Dodgy vettings

AlinFaolan said:
Many many years ago someone I knew bought a pony from a well known showing yard, vetted by one of their vets from a locally very well known vet practice, think the queens vet practice at the time. Vet claimed to have never seen this particular pony and it passed its vetting, going lame a short while later which turned out to be a long term issue. Long story short turned out vets signature was on the pony’s vaccination book, vet practice eventually settled out of court..
Click to expand...
Why risk all those years of studying. Dealers I wouldn't expect anything else, but Vets please!!
 
onemoretime said:
Why risk all those years of studying. Dealers I wouldn't expect anything else, but Vets please!!
Click to expand...

Because proving collusion is nearly impossible - nobody is sending texts saying anything incriminating, just a subtle word as the vet is there doing it about how many the dealer puts their way each year.

With many vet practices being large corporate owned now, some vets can come under pressure to meet sales targets, especially new younger vets who haven't got a loyal client base yet.
The pressure on vets to him ££ targets can be huge.

Or older independent practices where the cost inflation in recent years has hammered their profits. Vets have a tough time and can be subject to pressure the same as any profession.
 
Polos Mum said:
Because proving collusion is nearly impossible - nobody is sending texts saying anything incriminating, just a subtle word as the vet is there doing it about how many the dealer puts their way each year.

With many vet practices being large corporate owned now, some vets can come under pressure to meet sales targets, especially new younger vets who haven't got a loyal client base yet.
The pressure on vets to him ££ targets can be huge.

Or older independent practices where the cost inflation in recent years has hammered their profits. Vets have a tough time and can be subject to pressure the same as any profession.
Click to expand...

I’m sorry, but this is just utter nonsense.
Vets are humans. Some will always have had more integrity than others it’s true, but to suggest that any professional would offer deliberately misleading advice in some big conspiracy theory around large corporates is just laughable. In what possible way would passing a horse on its vetting help anyone meet this mythical sales target?
 
TheMule said:
I’m sorry, but this is just utter nonsense.
Vets are humans. Some will always have had more integrity than others it’s true, but to suggest that any professional would offer deliberately misleading advice in some big conspiracy theory around large corporates is just laughable. In what possible way would passing a horse on its vetting help anyone meet this mythical sales target?
Click to expand...

Because if you have a reputation as 'failing' horses then dealers will find ways to avoid their customers using you.

Money is a powerful motivation.

I was writing for a BD dressage judge at a unaffiliated comp. last year. There were some lame horses limping (but not hopping) down the center line. I was writing "uneven steps" quite a lot.
At lunch I asked whether she ever rang the bell and asked people to leave - she said she wouldn't because she would lose her regular unaffiliated work and the money that went with it.
They weren't horribly lame but def lame.

It's naive to think vets aren't human enough to think of the consequences of regular vet fails - even the nice vets.
Ignoring the crooks.
 
I definitely know of 1 vet who I believe passes horses who should not pass. I'd not say it goes as far as corruption but definitely looking after the dealer more than the client and so any shades of grey on the vetting going the dealer's way.

With a dealer recommended vet I used for a pony who was never ever right, and was PTS 18 months after I got her, I strongly suspect collusion. I used the dealer recommended vet because 'she's coming tomorrow to vet another one, if that helps you out. Obviously you're welcome to use who you like but you might then need to wait a couple of weeks'. It just seemed sensible. I rang the vetting vet a couple of weeks later, as the pony was aggressive (later discovered secondary to pain) and she said 'oh yes she was a bit touchy'. Well I wasn't told that. And the flexions weren't done because pony would not tolerate it - again a red flag but not flagged by the vet and I was much more naive back then. She just said 'oh its optional and it felt unnecessary to do it'.

The whole viewing was a set up - I went to view a different one, and did all the handling in the stable etc. Then she said oh before you try that one why not have a little sit on.... X ... who was already on the yard. Groom immediately tacked up. Daughter hopped on and she was fab to ride. Dealer then said, you know that pony is a much better match, I just think the one other one is too sharp. Shame for me as he's twice the price ha ha. And I just got caught up in sales patter and agreed to buy there and then. And never handled her myself. Very expensive lesson learned. (I later discovered she had done exactly the same thing with a friend and off-loaded another dodgy pony who was not the one they had gone to view. That one was the fabulous looking bait pony they had no intention of ever selling! Who was on sales livery!!!).

