England COVID restrictions update

[whiteflower]

You are allowed to travel to exercise a pet and stables are no longer on the list of places that have to shut.

On that basis I think I can go to yard to exercise my pony tomorrow.

As pointed out by Maya above, the 'guidance' does not list every single business that must close, it's just an overview, the full legislation is available to read and I guess what the BHS and bef will be looking at in detail

 

[blitznbobs]

Derailing the thread a bit, but you need to go back more than 30years to Thatcher. The declined slowed in 1997, but hasn’t stopped.
Read the whole story here -https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/publications/nhs-hospital-bed-numbers

I agree thatcher has a lot to be blamed for but labour had a long innings and didn’t put it right .. in fact it got worse. It’s a very complex issue tbh and it’s not as simple as it needs more cash and probably not something for discussion on a horsey forum... we may get shouted at by the forum gods

 

[Kat]

Still no update from BHS or BEF - lots of people in limbo until they issue guidance.

 

[OrangeAndLemon]

Our yard has said in the light of no advice, livery yards remain open (sensible precautions apply), elite / professional athletes can still come and use the facilities, and anyone local can still come and use facilities.

Other stuff I've seen from local RSs; Private lessons are continuing, group lessons only where the participants are in a bubble (family group or support bubble).

 

[Kat]

BHS have published something now but it doesn't mention coaching.

 

[ecb89]

So the updated guidance says the outdoors exercise is permitted and this includes horse riding. You can travel for exercise if you need to make a short journey to do so. You can leave your home to care or exercise an an animal or horse where they are not kept at home.

Therefore from that I take that livery yards do not need to lockdown

 

[asmp]

Well looking at the amount of traffic that was on the road this morning and the number of people walking around town, it doesn’t seem any different to earlier in the week

 

[ecb89]

Also this important line. The ‘when’ means we can visit just have to socially distance.

• When visiting a livery yard or stables you should avoid unnecessary social contact and gathering with people who you do not live with

 

[ester]

Well looking at the amount of traffic that was on the road this morning and the number of people walking around town, it doesn’t seem any different to earlier in the week

It was really quiet here (I don't start until 10am) it's usually still busy yesterday was long queue of traffic on the A10 this morning barely anything.

 

[Kat]

Guidance has been published. Coaches can teach 1-2-1 sessions, riding a horse you own/loan or care for is permitted.

 

[Equine_Dream]

We need to remember livery owners do not restrict access for their own good they do it for the safety of everyone, whether or not this is necessary is a different matter but they are trying to do the right thing. To say you will move your horse If access is restricted I find a little shallow and ridiculously selfish there are worse things happening out there like people never seeing their loved ones again, businesses going down , people loosing jobs etc.

As someone who was initially faced with not being allowed to see my horses during the first lockdown, I completely understand where Griffin is coming from. I suffer with anxiety and the thought of not seeing the horses was crippling me. I honestly would not have coped with not being allowed to see them for weeks/months on end.
Luckily for me my YO changed their mind at the last minute and we were allowed limited access to our horses. But if the initial idea of not being allowed to see my horses at all had come into force, I would have moved yards.
You may call this selfish but I think this is incredibly short sighted. For myself and many others, my horses are my sanity, and to not be allowed to see them would have caused enormous damage to my mental health. Yes there are far worse problems but it doesn't make my own feelings any less valid.

 

[bouncing_ball]

Guidance has been published. Coaches can teach 1-2-1 sessions, riding a horse you own/loan or care for is permitted.

Could you link to the coaching bit? Thanks

 

[milliepops]

Could you link to the coaching bit? Thanks

link on this page
https://www.bhs.org.uk/our-charity/...hIHthUGzRHNrYqU5WJV6qMyxUY66crThPP1lsf4xgoTpI

 

[MagicMelon]

I really cant imagine the police would care less if you were caught driving to go and check on the welfare of your horse. They're not going to fine you for it are they? Imagine how much time they'd have to waste trying to prove your horse was on full livery for example and you didnt technically "need" to go. Im in Scotland and keep my horse at home, but if I were locked down and kept my horses anywhere else nothing would stop me checking them twice daily as normal.

 

[milliepops]

depends on how far you're proposing to drive

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/...TAlj8k7H3JB9qH7OvQ6Z-oU-iZJo7Hk9FZe7aX59E_hn4

 

[Kat]

The advice has been updated again. Seems to allow 1-2-1 coaching, and lessons at riding schools and boxing out for lessons/arena hire/hacking

I'm quite excited that boxing out is allowed, I can plan some long hacks with the husband.

