Farmers land owners etc. Allowing riders on land?

[Goldenstar]

I was thinking that if you have your own insurance it might be ok? It seems to me farmers are missing out on income. You would have to have some way of showing you had paid like a hat band or something. Also rules such as not using it in very wet weather or cantering on specific areas etc. With the roads getting ever more busy I can see in the future it may be the only way of hacking out.

Why would your own insurance help? if the farmer did something that was deemed negligent he would liable if you where insured or not .

 

[Tiddlypom]

Why would your own insurance help? if the farmer did something that was deemed negligent he would liable if you where insured or not .

Indeed. Say you rode your horse over a forgotten set of chain harrows in longer grass? Not malicious but negligent if the farmer had said that riders could use that route.

 

[Sandstone1]

Why would your own insurance help? if the farmer did something that was deemed negligent he would liable if you where insured or not .

I was thinking more of a fall or accident not the farmer being negligent. If he was negligent you would claim on his insurance the same as if you had a accident on the road with a driver etc.

 

[Goldenstar]

I was thinking more of a fall or accident not the farmer being negligent. If he was negligent you would claim on his insurance the same as if you had a accident on the road with a driver etc.

How does you being insured help the farmer .
Hes just worried about being sued himself if you are not on his land he has no risk .
It’s the same as why I don’t let anyone except a few trusted people use my school .

 

[Sandstone1]

Looks like hacking will soon be a thing of the past then......

 

[ycbm]

I think the future in Engkand and Wales, unless you livery near wild moors, is going to be dedicated farm rides costing £15-25 a circuit, Public Utility paths provided as part of their community requirement, Forestry Commission permits, National Trust permits for country estates and very, very benevolent private estates like Chatsworth and Badminton.

Anyone who doesn't live near enough to one or more of those, or simply can't afford the payments (Dyrham Park is small but was £75 a year to the National Trust in 1984, heaven knows what it is if it's still allowed now!) either has to take their life in their hands or not hack.

Back in the 80s somebody tried very hard to set up a network of UKChasers courses. These were farm rides with a some jumps on them. I went to one one and it was lovely. But the idea just didn't stick as a paying business for farmers and sadly it faded out.

Tough times for horse riders, too many road users everywhere

 

[Sandstone1]

I think the future in Engkand and Wales, unless you livery near wild moors, is going to be dedicated farm rides costing £15-25 a circuit, Public Utility paths provided as part of their community requirement, Forestry Commission permits, National Trust permits for country estates and very, very benevolent private estates like Chatsworth and Badminton.

Anyone who doesn't live near enough to one or more of those, or simply can't afford the payments (Dyrham Park is small but was £75 a year to the National Trust in 1984, heaven knows what it is if it's still allowed now!) either has to take their life in their hands or not hack.

Back in the 80s somebody tried very hard to set up a network of UKChasers courses. These were farm rides with a some jumps on them. I went to one one and it was lovely. But the idea just didn't stick as a paying business for farmers and sadly it faded out.

Tough times for horse riders, too many road users everywhere

I fear you are right. Its sad but I honestly think the roads are very quickly getting too unsafe to ride on. I do feel that there must be a way for farmers to make some extra income but it seems people feel quite negative about that.

 

[Clodagh]

I fear you are right. Its sad but I honestly think the roads are very quickly getting too unsafe to ride on. I do feel that there must be a way for farmers to make some extra income but it seems people feel quite negative about that.

I would imagine that farmers would feel the hassle and damage would outweigh the small financial benefits.

 

[PeterNatt]

Our small BHS Access Team in Hertfordshire has obtained numerous new Bridleways and Restricted Byways for Horse Riders and Carriage Drivers. The advantage of these being that future generations of Horse Riders and Carriage Drives will be able to use them.

 

[Steerpike]

There is quite an active bridleway group in my county of Wales and the council have been quick to fix a gate when I've reported it, they have also re opened a bridleway here recently so we do have decent riding here, I know I'm very lucky as some in Wales have little to no bridleways.
I know when I kept my horses on my BIL farm he allowed me to ride on some of his field margins, I couldn't ride on all of them due to subsidies, but he had to block quite a few entrances as other people decided they would do the same without his permission which annoyed him as they started to ride on parts they weren't supposed to.

 

[daydreamer]

Where I am there is a scheme where you pay and get given a tag so you can ride along farm tracks that are part of the scheme - east Anglia farm rides. I know in some of the local areas it works well and there are loads of routes. Sadly where I am there is a scheme track just opposite the yard but the farmer has let the entrance become completely overgrown and ploughed the field so there is only about 1m up the edge so apparently doesn’t really want horses on it even though (presumably) they’re being paid to allow us on it.

 

[Frano]

So local hunts ride on all sorts of land owned by various people. So how do they get around the problem?

They churn up lots of tracks,fields etc. Is insurance a problem for them?

 

[blitznbobs]

So local hunts ride on all sorts of land owned by various people. So how do they get around the problem?

They churn up lots of tracks,fields etc. Is insurance a problem for them?

Most landowners I know wont let the hunt on … they make such a mess and cause quite a lot of disruption as they come through

 

[Clodagh]

So local hunts ride on all sorts of land owned by various people. So how do they get around the problem?

