DIY Vs Full Livery

EllenJay

EllenJay

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Until I put my boy on retirement livery 5 years ago,I have had my horses on DIY livery for the last 20+ years. Once I retired my boy I decided to give up horses, but as so many before me after a break I missed them. So I took on a horse on a share basis, then moved to a full loan and eventually brought him. When I shared and loaned he was on full livery, which worked out well for me.

Now I own him, I am getting twitchy about some of his care. I am loving the not having going to the yard twice a day, but hate not having control about feed, bedding, turnout etc. So I am seriously thinking about going back to DIY - but I need to weigh up pros and cons. Horse is really happy in his current routine - but he is such a dude he would be happy in any routine.

So I need a list of things to think about going back to DIY - help xx
 
I've been left with massive trust issues where full or part livery is concerned, and would now only ever be DIY. It does eat into your free time though.
 
The livery I am at look after my horse far better than I ever did, so I do not miss diy at all . He wants for nothing , he is fed really well and has never looked as good.
 
I’ve been back and forth from DIY to part livery and occasionally training livery depending on my work pattern and each time I’ve switched it’s been a difficult decision. I can honestly say though that I’ve never received the quality of care I would like for my horse on a livery basis. I much prefer DIY and add services when I need them. Current yard doesn’t offer services but luckily I’ve been able to come to arrangements with other liveries who do freelance work.

In this way I have full control on bedding, feed and forage and I can manage my allocated paddocks as I’d like. The freelancers I use can be fully trusted to carry out my wishes and are thorough so spot any potential issues. More than I can say for being on part-livery sadly where colic symptoms and field injuries have been missed never mind restricted forage and filthy beds.
 
Just because he is on full livery does not mean you have no say in his care, if he has remained on the same yard they will be used to doing him their way but most YO's will be open to a discussion and possibly some changes if they are realistic and not going to add to the costs, it would make sense to have a chat to the YO and take it from there, we are not all ogres and most are willing to make changes if they are possible.
Most of my liveries have full care but do have input into feeding, provide supplements, all get ad lib hay or haylage so are unlikely to want that changed, get turned out all day every day or 24/7 the only thing they may want to really change is the bedding I provide straw on rubber mats, if they need dust free bedding it will put the cost up a little but can be done, they only need to ask.
 
I would love to put my two on full livery - but have yet to find a yard that actually did what they promised.
I've always ended up really resentful.
Either you complain and they hate you , or you don't complain, and you hate yourself for paying for a crap service. :p
They take your money fast enough but they don't actually care about your horses/you.
 
be positive said:
Just because he is on full livery does not mean you have no say in his care, if he has remained on the same yard they will be used to doing him their way but most YO's will be open to a discussion and possibly some changes if they are realistic.
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BP I know from your posts you are a fair and lovely YO but sadly in my experience many YO are not flexible at all and lie about what they offer. You’ve only got to read the numerous posts on here to realise that
 
Sussexbythesea said:
BP I know from your posts you are a fair and lovely YO but sadly in my experience many YO are not flexible at all and lie about what they offer. You’ve only got to read the numerous posts on here to realise that
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I know what many are like but thought it worth telling the OP to try actually communicating as a starting point, if the horse is well, happy and settled the yard cannot be too bad and may be able to tweak things a little to be more suitable for the OP, if you don't ask you will never know and if they are not interested it makes a decision to move easier.
 
The best arrangement I had was a full but just basic care livery. Probably more a part livery but you could not turn up if you wanted and your horse would be kept alive. I got to spend lots of quality time with my horses and did plenty of top up care. YO would feed them but we provided feeds. I mixed my own and fed them myself because The Beast's feed is just stupidly complex and I couldn't do that to the poor YO! So I always felt in control but didn't have to worry about the basic care or maintaining a routine. The horses were happy because the whole yard was on the same routine.

On full DIY I feel like I'm constantly chasing my tail and battling the yard set up (field a long way from stables, tack room a long way from stables etc etc etc). I also feel like I'm always driving as I'm there twice, sometimes 3 times. Things I would usually do like tail washing and keeping the horses tidy and well groomed have to take a back seat and I really don't like that.

If the horse is doing well on his current full livery I would leave him on it personally. DIY is hard!

I always thought I was a die-hard DIYer until I found my previous yard. But I imagine some full livery is a horrible experience is you like to be in control of stuff. My part/full livery yard was just a nice balance and YO was laid back but really cared about the horses.
 
I can see the charm of full but could never do it myself for the following reasons:

I would never want to pay someone to bond with and spend more time with my horse than I do... what is the point of owning a horse then?

