Do horses struggle to cope with loss?

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dodgers89

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I ride a horse for a friend. Just before Christmas one of her horses died suddenly. She has got a little highland pony as a field companion but even with the pony, the horse seems very anxious and unsettled. When I take him out he wants to rush back and always seems disappointed when he sees the pony. Is he grieving? It's been just over a month since we lost the horse and I'm wondering if it takes them a while to come to terms with losing a friend?
 
They can form such strong bonds with each other that they can struggle for a while and do feel loss perhaps not on the same level as we feel it but they certainly do. he may well form a nice attachment with the new pony but it all might take time.
 
A bit too late now, but when I had to have my lad put to sleep the vet recommended that I showed the girls his body as he said it helps them to understand. The girls were very attached to him, so it was a very sad time for all of us. I did give the girls Ignatia which help with loss/grief.
 
I think they do struggle. A friend had her elderly horse PTS a couple of years ago. She had 3 other horses that had all been together for a few years but one of them was particularly attached to the one that she lost. He came down with an abscess in his jaw (which he was prone too - despite investigation it always seemed to flare up when he was stressed but never caused a problem) which was treated by the vet but he lost all enthusiasm for life and two weeks after losing her elderly horse she discovered her other one dead in the stable. He was only 15 and had had a very easy life, losing his best friend just made him give up on life himself.
 
3Beasties said:
I think they do struggle. A friend had her elderly horse PTS a couple of years ago. She had 3 other horses that had all been together for a few years but one of them was particularly attached to the one that she lost. He came down with an abscess in his jaw (which he was prone too - despite investigation it always seemed to flare up when he was stressed but never caused a problem) which was treated by the vet but he lost all enthusiasm for life and two weeks after losing her elderly horse she discovered her other one dead in the stable. He was only 15 and had had a very easy life, losing his best friend just made him give up on life himself.
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That's so heart breaking the poor boy, It must of been such a hard time for your friend :(
 
We did show him the other horse when he died which the vet recommended so he knows he's dead I think he just forgets sometimes which breaks my heart a bit. He also puts his ears back and nips at the pony which he never did before. It probably sounds daft but I wonder if he doesn't see her as a horse because she's so much smaller than him or the horse we lost?
 
My 21 year old mare had been with her companion for 12 years and they were devoted to each other - she was boss but they just didnt fall out. When i lost her companion about 18 months ago i put her in a yard temporarily so she wouldnt be on her own and she seemed ok initially but it soon became clear that she had lost her mojo a bit (was quite flat, wouldnt come to me for treats (real foodie), allowed herself to be bullied (although i appreciate there was an established pecking order at the yard) and generally seemed quite miserable). I have since moved her twice (now at home with me) and whilst she is now very settled and has two new companions who seems quite fond of (one has been with her circa 12 moinths), she hasn't formed the same bond at all. So whilst i dont think they grieve in the same way we do (she saw her companion PTS and seemed failry unfazed) i do think they are affected by loss
 
Yes, my mare is still heartbroken (she is not the only one :frown3:) after the loss of her lifelong friend and mentor. It has been two years and she is a shadow of her former self. I am getting a new horse in the Spring, I am choosing him carefully as he will need to take her under his wing.
 
We lost one of our boys two weeks ago :( and i didnt think of letting his mate see him as i thought it would upset him. But as it stands as the mo he is upset he has friends in the next fields but no friend in with him hence to say with this wet weather he has trashed the fence line and gateway to his field where he just paces the fence and stands by the gate(heart breaking). almost to scared to venture out in to his field on his own. Went up to see him this afternoon only to find that the little pony who is 25 had found her way though the tape(not on) where a couple of trees had come down and the pair of them were grazing at the bottom of the field so i left them to it and mucked out their stables so hopefully they will be friends as he can be quite bossy and i don't want him to hurt her .
 
I lost two last year.
Neither seemed terribly upset. Jack n Benj were together 5 yrs and were very close. Jack called when Benji was taken to hospital in the trailer but settled very quickly afterwards ,as is usual when one of mine is taken away. I guess he just thought Benj was coming back at some point...
Jack also lost his companion of 8 yrs in a similar fashion a few years back and again got over it very quickly.
Tigger watched Bones die as it was all very sudden and seemed quite laid back about the whole thing.
I often move my horses about and split them up for various reasons ( usually starvation paddocks ) so I guess they are just used to it...
 
