Dental fees for someone who doesn’t know about horses

It seems you may have been lead to believe it really wouldn’t be that big of a deal. If ALL the front teeth are missing the horse will not easily be able to graze or pull from a haynet. They may be able to chew depending how many back teeth are left but the risk of choke or quidding will increase. Haylage will be a softer option but not great for gums. The time it takes to make up feeds will increase if they need mash/softer or shorter stem options and with CPL you must be aware of the ingredients, for example my horse can’t have anything processed so expensive organic feed only, with zero soya, alfalfa or carrot as it causes issues with his cpl. A lady I knew with a 30+ year old who had about 4 teeth left spent hours daily making up his feeds and using a pair of scissors to cut his haylage into shorter edible bits..all done for the love of a horse she had had for most of his life. A loaner is simply not going to put that much effort in.
 
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I wonder what the deceased owner would have preferred happened to her horse. I know if it was mine I would have wanted it pts. Different when it is the loving owner caring for it. My sister knows that is what I would prefer for mine and likewise for hers as they are all compromised in one way or another. Very sorry you are in this situation.
 
OP I wonder would it be any help if you showed this thread to those family members who seem to be unaware of the reality of this situation, and that keeping the horse going merely because you can is very often not the kindest thing to do. Very unfair if you are having to handle this without any experienced support, but I do hope you can manage to sort things out and you will not for one moment feel any guilt or lack of care with whatever decision you come to.
 
Unexpectedhorse said:
I like to think they’d not want us up to our eyeballs in debt though
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If god forbid anything happened to me I certainly wouldn’t want my loved ones saddled with horse related debt.

It’s ok to say significant treatment, follow up care and all that goes with it (including the bills) isn’t what you signed up for.
 
Having just lost a horse with, amongst other issues, severe teeth issues, I think the best advice would be to allow your horse to slip over rainbow bridge and re-join his beloved original owner.

The cost and effort of caring for him after having a lot of teeth removed will be huge and his quality of life could be challenging. My old lad was very old and had worn his teeth to nothing, watching him wanting to eat was pitiful.

You have been very kind in trying to fulfil the wishes of the owner but you are facing an expensive and worrying challenge, you have to think of yourself not just the horse.
 
it says it covers root canals & broken teeth, and gum disease but not EORTH which is what they tried to put it under prior and got declined.
I’ve tried ringing them this morning and they are still messing me about, I think they want me to ultimately set up a new claim instead of continuing the claim on but then he won’t be covered! This is turning into a huge nightmare.
 
Unexpectedhorse said:
it says it covers root canals & broken teeth, and gum disease but not EORTH which is what they tried to put it under prior and got declined.
I’ve tried ringing them this morning and they are still messing me about, I think they want me to ultimately set up a new claim instead of continuing the claim on but then he won’t be covered! This is turning into a huge nightmare.
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As has been said, if you get his teeth out he’s going to need more intensive care than nearly anyone would be able to provide, especially on livery, and his maintenance diet alone would cost a fortune.
I suggest you need, if you are being pressured by family, to get insurance to say why they won’t pay in writing and the family members that want to horse treated can pay for it and for his feed afterwards. It will be so much money. He’ll never be able to graze again, which ultimately is what horses are meant to do.
 
I’ve spoken to the insurance again, they’ve said he’s only covered for 3 grand. The vets are saying they will remove 3 (the most wobbly) and wait for the others to become wobbly, so I won’t be able to claim again on the insurance in future when the next lot need removing will I? As it’s then a “old existing” problem.
It’s becoming a right headache, he needs them out before it becomes a welfare issue.
 
No insurance won’t cover it at all as vet has already wrote about EORTH.
Looking at a estimated bill of £1,000 for two teeth out, and widening the teeth so food doesn’t get stuck in between 2 hours job but obviously can take longer and be more expensive. Only have £500 left from the estate. Vet said the eorth is evolving very fast and will need the rest out probably in 9-12 months.
Family want to do a payment plan, but once that’s paid it’s going to be go again and pay more thousands out.
Would you all say the £500 is best to be used to PTS?
 
That’s what I thought. Now to convince the rest of them. Even the vet is saying to me that we need to be realistic here along with the CPL that he could end up needing thousands of pounds worth of work while he slowly declines. Thousands just so someone else can ride him it doesn’t make sense. I know they don’t want him PTS for sentimental reasons but this is silly money.
 
