Even more livery yards moving towards banning winter turnout?

[ihatework]

I have never seen my mare play.
She is very very happy and content in her own company and generally far more settled to deal with. She is the only one I have had that seems happier on individual turnout.

This last year she has had to socialise, on the whole the only interactions she has with the others (other than her own foal) was to scowl at them and tell them to do one.

She did seem to very much get on with one mare at stud pre-foaling, which was not the norm for mine.

 

[Identityincrisis]

But what does the average horse do all day? Eat, sleep and poo. We have to be absolutely clear that as owners we need to meet their needs,

See I feel that daily turn out is an essential part, I am lucky (very, by the sound of it!) that we have all day turn out in Winter, I get frustrated as many don't turnout daily, saying their horse wants a 'Duvet day', no they don't you're projecting your feelings on to them! This wouldn't bother me most times, each to their own, but sometimes the whole yard (full of over pampered hairies) decide to keep in so I have no choice as I wouldn't be happy turning out my young horse on his own without me being able to keep an eye on him.

I believe daily turnout is important for mental and physical health. I'm not criticising those who can't due to rules. I just agree with the comparison of us being stuck in a bathroom day after day

 

[ycbm]

The way I see it you should try staying in your bathroom for 23 hours a day and see how long you last someone could provide food, you would have on tap water to drink, room to lie down just the only activity you could have would be eating, sleeping and using the toilet. Might change your mindset a bit.

But it's not the same is it? Horses don't read books or play chess, it's not in the intellectual capacity. The have a much higher boredom threshold than a human. You might as well say to a person 'you try eating nothing but grass and see how you like it'.

Lots of horses seem perfectly content in a stable.

 

[Amye]

I think it's difficult to compare with 'us being stuck in a room all day', humans have intelligent minds and are quite content to sit around all day if they have a tv/books etc to stimulate them. But I don't think you can equate that to a horse being stuck in a stable all day with food - horses were built to roam miles upon miles everyday in search of food, quick bursts of energy to escape danger all in a herd. They are prey, we are predators, their minds are completely different from ours, and we can't *really* imagine what they actually think or feel. You'll always be able to argue one way or another in that comparison, as you can't really compare without anthropomorphism. We can't say that horses have a higher 'boredom' threshold than us because getting bored is really just a human term.

I know that none of what we do with horses is 'natural' but I also think that being turned out is good for a horses mental and physical health. Just my opinion! Everyone has their own opinion on what is best for their horse - and as we all know, what's good for one might not be for the other.

Personally, I would always look for a yard with daily turnout throughout the year as that's what I believe is best for my horse.

 

[smja]

I get frustrated as many don't turnout daily, saying their horse wants a 'Duvet day', no they don't you're projecting your feelings on to them!

Speak for yourself. My horse has literally refused to go out before in the winter, planted in the barn doorway and was having none of it. He cheerfully went back into his stable, happy as Larry!

 

[Annagain]

Speak for yourself. My horse has literally refused to go out before in the winter, planted in the barn doorway and was having none of it. He cheerfully went back into his stable, happy as Larry!

Some horses cope with it far better than others. Mine is very happy to come in but he's far more desperate to get out in the morning. My farrier always shoes him at 8am so used to do him straight from the stable in winter but now we turn him out for an hour before getting him in and cleaned up for shoeing. It's more work but so much easier as he's just so grumpy if he hasn't had his turnout and a roll. If we plan on riding him straight from the stable we have to get him clean the night before as he just won't stand to be brushed.

Once there was a breakdown of communication and he got stuck in his stable until 2pm. He attacked me when I arrived, it's the only time he's ever done anything like it. The one time he got left out overnight due to a problem (these incidents were 7 years apart, it's not common!) he didn't even care about coming in to eat his food in the morning.

 

[Damnation]

My mare is like yours Annagain, she wouldn't attack me but is normally a very well mannered horse. If she is in she just becomes so pushy, even in storm conditions she would rather be outside and miserable than inside eating hay!

Always desperate to go out in the morning, she can cope being in for a few days but she really does not like it.

Having been bred in Holland where she was in the field and then going onto an Eventer I wonder if she just didn't get turned out with the Eventer and this has traumatised her somewhat?

If only they could talk..

 

[Amye]

If only they could talk..

I think this would solve all our problems!

 

[cobgoblin]

I think this would solve all our problems!

Nope...that would start a whole new raft of difficulties!