I enjoy the precious time I get, mucking out, preparing feed and bringing in at the end of a day... makes my day worth it and soothes away my daily stress

Time and experience has taught me that where I may do things one way... others don't always. I paid £12 last year per day for someone to bring in, muck out, feed and turn out... they didn't bother mucking out, just skipped out and after the week I returned and had to remove the entire bed... this was not the first time!

Personally I like a balance... I would never give up my evenings of time with the beast, bedding him down, putting him in and ensuring he is warm and cozy with his feed. However, I find it convenient with my work to pay for him to be turned out in the morning. That works for me.
 
I think it depends on your yard. The basic full livery at mine is no frills, but includes basic feed, comfortable bed (rubber mats + shavings), plentiful good quality daily hay and turn out until at least 2 or 3pm. It also includes oversight from eagle eyed yard owners who spot any problems before they become serious. I know my horses are safe and in a good routine => I can spend my time with them on riding, grooming etc
 
Depends on the yard! I’ve moved from full livery to DIY and I love being DIY but it is hard work and time consuming. My last full livery yard was brilliant, amazing care and really went the extra mile. Not cheap but I trusted them with my boys and that is priceless really. I’ve also been on a couple of yards where the care really hasn’t stacked up at all, and had to move ASAP. So when it works, it’s brilliant but you do have to find a yard that really ‘gets’ you and your horses, or you will be fighting a constant battle.
 
I have assisted livery with additional services in winter. It allows me to control feed & bedding as these are not included. This gives me time to ride/spend time with horse during the week instead of shovelling poop. Is worth extra money as get to enjoy the horse but still keep eye on care. I find good communication is key when having someone else doing the horses.
 
I'd always been on DIY until a few years ago sharing the ends of the day with a friend or using the yards assistance but due to a new job & shifts, have since been on a few yards full/part livery. Every single one has had something I didn't like or agree with. This ranged from only a couple of hours turnout in winter every few days, in if it rained for a few hours for days on end even in summer, feeding mouldy haylage, not mucking out for days, not doing things when they said they did such as changing rugs etc, he'd even been left out overnight depths of winter as they knew I wouldnt be there. It left me with serious trust issues! I'm now back on DIY despite the shifts & managing due to being on a gem of a yard where I can keep him out 24/7 if I want, so me & the lady who owns the horse that mine shares the field with share & I have the yard owner for back up.They have a shelter with concrete base we leave hay in nightly but plan to bring them in on bad nights or just once or twice a week to suit us just for them to have a good kip etc & dry out. I like being back in control of my feed, rugs, routine & bedding!
 
I am at the end of my tether with livery yards! Ive now moved to a totally DIY yard. Its run by a farmer who runs it as a business. Its maintained to an ok standard but isnt the smartest place. We do have water,lights, a school and unlimited turnout though. I pay a freelancer to do services for me. It means I can control the care of my horse but not run myself into the ground!
 
I used to be DIY but, due to work commitments, moved over to full a few years ago. Finding the right yard and the right YO is paramount and not easy - took me a couple of yards to get it right!

Providing you have the right yard you don't lose control of your horse's care, you just delegate it to other people. If I want my horse to start having hay instead of haylage, I tell the YO and she will implement the change. Good yards will accommodate requests and will be open to discussion at all times regarding your horse's care.

I don't believe you lose the bond with your horse by putting him on full livery. My horse (and all the other horses at the yard) know who they belong to - she always greets me with the usual whicker! As the YO says, she's not there to bond with the horses - she just turns out, mucks out and then brings in.

I guess the question you need to ask OP is, will you have the time to do DIY? If you boy is settled in his routine, why change it? Like they say, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".
 
Baffled by bonding when on DIY. My pony couldn't care less who mucks him out, fills his haynets and so on. He isn't usually around when this is done. My arrival means playtime and has him standing hopefully at the gate. As I never feed him and have rarely even hung up a haynet in his stable, wanting fed plays no part in our relationship!
 
lannerch said:
The livery I am at look after my horse far better than I ever did, so I do not miss diy at all . He wants for nothing , he is fed really well and has never looked as good.
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Totally. Have been on two yards, both full livery. Both had great YMs who know far more about horses than many owners.
 
Smogul said:
Baffled by bonding when on DIY. My pony couldn't care less who mucks him out, fills his haynets and so on. He isn't usually around when this is done. My arrival means playtime and has him standing hopefully at the gate. As I never feed him and have rarely even hung up a haynet in his stable, wanting fed plays no part in our relationship!
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I agree on the bonding, I have horses for years on DIY/Part/Full and have never felt the bond was impacted.

What I do think you miss on full livery, versus DIY, is the very close oversight of behaviours - little things like, how much water they drank, change in toilet habits, temperature, rolling etc etc that can all build a bigger picture so as an owner on full livery you are completely reliant on the yard staff caring and being observant to this
 
I think I was better "bonded" with my horses on basic full livery as I still spent a lot of time at the yard but it was all horse interaction based time. Granny horse did love the YO for bringing her her haynet and he was the only other person in the world that she didn't hate apart from me. 😂 But that was ok, I was still her favourite.

