Decision re livery

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CBAnglo

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I cant decide between 2 livery yards so please help me make up my mind.

Yard 1
YO more laid back (some would say lazy)
Stables small (11x12) which occasionally leak
school small (20x30) freezes in winter
extensive hacking on doorstep
summer turnout - 4 hours a day (6 days) in herd of 12 in a 10 acre field (May - December)
Winter turnout 4 hours a day (3 days) in herd of 4 in a 20 acre field - very muddy entrance and quite a trek to turnout
Maintenance on yard lacking i.e. right now there is no electricity connected to stables therefore no lights/power
no storage

Yard 2
YO lives on site and can be tetchy
summer turnout 4-5 hours a day (6 days) in small individual field (May - September)
Winter turnout is 2-3 hours in a mud paddock with hay/haylage (Oct-April)
School is decent size (20x40) and rubber so doesnt freeze as badly
Maintenance on yard better
Stables (14x12) and (12x12)
Extensive own storage
hacking decent - some roadwork first though

So which one should I choose? Yard 2 is more expensive by £15 but not really a big difference as more important to have a better environment for the horses. I like yard 1 because more turnout but yard 2 has bigger stables and they spend more time in their stables than the field and also t/o every day better than 5 days a week? and the school is better.

Neither is ideal but the best of a bad bunch in the area as I need part livery and not many places seem to offer this!
 
If you really do not have any other options ( and if I were you I would keep looking) then option 2 sounds safer and more reliable - unless you are in a real rush I would wait and look around. If you go to either I suspect you will move again
soon. Good luck.
 
Kind of in a real rush ... hence why I cant make up my mind.

Unfortunately these are the only 2 yards where I would actually get to see my horses during the week, let alone ride.

It is incredibly difficult finding livery for 2 horses ... especially when you have a youngster who needs to be out everyday and an anglo that goes insane if he doesnt have regular turnout.

DOes your opinion change if I say I am at yard 1 and the horses have finally settled in after 6 months and the option is to stay there or uproot the horses to yard 2?
 
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If you really do not have any other options ( and if I were you I would keep looking) then option 2 sounds safer and more reliable - unless you are in a real rush I would wait and look around. If you go to either I suspect you will move again
soon. Good luck.

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Agree with this, other than would have said go for Option 1. Having had a YO from hell some years ago am still scarred from the experience!
 
i'd always go for whichever had more turnout but since theres not alot of difference and yard 2 has slightly more to offer then prob go for that.
 
Having had a YO from hell some years ago am still scarred from the experience!

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Yes, I also had a very difficult YO who was also my trainer which made it worse. Its the reason I chose Yard 1 but to be honest the lack of attention and commitment is worse when I am relying on this person to provide day to day care for my horses. It would be fine on DIY but I simply cannot get up there to t/o etc. As it is, I go up in the evenings and muck out (yes they are on livery), change water, fill haynets etc as these things arent always done (and I mean to any standard let alone mine).

With my old YO I didnt see the horses Mon-Thurs but I knew I they were in one piece and had hay and water. With this YO I am getting at least 1 call a month saying "Not sure what you want to do but x has come in from the field with an open wound. I have put sudocrem on it but you might want to come and have a look and see if you want to call the vet."

Yes, he does think sudocrem cures all evils (even open wounds!) and no he cannot make the assessment to call the vet himself nor do I trust him to. The other YO probably knows about as much, but as the horses are in separate fields next to each other, less likely that they are going to come in with open kick wounds etc.

I guess the real question is, should I move to Yard 2 or stay at Yard 1 and look for another yard? Bearing in mind that there are the best of a bad bunch AND I want to stay in the area because its the only way I will see them during the week and I spent the last 18 months never seeing them except at weekends. Or maybe I am being completely selfish and should move them further out, with better turnout and try to see them once in the week and both weekend days?

Why is everything to do with horses so difficult?
 
I suppose it depends on what the issues are with YO on yard 2 is what do you mean when you say a bit tetchy.

If there is no electricity on yard 1 is it not going to be a bit tricky in the winter to see your horses in the dark?

Personally if you can afford part livery I would go further away and only see them at the weekends and then take days off work to see them occasionally during the week than be at a yard that I did not think was suitable for my horse. Esp if all you are doing is the chores in the evening that you are actually paying someone to do for you - so you get less quality time with your horse anyway.