 

[teapot]

The advice has been updated again. Seems to allow 1-2-1 coaching, and lessons at riding schools and boxing out for lessons/arena hire/hacking

I'm quite excited that boxing out is allowed, I can plan some long hacks with the husband.

The BHS has posted advice in direct contradicition to the BEF!

https://www.britishequestrian.org.u...mztY6_TxR90O-WIJEvVGL-oKxBxJK_-7QMuiscSrO27PM

 

[Kat]

No they haven't. BEF say they are awaiting further clarification regarding travelling horses but it is probably acceptable for safety or welfare purposes. BHS added an extra bit to their covid page saying that they have consulted further and "You can travel your horse to use an outdoor arena to exercise and an arena can continue to be hired out providing all necessary Covid protocols and social distancing are in place".

That isn't direct contravention. That suggests that the BHS have added an addendum more quickly that the BEF.

 

[teapot]

No they haven't. BEF say they are awaiting further clarification regarding travelling horses but it is probably acceptable for safety or welfare purposes. BHS added an extra bit to their covid page saying that they have consulted further and "You can travel your horse to use an outdoor arena to exercise and an arena can continue to be hired out providing all necessary Covid protocols and social distancing are in place".

That isn't direct contravention. That suggests that the BHS have added an addendum more quickly that the BEF.

Oh I was talking about lessons and centres; not even read the traveling bit!

 

[MereChristmas]

No they haven't. BEF say they are awaiting further clarification regarding travelling horses but it is probably acceptable for safety or welfare purposes. BHS added an extra bit to their covid page saying that they have consulted further and "You can travel your horse to use an outdoor arena to exercise and an arena can continue to be hired out providing all necessary Covid protocols and social distancing are in place".

That isn't direct contravention. That suggests that the BHS have added an addendum more quickly that the BEF.

I can hack from home, always alone.
Is there anywhere that says I and a friend can or cannot transport our horses a short distance from our separate homes to meet for hacking? We often did this pre lockdowns.

 

[Kat]

Oh right, I think upon reading that the issue might be around the definition of public/private.

My guess would be that when they say private garden they mean domestic, rather than commercial premises.

The guidelines are for all sports, I doubt that the rules are intended to discriminate between a local authority owned park and the local stately home that allows visitors to pay a fee to walk in their parkland, or between a commercial golf course and a local authority one. The focus is on ensuring that venues are covid secure.

 

[Kat]

I can hack from home, always alone.
Is there anywhere that says I and a friend can or cannot transport our horses a short distance from our separate homes to meet for hacking? We often did this pre lockdowns.

The BHS say that you can transport your horse to exercise it away from your yard whether to hack or arena hire. The BEF say that they are seeking clarification on travelling horses but it might only be for safety or welfare. I'd travel to go hacking with one other person based upon the BHS advice. I wouldn't travel with that ither person though I would meet them there are car sharing is discouraged.

 

[Griffin]

We need to remember livery owners do not restrict access for their own good they do it for the safety of everyone, whether or not this is necessary is a different matter but they are trying to do the right thing. To say you will move your horse If access is restricted I find a little shallow and ridiculously selfish there are worse things happening out there like people never seeing their loved ones again, businesses going down , people loosing jobs etc.

I think making such harsh judgements without knowing someone's personal circumstances is rather unkind. I would like to think that all YO always put the interests of everyone first but I think after seeing the behaviour of some in the first lockdown (e.g. banning liveries for months and forcing people who had been furloughed or made redundant to pay full livery), this is clearly not the case for everyone.

I am acutely aware that there are worst things than not seeing my horse (I am a key worker and I work with some of the most vulnerable on our society) but as she is pretty essential to my mental health staying on fairly positive level, I don't want to be unable to see her every day. Thankfully, my YO is not locking down to liveries due to guidance today but I feel for owners who are not as lucky.

 

[ycbm]

To say you will move your horse If access is restricted I find a little shallow and ridiculously selfish there are worse things happening out there like people never seeing their loved ones again, businesses going down , people loosing jobs etc.

The fact that other people are losing jobs, loved ones and businesses has no bearing on how upsetting any one person finds it to be refused access to their horse. They may love that horse more than any human in their own life. Riding or spending that time with their horse might be the safety valve that prevents stress blowing their whole life apart.

Livery owners are providing a service for which they are paid. Horse owners don't, in general, pay for the horse to be kept. They pay for the horse to be kept so that it is available for them to spend time with.

If the law says that access to the horse is allowed but the livery owner refuses to a permit that, then they should expect to lose customers to livery owners who will.

You wouldn't keep paying Tesco if they took your groceries order and refused to give you them.
.

