Fed up with dressage, or with trainer?

QueenT

QueenT

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Here's how today's training went: In the time it takes to ride a 20 m circle, I was instructed to maintain frame, soften inside hand, no not that much, you lost contact, ride more up to outside hand, sit straight - don't lean, activate inside leg - she's out of rhythm! increase stride, half-halt, half-halt, inside hind is off track - she's off balance, correct outside shoulder, activate, activate!... well, you get the picture.

So, while all of these things are true, I now sit with a feeling that I am hopeless rider and a fool to even try. Right now starting even the smallest competitions is out of the question. My wonderful schoolmaster horse, who in addition to M level training has a fantastic mind, is confused and frustrated, but keeps trying to understand what I want her to do. I feel that I should be able to correct all of these things as instructed, but I am simply not able to adjust these things as fast as required. Or apparently not well enough... dressage is difficult, maybe I just need to suck it up? Or drop it altogether and go out hacking. Or find another trainer who can explain aids better...?

Have any of you had similar experiences, and what did you do to move on?
 
QueenT said:
Here's how today's training went: In the time it takes to ride a 20 m circle, I was instructed to maintain frame, soften inside hand, no not that much, you lost contact, ride more up to outside hand, sit straight - don't lean, activate inside leg - she's out of rhythm! increase stride, half-halt, half-halt, inside hind is off track - she's off balance, correct outside shoulder, activate, activate!... well, you get the picture.

So, while all of these things are true, I now sit with a feeling that I am hopeless rider and a fool to even try. Right now starting even the smallest competitions is out of the question. My wonderful schoolmaster horse, who in addition to M level training has a fantastic mind, is confused and frustrated, but keeps trying to understand what I want her to do. I feel that I should be able to correct all of these things as instructed, but I am simply not able to adjust these things as fast as required. Or apparently not well enough... dressage is difficult, maybe I just need to suck it up? Or drop it altogether and go out hacking. Or find another trainer who can explain aids better...?

Have any of you had similar experiences, and what did you do to move on?
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Gosh I'm confused reading that.... what were you trying to achieve at the time?
 
sometimes the way instructors teach don't suit a person. i would be useless with an instructor like that, i need one who makes me understand 'why' im doing stuff, not just talking me through instructions to get a horse going a particular way which i can never replicate myself again solo!

try a few different instructors and see if any click
 
I had a trainer who made me feel like this... too many instructions, too many criticisms. . Too negative. I'm really self critical anyway and this just crippled me, I lost all my confidence and had no idea what to do next.

What i did was find a new trainer. Someone who complements my way of learning better. He doesn't overload me with things but we don't ignore the details either, it's just not overwhelming and I can practice and play with stuff on my own with confidence.

Look elsewhere for training, it shouldn't be like that.
 
Bombarding you with too much information is not going to get you anywhere, I train people and often have to take a step back to prevent myself doing the same as sometimes the effect of the rider doing instruction 1 means the next instruction is required to balance the first, before you know where you are you are talking non stop and everything is falling apart, when that happens I try and take stock and get back to keeping things simple.

I would either have a chat to your instructor and see if you can get back to basics, not necessarily basic work but concentrating on the basics within the work you are doing, or try someone new who will get you to start to feel more confident in your ability, confidence is so important whatever sphere you are doing, working towards getting out to a competition rather than making you negative in what you are doing, dressage is not easy to do well but riding should be fun not torture.
 
Ah ok. It just sounds as if she is trying to get you to keep a nice inside bend whilst ensuring you don't let your mare fall to the inside of the circle - or you for that matter as you get drawn in (easy done!). It does sound like a lot but to ride a nice circle does take a lot of work indeed as you ensure the horse is listening to your aids... by medium though you perhaps shouldn't be needing to use this many aids to keep her on a circle as she should be nice and straight for you. My mantra is that, if it feels difficult, I've missed a step and so I go back. You always need to go back and check your foundations are in order I feel especially if you're feeling a bit down about training - it's a sign.

Don't be so hard on yourself, don't push a locked door as they say, go back and find the key :)

Also, if your trainer is knocking you, have a chat and see where it's going.
 
See, all of that makes perfect sense to me; I understand what the instructor wants you to do. Perhaps you need to go back a few steps and get your instructor to explain what is required before throwing it all at you in a glob like that?
 
Well, you are right of course. It's just that the foundations don't even seem to work. When I bought her, we were training canter leg-yields and other diagonal stuff - she didn't really have the strength for it, so I have focused on building that, and now nothing works. In any case, thanks for the support! :-)
 
It sounds like a trainer whose style doesn't work for you, rather than a bad rider, or bad trainer. I respond well to people who train in this way, but I can see how people might not. I trained in Germany, and became used to a very disciplined way of training - it was a surprise to come back to the UK, and be taught in a very different way.
 
