Different types of livery?

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SaddleUpSin

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Me again with my endless questions! So I’m hoping to buy my first horse by the spring, and livery around here seems to fill up rather quick. One place I feel will have livery space is my old college, only thing is I think they only take on full or working livery. As this will be my first, I’d rather be his only rider, so I think if I did board him there it would be full livery. Have sent them an email regarding what they have available. Only thing I’m unsure of is cost!

Does anyone have horses on full livery and do you feel it is worth what you pay? Does it affect your bond? It might be easier to fit around my 9-5 too and allow me more time for my studies (part time at said college around work). Also I find the idea of a generous indoor and outdoor school (regularly hosting events and clear round etc.) very appealing, alongside horsewalker, roundpen and a forest to ride through nearby. Not keen on the minimal turnout they get but I’m wondering if I could negotiate this to longer than a couple hours a day?
Decided I’m going to stay at home for a few more years as I’d rather invest money in something that makes me happy than flying the nest (have a good relationship with my mum also – she’s very important to me) so I could invest the money now into a yard with good training facilities whilst as I grow as a rider, then by the time I need to cut back I’ll be better equipped to make the most of less developed livery yards with less help available – if that makes any sense?

Pros and Cons? DIY vs Full? Preferences?
 
I can never understand why people think having a horse on DIY builds a bond. A horse neither notices nor cares who fills its hay nets, mucks out etc. Half the time the horse isn't even around as owner does this before bringing horse in. Always had horse on full livery so, as far as horse is concerned, I represent playtime - I am the one who does the fun things with it. Also, any time spent at yard is spent with horse, not mucking out, filling hay nets etc. Would never have horse on DIY.
 
I own a yard and do only full/part livery. I can honestly say that the horses know very well who their owner is and they have a special bond with them.
 
baran said:
I can never understand why people think having a horse on DIY builds a bond. A horse neither notices nor cares who fills its hay nets, mucks out etc. Half the time the horse isn't even around as owner does this before bringing horse in. Always had horse on full livery so, as far as horse is concerned, I represent playtime - I am the one who does the fun things with it. Also, any time spent at yard is spent with horse, not mucking out, filling hay nets etc. Would never have horse on DIY.
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Thats a very good way to see it! I guess its strange trying to imagine it from the horses point of view! Do you find it cost/time effective? Possible more so compared to DIY?
 
I could never have my horse on full livery.
To me, I want to see how much my horses poo, how much they drink, I want to turn them out and bring them every day and all of this DOES develop your bond with your horse. Horse ownership is not all about the fun stuff unfortunately and I'm pretty sure that not all horses class us riding them is as fun for them as perhaps it does for us.

I work full time plus have a business on the side and have dogs and relationship and still manage to see to my horses on a DIY basis. Perhaps looks for a DIY yard that offers assistance?
 
baran said:
I can never understand why people think having a horse on DIY builds a bond. A horse neither notices nor cares who fills its hay nets, mucks out etc. Half the time the horse isn't even around as owner does this before bringing horse in. Always had horse on full livery so, as far as horse is concerned, I represent playtime - I am the one who does the fun things with it. Also, any time spent at yard is spent with horse, not mucking out, filling hay nets etc. Would never have horse on DIY.
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Because DIY is less regimented and more lenient you do spend more time with your horse, even if it just quiet time. For example I get up early every morning to go and fly mask mine - this includes a quick cuddle and a treat. When I turn out I do carrot stretches with them in the field. When I rug up in the winter I make sure I leave them off for a few minutes so every can have a itch, or sometimes I help scratch that itch! In winter I muck out in the evenings, depending on the light/weather I either tie my up in the barn with hay or let them graze around the yard, I chat to them as I am going back and worth to the muck pile etc, if they are loose they come inside to "inspect" the stables. Basically, my horse isn't just another task for an employee to deal with, and they get so much more interaction - even through the most mundane tasks, for that reason I could never be on full livery.
 
SaddleUpSin said:
Thats a very good way to see it! I guess its strange trying to imagine it from the horses point of view! Do you find it cost/time effective? Possible more so compared to DIY?
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There are different types of DIY, round by us the phrase is 'assisted DIY' which in my case means my horse gets brought in from the field overnight, de-rugged, fed a breakfast (made up by me) and given a net and bioflow boots put on. Then lunchtime another net. Sometimes when I need to rush off after I've ridden in the evening or its too hot to turnout the YO will do this also f.o.c, I do every other Sunday as a minimum, and bring in and feed the whole lot so its swings and roundabouts and we help each other out. This is around £255 per month.

