DIY yards - BRING IN TIME

diamonddogs said:
Strangely, most horses are allowed out on their own in the mornings...
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I can turn my gelding out first and he's fine being alone in that circumstance, but if he was in the field and I took all of his companions away, he'd get upset. I don't think that this is unusual, I've come across the same thing with different horses.
 
We have individual turnout at our yard and it's DIY. I share turnout and bing in with another livery though - I chuck out of a morning and she brings in of an evening (I sometimes work late on my shifts and she'd need to be up there and turning out her girl on her own at some ridiculous time). We don't bring in the last horse out though. Sometimes liveries will keep their horse out ovrnight if they can't get up the next day so it would be an inconvenience for the owner. All the horses seem to be fine on their own though. there's just the one that screams if he's out by himself, but he does that when he's out in the morning by himself as well. But it's a bit awkward to bring him in if you've got yours in for a lesson for an hour as then he'll get stressed being in a box by himself.
 
50p was a thumb suck figure, i usually do it for free, what does it matter at least horse is safe and owners an as.....ole, but thats me
 
Ours live out so bring in time is not a problem. However, we never leave one on its own if the others are being ridden so will always bring the one that would be left alone in until a horse is available to go out with it.
 
SusieT said:
BubbleDog-why should the other livery work to your time. 5pm is incredibly early for anyone who works to afford their horse..
If you want them to work to your time turn it around - you are currently unhappy that the third option is for YOU to alter your times at the yard -but that doesn't work for you so why should changing times work for the other owner?
Have you spoken to YO about it?
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Well I'm not expecting her to work to my time. I couldn't care less what time she does her horses it's none of my business. But our yard has a policy of not leaving a horse out on its own so unfortunately for her that means when the 2nd to last horse comes in then her horse if still out has to come in too. As most people have routines regardless of whatever time this occurs if she is not there to bring him in then in my opinion she needs to pay for it to be done on her behalf. At a DIY yard you cannot stop people bringing their horses in early if they wish and if I only had 1 horse and our fields were empty by 4.00pm I would not be able to be there but if that were the case I would expect to have to pay the yard to do it, not expect the 2nd to last livery to do it daily free of charge (in fairness I prob wouldn't choose to go to a yard if I didn't think I could be there early enough to do bring in).
 
BubbleDog said:
Well I'm not expecting her to work to my time. I couldn't care less what time she does her horses it's none of my business. But our yard has a policy of not leaving a horse out on its own so unfortunately for her that means when the 2nd to last horse comes in then her horse if still out has to come in too. As most people have routines regardless of whatever time this occurs if she is not there to bring him in then in my opinion she needs to pay for it to be done on her behalf. At a DIY yard you cannot stop people bringing their horses in early if they wish and if I only had 1 horse and our fields were empty by 4.00pm I would not be able to be there but if that were the case I would expect to have to pay the yard to do it, not expect the 2nd to last livery to do it daily free of charge (in fairness I prob wouldn't choose to go to a yard if I didn't think I could be there early enough to do bring in).
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But how do you know that when she went to the yard, all the other liveries arrived after her ? and she was one of the early ones ?

You cannot punish someone who is doing exactly what the yard owner has stated the rules are and 5 o clock is so early to working folks that it is virtually impossible.
 
Well thank you everyone that has responded it has been really helpful to me as I wanted to make sure that I wasn't being unreasonable. I'm also grateful for the ideas and suggestions put forward to such as the idea about writing it in a diary and the yard paying me and then recharging the owner, & also the idea about the yard doing it on her behalf and adding a surcharge if the bring in hasn't been booked with them. And a very good point too about the issue of other liveries not being insured etc to bring in other peoples horses. It was also refreshing to hear 1 of the posters who was obviously a yard manager saying that she wouldn't want her client's burdened in this way.

I'm planning to speak to my yard manager about the matter but all the useful suggestions about what could be done are great so that I can turn my discussion into a positive episode instead of it just being a whinge and I can try to get the yard to be a bit more proactive about taking responsibility for it.
 
Gingerwitch said:
But how do you know that when she went to the yard, all the other liveries arrived after her ? and she was one of the early ones ?

You cannot punish someone who is doing exactly what the yard owner has stated the rules are and 5 o clock is so early to working folks that it is virtually impossible.
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It really doesn't matter when she went to the yard or what the status quo was then and now. Only she can be responsible for bringing her horse in and it is totally absurd to think that anyone else should be. So therefore whatever time the fields start emptying she either has to be there to do it herself, to pay the yard to do it on her behalf if she is not or to ask the yard for special permission for her horse to stay out on his own, if this is what she prefer. It is not down to anyone else at the yard to take any responsibility for her horse on a daily basis. It is DIY yard i.e do it yourself.
 