For me, and perhaps for you OP, the problem with this kind of highly instructive training is that it doesn't equip me to ride independently between lessons. I need to learn the feel of correct work, understand the breakdown of how I got there and then to have a moment to repeat it independently.

Otherwise you need someone barking commands at you every time you ride (well I did with this kind of trainer!) No good if you only have fortnightly lessons and have to go it alone in between ;)
 
Yes, style mismatch. Or just an off day for one/all concerned. I like constant instruction (I don't pay for silence or reassurance and find iy keeps me from worrying so is in fact reassuring!) but plenty don't.
 
As others have said, I think it's just a style mismatch. I can understand what that means, and have been taught like that in the past. Like MP I am incredibly self-critical and need someone who tells me how to correct things without making me feel useless. I get on so well with my current instructor, much better than other instructors I've had (I'm still at an age where I can do PC rallies so I've had a few!) I understand how she teaches and she understands me, I always come away from a lesson feeling like I've achieved something. Can you try and have a lesson with another trainer? See if they can help you make more sense of things? Or even a conversation with current trainer to tell them how you feel and see if they can adjust accordingly?
 
It sounds like you just aren't the best match for each other, and that is fine. Some people respond to that kind of style, others need more explaining of HOW exactly you 'ride up to the outside rein' or how you stop the horse swinging to the inside etc. Some know exactly how to use their inside leg to push the horse into the outside rein but need to understand why, so that they know when to apply the aid and when to do something else.

Try a few different instructors and see what works. Often it is just about finding the right match for you and your horse.
 
I'm another that understands what the trainer was asking, but then again I love having that kind of trainer as it reminds me I need to always be thinking rather than just being a passenger and over time my reactions have become a hell of a lot quicker as a result!

But, what works for some won't work for everyone and if you're feeling lost and it's sucking the enjoyment out of it either speak to your trainer and see if you can find a middle ground or try someone new. Horses are meant to be fun afterall!
 
Also, just a thought but what do you say to your instructor when you're being given all those orders? I know for me I'd get nothing from it if I just sat there trying to do as I'm told and like MP mentioned I'd feel like I wasn't equipped with the how/why I'd need for replicating independently.

What I do do, especially if it's all falling apart, is ask why and where I went wrong? Or if I'm not getting the expected result I ask whether I'm asking correctly/timing things right. The crux of it is with this kind of trainer you need an open dialogue throughout the lesson to get the most out of it, otherwise I can imagine it does get quite disheartening.

It sounds like I have a very similar horse and trainer. My boy was out competing AM before me and schooling GP at home. But his way of going was very fixed and whilst he was great at looking pretty he wasn't working through his back properly. I've been riding since early childhood and have dabbled with dressage over the years. I had a great foundation as I worked weekends at the TTT for many years as a teenager but just like my boy, whilst I have a fairly classical seat and "look pretty" it's only been in the last year that I've truly become an effective rider and a lot of that is thanks to my trainer. Sure we have some lessons where I just want to cry...and trust me in the first few months there were plenty of those! But overall I find the bad lessons just spur me on and make me work harder. If there's something I'm struggling to get, I'll speak to my trainer, have a play around in the school and watch YouTube videos until I've sussed where it's going wrong. For me dressage is a journey and I love how rewarding it is when you start to see things coming together just as much as I love getting out there and competing.
 
You've got nothing to lose by trying a different instructor. In fact even if you are happy with what you have, a different pair of eyes can give you something you didn't have from the current instructor.
 
Yes, I think it is a style/personality mismatch. All my lessons are like that, it's what I pay my instructor for ;) She works me hard, I get a good feel of what I should be doing (because when I ride by myself I rarely push myself as hard), and usually I get the best work out of my mare. However it's not done in a bark-y type way, and we have a laugh along the way. usually with lots of eye-rolling from me as I complete an exercise, then my instructor reminds me of "one more thing" I also need to be doing.

At the moment she (my instructor) is really pushing me to improve my equitation, so I'm getting lots of "heels down, leg ON and fixed, look UP, hands TOGETHER" and I'm shouting back "I can't have my leg ON and rise AND heels down at the same time."

But despite all of the "one more thing"s we are slowly improving, T is improving, despite her muscle difficulties. I'd much rather be corrected for everything, than left to figure things out by myself. I had plenty of lessons from another instructor where he would just shout school figures out to me - I can do that in my own time thanks!

You really need to find someone who you can get along with, whose teaching style suits you and your learning preferences to get the most out of your lessons.
 
Sometimes you just don't gel with an instructor or an instructor just doesn't get your horse.

