Fitness at lower level eventing

[TarrSteps]

It's interesting what the poster said above about affiliated events & riders going further afield, encountering terrain/going they just weren't prepared for.

My horse is fit. After a recent XC schooling session with an Olympic eventer I was warned not to push his fitness any more (he can be difficult to ride in the dressage & SJ ) HOWEVER having heard about the conditions at Stafford I think he would've struggled. Firstly being from East Angular he's not used to hills - I do try but there is very little around here. Also he's crap in mud.....but then that is why I didn't run at Stafford

Exactly. You made a considered decision based on various pieces of information, partly on the advice of someone very experienced. My point was that people who are running extremely unfit horses repeatedly, either don't know or don't care. This is a much trickier problem to solve and in direct conflict with the idea that 'everyone should have a go'.

I'm sure most people, despite assertions to the contrary, would be more annoyed than grateful to be told the horse they are competing at that moment is not fit enough to continue. So what is the solution?

 

[Rosiefan]

This is all very interesting and a tricky problem and I suppose the answer has to be education. When Rosie was doing juniors, the team trainers were very hot on fitness - not sure how they approached the issue as they were happy with her horse and trusted her family's system because they trained and rode pointers at the time as did Rosie.
Do trainers address horse fitness issues as a matter of course? How about the accredited coaching scheme, does that include fitness training?

 

[LFD]

I've read through this post with much interest as I'm competing in my first ODE in 2 weeks (BE80T).

I thought my horse was quite fit before reading the comments but I'm now am now starting to worry. I ride 5 days a week, 1 day is usually SJ coaching, 1 day SJ comp, 2 days flatwork and 1 day hacking. We've also been xc schooling a couple of times over the last few weeks and he's been in full work all winter SJ'ing.

What can I add into our plan for the next 2 weeks to help with fitness before the event and for the rest of the season?

Many thanks for your help!

 

[chestnut cob]

Do trainers address horse fitness issues as a matter of course? How about the accredited coaching scheme, does that include fitness training?

Mine does. We have discussed my horse's fitness and how to improve it, designed interval training plans as well as a general work schedule so he works harder and gets the right sort of work. I had a XC lesson with a BE accredited coach recently and fitness wasn't addressed in that, though the horse was (is) plenty fit enough for the session, and the trainer didn't stick to the hour I'd booked. At 45 mins, he said that's enough, 1-2-1 XC for 45 mins is enough, if we do more the horse will get tired and make mistakes so best left there.

I did an 80(T) at the weekend and there were plenty of trainers around and they were pretty proactive in approaching people to ask if they needed any help. People can't be made to use the trainers and they wouldn't be able to get to everyone, but you'd have to hope if it was obvious a horse wasn't fit enough then they would discuss it with them. I found having the trainers there really useful and spoke to one in each phase (SJ trainer was particularly useful; I asked for tips, we discussed some things, she then watched my round and gave me feedback after), but I think most people were happy to do their own thing. Maybe there should be more emphasis on using the trainers provided?

That said, competition isn't really the place to address this stuff. I was at an UA SJ the weekend before and was gobsmacked by the amount of seriously overweight and unfit horses. There were a couple I thought must be stallions because of their crests, but they weren't. Those horses were being asked to jump 80/90cm courses and could only just about maintain a canter, heaving themselves over jumps. All of these fat horses were with families who've kitted the kids out in fancy SJ jackets and sparkly boots, but don't seem to be educating themselves on horse management. There is, IMHO, no excuse for a horse to come out of winter that fat or in fact to ever be that fat!! Who tells these people that though?

 

[Quadro]

I know the stewards can pull people up on unfit horses but does this happen often at 80/90/100? Just curious!
Q

 

[Darremi]

I've read through this post with much interest as I'm competing in my first ODE in 2 weeks (BE80T).

I thought my horse was quite fit before reading the comments but I'm now am now starting to worry. I ride 5 days a week, 1 day is usually SJ coaching, 1 day SJ comp, 2 days flatwork and 1 day hacking. We've also been xc schooling a couple of times over the last few weeks and he's been in full work all winter SJ'ing.

What can I add into our plan for the next 2 weeks to help with fitness before the event and for the rest of the season?

Many thanks for your help!

You need to get the horse out cantering lots whilst you go out hacking. And make sure the schooling sessions are hard.

 

[LFD]

You need to get the horse out cantering lots whilst you go out hacking. And make sure the schooling sessions are hard.