BubbleDog said:
It really doesn't matter when she went to the yard or what the status quo was then and now. Only she can be responsible for bringing her horse in and it is totally absurd to think that anyone else should be. So therefore whatever time the fields start emptying she either has to be there to do it herself, to pay the yard to do it on her behalf if she is not or to ask the yard for special permission for her horse to stay out on his own, if this is what she prefer. It is not down to anyone else at the yard to take any responsibility for her horse on a daily basis. It is DIY yard i.e do it yourself.
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But with respect you are the new person to the yard - and that yard rule was in place before you took the places, and you went to the yard knowing the rule so you are now complaing and coming accross as someone that wants the rules changed o suit you.
 
Well, I always tried to operate with a 'do as you would be done by' attitude to being on DIY. I wouldn't want my horse left on her own, so I didn't mind at all bringing in other peoples horses. As I said in my earlier post, I ended up bringing in one horse daily for three months. The yard did not offer services, so it was leave the horse out to stress, or bring her in myself.

What would you do if someone left your horse alone and they were injured? Have you ever seen the injuries after a horse runs through a fence? I personally think that the no horse left out alone is a good rule and I wouldn't be able to sleep at night if a horse was injured because I left it out alone.
 
Gingerwitch said:
But with respect you are the new person to the yard - and that yard rule was in place before you took the places, and you went to the yard knowing the rule so you are now complaing and coming accross as someone that wants the rules changed o suit you.
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It really doesn't matter whether I am the new person at the yard or not. And I really don't have a clue what you are talking saying the yard rule was in place before I took the place there. The rest of the horses at the yard are in by 5,00pm. My horses come in at 6.00pm. If I hadn't gone there she would have to get her horses in by 5.00pm which she wouldn't be able to do either and judging by her assumption that someone else should bring her horse in daily free of charge it would then fall to the other other last people in the field (one of the liveries who brings in at 5.00pm). At a DIY yard you cannot insist that people leave horses out late in the day just so that someone who works late can get down to the yard to do their own horse at the time that suits them. They are governed by whatever times other people start bringing in. As my yard are clear that they don't want horses out on their own (understandably) that means when the second to last horse comes in (whatever time that may be) then her horse will have to come in too. On that basis she needs to take responsibility for doing this by either doing it herself, paying the yard, getting a friend to do it, or having the horse left out by requesting permission from the yard. As I have already said several times now how can someone else s horse possibly be my responsibility to bring in on a daily basis free of charge because her commitment don't allow her to be present when bring in is required. Are you seriously trying to suggest that if you couldn't pick your kids up from school because you were at work it would be the responsibility of either the school or another kids mum to deal with your child & take him home???
 
Faracat said:
Well, I always tried to operate with a 'do as you would be done by' attitude to being on DIY. I wouldn't want my horse left on her own, so I didn't mind at all bringing in other peoples horses. As I said in my earlier post, I ended up bringing in one horse daily for three months. The yard did not offer services, so it was leave the horse out to stress, or bring her in myself.

What would you do if someone left your horse alone and they were injured? Have you ever seen the injuries after a horse runs through a fence? I personally think that the no horse left out alone is a good rule and I wouldn't be able to sleep at night if a horse was injured because I left it out alone.
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I'm not sure if you are missing the point here or whether you haven't read though all the other messages but we are not talking about the occasional favour of bringing in someone elses horse. We are talking about a livery who openly admits that she can never be there at the time that the last but one horses are brought in and she therefore expects that her horse should be brought in by me on a daily basis free of charge simply because she is not there.
 
Gingerwitch said:
But with respect you are the new person to the yard - and that yard rule was in place before you took the places, and you went to the yard knowing the rule so you are now complaing and coming accross as someone that wants the rules changed o suit you.
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And actually I'm not the new person at the yard. The yard has recently opened after being closed for 3 months for a refurbishment and everyone at the yard arrived at the same time that I did. Neither am I asking for anyone to change rules for me. I can take proper care of my horse I am simply suggesting that I am not prepared to be used by someone else on a daily basis to provide a free bring in as they allege that they can't get there. It really isn't my problem.
 
BubbleDog said:
I'm not sure if you are missing the point here or whether you haven't read though all the other messages but we are not talking about the occasional favour of bringing in someone elses horse. We are talking about a livery who openly admits that she can never be there at the time that the last but one horses are brought in and she therefore expects that her horse should be brought in by me on a daily basis free of charge simply because she is not there.
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Yes I know - I've read the whole thing. I would still bring the horse in.
 
Understand OP..

There is a bring in time, if she can't be there its her problem not yours. So what she works, she knew the rules of bring in when she decided to stable there so why is that everyone else's problem?

She either gets there and brings in or pays for it, sounds like she's the one wanting the rules changed to suit her not op! Why should you have to constantly bring in or leave yours out to suit another completely unreasonable in my opinion.