I remember once having a lesson off a very talented lady, she rides beautifully and her horses are very well schooled and out winning lots. Lots of people have lessons off her and get great results, but I just felt that she didn't quite 'get' my horse and the things she was telling me to do just sent my horse into a tense frenzy until she completely shut down. I didn't get even half as much out of the lesson as I get when I ride on my own at home. Yet when ive had lessons off my friend, who I regard as on each of the best horseman I've ever met, within 2 minutes he had observed and Sussed the horse out and was able to make suggestions that really worked.
Yet previous lady arguably has had more success in the ring than other instructor.
 
I think a good instructor should be able to break down an exercise which isn't going well, and work on each component part. And provide exercises you can do to get to where you want to be. Doesn't sound as though your instructor can do that - or maybe she can if you ask her?
 
If it is affecting your confidence, which it obviously is, you need to look elsewhere for lessons even if it is only a short term boost with someone else.
Someone on here said that those lessons where they feel a bit useless at the end spurs them on to work on it in between but I am the opposite. If I feel like I've ended on a low note I get a bit frustrated and it doesn't take many sessions like that to really pick away at my confidence. I need to finish my lessons on a buzz; we don't have to have been world beaters but we do have to finish better than we started and that spurs me on.
We are all different and motivated in different ways and you need to find a training partnership where you respond to their teaching style or they can adapt to your learning style but that ain't always easy.
 
I think it's all about finding someone you gel with teaching wise, not everyone enjoys or benefits from the same kind of training. Personally I don't appreciate or benefit from the kind of instruction you listed above. I'm with Milliepops where I need the time to go away and do that myself and to really get the chance to play with the exercise myself in order to be able to continue after the lesson. I also find it beneficial to be able to teach people to be able to feel for themselves, and they might not pick it up so quickly if instructions are being shouted so rapidly they aren't fully feeling the benefit of each slight change.
 
See to me, that is the instructor telling you what to do (ie riding through you) rather than teaching you HOW to ride.
I'd much rather be taught how to feel when your horse is off balance and then be given a tool kit of things you can do to get them back in balance (and also explain the WHY behind this).
That way, when you ride on your own you know from the feedback you are getting from your horse what you need to work on, why you need to work on it and you have the tools to do the work.
If you are taught to rely on someone telling you what to do and when to do it then you feel at a loss when you school on your own.
 
Cortez said:
See, all of that makes perfect sense to me; I understand what the instructor wants you to do. Perhaps you need to go back a few steps and get your instructor to explain what is required before throwing it all at you in a glob like that?
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Same, and my thoughts exactly.
 
My instructor sometimes does this when I'm trying something new, but he's already explained all the concepts/actions to me previously and now a 'keyword' (e.g. elbows!) means something to me, and can be shouted as a reminder.

I'd be either trying someone else - no harm in that, and it will help you understand a) where the problem is and b) what your solution might look like.
 
FestiveFuzz said:
I'm another that understands what the trainer was asking, but then again I love having that kind of trainer as it reminds me I need to always be thinking rather than just being a passenger and over time my reactions have become a hell of a lot quicker as a result!

But, what works for some won't work for everyone and if you're feeling lost and it's sucking the enjoyment out of it either speak to your trainer and see if you can find a middle ground or try someone new. Horses are meant to be fun afterall!
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I agree with you FF. I often get so much instruction in my lesson I feel like I'm patting my head and rubbing my tummy, it really makes me work really hard which I don't do on my own and I love it and can feel the improvement when I school alone.
OP have you tried speaking to your trainer to tell her your concerns? She is supposed to be working for you and if you don't understand her then she is going to lose you as a client.
 
I used to have lessons with a FBHS and a list one judge, on her school masters. She used to say very little and I learnt more in her lessons than I can say. I think a lot of instructors ride well, have no idea what its like not to get it and work on too many things at once, instead of working on one basic thing, allowing you and the horse to get it right and build from there. Its developing a language that all three of you understand.
A lot of riding is getting feel, what feels right, sometimes what you think is right is actually all wrong. I would go back a level, choose a different instructor and take the stress off. I have paid a lot of money for my daughters to have lessons with people who are selectors, ridden at international level etc, who are not actually very good at teaching.
 
Sounds like your trainer is training the horse from the ground through you, using you as a puppet rather than training you in how to train the horse. Either discuss this with her or change trainer.

Some trainers have had no training in how to Coach a rider and know nothing about how people learn, they are just riders that are training.
 
CoachinaCar said:
Sounds like your trainer is training the horse from the ground through you, using you as a puppet rather than training you in how to train the horse. Either discuss this with her or change trainer.

Some trainers have had no training in how to Coach a rider and know nothing about how people learn, they are just riders that are training.
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Sorry, could you elaborate/clarify what you mean by this - I think I understand, but it's not clear.
 
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