I have just learned not to trust anyone apart from people I trust. Being a doctor, teacher, vet, Olympian.... means nothing. Humans gonna human.
 
Polos Mum said:
Because if you have a reputation as 'failing' horses then dealers will find ways to avoid their customers using you.

Money is a powerful motivation.

I was writing for a BD dressage judge at a unaffiliated comp. last year. There were some lame horses limping (but not hopping) down the center line. I was writing "uneven steps" quite a lot.
At lunch I asked whether she ever rang the bell and asked people to leave - she said she wouldn't because she would lose her regular unaffiliated work and the money that went with it.
They weren't horribly lame but def lame.

It's naive to think vets aren't human enough to think of the consequences of regular vet fails - even the nice vets.
Ignoring the crooks.
Click to expand...
I had the same thing when I was writing for a dressage judge. The horse was clearly lame and I said to her that it was lame and all she said was we are told not to ring the bell unless they are practically on 3 legs!! The horse won the novice class!!
 
onemoretime said:
I had the same thing when I was writing for a dressage judge. The horse was clearly lame and I said to her that it was lame and all she said was we are told not to ring the bell unless they are practically on 3 legs!! The horse won the novice class!!
Click to expand...
Well that either says something about the quality of everyone else competing or the judge is not doing their job judging. That would drop significant marks. It should be hit in the marks with the comment of uneven steps throughout the test at the end and the judge should have had a tactful word with the rider
 
onemoretime said:
I had the same thing when I was writing for a dressage judge. The horse was clearly lame and I said to her that it was lame and all she said was we are told not to ring the bell unless they are practically on 3 legs!! The horse won the novice class!!
Click to expand...
Have also had similar experience when writing for listed judge (and BHS approved trainer).
 
LEC said:
Well that either says something about the quality of everyone else competing or the judge is not doing their job judging. That would drop significant marks. It should be hit in the marks with the comment of uneven steps throughout the test at the end and the judge should have had a tactful word with the rider
Click to expand...
I completely agree!
 
I have had two off experiences with vettings, one when I was 18. Put a deposit on a beautiful horse that was out of work, owner had flip flopped on us riding it (me and friend worked for a dealers, I was young and stupid and would ride ANYTHING) got it vetted by my own vet (never had needed anything but passports, vaccinations and he vetted my first pony for insurance..) who rang me and told me not to buy the horse. Said something was defo wrong with its back etc. perfect thank you mr vet, wonderful work. Only on the paper work he’d passed it? So couldn’t get the deposit back. Mum luckily help me chalk that one up to experience.

Second weird one was as the seller. Sold a horse (advert got shredded on here but he was actually a lovely, sound horse who to my knowledge has never had a sorry day in his life but the surface in the arena was awful so I can understand the comments!). Non-horsey mum was cautious which I supported as my mum was non-horsey and without horsey people helping novices and the uninitiated won’t get far!! Horse went on a month trial (part livery, met both instructors, BHS loan contract was adjusted etc). End of the month had a vetting. Failed for minor thrush. I honestly was like noted?! Understandable but FAILED?! Horsey had already been doing what they needed for a month, and about 8 viewings. Only way they could get it insured was me ringing NFU to state they currently insured him, I explained the situation and they allowed it. The first phone call from nonhorsey mum nearly killed me, as vet had told her failed = don’t buy!! Instructor 1 rang me to discuss and agreed with me completely and stated she’d already complained to yard staff as horsey didn’t leave me with thrush, then contacted next day to say it was barely detectable. Turns out it was a very freshly qualified vet and I think they were just being very very cautious. But vettings aren’t always great from either side of the sale!!

(And my disaster of a TB aced his vetting and started falling apart basically on arrival…)
 
I bought my latest one from the middle of nowhere with only one vet covering the area so of course it was also the dealers vet.

I already knew the dealer was considered dodgy but I was looking for a specific breed and she had one. I googled the vet and he'd been 'let go' from a large group and had set up on his own.

He was very pally with the dealer when we were there and I did wonder why I was bothering.

The horse was fine and I would have bought him without vetting anyway but needed it for the insurance and I wanted blood drawn to check for sedative if his behaviour changed once home.

If anything had subsequently gone wrong with the horse I'd have been inclined to say it was all dodgy but really horses break and a vet can only inspect the horse in front of them.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top