When you bring in I'd simply tell your YO your bringing yours in and refuse to collect this horse anymore as you feel they are taking advantage of the rule. Then they can charge the livery for that privilege.

It's not on expecting someone else to bring yours in every night because you can't be there at a set time. Not on, as the odd favour or agreed arrangement yeah but if not pay for it.
 
This is the challenge with all the bringing in/turning out stuff at livery yards. This last winter I worked with a few livery acquaintances to turn out and bring in up to 12 horses daily. There were some issues, some genuine, some down to personality confilicts so we probably won't do it again this winter which will actually place me under a huge amount of pressure at work, but that is my issue, and maybe I will get in earlier in the morning if I am not turning out so many so will be easier in the long run.

In your situation, If I were the owner of the horse and I genuinely couldn't get there in time to please you I would rather pay someone to bring my horse in than have someone do it resentfully. Tbh, I would certainly offer you some money if you were having to do it every day, or maybe I would offer to turn out for you or something
 
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I'm with Faracat on this - I would just bring the horse in. Alternatively leave one of your horses out with hers so that she has to bring one of yours in when she does get there. How far is it to the field?
 
Holly Hocks said:
I'm with Faracat on this - I would just bring the horse in. Alternatively leave one of your horses out with hers so that she has to bring one of yours in when she does get there. How far is it to the field?
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But why should the OP have to even consider doing this?
The general yard rule of 'no horse left out alone' is a sensible one to cover situations where someone has been avoidably detained, or it's an infrequent occurrence. At least that's the way I understand it.
The OPs yard offers a service (to be paid for) to bring in horses for people who can't do it themselves.
It's simple - the other owner pays for the yard to provide a service, rather than expecting someone else to do it for free every day (i.e. the OP). The hours she works are irrelevant - if she knows she can't get there with everyone else, then she should make arrangements.

I really don't see why the OP should bring this horse in as a matter of course, when there are services available to cover the situation and the other owner isn't taking them up....Or offering to reciprocate in any way!
 
skint1 said:
This is the challenge with all the bringing in/turning out stuff at livery yards. This last winter I worked with a few livery acquaintances to turn out and bring in up to 12 horses daily. There were some issues, some genuine, some down to personality confilicts so we probably won't do it again this winter which will actually place me under a huge amount of pressure at work, but that is my issue, and maybe I will get in earlier in the morning if I am not turning out so many so will be easier in the long run.

In your situation, If I were the owner of the horse and I genuinely couldn't get there in time to please you I would rather pay someone to bring my horse in than have someone do it resentfully. Tbh, I would certainly offer you some money if you were having to do it every day, or maybe I would offer to turn out for you or something[/QUOTE

It's not about her doing it at at time to please me, I couldn't care less when she does her horse and as I said about it's none of my business. But at any yard at all where they have a policy of no single horses out on their own her horse would therefore be required by the yard due to the policy to come off the field at the time that the 2nd to last horse does whenever that is. That time would be variable at different yards but would be largely influenced and governed by what time others bring in. I would be more than happy to do it if she was willing to pay for it at the going rate but I am not prepared to be used as a free bring in service for her on a daily basis 7 days per week when I have got my own two to bring in and a 10 minute walk to and from our fields (often in the rain). She is clearly exploiting the yard policy of no single horse being left out and just thinks that if she is not around someone else will have to do it.
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Holly Hocks said:
I'm with Faracat on this - I would just bring the horse in. Alternatively leave one of your horses out with hers so that she has to bring one of yours in when she does get there. How far is it to the field?
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Why on earth would I want to leave one of my own horses out for someone else to bring in on a daily basis once I have already left the yard for the evening?????
 
risky business said:
Understand OP..

There is a bring in time, if she can't be there its her problem not yours. So what she works, she knew the rules of bring in when she decided to stable there so why is that everyone else's problem?

She either gets there and brings in or pays for it, sounds like she's the one wanting the rules changed to suit her not op! Why should you have to constantly bring in or leave yours out to suit another completely unreasonable in my opinion.

When you bring in I'd simply tell your YO your bringing yours in and refuse to collect this horse anymore as you feel they are taking advantage of the rule. Then they can charge the livery for that privilege.

It's not on expecting someone else to bring yours in every night because you can't be there at a set time. Not on, as the odd favour or agreed arrangement yeah but if not pay for it.
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Thanks for your comment. Yes I think that is a good idea about just telling the yard owner that I am not bringing the horse in any more. As I've said much earlier on in the thread I'm really not against doing people the odd favour or helping someone out if they are in a genuine predicament but as you have said this woman is clearly taking advantage of the rule. I'd be more than happy to do it for her if she wanted to pay me but then again she could also get the yard to do it for payment. What it amounts to is that she doesn't want to pay for it and thinks that she can exploit the no single horse out rule to get free bring in every day. As you've said totally not on.
 