In the winter when they are only out for two hours a day (due to peat fields) I get the YO to muck out for me. This is £290 per month.
 
I've done DIY, Part and Full livery. Part was just because it was the only yard I could find so it included turnout or bring in and hay but I tended to go up twice a day anyway. We then moved to full livery, which again was the only suitable yard. I found it very difficult not to go up twice a day to begin with.

I love the yard, so we stayed and have been there 8 years. Two years ago I changed job and can spend 3-4 hours a day commuting, or need to work away on relatively short notice. Full livery means that my boy gets a routine and I know he's being well cared for. It also helps me manage costs to an extent because it's a fixed fee (not that I don't spend a fortune on supplements, treatments etc). These days I like that I can take a break if I want without feeling too guilty as our journey hasn't been plain sailing and sometimes I just need to take a step back.

I have met people who are extremely judgemental to those of us on full livery and there's an attitude that we don't care about our horses, are lazy etc, but from what I've seen that is completely unfounded. I don't miss DIY at all, but when I was on DIY I couldn't imagine not doing all the day to day care myself. I think don't knock any type of livery until you've tried it.

ETA - I should add that my horse is not just a "task" to be completed. I'm very lucky in that YO treats each and every horse as if they were his own, taking all individual needs into account. I'm sure there will be full livery yards where that isn't the case but you need to find a good one. Also - no bitching on our yard whereas that wasn't my experience on several DIY yards at all.
 
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I've had loans on DIY before, so thats what is the normal to me, the idea of full livery is so foreign! Full livery is at £110 p/week at this college. Not sure what this includes.
 
I had my newest horse on full livery at his old home before I bought him home .
In many ways I loved it when I was there I had nothing to do except groom and work on with him and exercise him .
I always sorted his bed when I was there I really enjoyed it it was so relaxing nothing to think about except tacking up and riding .
It was like a little holiday every day .
 
I'd really love to go back to the yard I was at for my loan, pay for services as and when, e/g £4 turnout, £1.5 pick out feet, totally tailored and a base rate of £25 p/week, lovely american barn, outdoor school and turnout all year (stabled nights in winter). But as you can imagine, its in high demand! The yard manager does all the jobs as well and I literally couldnt fault her. It was like a second home but spaces come up once in a blue moon!
 
Having been to two equine colleges, I would never keep a horse at one. There are various threads regarding keeping horses at one and it is the general consensus. Perhaps yours is better, but maybe do a search of this forum and see what people say about it.
 
claireandnadia said:
Horse ownership is not all about the fun stuff unfortunately and I'm pretty sure that not all horses class us riding them is as fun for them as perhaps it does for us.
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I find that rather sad. For me, the horse is fun. Also, I can only assume my horse enjoys it too. I never feed him so when he comes to the gate when he hears my car, it is in the expectation that he will be doing something, not because it is teatime.
 
baran said:
I can never understand why people think having a horse on DIY builds a bond. A horse neither notices nor cares who fills its hay nets, mucks out etc. Half the time the horse isn't even around as owner does this before bringing horse in. Always had horse on full livery so, as far as horse is concerned, I represent playtime - I am the one who does the fun things with it. Also, any time spent at yard is spent with horse, not mucking out, filling hay nets etc. Would never have horse on DIY.
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When money isn't an issue then Full Livery can work, but many horse owners cannot afford full livery & even diy price can sometimes be a struggle. DIY isn't always looked on a bond building, mainly as a cost effective way of affording a horse.
 
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Toby_Zaphod said:
When money isn't an issue then Full Livery can work, but many horse owners cannot afford full livery & even diy price can sometimes be a struggle. DIY isn't always looked on a bond building, mainly as a cost effective way of affording a horse.
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I agree the basic price of DIY is cheaper but it always surprises me when people don't factor in the extra petrol and mileage on the car. If you go up to your horse twice a day, surely that must cost a fortune. Anyone self-employed knows you have to add that into your costings.
 
My horse is on full livery for six months of the year and has a sharer but the sound of my car is the only one she reacts to, I'm the only one she whinnies or nickers at from her stable and the only one she'll lift her head for in the field 😂. Bonding is done through grooming, working and sharing time, not through mucking out while they are in the field and filling 14 haynets a week!
 