 

[Abi90]

The fact that other people are losing jobs, loved ones and businesses has no bearing on how upsetting any one person finds it to be refused access to their horse. They may love that horse more than any human in their own life. Riding or spending that time with their horse might be the safety valve that prevents stress blowing their whole life apart.

Livery owners are providing a service for which they are paid. Horse owners don't, in general, pay for the horse to be kept. They pay for the horse to be kept so that it is available for them to spend time with.

If the law says that access to the horse is allowed but the livery owner refuses to a permit that, then they should expect to lose customers to livery owners who will.

You wouldn't keep paying Tesco if they took your groceries order and refused to give you them.
.

Well said. Everything is relative and people can be upset about whatever makes them upset at the time

 

[Winters100]

I can see both sides of this. Just because the rules do not specifically say that yards must close it does make sense to me that yard owners would want to limit access, especially if they have staff to protect. That having been said covid will go away soon, so there has to be some compromise when it comes to animals. I agree for some with genuine mental health issues being able to see their animals is crucial to their wellbeing, and I would hope that YOs and other liveries would recognise these people as an 'exception' and make some concessions to allow them to safely visit their animals. I do however also believe that we need to differentiate between genuine mental health issues and being 'down', 'frustrated', 'sad', 'worried' etc. I can say that when I could not see my horses I felt all of these things, but to say that these were mental health issues is, to me, really insulting to those who truly suffer greatly, as some people on this forum do, and as my close family member who took his own life did. Having experience of people who have suffered from depression I am quite certain that my feeling lethargic and down was not even a tenth of what they endure. To me now is the time for all of us to try to be part of the solution. To limit our activity to what is really necessary, for some this will mean going to their horses, while others will be able to limit or stop this. Where I am there is no lockdown yet, but seeing how the numbers are going has prompted me to limit my visits again. I have one booked for a tooth removal on Monday, so I have to go at the moment, but I am working with YO to make sure that I am there as little as possible and at non-busy times. I am also helping other owners as much as I can while I am there, sending videos and doing little jobs so that they can also limit their visits, and they do the same for me. Time for those on yards to help each other out, and also to help YOs and staff, most of whom are just doing their best in really difficult circumstances.

 

[ycbm]

I can see both sides of this. Just because the rules do not specifically say that yards must close it does make sense to me that yard owners would want to limit access, especially if they have staff to protect. That having been said covid will go away soon, so there has to be some compromise when it comes to animals. I agree for some with genuine mental health issues being able to see their animals is crucial to their wellbeing, and I would hope that YOs and other liveries would recognise these people as an 'exception' and make some concessions to allow them to safely visit their animals. I do however also believe that we need to differentiate between genuine mental health issues and being 'down', 'frustrated', 'sad', 'worried' etc. I can say that when I could not see my horses I felt all of these things, but to say that these were mental health issues is, to me, really insulting to those who truly suffer greatly, as some people on this forum do, and as my close family member who took his own life did. Having experience of people who have suffered from depression I am quite certain that my feeling lethargic and down was not even a tenth of what they endure. To me now is the time for all of us to try to be part of the solution. To limit our activity to what is really necessary, for some this will mean going to their horses, while others will be able to limit or stop this. Where I am there is no lockdown yet, but seeing how the numbers are going has prompted me to limit my visits again. I have one booked for a tooth removal on Monday, so I have to go at the moment, but I am working with YO to make sure that I am there as little as possible and at non-busy times. I am also helping other owners as much as I can while I am there, sending videos and doing little jobs so that they can also limit their visits, and they do the same for me. Time for those on yards to help each other out, and also to help YOs and staff, most of whom are just doing their best in really difficult circumstances.

I cannot accept that a livery yard cannot be run safely and almost normally with social distancing, if the yard owner wants it to.

In the last lockdown plenty of livery yards did just that. Those who didn't deserved to lose customers.
.

 

[claret09]

we have been told we are back to one visit per day for one and a half hours if riding. less if you aren't. i could put my thoughts into words - but it would very very rude, so i won't

 

[Equine_Dream]

YO's are perfectly entitled to do whatever they feel is best for their yards, and I would never dream of telling anyone what they should and shouldn't do with their own yard. They should of course do what they feel is best.
Equally liveries are paying for a service, and if they do not feel they are getting a service that is suitable for them, they are well within their rights to go elsewhere, and find somewhere more suitable.
I don't agree with labelling people as selfish for deciding to move to a different yard. They are entitled to move their own horses as they see fit, whether it's because their current yard has stopped them from seeing their horses, or they would prefer a yard with an indoor school. It's not for anyone else to judge.

 

[teapot]

It is do-able with good risk assessments, effort and decent organisation. Plus a bit of flexibility on both sides.