I am another who would support PTS for this horse.

There will be significant and ongoing management requirements to keep his weight, and it will be costly. You will also need to consider come winter that he won't be able to efficiently graze, and if he is out in a herd then you will not necessarily be able to supplementary feed which means either a lot of time in the stable, or individual turnout which also (depending on who you ask) can be unfair on the horse in itself. I also wouldn't progressivley take this many teeth out as and when over the next 'period of time' as it really is quite a severe procedure as YCBM has noted. You have done your best OP, and I'm sorry if this decision will upset the family, but most horse owners would support your decision here.
 
I think it’s because they are listening to the yard owner’s opinions. But her opinion is spend, spend, spend. Not understanding people have limited pockets.
I asked the vet if we can just take all the offending teeth out now before they get worse, but they won’t, so yet more trauma to the horse having it done and done and done again. Not to mention the risk of infections and possible colic while having this done or afterwards. He’d have to be pts if we went forward and got colic. Just frustrating.
 
OP I feel really sorry for you being in this situation, but you are at the start of a slippery slope that is highly likely to end in the horse needing to be PTS for financial or welfare reasons. I think it would be far better to do that now rather than put the horse through a lot of painful procedures requiring ongoing care. The horse will know nothing about it - there are worse things than being PTS, like having a lot of invasive surgery and not being able to eat without pain.

I think you know from all the responses on here what you should do. You have had the courage to come on here and get advice from the many very knowledgeable people on this site, who have suggested what should be done. Hopefully their advice will outweigh the sentimental responses from people who know nothing about horses and the advice from people who stand to make money if you continue to treat. As suggested above, showing these responses to family members may help them to reconcile themselves with PTS if that is what you decide.
 
My partner has a much loved old horse with dental issues that are getting worse. He also has a heart condition. The horse dentist says the six monthly appointments he has been having are no longer enough and he needs sedating for major works. We haven't looked into the cost but will not be putting him through that, or anything else major for that matter, and have decided to let him go when he starts to struggle.
 
I am sorry for your loss. Sadly this is a horse that is not going to be easy to loan out due to it's medical conditions requiring time and money and a knowledgeable loaner to keep on top of to ensure he has a good quality of life.

I completely understand that for sentimental reasons the family want to keep the horse but that might not be in the best interests of the horse.

I would put together a spreadsheet of all the costs and management requirements to keep this horse going and present it to the family. When they see it they will probably be more realistic about how even if the teeth issue is resolved that it will be challenging to find the right person to loan the horse.

I am presuming that this horse is a cob because of the CPL and depending on his temperament and if he can be ridden if quiet and weight bearing you might be able to find an RDA centre who might be willing to loan but I cannot see there being many options if you do not have not the resources for him.

The YO will be looking at it from a different perspective and may herself be upset about the passing of your relative and thinking about what your relative would have done if alive but that is a very different situation from yours. A lot of owners will get into debt and spend hours dealing with complex horse care. But that is very different from inheriting a horse and it is not your hobby or passion and you don't have knowledge and you don't have the resources to pay for vets fees and full livery care.

In terms of costs I paid £250 to have 2 wolf teeth removed including sedation. It was not an easy job vet had to do it in two visits.

The British Horse Society have a scheme called friends at the end and they provide support with regards to PTS which might be useful for you if you decide on that as they can even be there on the day and if the YO is not supportive of your decision.
 
I'm sorry you are facing this. Personally I think the kindest thing would be to PTS. The horse is looking at a drawn out period of medical interventions which will leave him needing extra care. I am sure his old owner would want the best for him. I would just make the appointment and tell no-one else what is happening prior to the day.
 
Sorry, I've not read all the replies to this post. Sorry you are in this position OP.
I had a horse with EORTH and I swore that if i ever had another with it badly it would be pts. The one thing I would urge is to contact a specialist in the field, I can highly reccomend Chris- this is his site

Equine Dental Clinic | Centre of Excellence for Equine Dentistry

EDC is the UK's first veterinary practice dedicated to equine dentistry | General, advanced & referral dentistry | CPD Courses | Equine Dentist Dorset
equinedentalclinic.co.uk equinedentalclinic.co.uk

My own vets tried and failed to remove broken damaged teeth and roots. The poor horse was in theatre for hours at a time several times and it was really pretty hideous. He was in pain and miserable, he got ulcers and anemia, he was quite ill for some time. This process cost a fortune (mostly insured)

Eventually I contacted Chris who was incredibly helpful over the phone and via email. They travel the country so came to my own vets and completed the treatment swiftly and in a much easier way for the horse to handle. They literally cleaned up the mess previous vets (a proper equine referral clinic) had left. They did this in half the time and for half the price because its what they do.

