Dream horse turned nightmare... help me!

[browbrow]

http://www.lusitano-interagro.com/novi.htm

http://www.endhousestud.co.uk/associate/crowncornelion.htm

This isn't up for debate - they are notorious for not being good jumpers - please don't try and kick up dust for the sake of it - this is what I think is crap about this forum - off to close account .

 

[Caol Ila]

"You just cannot expect a spanish horse or any type of overseas horse to adapt to an English way of stable management ( and climate)..."

Oh, I don't know. My "overseas" horse adapted all right, and I suspect Colorado summers are similar to Spanish summers, while CO winters are bloody freezing, but a very dry cold.

 

[weebarney]

Sorry it still doesnt make sense (BTW I was given a company car immediately after passing my test and my grandad still drives a Fiesta) The OP has ridden since they were four and 3-4 times a week for at least some time more recently as well as different horses over the years so its fair to say their riding ability is probably more than average.

You dont pass a test to own a horse so the progression to a ferarri should be when you feel the time is right and not at a set point in time as to whether you own the horse or are sharing it

perhaps some of the pro riders out there who ride other peoples horses should buy a 13hh pony when it comes time to buy their first mount?

Ooh a company car, not a Ferrari then. Are you suggesting because a pony is 13 hands its suitable as a 1 st mount? And I would suggest the reason a pro rider would not buy a pony is because they would be too big on it, the size of an animal has nothing to do with how quiet it is. You are seriously dangerous to suggest 1st time owners won't do best with a quiet horse.

 

[Hedwards]

OP - so sorry to hear you're injured...

I'm going to forget that this horse is a PRE (and agree with those that suggest this may not be just a 'spanish' problem & while i agree PRE's are not always the best option as a first horse, some of them are perfectly suitable)

Is it possible your new ned has stomach ulcers? I went through a very similar experience with my new horse a few weeks ago (a TB) - and although have numerous bruises and pains, came off less injured then you. My inclincation is that he has stomach ulcers as its not in his nature at all! we had been working in the school when he just exploded when i put my leg on...May be worth having a vet out to him and get their opinion?

best of luck OP

 

[ester]

This isn't up for debate - they are notorious for not being good jumpers - please don't try and kick up dust for the sake of it - this is what I think is crap about this forum - off to close account .

Over reaction much?

 

[Littlelegs]

I don't see that the pros & cons of Spanish horses or their training are the actual issue. Bottom line is the horse isn't suitable. It could happen with a horse from any background, its no reflection on the breed as a whole.

 

[posie_honey]

my only experience riding such horses was in the stud in solvenia - rode a mare for one lesson - RI said my sister and i were more advanced than other riders so could ride his stallion on the lunge once a day rather than ride the mares twice a day. mares were very sweet accepting quiet things (but they had to be )) stallion was amazing - he was a performing one so we'd watch him in the evening performances do all the airs above ground etc - so top level of training and we were seriously lucky and privilidged to ride him.
this to me just sounds like a horse who's testing - for whatever reason - and OP has had an unfortunate accident. this can happen with any new horse - certainly happened with mine who - after physio and lots of money on a saddle that actually fitted her - went from a very quiet stoical mare to a fly byucking looney tune - simply as she was not in pain for the first time in years.
OP - if you can get a pro to ride then great - get them to find out more etc - but it would still be a risk - if you want no risl then send him back to dealers and get an older more established horse but be prepared for any horse or any breed to do a bit of questioning/adjustment iwth a new rider

 

[WelshD]

Are you suggesting because a pony is 13 hands its suitable as a 1 st mount?
You are seriously dangerous to suggest 1st time owners won't do best with a quiet horse.

Are you suggesting that because a horse is Spanish its not suitable as a 1st mount?

Works all ways. horses are individuals

A 1st horse should be something that is matched to your level of competance and experience at the time of the purchase, no more no less.

 

[weebarney]

Are you suggesting that because a horse is Spanish its not suitable as a 1st mount?

Works all ways. horses are individuals

A 1st horse should be something that is matched to your level of competance and experience at the time of the purchase, no more no less.

Where have I said that????????

 

[WelshD]

Well you did liken it to buying a Ferarri

This horse has had one short moment where there has been a problem, it has been fine before and after the event

The rider was injured because they chose to throw themself off the horse during that moment. Even the quietest horses have had the odd blip but it doesnt make them unsuitable

There is nothing to indicate otherwise that this wasnt a good 1st horse

I think the rider is possibly over-reacting and that the horse will suffer a blotted reputation as a result which is a shame

 

[weebarney]

I have never said a Spanish horse is an unsuitable 1 st horse. You can make stuff up all you want darling. Like people have said thre breed is irrelevant. It's the fact it's 5 , hot blooded , and by the sounds of it is on the sharp side which has resulted in fly bucking across arena. Not my idea of perfect 1 st horse. But hey I don't like getting hurt.