They churn up lots of tracks,fields etc. Is insurance a problem for them?

Hunts have insurance and are invited on by the landowner. (In the main… if they aren’t invited that’s a whole other subject.)

 

[Sandstone1]

So local hunts ride on all sorts of land owned by various people. So how do they get around the problem?

They churn up lots of tracks,fields etc. Is insurance a problem for them?

100% ! They also break the law frequently. I have my own insurance but was told that does not count. Go figure as they say!

 

[Sandstone1]

Hunts have insurance and are invited on by the landowner. (In the main… if they aren’t invited that’s a whole other subject.)

But if there was a properly ran scheme to allow riders on to farm land they would have insurance and be invited on to the land. Whats the differance????

 

[Clodagh]

But if there was a properly ran scheme to allow riders on to farm land they would have insurance and be invited on to the land. Whats the differance????

If they would pay enough money to make it worth while then none. The hunt don’t come all year, every day.

 

[Clodagh]

It’s like asking your friends to come and play rounders in your garden v asking some complete strangers to pay to do so.

 

[ycbm]

So local hunts ride on all sorts of land owned by various people. So how do they get around the problem?

They churn up lots of tracks,fields etc. Is insurance a problem for them?

The farmers who allow it like the hunts, the activity, the tradition, the people who run it, the fallen stock service and the vermin control services.

Some farmers are tenants forced to allow hunting by the landowner, who will often be a hunt member.

There was never any vermin control by the drag hunts in Cheshire but they were welcomed by lot of farmers, including some who were against hunting fox. They enjoyed seeing us enjoy ourselves and the horses and hounds.

 

[Sandstone1]

If they would pay enough money to make it worth while then none. The hunt don’t come all year, every day.

I would think that there would be some restriction on how many times you could use it or only at certain times of year etc. Im sure it could be done. Farmers are always saying they need more money. Also single or small groups of riders would make a lot less mess that the hunt.

 

[Goldenstar]

So local hunts ride on all sorts of land owned by various people. So how do they get around the problem?

They churn up lots of tracks,fields etc. Is insurance a problem for them? rights is why many hunts have acces

Sporting rights is how.

 

[cauda equina]

That's why it would be so helpful to have some government involvement and money
There's a lot of talk about getting people more active, out into the countryside and so on but I can't see anything actually being done

 

[Sandstone1]

It’s like asking your friends to come and play rounders in your garden v asking some complete strangers to pay to do so.

But they do not make money from the hunt and the hunt also damages the land.

 

[Goldenstar]

That's why it would be so helpful to have some government involvement and money
There's a lot of talk about getting people more active, out into the countryside and so on but I can't see anything actually being done

Well there’s an explosion of people out and about in Northumberland .

 

[Sandstone1]

Sporting rights is how.

Well, its soon going to be a thing of the past so it wont be a issue.

 

[ycbm]

I used to ride on a path around a field where the farmer was happy for us to do that. One day my horse trod on a piece of angle iron buried in that path, (left from a fence cut off at ground level years and years before) and punched a hole right through his sole. In 1983 it wouldn't have occurred to most people to sue but my impression is that today it would at least cross most people minds.

At the very least, that claim would raise insurance premiums in following years, before even thinking about the stress of it all.

I can see exactly why farmers wouldn't want the hassle.

Can people in Scotland tell us how the open access rights are going there? Do you genuinely have access or are farmers locking gates? Are farmers being sued for accidents?

 

[Goldenstar]

Well, its soon going to be a thing of the past so it wont be an issue.

?
You asked how hunts access land and I explained sporting rights (and by arrangement ).

 

[Goldenstar]

I used to ride on a path around a field where the farmer was happy for us to do that. One day my horse trod on a piece of angle iron buried in that path, (left from a fence cut off at ground level years and years before) and punched a hole right through his sole. In 1983 it wouldn't have occurred to most people to sue but my impression is that today it would at least cross most people minds.

At the very least, that claim would raise insurance premiums in following years, before even thinking about the stress of it all.

I can see exactly why farmers wouldn't want the hassle.

Can people in Scotland tell us how the open access rights are going there? Do you genuinely have access or are farmers locking gates? Are farmers being sued for accidents?

Scotland is held up as an example for access but my experience is it’s easier in some ways and worse in others .
Like the whole payment for social care thing all is not quite what it seems .

 

[Sandstone1]

I can understand insurance issues but I am sure there would be a way round it. After all we ride on the roads with massive risks from traffic, loose dogs cyclists etc etc.
Surely a way of getting riders off roads would make sense.
Unless something is done soon I think hacking and owning a horse for the happy hacker will become impossible. That in turn will effect farmers who make hay etc.

 

[ycbm]

Scotland is held up as an example for access but my experience is it’s easier in some ways and worse in others .
Like the whole payment for social care thing all is not quite what it seems .

I thought that might be the case. Before we moved I had permission to ride on about 1000 acres of Peak Park. The problem was that for most of the year most of the gates between fields were shut and many were padlocked because otherwise walkers would leave them open causing problems like letting the rams impregnate their daughters.

So my open access, which was wonderful in theory, was a non starter for practical reasons.