Detectives needed - Horse Related

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Ifmpw

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So, brought a 4 year old 1.9.24 - 5* vetting and x rays - nothing of note
Had saddle fitted first day i owned him -
Few weeks later- had saddle re fitted and it was 2 sizes to small -on the gusset and the girth was not right for his shape
Got a bit of mud fever - being treated on rear hind
Has had back checked - no soreness, very flexible.
Stands at mount block
when you get on he humps his back and has kicked out twice with his off side rear hind, today he bucked - then he just carries on happy to walk and trot - ground to slippery for canter
other things
he is young and is playing alot, gallops in field
when his saddle is on it is more so - if you lift up his front legs ie to put hoof boots on, he drops down ie crouches down, both near side and off side.
First time he kicked out was 2 weeks ago, this was when we he was asked to move off from the mounting block - I put this down to me having jodhpur boots on - and him feeling warm legs not cold leather
, 2nd time (next day) I put it down to his reflective boots possibly irritating and him being a bit sore on his off side hind due to the mud fever.
He has not been ridden since then, up till this morn, and today it was a buck - not a "get off me buck" but a buck all the same, then walked out - short hack - no issues at all, If you get off him and then back on him - no reaction.
Vet and back lady due on Tuesday
Saddler coming again on Friday
Bit fitter coming 2nd Nov
Was very girthy with first girth, much better with the new straight cut girth.
Had his saddle re checked as he did run off from the mount block with me half in and half out saddle, when we found we had been fitted too narrow.
He is fed a small chaff fed before we ride
He is on ad lib hay/haylidge -
Turned out in a 4 for 8 hours a day

Stabled at night
Fed chaff and a handful of pony nuts
Most important thing to note - he is a nice "person" so i think their is a genuine issue not a behavioral one

anyone got any thoughts ?
 
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Melody Grey

Melody Grey

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The dipping down is strange and I’d want a vet considering that. Have you tried bringing front legs forward as you tack up to eliminate skin pinching under the girth? Is the saddlecloth well fitting?
 
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Ifmpw

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Melody Grey said:
The dipping down is strange and I’d want a vet considering that. Have you tried bringing front legs forward as you tack up to eliminate skin pinching under the girth? Is the saddlecloth well fitting?
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Hi

I pull his legs out in front, he is in a cottage craft girth, we girth up slowly and equally on both sides, have changed saddle cloth, made sure nothing is sticking in him like a label, or the securing devices, saddle cloth pulled up and fits well, no pressure any where
 
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Ifmpw

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Pearlsasinger said:
Cold backed is the old-fashioned term for 'there's something wrong but we don't know what'. I would suspect soreness, probably in the back. Who checked the back and what checks were done?
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he was vetted and back x rays done.
my usual physio, recommended by my vets and worked for me for many years, highly trusted saw him 3 weeks ago, no soreness, very flexible. He had had saddle fitter 2 days earlier but had not been ridden between back check and saddle check.
 
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Pearlsasinger

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Unfortunately neither physios nor vets have x-ray eyes!
I would be wondering about having the back x-rayed if there is no soft tissue damage to be found and all other checks are fine.

Eta just seen he was x rayed at the vetting. That is good, at least if you re test, you will be able to see any changes.
 
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Ifmpw

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tda said:
But vetting doesn't check the insides, and who rode him for the vetting, were they already on board / had been on before vet arrived
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The owner rode him at the vetting.
coming to think about it I never got on him first at the viewings - I always was the second to ride him - and like i say if you get off him and then get back on him their is no reaction at all.
First time he lifted his back was the day we put the first saddle on him to try at the fitting and I just put that down to trying a new saddle, which we did discarded quite quickly, he did not do it again when we tried different saddles on the same day.
 
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Ifmpw

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Pinkvboots said:
Ulcers and possibly badly fitted saddle?
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His first saddle was badly fitted, hence my own saddler came out after I had had him 3 weeks and moved him up to gusset widths, so yes it started with a badly fitted saddle, and girth to be honest, too much pressure on the front. Changed girth as advised to a straight cut cloth girth no elastic.
 
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If I read this rightly:
He's 4, so very much still in the learning phase and with his Kevin period approaching, not surprising that he bucks occasionally.