FF to now several years later and the horse is alive still, retired and back with his family (I had him on loan) he now seems to graze ok- that took a long time. He also needs quite expensive regular dentals as he has problems with his remaining back teeth but he is a good weight, healthy and happy.
 
I would support your having the horse pts.

Many of us horse owners and former owners are bonkers about our horses - your comment about her sleeping the stable when the horse coliced hit a nerve, because I suspect most owners would consider that normal, along with visiting multiple times a day, getting into debt and generally being completely obsessed, so although this is a tough time for you I think you’re getting closer to understanding what’s best for you and the horse.

And thank you for doing your best for him. Many on here will have left horses in wills to friends or family and I hope we would all say that it’s better to put to sleep a day early than a day late. Look after yourself.
 
I think you would be right to let him go. It's a huge commitment if you are nuts about your horse, but being sensible about an animal that you didn't choose to have is where you are now. The initial costs are nothing compared to the time spent on aftercare and ongoing feed costs. Horses with no front teeth can figure out grazing, but can't go out on short grass for obvious reasons. Maintaining a healthy weight, especially on a livery yard that probably doesn't have the set up for a dentally challenged horse will be time-consuming and expensive. Feeds will need soaking and if hay is no longer suitable the substitutes are very expensive to feed as complete hay replacers. Then you have the time and expense of the CPL. Both conditions can make a horse absolutely miserable. Mites are awful - imagine being constantly itchy.

Nobody in their right mind is going to want to loan a horse that requires that amount of time and financial commitment.

Are those who want to keep the horse going prepared to put their hands in their pockets long-term, and spend hours soaking feeds, flushing out a sore mouth, treating sore legs (risky, if you don't know what you're doing) and paying out for ongoing vet care in a compromised, aging horse that they are getting little out of?
 
I'd suggest you have a meeting with the family and go through the issues with this horse one by one.

Teeth.

May be onging issues which would mean that the horse would not be able to be loaned out for some time.
I would estimate at least one year maybe long before loaning is possible.
During that time the horse would need full livery paid for with specialist diet and extra costs for care.
Specialist diet will probably be needed for the next 10 years, assuming horse lives to 26, which is not unreasonable.
Teeth will never be insurable again so you will need a fund to support emergency vets fees and ongoing care.

Loaning sounds like a great option.... but no one is likley to take on an oldre horse with onging issues, who may or may not be ridable.

The family are, I assume, aware that a loan can end at any moment and I'd suggest that they have a £3000 fund for transport costs, livery costst to include one month up front
and any vet issues which may arise.

You always need a PTS fund in case of emergencies.

I'd suggest asking how much each of them will be paying into this and telling them that if the funds are not available in one month that you will be having the horse quietly pts.

Its so easy to say carry on and keep going if you are not paying the bills or watching an animal suffer.
 
Please whatever the family decide do not loan this horse out. The only people who would take him would sadly be someone who was ignorant of his needs. He would definitely notvreceive the care he would need.
This horse has multiple problems and it's wonderful thar people care but love is not enough. He will not suffer at all if he is PTS kindly.
He will cost a fortune and unless someone in the family has a lot of time and deep pockets he will suffer x sorry you are having to deal with this. X
 
Unexpectedhorse said:
No insurance won’t cover it at all as vet has already wrote about EORTH.
Looking at a estimated bill of £1,000 for two teeth out, and widening the teeth so food doesn’t get stuck in between 2 hours job but obviously can take longer and be more expensive. Only have £500 left from the estate. Vet said the eorth is evolving very fast and will need the rest out probably in 9-12 months.
Family want to do a payment plan, but once that’s paid it’s going to be go again and pay more thousands out.
Would you all say the £500 is best to be used to PTS?
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Absolutely yes to your last question. In the interests both of the horse and of the family.
I'm so sorry you are facing this and I hope you can get the family to see reason.
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