 

[scats]

Mine enjoy going out on in any weather. Granted, in winter I might bring in a few hours earlier if it has lashed down all day, and they usually look pretty happy with that arrangement. BUT, they are just as keen to go out in all weathers. They might walk sidewards to the field to keep the rain off their faces but once they are out, they happily go and graze and play. I knew someone who used to insist their horse hated the rain, and granted it would appear to stop and refuse to move, but in reality, if you watched the owner leading it, you could tell that they really didn't want to go out in the rain by the way they lead it and walked and I'm absolutely positive some of that reluctance transferred to the horse, hence the reason it kept stopping.

 

[Annagain]

Nope...that would start a whole new raft of difficulties!

Oh yes, I can imagine the negotiations with mine. He'd drive a very hard bargain

 

[Goldenstar]

Well I know said I liked the black Antares but now I think I would prefer a brown Butet and another thing I don't think blue is really my colour so would it be an awful lot of trouble could you get me a red thermatex and another thing I don't like that new bay at the end of the row would you mind getting rid of him thanks awfully shut the door quietly on your way out .
Munch munch munch .

 

[Kathy657]

It's what your horses get used to I suppose. At our yard as youngsters they are out 24/7 . In the winter they are barned in groups with no turnout. The ridden horses go out at night in the summer and come in during the day, and they are ready and waiting at the gate. God help you if you try and leave them out for a day off, they just go mad running around causing havoc. In the winter they stay in when it gets wet. If we do manage to turn out for a couple of hours they just stand by the gate.
We aren't being cruel, the horses are happy. It's an American barn system so they have company.
Personally I can't bear to see horses out all day unless they have adequate rugs, grazing & some shelter.

 

[DipseyDeb]

I had the same dilema, the yard I was at was the most expensive in the area but very restricted turnout in the winter, resulting in mine developing a bit of a dust allergy. I have been lucky enough to get on one of the few yards in the area that doesn't have any restrictions. They have an abundance of well maintained grazing land and all for almost half of what I was paying. That said it is in the minority (I believe) round these parts and I certainly won't be moving on in a hurry

 

[SO1]

I have never been on a yard which has not offered all year round turnout, but I am in the SE and the weather is drier for longer. However I would have though that in Northern England even though the weather is wetter land is cheaper and it is less built up so you would have more yards with lots of land and perhaps YO would not need to get so many liveries to cover the cost of the land.

I think the horses do need to go out every day and one hour for a healthy horse is not enough even if the owner can come and ride every day. I work full time and have a long commute from work to yard and so I don't normally get to the yard until about 6.45pm. In winter my pony is not very keen in coming out of his stable to be exercised in the school in evenings when it is cold, he would rather be in his stable eating his hay. He is a native pony and very greedy his happiness is mainly based around where the best food is! In the summer the best food is in the field in the winter when the grass is not as lush and is more like living hay he likes to be in his stable when he can stuff himself with hay without much effort. He does still have to go in the field every day though and he does get keen to come in during the winter.

I can sort of see the logic in that part/full livery yard may have more consistent turnout as it helps with their routine and it is easier with staff and hay/feed ordering if they have a similar routine all year round. A DIY yard may be different as reducing turnout does not reduce profit because the owner is doing the mucking out and buying hay etc and it is not extra work for the YO. If a part/full livery yard can have the horses going out every day then it means less time spent mucking out and less hay needs to be feed. I am on part livery and the horses have the same routine all year round - out during the day in at night and there is plenty of grass even in the winter, however even though there is loads of grass the horses still sometimes wait around wanting to come in the winter when the grass is less green and tasty.

I used to be on DIY grass livery for many years, there were two yards that did grass livery and both of them did not allow big horses to live out it was only ponies and cobs who could live out, their reasons being that the smaller ponies and cobs were less prone to running around and did not churn the land up as much as the bigger horses.

 

[HashRouge]

I have never been on a yard which has not offered all year round turnout, but I am in the SE and the weather is drier for longer. However I would have though that in Northern England even though the weather is wetter land is cheaper and it is less built up so you would have more yards with lots of land and perhaps YO would not need to get so many liveries to cover the cost of the land.

Sadly this is a slightly naive view. It's true there is a lot of land. There certainly is where my parents live, which is roughly where I think the OP lives. However, that doesn't mean the livery yards have any more land than elsewhere in the country. Most of the land is owned or rented by sheep farmers, who certainly don't want horses making a mess of their grazing!

 

[stencilface]

Yes, because all land in the north is windswept grassland owned by Greengrass and only costs a quid an acre

There is little horse grazing as said above, most is for sheep or farming (to provide the southerners with food no doubt ) precious little is there for livery yards. And yes, it rains, although I don't think that's an exclusively northern thing.

Fwiw our geldings play regularly. Mainly instigated by the mule jumping on one of them

Three of ours are out 24/7 year round, two will go in at night for the wettest and darkest months (Dec to Feb generally). Lucky in that it's our land and there's enough of it, even if lots of it is clay.