You bought him on 1 September this year? That means you've had him a bare 6 weeks, hardly time for him to settle. Moving home is stressful for horses and the new environment may need a while for them to adapt to.

I agree that you want him physically checked but if nothing is diagnosed I'd suggest giving him a break from ridden work, if possible increase his turn out time so that he develops mentally and physically. Meanwhile concentrate on getting to know each other through grooming and in hand work, then start again from basics.
 
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Marigold4

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Ifmpw said:
So, brought a 4 year old 1.9.24 - 5* vetting and x rays - nothing of note
Had saddle fitted first day i owned him -
Few weeks later- had saddle re fitted and it was 2 sizes to small -on the gusset and the girth was not right for his shape
Got a bit of mud fever - being treated on rear hind
Has had back checked - no soreness, very flexible.
Stands at mount block
when you get on he humps his back and has kicked out twice with his off side rear hind, today he bucked - then he just carries on happy to walk and trot - ground to slippery for canter
other things
he is young and is playing alot, gallops in field
when his saddle is on it is more so - if you lift up his front legs ie to put hoof boots on, he drops down ie crouches down, both near side and off side.
First time he kicked out was 2 weeks ago, this was when we he was asked to move off from the mounting block - I put this down to me having jodhpur boots on - and him feeling warm legs not cold leather
, 2nd time (next day) I put it down to his reflective boots possibly irritating and him being a bit sore on his off side hind due to the mud fever.
He has not been ridden since then, up till this morn, and today it was a buck - not a "get off me buck" but a buck all the same, then walked out - short hack - no issues at all, If you get off him and then back on him - no reaction.
Vet and back lady due on Tuesday
Saddler coming again on Friday
Bit fitter coming 2nd Nov
Was very girthy with first girth, much better with the new straight cut girth.
Had his saddle re checked as he did run off from the mount block with me half in and half out saddle, when we found we had been fitted too narrow.
He is fed a small chaff fed before we ride
He is on ad lib hay/haylidge -
Turned out in a 4 for 8 hours a day

Stabled at night
Fed chaff and a handful of pony nuts
Most important thing to note - he is a nice "person" so i think their is a genuine issue not a behavioral one

anyone got any thoughts ?
Click to expand...
I have a horse who did all of those things, including the dropping down, when backing her. I'm sorry to say that we xrayed her back and found kissing spine. She had had a rotational fall over a fence as a yearling and did herself all sorts of damage that was never treated. Was your horse's back xrayed at the vetting?
 
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Trouper

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If the vet/saddler/back lady etc can find nothing (and I agree re-xrayand consider ulcers) then I would be thinking his growing spurts are causing some conflicting strain on his muscles and all the interconnecting structures etc and he is just not strong enough to cope yet. If this is the case, then I would be thinking of doing a lot of ground work with him to build and strengthen all his muscular structures, particularly over his back, so that he can carry tack and you. It is not a process I would rush.
 
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Ifmpw

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Trouper said:
If the vet/saddler/back lady etc can find nothing (and I agree re-xrayand consider ulcers) then I would be thinking his growing spurts are causing some conflicting strain on his muscles and all the interconnecting structures etc and he is just not strong enough to cope yet. If this is the case, then I would be thinking of doing a lot of ground work with him to build and strengthen all his muscular structures, particularly over his back, so that he can carry tack and you. It is not a process I would rush.
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Hi
thank you, I had already decided he was going to have 12 months of hacking round the farm allowing him to mature, he is very settled in the stable and on the surface appears to be a really chilled out lad.

I do take my time with youngsters and fit the work to them, ie Imake a plan based on their body and brain, for example I had an ID whom did nothing but go for a pootle until she was 6 as it was so obvious she had a lot of growing to do, and she didnt jump a fence until she was 8 as that is what I felt was best. She is now the most sure footed horse I have ever owned, had I rushed her I think she would have had a bad fall
 
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Ifmpw

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Marigold4 said:
I have a horse who did all of those things, including the dropping down, when backing her. I'm sorry to say that we xrayed her back and found kissing spine. She had had a rotational fall over a fence as a yearling and did herself all sorts of damage that was never treated. Was your horse's back xrayed at the vetting?
Click to expand...
Hi thank you, I have had a full set of x rays, back, neck included - nothing on these
 
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