I've had mine diy, part and full. Each has their place and with the right yard would do either depending on our needs at the time.

What I wouldn't ever do again is have a horse at full livery at a college, standard of care just doesn't compare with a standard professional yard.
OP- one of the draws of a college is the facilities and one of the downsides is nearly always lack of decent turnout. You can ask for more but it's low for a reason
 
No way would i ever let anyone look after my horses, they are mine ...all mine but thats just me!
Ive worked with horses a long time ago and finally got my own, I worked with liveries who turned up had a stiff whisky to get on plods and liveries who might as well have been on diy.
I really do think its down to your own personal needs and what you want to get out of owning your own horse.
The only thing that would be a big no no from the op s post is 2 hours turnout. There is no way at all that that can be good for any fit and healthy horse.
 
Smogul said:
I find that rather sad. For me, the horse is fun. Also, I can only assume my horse enjoys it too. I never feed him so when he comes to the gate when he hears my car, it is in the expectation that he will be doing something, not because it is teatime.
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Not sure what you find rather sad about my comment Smogul? For me, winter is a pretty grim time of horse ownership and is certainly not as fun as it is in the summer. But it is full on DIY ownership and I love it otherwise I wouldn't do it.

We can all only 'assume' our horses enjoy being ridden but we don't know. For me, going round a circle for longer than half an hour bores the hell out of me and I can only 'assume' that some horses might feel the same but again, we don't know. The same has hacking, I love it but some people and horses don't.
 
I think it's swings and roundabouts when it comes to the type of livery. Some people like to sort out all of their horses daily activities, beds, feeds etc and will opt for DIY. Some people are only on DIY because they can't afford any other option (same could be said for part). I am on DIY at the moment, I've never done full and tbh I can't imagine not going up the yard everyday and doing everything for my boy, though that's easy to say now it's summer and I don't have mucking out to do.

I have factored in my costs and it is cheaper for me to drive to and from the yard to turn out and bring in twice a day in winter then it is to pay for the yard to do it (they do 'extras' at a charge) and I don't really mind, it's a nice way to start my morning with a cuddle from my beastie. Saying that though, I have on occasion paid for someone to muck out the stable and it is SO lovely to come to the yard to a clean stable knowing all you need to do is cuddle, groom and ride (and feed !) :)

I don't know if i would ever do full as I do like to be in control of certain things like feeding etc but if i could afford it I would pay part or maybe just for all the mucking out to be done :D

I have a haybar so no haynets for me!! That was a godsend when I bought that!

OP - the 2 hours turnout would concern me... I would consider looking for other yards first before you decide on the college.

I think if full is your only option and you could afford it then that will be ok. So long as your spend plenty of time with your horse then there is no reason your bond should really differ. Like people have said, they don't care who is mucking out their stables. There are nice parts to DIY too though...
 
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I had one on full livery once and it wasn't for me - I never felt I got to know her well enough. I'm not one that lingers over chores or enjoys them but I do find them a useful way of knowing my horses and their health in a way riding alone doesn't allow me.
 
I've been on all types of livery over the years.

I can 100% confirm that in terms of bonding with horse there has been absolutely no difference between DIY/assisted/part (some call full). But then I am a fairly involved part/full owner and I can tell just by looking at my horse if they are ok or not.

The only type of livery that I definitely don't have the same bond is competition livery. I get other positives from that but I'm definitely not as close to my event horse as I am with the ones I'm involved with daily
 
claireandnadia said:
We can all only 'assume' our horses enjoy being ridden but we don't know. For me, going round a circle for longer than half an hour bores the hell out of me and I can only 'assume' that some horses might feel the same but again, we don't know. .
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Ha ha I'm with you on that one! That's why I never lunge (on the odd occasion that I do) for more than 30 mins (that includes stretching, warm up, cool down and jumping/polework) and I rarely school for more than 25-30mins.
 
Before moving to home Dusty was on part-livery. She was looked after in the day but I turned up later to skip out, fill late-nights nets and ride/groom. On the weekends, I was the one looking after Dusty.
When I was on DIY and now at home I do have to say our bond is stronger, but that could be simply I've grown up a bit (I was 8 on livery and am now 13) so on some respects I think DIY is a good option.

part-livery for me was about £20 a month.
 
pixie said:
Having been to two equine colleges, I would never keep a horse at one. There are various threads regarding keeping horses at one and it is the general consensus. Perhaps yours is better, but maybe do a search of this forum and see what people say about it.
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I was an equine student at this college, and although I didnt enjoy the course, I know the horses are kept and treated to a high standard.