I have come to the conclussion that happy horse = happy me.
 
YO2 is basically nice but can be a bit grumpy - but then isnt everyone? I pay rent on time and look after my horses and abide by the yard rules so I hope I dont incur his wrath.

There is electricity on Yard 1 - its just something happened to the fuse box about 3 weeks ago and it hasnt been fixed yet. The floodlights and the electricity in the tack room etc still work, its just no power to the stable block.

They would be on part livery at both - the price difference between the two yard isnt a lot in the grand scheme of things.

The problem with them being so far away is that one has to be exercised at least 4 times a week because of a sacroiliac injury (basically every other day) and the other becomes a nightmare if he has more than 3 days off and he is particular about who he will let ride him. They used to be at a yard where they had 12 hours t/o in winter and 16 hours in summer (they both refuse to stay out overnight) but they still needed to be ridden during the week so I would need full livery but am very particular about who rides them (they have been retrained by new trainer and I dont want to waste efforts). If I had to pay my instructor to ride them in the week it would cost the same again in livery!

I thought with a minimum of 3-4 hours of turnout a day they would be alright, especially if in larger stables. And they would be ridden every other day, sometimes every day.

There is another yard I could go to which is perfect in terms of t/o and standard of care and I could probably get there twice during the week. BUT my trainer wouldnt travel that far out (she is quite old now so doesnt like to spend long periods of time in the car) and she has really turned me and the horses around these last 6 months so I dont want to leave her. Maybe in another one or two years but for now I still have so much to learn from her that I (and the horses) need our weekly lessons.
 
This is always a very presonal decision CBAnglo. But if it was me I would ALWAYS, ALWAYS, without any hesitation, go for where my horse/s would be happiest. Horses can manage without lighting, without flashy schools, without a ton of things that make life easier and bearable for people. They won't even care if the stable is a foot or so smaller as long as they have their routine and turnout. What makes a horse happy (there's always the exception!) is max turnout, decent grazing, friends, routine, somewhere to get away from the flies, somewhere to have a break from the winter weather and - year round - a regular check to make sure legs pointing the right way etc. TBH neither yard has brill turnout to my mind and I'm not a fan of individal fields. I wouldn't worry too much about maintenance as you can always offer to help and DIY the stuff in/around your own stables anyway. Big stuff like safe fencing and no ragwort is a must of course. TBH neither sounds ideal to me but then life is never ideal. I'd go with whichever one you think will make your horses happier. One thing to seriously chew over is that you said both neds had settled in the yard you are at now and were happy. Sometimes the grass looks greener (ha ha!) somewhere else but often that's just an illusion. If you're really struggling why not try this. Go up to your neds and ask them whether they are happy where they are or would like to move. What do you think they'd say if they could talk? There's your answer. x
 
Yes, they have settled but I dont know if they are happy.

One of them has picked up a habit of biting and snatching at anyone who walks past which is just so upsetting for me. The other one has stopped being so gobby. The hard thing is that they are both so different I think they would be happier at separate yards although that would make my life impossible.

I think the stables are too small at yard 1 for a 16hh and a chunky 15.2hh - one of them loves rolling (when I have mucked out and his bed is actually clean!) and he has been cast several times. Not saying it wont happen in a bigger stable but I think it is less likely to occur. But then the turnout is better at yard 1 and I have always thought the more t/o the better, especially in winter. Not sure it is safe though - over the last 6 months casting horse has come in from field with 3 injuries requiring stitches, staples and more stitches.

So as you can see, both are not ideal but one has better turnout and the other better stables. I think the other pros & cons weight each other out but I need to decide whether 4 hours in a field are more important than 20 hours in a big stable or vice versa. I cant decide which is the most important for them and if only a slight difference, is it worth moving them to a place where ultimately there will still be problems but I will have to go through the whole settling in process again.

Sorry to keep going on - I havent been able to sleep at all these last 3 days as I cant seem to make my mind up which isnt a good sign. I might actually end up with 4 stables.
 
Do they really need to be ridden so much could they be lunged instead which would be easier than finding someone to ride them?

You know your horses the best and what they need. It sounds like you will struggle to find your perfect yard (but then so do most of us) so I guess you just have to do what you think is best for your horses - could you box them to your trainer so she does not have to travel?
 
I know what it is like trying to decide which yard to go to - it caused me sleepless nights as well.