We had two mares who had been together for 20 yrs when one had a stroke in the stable and had to be pts with the other one watching. The one left was a bit quiet for a while but went out in the field with their other 2 companions and they all behaved normally. Until we got the new mare about a month later, when she perked up and played with the new one as she had played with her friend in their youth.

Of course in the wild they don't have the time to grieve as that would make them vulnerable to predators themselves.
 
No, I don't think they "struggle", why would they? Horses die in the wild and it is part of herd life; a horse dies and the herd moves on. I have had mares lose their foals, they sniff, maybe paw at the body but pretty soon they move off after the herd and settle to grazing with perhaps the odd whinny for a day or so. Horses, unlike humans, are utterly unsentimental.
 
Cortez said:
No, I don't think they "struggle", why would they? Horses die in the wild and it is part of herd life; a horse dies and the herd moves on. I have had mares lose their foals, they sniff, maybe paw at the body but pretty soon they move off after the herd and settle to grazing with perhaps the odd whinny for a day or so. Horses, unlike humans, are utterly unsentimental.
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Yes, but in the wild they live totally differently. They witness birth and death and the ageing process in between and don't just get 5 minutes to sniff the body or whatever. In our artificial world things are so very different. My old girl had a pony companion who was in her 40s. They had only been together for about 4 years, but the pony was devoted to my girl who showed great kindness and care to her little friend. When the pony was finally PTS, my old girl would have been able to watch from the gate. That evening, whe I brought her up for her feed, she ate up ok, but then went and stood on the spot where the pony was always fed, and her head went down and she was clearly aware that her little friend was gone for good. My friend had a big point to pointer and his daughter's pony in adjoining stables. The pony died quite unexpectedly, PTS in her stable. The big chap was very agitated all day, and when they went to feed him in the evening, he bolted out of his stable and ran into the pony's stable next door. He flat refused to come out and has never gone back to his own stable since. I think it is totally wrong to say animals don't suffer loss. I once watched a film taken over several years about a herd of African elephants. The old matriarch's youngest daughter produced her first calf but it was born premature and was barely alive. The mother was confused and didn't seem to know what had happened or what to do, but the matriarch came over and gently tried to rouse the calf with her back foot. When this didn't work she gently picked the calf up with her trunk, balanced it over her tusks and carefully and deliberately laid it under a bush to get it into the shade. After a couple of hours the calf died but the old girl stayed with it for the rest of the day, just standing guard, and after a while, partially covering it with twigs and sand. The rest of the herd started to move away but she didn't and had to catch up with them later in the evening. Elephants are well known to visit sites where family members died years back. Is this not sentimentality?
 
Elephants are not horses, they have extremely complex and well documented social orders which are quite unlike a horse's.

Death is separation, such as would occur if you broke a pair bond by selling one of the pair or moving it. Yes, the horses may exhibit anxiety (which is why it is advised to allow herd members to view a death, which is understood), but they are not "grieving" as we would be if a family member died. Sentimentality is defined as adding meaning which is not there; humans are good at this, as attested to by all soap operas.
 
My retired horse (19) certainly missed his young stable mate who I lost a year ago with a twisted gut. They never got to say goodbye because he was carted off to the vets and never came back. The older horse was pretty picky who he liked, previous stable mates he had virtually ignored, but he was very fond if this one. (I only ever have two horses at a time). He used to go and look for him over his box door to see if he had come back. Heartbreaking to watch and try to explain that his friend wasn't coming back.
 
NorthDevonTraveller said:
My retired horse (19) certainly missed his young stable mate who I lost a year ago with a twisted gut. They never got to say goodbye because he was carted off to the vets and never came back. The older horse was pretty picky who he liked, previous stable mates he had virtually ignored, but he was very fond if this one. (I only ever have two horses at a time). He used to go and look for him over his box door to see if he had come back. Heartbreaking to watch and try to explain that his friend wasn't coming back.
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Sorry, but why is it any more heartbreaking than selling the horse on, in which case it also would not be coming back; surely this is you adding a meaning which the horse could not possibly understand?
 