We've been doing some interval work, cantering for 5 mins, then a short break in walk and then repeating the 5 min canter - doing this say twice a week. I assume I need to increase this?

My boy is young and feels very fit but I don't want to mix up his enthusiasm and willing for good fitness! Thanks.

 

[TarrSteps]

For the horse's sake a person in that situation should retire. Frankly it would be unfair and dangerous to continue with an exhausted horse. People have to remember animals are involved. They should not be allowed to push a tired horse simply because they want to finish.

Be Stewards have the power to pull somebody up who is on an exhausted horse.

Again, of course. I said earlier the rider should have put his/her hand up. But at an unaffiliated event - which people want to be inexpensive and not restrictive - there is no steward, there is no vet and there is a big emphasis on letting people finish even if they have been eliminated. People LIKE this set up because it allows them to compete very early on in the training process, relatively inexpensively. Plus the internet is full of people accusing them of 'dumbing down' BE. The flip side is you get people without a horsey background, who may receive only very intermittent training. (Look how many people on here fully admit they prioritise competing over training when money is tight.) So the fact that some people will be riding ill prepared horses and 'someone' isn't stopping them is not unexpected. When you see someone in that or a similar situation do you go and have a word?

 

[ArcticFox]

I'm sure most people, despite assertions to the contrary, would be more annoyed than grateful to be told the horse they are competing at that moment is not fit enough to continue. So what is the solution?

I think I would be ashamed rather than annoyed personally.

 

[Darremi]

We've been doing some interval work, cantering for 5 mins, then a short break in walk and then repeating the 5 min canter - doing this say twice a week. I assume I need to increase this?

My boy is young and feels very fit but I don't want to mix up his enthusiasm and willing for good fitness! Thanks.

Oh you did not mention that in your original post! So you actually hack 2x per week with cantering?

If so that should be fine for 80/90. But you have to make sure when doing interval that you do not allow the horse to recover its breathing between canters.

My rule is 5-2-5-2-5 interval for Novice level. But you need to go up hills too if possible. You just do a bit less for 80/90/100.

Hope that helps!

 

[TarrSteps]

Just a note to rider fitness, you should be able to maintain a galloping seat for the duration of your canter. You don't have to go as far as taping tacks to your saddle, but if you're honest it's a fairly good marker.

Rather like horses, most riders can be fit enough to do up to 100 by being active in their daily life, riding seriously 5 or 6 times a week on a mixed schedule. Over that, most people have to do more prep. But, also like horses, if you're not naturally quite fit, have a heavier build or are new to the sport so likely to find it stressful, you might be more comfortable and confident doing a bit more.

 

[wench]

Rider fitness also helps if you have an easy to ride horse.

Put a stroppy, nappy horse in the equation instead and you need twice the fitness to cope with it...

 

[mil1212]

LFD - useful guide here: http://e-venting.co.uk/2013/09/tips-from-the-top-canter-work-for-fitness/
If you have been cantering for 5 mins I think should be plenty fit enough for an 80.

Interesting discussion. FWIW I always notice plenty of tired horses at Stafford, sort of renoun as a really nice course at the level, but probably people don't think about it being a max length course with a big long hill at the end. Education is key I suppose. I still come across people who ride once maybe twice a week and either say their horse needs to be fresh to be keen enough, or it keeps itself fit :confused3: :rolleyes3:

 

[Goldenstar]

Most of my horses never did any fitness cantering until novice they simply did not need it .
But I love flat work training and my horses are very fit because they work hard in the school and because most of them do hunt so they have been fit and we have proper hacking .
I ride then up and down the grassed over bank of an old quarry working their backs and wind .
Of course they canter when they cross country school and sometimes for fun around the edge of a field .
So if say I don't do canter work with my 90 /100 horses they are fit .
On riders I can canter with short stirrups easily because I did it when I was young a lot and it's a learnt skill I find a tough dressage session much harder.

 

[LFD]

Oh you did not mention that in your original post! So you actually hack 2x per week with cantering?

If so that should be fine for 80/90. But you have to make sure when doing interval that you do not allow the horse to recover its breathing between canters.

My rule is 5-2-5-2-5 interval for Novice level. But you need to go up hills too if possible. You just do a bit less for 80/90/100.

Hope that helps!

Yes, canter work twice a week -I didn't explain that very well, sorry! We have a grass field next to our school which I use for the interval stuff. It's quite flat though so I'll need to work some hills in too. I'll go down to a 2 min recovery as he does seem to recover his breathing on our 3 min recoveries.

Really helpful advice - thanks!