I think turnout is more important for some horses than others. Mine stresses big time if he is not turned out 24/7 during the summer and will only tolerate being in in the winter. Others seems to not mind being in more.

Horses are naturally herds animals and I think socialisation with other horses is also important for them - but again depends what they have been used to.

The injuries tend to be worse when horses have less turnout as when they do get out they find being out so exciting and have more energy so they go out so tend to run around more than a horse that goes out all day every day.
 
One does not lunge as he was "rebroken" 3 times before I got him ... well he does, but he spend most of his time trying to kill you. No-one is prepared to get in there with him. I can just about lunge him on the right rein but on the left he just runs at you with all feet in the air. I have lunged some really big and powerful warmbloods and they are nothing compared to him. The other one is a sweetie on the lunge now, but as he has a sacroiliac injury I limit the amount of lunging I do as I dont want him doing small circles.

I think it is just so hard to get anyone to ride them. I would buy a trailer and go to my instructor but she is not based at a yard and made the smart decision 20 years ago to never keep a horse in England again - it is just too stressful.

They are both happy to come in but if they dont go out for a couple of hours every day they become very restless and then the alternate days they do go out they are a handful as "they are being turned out". So I think perhaps it is better to be in a mud paddock for 2-3 hours every day for 7 months than 4 hours every 48 hours for 4 months.

The thing that frustrates me about Yard 1 is that in winter they would be able to go out everyday if you were there to t/o and bring in - the reason they restrict the t/o is because the winter field is so far away that it takes 20 mins to turn the horses out and they dont have the staff!
 
I choose yard 2 as the lesser of two evils I think, but I have been deliberating since you posted last night!

I was going with Yard 1 initially until you added the post about the clueless YO. That, coupled with the lack of maintenance forced me to choose Yard 2.

The individual turnout is a drawback - but once you have your feet under the table there perhaps you could persuade YO to let you have two fields combined for your two, if they are compatible?
 
Well you know where I think you should move to!lol!
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Seriously, I would choose yard 2. I know you are seriously not happy at yard 1 and your boys aren't either. Okay Yard 2 as slightly less winter turnout but they still get to go out and stretch their legs. You know the new YO is tetchy so it won't be a shock when you get there and at least they would get sudocreamed all the time
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Thanks Bounty.

Actually my two do not get on in the field (or anywhere except on hacks) so individual turnout is a plus side for me! They really are like chalk and cheese which is why I chose yard 1 for the anglo (as he needed the most attention) but poor little cb is getting injured on a weekly basis so want to move him to yard 2 but worried about stressy anglo. anglo could go out with another horse if the other owner agreed - there are a few that do this they just keep the gate open between 2 fields.

to be honest, YO2 doesnt know much more than YO1. the thing that really scares me is what if Yard 2 is worse and I cant move back to yard 1. Yard 1 is small (total 17 horses) and no-one leaves. People at yard 1 say they have been at every other yard in the area and this is the best one.

Yard 2 has 27 horses and there is a steady turnover of liveries, but then quite a few who have been there 10 years or more. Have heard from someone on here that YO2 changes mind a lot from day to day and that she was very unhappy and I think there was a disagreement about liveries helping each other whereas I will be on part livery so no question about asking others to do my horses for me. This is what made me change my mind about yard 2 as otherwise I have made decision to go.

I suppose it really is just the fear that if I move to yard 2 I dont have any other options if I dont like it. Being at yard 1 means that I always have the option of yard 2 (if stables are available). I dont want to leave the area for another year or so because of trainer, but I suppose if I have to leave yard 2 to go somewhere else then I will just have to leaver her.

Maybe I should keep one at each yard. they are only about 2 miles apart so realistically I could manage to do 2 but would be a pain for farrier, vet, lessons etc. And not sure how stressy anglo will cope without his brother (who hates him so will be happy to see the back of him).
 
However, I do think if you are only using either of these yards as a stop gap until you get the one you want then I would stay at yard 1 as the grass is not always greener.
 
I am using them as a stop gap for at least another year. Then I am moving to your yard. I just dont think I can handle any more vet bills.

I had this same decision to make last November and I chose yard 1 and I have spent the last 6 months looking at other yards in the area. Yard 2 is the only one that I felt was an alternative. If it doesnt work out there, I dont know how long I would be able to stick it out and then I will need to find livery for 2 horses in winter and settle them in. It will be a nightmare. So I either move now or not bother until next year. I just dont know how many more injuries the CB is going to be able to take.
 