SpottyMare said:
But why should the OP have to even consider doing this?
The general yard rule of 'no horse left out alone' is a sensible one to cover situations where someone has been avoidably detained, or it's an infrequent occurrence. At least that's the way I understand it.
The OPs yard offers a service (to be paid for) to bring in horses for people who can't do it themselves.
It's simple - the other owner pays for the yard to provide a service, rather than expecting someone else to do it for free every day (i.e. the OP). The hours she works are irrelevant - if she knows she can't get there with everyone else, then she should make arrangements.

I really don't see why the OP should bring this horse in as a matter of course, when there are services available to cover the situation and the other owner isn't taking them up....Or offering to reciprocate in any way!
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Yes very succinctly put Spotty Mare. It's not that she has no other option it is exactly that - the yard had facilities for people who can't get there at the times require, she just doesn't want to pay for them.
 
If the woman cannot fit bring in into her busy schedule surely that is what part livery is for (or assisted livery), not relying on someone else to take on her responsibility out of guilt at the prospect of the horse being left on its own.

OP - if you are ever late does she do the same?
 
Fides said:
If the woman cannot fit bring in into her busy schedule surely that is what part livery is for (or assisted livery), not relying on someone else to take on her responsibility out of guilt at the prospect of the horse being left on its own.

OP - if you are ever late does she do the same?
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Good point! I've never been late but I've got two so if I was she would just leave mine!
 
BubbleDog said:
Thanks for your comment. Yes I think that is a good idea about just telling the yard owner that I am not bringing the horse in any more. As I've said much earlier on in the thread I'm really not against doing people the odd favour or helping someone out if they are in a genuine predicament but as you have said this woman is clearly taking advantage of the rule. I'd be more than happy to do it for her if she wanted to pay me but then again she could also get the yard to do it for payment. What it amounts to is that she doesn't want to pay for it and thinks that she can exploit the no single horse out rule to get free bring in every day. As you've said totally not on.
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This is your take on the matter and a rather harsh one at that.
 
BubbleDog said:
It really doesn't matter whether I am the new person at the yard or not. And I really don't have a clue what you are talking saying the yard rule was in place before I took the place there. The rest of the horses at the yard are in by 5,00pm. My horses come in at 6.00pm. If I hadn't gone there she would have to get her horses in by 5.00pm which she wouldn't be able to do either and judging by her assumption that someone else should bring her horse in daily free of charge it would then fall to the other other last people in the field (one of the liveries who brings in at 5.00pm). At a DIY yard you cannot insist that people leave horses out late in the day just so that someone who works late can get down to the yard to do their own horse at the time that suits them. They are governed by whatever times other people start bringing in. As my yard are clear that they don't want horses out on their own (understandably) that means when the second to last horse comes in (whatever time that may be) then her horse will have to come in too. On that basis she needs to take responsibility for doing this by either doing it herself, paying the yard, getting a friend to do it, or having the horse left out by requesting permission from the yard. As I have already said several times now how can someone else s horse possibly be my responsibility to bring in on a daily basis free of charge because her commitment don't allow her to be present when bring in is required. Are you seriously trying to suggest that if you couldn't pick your kids up from school because you were at work it would be the responsibility of either the school or another kids mum to deal with your child & take him home???
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When you went to view the yard you were told no horse out on its own. You agreed to this and moved and now are complaining about a rule that was in place prior to you taking up the places.
 
Gingerwitch said:
But its your required time not the yards and as I have said once before 5 o clock is way to early for all horses to be in if the owners are at work.
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Its not my required time. It is the yards required time as they insist that when the last but one horse is brought from the field the remaining horse cannot remain out alone. I cannot be forced to leave my horses out beyond whatever time I wish to bring them in just to suit someone else because they cannot be there. If the yard requires that the horse cannot remain out in the field alone after the time that I wish to bring mine in then that means that the horse in question has to come in. I am simply saying that it is not my job to do this every day because the other person cannot be there and I happen to be the last but one person.

If I left the yard and my two boxes were filled by someone who wanted to bring their horses in at 5.10pm every day then this is the time that the last horse would have to come in. This has got nothing to do with it being the owners required time, it is entirely due to the yard policy of no single horses out alone. And on that basis as an owner if you cannot be there for that time (whenever it is) then you need to pay for someone to do it on your behalf.

As others have said above if she cannot be there she needs to either pay for it or to ask for her horse to be able to stay out on its own if this is something that she would prefer.
 
Gingerwitch said:
When you went to view the yard you were told no horse out on its own. You agreed to this and moved and now are complaining about a rule that was in place prior to you taking up the places.
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Yes but that rule is in place to avoid the odd time when someone is genuinely held up and cannot get to the yard in order to avoid the horse in question having an accident. It is not in place to facilitate some liveries holding others over a barrell to get a free bring in service on a daily basis.
 
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