 

[3Beasties]

Can we see the video?

 

[stencilface]

Over reaction much?

I thought so too!

Calm down dear, its only an online forum.

(although just to add, my Luso x TB is also an amazingly clean jumper, only let down by me - popped 1.30m as a 5yo)

 

[Cortez]

Novilheiro......................jumped internationally with John Whittaker in the 80's. He was Lusitano, 'tho.

 

[stencilface]

Novilheiro......................jumped internationally with John Whittaker in the 80's. He was Lusitano, 'tho.

Well I know that, but they all stem from the same stock don't they? (thats a genuine question!) and tbh I tend to lump lusos and Pres together as a type as in my eyes they are fairly similar - like lumping together dales and fell because they're both native UK breeds of the same type

 

[chazza44]

Well you did liken it to buying a Ferarri

This horse has had one short moment where there has been a problem, it has been fine before and after the event

The rider was injured because they chose to throw themself off the horse during that moment. Even the quietest horses have had the odd blip but it doesnt make them unsuitable

There is nothing to indicate otherwise that this wasnt a good 1st horse

I think the rider is possibly over-reacting and that the horse will suffer a blotted reputation as a result which is a shame

That is very unfair. I did very well to sit what happened as far as I did and for your information i was ejected at out of the saddle and decided to roll off to the side i did not 'throw' myself. This is a horrible situation and I need to do what is best for him and for me

please if for whaever reason you dont want to be constructive i would rather you didnt reply.

 

[PandorasJar]

I would expect any well trained 5/6 year old horse to walk/trot/canter under any competant rider, anywhere, at any time, yes.

To me it reads as a young five that hasn't actually been doing as much as was said and isn't balanced enough to potentially be cantering around in a school. I don't think this was a nasty moment, I think it was unbalanced going in first time and second and was too much.

 

[xspiralx]

Not read all posts, but I'd agree with those who say send the horse back and get something else when you recover.

I doubt there is anything wrong with the horse, and you may never have another problem, however a sharp youngster is not really the best choice for a first horse. You may be fine, but equally, you may try to struggle on and lose all your confidence and ruin the horse - to me, that isn't worth the risk.

Doesn't mean you have to get a plod, but I'd say get something a bit older that you can just have some fun on and not worry about.

 

[s4sugar]

Not read all posts, but I'd agree with those who say send the horse back and get something else when you recover.

I doubt there is anything wrong with the horse, and you may never have another problem, however a sharp youngster is not really the best choice for a first horse. You may be fine, but equally, you may try to struggle on and lose all your confidence and ruin the horse - to me, that isn't worth the risk.

Doesn't mean you have to get a plod, but I'd say get something a bit older that you can just have some fun on and not worry about.

This sounds like a sensible option.

 

[chazza44]

he isn't a nasty horse at all. in fact hes rather bomb proof and doesnt bat an eye lid to crazy noisy dogs, traffic, tractors etc. i think it was his balance, im just not sure if i have the confidence to find out. i have now got some help with his exercise which is a big relief so will have to see how he goes as i wont be riding again until jan due to my injuries so will probably be having withdrawals by then

thanks to everyone for their comments. it has given me great comfort to know i am not the only one!

p.s. my boy jumps BIG but definitely more of a dressage type

 

[EMC]

Can we see the video? Might be better to get an outside opinion from an onlooker who has no attachment to either the horse or rider? Or maybe email it to someone knowledgeable on here who can give constructive criticism rather than show everyone?

An experienced lady at my yard has a 5 yr old who was imported from Spain, brilliant in the school, nightmare to hack and I mean he put her through hedges backwards, sideways, spinning etc.....she went back to the importer a few days ago and worked with him on the issues, instant improvement. Some of the problem was her not giving him the signals he was used too, so he got confused and then behaved badly, he had also figured out her weak spot...very intelligent boy! He isn't cured by any stretch but it may be the difference between her selling him or not.

Could also be you are asking too much too early.Spend this time bonding, try again with little steps and go from there.

 

[WelshD]

That is very unfair. I did very well to sit what happened as far as I did and for your information i was ejected at out of the saddle and decided to roll off to the side i did not 'throw' myself. This is a horrible situation and I need to do what is best for him and for me

please if for whaever reason you dont want to be constructive i would rather you didnt reply.

I'm genuinely sorry if that upset you, maybe my choice of words wasnt very good

You will see throughout my many comments that I have defended your right to buy this horse as your first horse and that you obviously have experience in riding different mounts - there are an awful lot of more unconstructive comments on your choices on this thread!

You said you bailed out - however you look at it this wasnt a controlled dismount and my 'over reaction' comment was with reference to you considering sending the horse back at one point. Of course if you are going to keep the horse that isnt an over reaction.