Also agree with ihatework above though... which is why it is important to get the right yard. I also didn't fully appreciate how beyond disgusting The Beast is in her stable until I had to muck her out myself! If I'd have known I would have bought the YO even more beer at Christmas!!
 
Yeah I'm lucky my YO is a proper old skool chap and he also schools the weekend cover staff hard so they do everything his way :p
I found it weird not going in the morning having always been totally DIY before but it allows me to start work early so I can get there in daylight in the winter, but without the absolutely crazy early mornings I had before.
 
I agree assisted DIY might be a good option for you OP, that way you still have "full custody" but only have to go up once a day.
I've done part and assisted livery and I've done day duty shares with friends. I'm personally far, far happier on complete DIY with nobody but me touching my horses and not having to deal with any other horses either unless I offer.
 
DIY yards can be very different. I have been on a few and some are run on the lines that the YO dictates nearly everything, as in when and where you can turn out, what you can feed (i.e. buy own hay etc.) and the times you are allowed at the yard and, at the other extreme, you have ones like where I am now where you effectively rent the use of a stable and field and can do your own thing! I have never been on full livery so I cannot comment too much on that but the controlling DIY seems to me to be very close to the full livery except you have to do the work.
 
What is it that you would change about his feed / bedding / turn out if on DIY?

If your horse is happy and healthy I'm assuming that the changes wouldn't be particularly significant?

I do understand the feeling about "lack of control" on full livery and did find it hard to adjust when I went from DIY to livery.

When you say that you are getting twitchy about his care do you mean that you are worried about the standards or simply that you dont feel involved enough?

I would definitely recommend trying to identify the reason you are considering moving and in the first instance try and address those issues at your current yard if possible.

I say this because if your horse is happy surely that speaks volumes?
 
redredruby said:
What is it that you would change about his feed / bedding / turn out if on DIY?

If your horse is happy and healthy I'm assuming that the changes wouldn't be particularly significant?

I do understand the feeling about "lack of control" on full livery and did find it hard to adjust when I went from DIY to livery.

When you say that you are getting twitchy about his care do you mean that you are worried about the standards or simply that you dont feel involved enough?

I would definitely recommend trying to identify the reason you are considering moving and in the first instance try and address those issues at your current yard if possible.

I say this because if your horse is happy surely that speaks volumes?
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I would change his bedding & feed. The yard also regularly "forget" to give him his medication, unless I remind them everyday. T/O is fine. His feet are not picked out daily, and he is often put into a different field without my knowledge. One morning in the summer I turned up early to catch in and ride, but couldn't find him. So generally, they do look after him well, he is happy, but it's the little things.
 
How long have you been full OP?

I struggled for a little while when I first moved onto part livery, it was difficult to pass on the control of aspects of care. I used to faff about with feed quantities as and when I felt it was needed, and to then have to write it down for the yard staff was a pain (amongst other things)

I think it's about finding the right yard, and being able to put your trust in the yard / staff. I'm lucky in that I can't fault the yard I'm on now, and wouldn't go back to DIY if I could help it.

On the flip side, a friend of mine is having some real issues with her gelding on part livery. Important stuff, which is hindering his health... she has spoken to the yard owner on multiple occasions and has seen no improvement, so she is looking elsewhere.

Maybe give the yard the opportunity to improve initially, and if no improvements then go back to DIY.
 
redredruby said:
What is it that you would change about his feed / bedding / turn out if on DIY?

If your horse is happy and healthy I'm assuming that the changes wouldn't be particularly significant?

I do understand the feeling about "lack of control" on full livery and did find it hard to adjust when I went from DIY to livery.

When you say that you are getting twitchy about his care do you mean that you are worried about the standards or simply that you dont feel involved enough?

I would definitely recommend trying to identify the reason you are considering moving and in the first instance try and address those issues at your current yard if possible.

I say this because if your horse is happy surely that speaks volumes?
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I get what you’re saying but the horse doesn’t know it might e.g. be in danger from missed medication or failure to notice a field injury whereas the owner would. At one yard I used to make up a small feed myself to give expensive supplements as I was convinced mine were either not being given or were in fact being given to other horses.

When I’ve been on livery a lot of the time I’ve gone up most days to check he’s ok anyway. Even with that though it was still obviously less work and I do miss it sometimes especially not having to go twice a day and the freedom it gives. I’ve got two now so no chance of affording it!

FWIW I think you can bond just as much with a horse not on DIY. Mine still looked out for me a greeted me even though I didn’t muck him out. They know who their human is.
 
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