I'm really hoping to go back to my old yard with options to add services per day, say my bike broke down I could ring the yard manager and add a day full livery for £8.

Thank you for all points of view!
 
me_and_my_connie said:
Before moving to home Dusty was on part-livery. She was looked after in the day but I turned up later to skip out, fill late-nights nets and ride/groom. On the weekends, I was the one looking after Dusty.
When I was on DIY and now at home I do have to say our bond is stronger, but that could be simply I've grown up a bit (I was 8 on livery and am now 13) so on some respects I think DIY is a good option.

part-livery for me was about £20 a month.
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Really?

I had mine on DIY for years, although a friend who lived on site used to turn out for me in the mornings. When I had my operation I put him on part livery and after my operation I found I liked it enough to stay on part livery and it wasn't actually that much more expensive. I found it really nice to go up, groom, ride and then chill with him in his box (in in daytime in summer) and actually felt our bond was much better. In the highly unlikely event of getting another horse I'd either speak very nicely to my friend and ask to put it in her field, or put it on part livery. I don't think I would do DIY again.
 
I've always done DIY, mainly due to cost. Straight out of uni and in my first job it was all I could afford and 16 years later I still do it - partly out of habit and partly as I love my yard (been there 13 years) and it's purely DIY. I'd have to move for more and I don't want to. A few points I'd make
1. Don't expect to be able to negotiate extra turnout, especially at a college where the routine and rules will be strict. If you want a lot of turnout find somewhere that offers it as standard. Don't fall for promises of more turnout in a few months etc they usually don't materialise.
2. It's not always better the devil you know - just because your college is familiar doesn't mean it's the best. Do plenty of research, visit as many yards as you can find to see which you like.
3. The chances are, as a new horse owner you don't really know what you want / can afford / can do time-wise. I'd choose somewhere flexible that offers the whole range from DIY to assisted to part or full so once you're there and are working out what you can do, you can adapt the package you've got.
4. Good livery yards are hard to find and fill up quickly. Start looking now as it might take you a while to find one and/or you might need to go on a waiting list. If a space comes up before you're ready you can always turn it down and go back on the list for the next one, or maybe even work out a deal to pay a retainer.

Good luck with finding a horse and a yard!
 
I love DIY in the summer, but there are many, many days in winter where I wish I could get someone else to traipse through the mud to get my horses, scrape clay off their legs, muck out the boxes where they have spent hours hiding their poo and turn them out when the rain is coming at you sideways!!

BUT there is actually something quite special about turning up to a field gate in the pouring rain, with the wind blowing you off your feet and yelling "breakfast" and seeing 2 horse detach from the herd and come full pelt towards you! (slightly less special when they try to pull you off your feet in the mud in their enthusiasm to get in of course....)
 
Mince Pie said:
Really?

I had mine on DIY for years, although a friend who lived on site used to turn out for me in the mornings. When I had my operation I put him on part livery and after my operation I found I liked it enough to stay on part livery and it wasn't actually that much more expensive. I found it really nice to go up, groom, ride and then chill with him in his box (in in daytime in summer) and actually felt our bond was much better. In the highly unlikely event of getting another horse I'd either speak very nicely to my friend and ask to put it in her field, or put it on part livery. I don't think I would do DIY again.
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Ahaha I just realised I wrote month - in actual fact I meant week. That was Personally I prefer part-livery too but DIY was a lot cheaper for my dad so that was why I prefer it, as well as my belief that I spent more time with Dusty :) xx
 
I work shifts so can't do DIY as my horse wouldn't much like it being the only one turned out at 6am when I'm working early shifts or not coming in until 2130 and being left out alone when I'm working late shifts. Assisted DIY worked best for me, but he's currently on part as thats what the yard i wanted to be at offered, they do him on full livery 4 days a week and 3 days a week they will bring in or turn out but i do the other end of the day and muck out etc, this works well for me as I can pick my days around my shift. In the time I've had him he's been on grass livery, DIY, assisted, full and now part and none of them have affected our relationship.
 
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