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I am using them as a stop gap for at least another year. Then I am moving to your yard. I just dont think I can handle any more vet bills.



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Are you on the waitlist for our yard? As they are taking on any new people now I didnt think, they are waiting for natural wastage as want to scale the horses down a bit. And even that has bad points all yards have good and bad points
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My gosh!
I am in as much of a condrum as you now!
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I'm still saying 2 though - if it means your CB will be safer and less at risk of injury it may well be worth it. Not sure what to do with Anglo though, sorry
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Thanks Bounty ... am more inclined to lean towards 2 myself. Am off to the yard now to check on them and make sure they have hay/water etc and will sit down and have a good talk with them. Wish I could just trial the other yard for 2 weeks and if I didnt like it move back to yard 1.

In the beginning I really liked yard 1 and was so glad I moved away from previous domineering YO. But that was the honeymoon period I think and now I just hate being there.

The people for the most part are fine so its not even that. I dont get involved in the gossip etc and I like going down late in the evening so I have the place to myself. for the most part the care is ok - they have water (after a fashion) and ad lib hay which are my two biggest concerns.

Right then - 75% sure its yard 2 pending visit tonight.

If it doesnt work out, I will just find another yard further away with better turnout. I just hate moving - will put up with anything on the human side but want my horses to be happy.

How are your lot?
 
Let us know how you get on tonight
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You say you'd like to trial yard 2 for a fortnight - but like you said you had the honeymoon period with the current yard so it probably wouldn't leave you any the wiser even if you did have the opportunity to trial it
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My lot are a mixed bag really!
Rage is 11days post Kissing Spine surgery and Boo is just coming up to week 6 of box rest after damaging her DDFT whilst hooning in the field
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Little Fia is bloody fantastic though!
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We have achieved everything I wanted for this year so she is turned away for the time being - she might come back in to do a little bit in the autumn though, we'll see.
Tills and Pancake are gorgeous - enough said otherwise I will gush!
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I guess you need to be 100% sure that the 2nd yard is going to be better. If you can survive at yard 1 for another year then it may be the best option. However if you really think your boys are going to keep hurting themselves then it might be worth moving.

Have sent you a PM
 
Yeah, this is the problem. How can I be 100% sure of anything. The worrying thing is, if yard 2 doesnt work out then I will have to move them further out as there are literally no other yards who will do part livery ... or even assisted DIY! That means I wont see them Mon-Thurs and the youngster will definitely revert to being a monster again ... wont go into again why no-one else can ride/lunge him.

Whereas have been at yard 1 for 8 months now so maybe it is better the devil you know. Although in that time the youngster has been injured sooooo many times. House & Jackson love him. And it doesnt matter where he is - field or stable - he gets injured. It isnt isolated either - the vet is usually out once a month for one horse or another.
 
I'd keep searching for something other than either of these two yards from reading your further posts. Really hope you can find somewhere suitable soon.
 
Yes, I am aware that these two really arent ideal. However I am at yard 1 and have the prospect of moving to yard 2. should I do it?

I will be looking to move again in a year (hopefully) so these two really are just going to be a stop gap. But which one would be better in paper?

Yeard 1 - more turnout but really small stables (horse's settled - poss not happy and have loads of injuries). There are bigger stables on the yard, and if I had 2 of those I wouldnt mind the rest. But no-one leaves those stables (unless they are taken away) and I have a feeling that the yard owner will make 2 stables into 3 (like he did with mine - was was previously two 16x12 became three 10x12) which is fine for anything under 14.2hh but i have a 16hh and a chunky 15.2hh.

Yard 2 - less turnout, big stables (12x12 and a 14x12), individual paddocks so less likely to come in with kick injuries (one of mine now has a capped hock).

Need to make a decision by Saturday! And have changed my mind so many times now that I cant remember what the last decision was!
 
CBAnglo you should come to my yard! Then get a trailer, arrange to take your horses to a venue that your trainer is teaching at and voila! Orrrr offer to drive your trainer to and from the yard
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haha!
 
Yes, I knew you would say that!

Anyway, you told me that your yard is now full ... so no longer an option.

See, I procrastinate so long that I dont actually have to make decisions ... I just run out of options. How do you think I have managed to stay at Yard 1 for so long?
 
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