It sounds like you have things a bit more worked out now and I wish you all the best for the future and again apologise if my poor choice of words has upset you

 

[chazza44]

thank you, i appreciate that.

im still not sure exactly what to do but these things always teach you a lesson somehow. im going to give him time to settle and see how he gets on.

 

[Cortez]

To me it reads as a young five that hasn't actually been doing as much as was said and isn't balanced enough to potentially be cantering around in a school. I don't think this was a nasty moment, I think it was unbalanced going in first time and second and was too much.

In Spain horses are generally broken at three and are ridden from the start in a collected manner. As they are obviously young and inexperienced, the riders (who tend to be professionals, especially if the horses are well bred) would be giving the horse a lot of support and balance. If someone then comes along and rides the horse differently and doesn't give the horse the balance, then it is not surprising if the horse gets frightened and reacts as the OP's has done.

 

[TrasaM]

Cortez.. Could you explain the differences in riding style between how Spanish horses are trained to amd ridden in Spain and the way most ppl ride horses here? Am familiar with French classical and could see how a horse trained in this way would object to a sudden change to heavy hands and leg contact. Is there a similarity ?

 

[Cortez]

Exactly! Spanish/Portuguese training methods (there is a "Spanish school" of riding) are amongst the most uninterruptedly (if that is a word) classical anywhere and based on the original de la Guerinierre texts. The emphasis is on "descent de main" and collection. Of course there are many who don't ride or train well, but most professional trainers have qualified at the Royal School of Equestrian Art in Jerez.

I don't mean in any way to be rude, especially to the unfortunate OP, but there are not many people in the UK who ride this way.

 

[PandorasJar]

In Spain horses are generally broken at three and are ridden from the start in a collected manner. As they are obviously young and inexperienced, the riders (who tend to be professionals, especially if the horses are well bred) would be giving the horse a lot of support and balance. If someone then comes along and rides the horse differently and doesn't give the horse the balance, then it is not surprising if the horse gets frightened and reacts as the OP's has done.

Ah okay. I've only had the pleasure of riding older Spanish horses (normally with this kind of reaction from previous circus training )
Although balanced fine, last mare was a one/two person ride and would dump anyone else on her. That's if you could get her tacked up to get on. Took me three months before it clicked and she tried her best for me rather than battling.

 

[puss]

My own experience what the spanish have done to my boy they shouldnt be near a dead horse let alone alive one. When i was over there i see nothing but abuse im no fluffy bunny but this was pure abuse. I dont think they ride any better than english people imo a lot worse hanging on their mouths hauling them around by their mouths learning on side spur digging in the holes they made earlier. My boy has so many scars its untrue imo i think the horse are to scared to fart incase they are beaten. I was over there four years of and on i didnt see balanced riders soft hand squeeze of the leg more like a boot with big spurs on. I agree their diet is not the same as english food and i do think that causes loads of problems. But most spanish horses from spain are scared not dangerous again imo I cant comment on the English spanish horses as never had one.

 

[TrasaM]

Exactly! Spanish/Portuguese training methods (there is a "Spanish school" of riding) are amongst the most uninterruptedly (if that is a word) classical anywhere and based on the original de la Guerinierre texts. The emphasis is on "descent de main" and collection. Of course there are many who don't ride or train well, but most professional trainers have qualified at the Royal School of Equestrian Art in Jerez.

I don't mean in any way to be rude, especially to the unfortunate OP, but there are not many people in the UK who ride this way.

Can see what the issues may be then. I have lessons with a P.Karl trained instructor where emphasis is on lightness...descent de main and legerete . The little mare I get trained on would probably go into meltdown if I rode her the way my regular RI teaches especially as she was donated to him because she was deemed unrideable.
So would it be a suggestion that OP follow a similar path with her horse and find an instructor who can teach her as opposed to the horse having to relearn?

 

[Honey08]

you are so right. spanish horses are amazing.
i am just so sad that i dont think i deserve this little guy. my dressage horse is out there somewhere... i hope. i just cant risk too many more injuries as time off work and loosing function of my right had would be catastrophic for my job. my own silly fault though :-(

Thats the key.

You just had an accident that ended up with a broken arm that it affecting you work.. You've said you don't feel confident, and therefore it will be worse when you get back on in January. At the moment there is nobody to ride this youngster.. All in all not a great mixture of factors..

Your experience or riding doesn't come into it. I have had 18 months away from my proper job due to an operation, and although I'm riding again, I haven't jumped and evented since as in my head I know I can't risk any more time off.. I'm a reasonable rider, an instructor with 20+yrs of experience, but once that niggle is in your head its hard to get out. I will get back to it, but have a horse that I have owned for years and trust, so its a bit easier for me..

Personally I think I would return him and reassess when you're fit to ride in January. No shame, no reflection on you, just a sensible decision in the circumstances..