I think when my horse saw the other one dead in his stable it was different to him being sold. He knew something had happened to him. And if horses aren't sentimental, why do they get attached to specific humans?
 
dodgers89 said:
I think when my horse saw the other one dead in his stable it was different to him being sold. He knew something had happened to him. And if horses aren't sentimental, why do they get attached to specific humans?
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They don't. They may feel more comfortable with certain people (hopefully, their owners), but if you were to drop dead in front of them they would "move on" and be comfortable with the next person who treated them properly. This is why it is possible for horses to be sold.
 
Yes, in a nutshell. They can form very deep bonds.

One of the saddest accounts of this is in the book Tschiffely's Ride (he rode from Buenos Aires to New York -13,000 miles - in the 1920s using two Criollo horses, Mancha and Gato). The horses were already middle aged when they made the epic journey, and were retired afterwards to a ranch in Argentina where they lived, I believe, to both be over 40. When one eventually died the other was inconsolable. The ranch owner put him with another horse he appeared to be fond of, but in the end the horse chose a companion for himself. But the inference was that he lost the zest for life after his dear friend's death.

Our own horses definitely greatly miss companions when they die. As others have said, we always let them investigate the dead body ...we do that with our dogs as well.
 
My first driving horse clearly had been knocked sideways by the pair he was in being spilt and both sold separately .
I suspect he was not the dominant one of the two but I don't think that's loss as we see it it's just his working enviroment changed and it took him time to readjust .
One brood mare we had used to run to the trailer when we weaned her foals ( the foals stayed we sent the mares away )they just don't see loss like we do.
 
Cortez said:
They don't. They may feel more comfortable with certain people (hopefully, their owners), but if you were to drop dead in front of them they would "move on" and be comfortable with the next person who treated them properly. This is why it is possible for horses to be sold.
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Yes I agree with this, but my best friend did die unexpectedly a few years ago, and her horse was her life. I took him on, but he remained at his yard until I got stuff sorted out. His routine didn't overly change during that time, but it's like he knew something was drastically different as his demeanour changed hugely. He was very quiet for a couple of weeks, but yes he did move on, albeit after a time.
 
Yes, if they form a strong enough bond, I think they do.
I think it's arrogant to dismiss the idea that they can't.
We're only just starting to understand the complexities of many animal relationships.
 
I totally agree that horses dont grieve death as such like we do but when a companion of some years "goes" i think its the break in familiarity as such in their no longer there in field or stable and have seen this in a horse where their best mate was sold. Yes i think some take it bad- 2 at my old yard had been together some 20 years(sisters ponies) and on death of one the other went down hill very quickly. Could be coincedence who knows but having shared same field and adjoing stables for so long maybe the remainder just lost will. to be honest we will never know
 
dodgers89 said:
I ride a horse for a friend. Just before Christmas one of her horses died suddenly. She has got a little highland pony as a field companion but even with the pony, the horse seems very anxious and unsettled. When I take him out he wants to rush back and always seems disappointed when he sees the pony. Is he grieving? It's been just over a month since we lost the horse and I'm wondering if it takes them a while to come to terms with losing a friend?
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I would say yes it took months for my boy to get the sparkle back after his mum PTS last Christmas.
 
Corner Mad House said:
A bit too late now, but when I had to have my lad put to sleep the vet recommended that I showed the girls his body as he said it helps them to understand. The girls were very attached to him, so it was a very sad time for all of us. I did give the girls Ignatia which help with loss/grief.
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I led my boy in to say a last goodbye to him mum then we led him out till she went to sleep then we led him back in to sniff her. It was gut wrenching for me.:(
 
Leviathan said:
Sorry don't agree With mum and offspring its different, I saw big changes in my boys behaviour after his mum went.
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Having had a stud farm over many years, and having a couple of orphan foals, as long as there is another horse to "adopt" the foal into the herd and look out for him/her (not necessarily to provide milk), they seem to just get on with it. Some foals can be a bit low on the pecking order after, but as long as they don't get the " ah, poor ickle orphan" treatment from the humans, they do alright, worst thing ever is a human-raised orphan foal, though.
 
The two horses I've seen struggling with loss have both spent decades with their companions.
How many horses these days get that length of time to be together?
And with the same owner who would know them well enough to see the difference in them.
 
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