time we've had her she's reared, bucked, napped, refused to load, been terrible for dentist and farrier, attempted to bite and kick, etc- we've worked hard to resolve most of these issues and does have a lot of good points. She's now pretty safe to handle but I would never knowingly buy a horse with any vices again.
 
Self-mutilation is horrible, and in general I believe any horse that suffers from this despite having a normal lifestyle is better off dead. I certainly wouldn't buy a horse that did it.
 
Just to comment on the horses that have learnt to pull back and will snap anything you tie them to - Tie them to the inner tube of a bicycle tyre. It stretches so far without letting them go that it renders the tactical short sharp jerk they do to break free useless.

The only vices that really put me off are wind sucking and box walking because I have to keep my horses in livery yards so the amount of adaptation I can do to relieve these habits is limited. Everything else is workable, but I wouldn't necessarily choose it.
 
I hate door kickers and ones that are constantly "begging" when they're tied up. Real pet hate of mine! I know it can easily be sorted, but still! Other than that, I'm not a fan of rearers!
 
DabDab said:
Just to comment on the horses that have learnt to pull back and will snap anything you tie them to - Tie them to the inner tube of a bicycle tyre. It stretches so far without letting them go that it renders the tactical short sharp jerk they do to break free useless.

.
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Now that I think would have worked. He had theshort sharp jerk down to a t. I will remember that! :)
 
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