 

[LFD]

Just a note to rider fitness, you should be able to maintain a galloping seat for the duration of your canter. You don't have to go as far as taping tacks to your saddle, but if you're honest it's a fairly good marker.

Rather like horses, most riders can be fit enough to do up to 100 by being active in their daily life, riding seriously 5 or 6 times a week on a mixed schedule. Over that, most people have to do more prep. But, also like horses, if you're not naturally quite fit, have a heavier build or are new to the sport so likely to find it stressful, you might be more comfortable and confident doing a bit more.

I'd say I'm quite fit and active between my job and running about after my two horses but even though I've been maintaining the galloping seat through my canter work it still leaves my with sore legs :-( Will that ever change?!?

 

[Laafet]

Rider fitness also helps if you have an easy to ride horse.

Put a stroppy, nappy horse in the equation instead and you need twice the fitness to cope with it...

This is very true - I ride intervals at home, I stand at all times for cantering (a hangover from when I used to ride racehorses) and find it easy. Get to a competition and it is a whole different kettle of fish. I was fit enough to ride two jumping rounds back to back with no gap at Keysoe Arena Eventing, was just out of puff when I finished but he was ina forwards happy non spooky mode, compared to the 5 odd minute round at Isleham I was exhausted. I am usually fair fit, not as fit as him but sitting up foaling makes it difficult to maintain fitness.

 

[TarrSteps]

I'd say I'm quite fit and active between my job and running about after my two horses but even though I've been maintaining the galloping seat through my canter work it still leaves my with sore legs :-( Will that ever change?!?

No, because you'll just gallop for longer.

Honestly, it sounds like you'll be more than fine if your horse is handling what you're doing now well. You could do a bit more in your last couple of canters but you don't want to be hugely increasing the work in the last week anyway.

The fact that you're worried almost certainly means you'll be okay, even if it means you will be prepared to be conservative on the day of either one of you is getting too tired. The really worrying ones are the people who genuinely seem not to know/care that fitness even matters.

 

[LFD]

No, because you'll just gallop for longer.

Honestly, it sounds like you'll be more than fine if your horse is handling what you're doing now well. You could do a bit more in your last couple of canters but you don't want to be hugely increasing the work in the last week anyway.

The fact that you're worried almost certainly means you'll be okay, even if it means you will be prepared to be conservative on the day of either one of you is getting too tired. The really worrying ones are the people who genuinely seem not to know/care that fitness even matters.

Great, I'll just carry on with my current plan then

I'll out up a post event report to let you all know how it went.

Thanks again for the help and advice!

 

[Holidays_are_coming]

I do a lot of helping at unaff events (as well as BE) at a local pretty flat venue and am shocked how many horses finish nearly dying. As I am near the start/finish if the start team agree I have a gentle word sometimes its a young horse and the sights have left it mentally drained. I will also have a word about behaviour if needed!

 

[Honey08]

I know the stewards can pull people up on unfit horses but does this happen often at 80/90/100? Just curious!
Q

Yes sometimes.

I once got pulled up after the show jumping once at a BE90 as they thought my horse wasn't fit! That was Stafford too. She had blown a gasket in the SJ warmup because someone jumped the practice fence the wrong way just as we were three strides away and I had to pull her out. She got herself so fizzed up she was covered in foam by the time we went in. I had to wait for the chief steward to come and visit us at the trailer before I was allowed to continue to XC, and even after that the XC starter had to radio and check it was ok as they had been told not to let me go. Thankfully sense was seen and we were allowed to go round, flew round the XC inside the time and got placed!

 

[Quadro]

Sorry that happened to you! I have just personally never seen it. It must be a hard call to make!
Q

 

[Mince Pie]

Rider fitness also helps if you have an easy to ride horse.

Put a stroppy, nappy horse in the equation instead and you need twice the fitness to cope with it...

I agree with that! My lad isn't forward going at all so I need to be fitter than normal to keep him off my leg (he's not an eventer but I try to keep him 'eventing fit' as he's a porker!).

It's been said here that hill work is hugely beneficial to fitness, and I'm sure that a while back a poster mentioned that they managed to get a horse 80/90/100 fit without any fast canter work due to the steep hills they were using instead. How big is the impact? What would be the difference in routine for a horse living in a flat part of the country aiming to do a 100 vs a horse in a very hilly part of the country also doing a 100? I have access to some very steep hills but can't really do much more than walk/trot up them, although I also have access to a sand gallop which I am aiming to use once a week, what would you say I need to be doing to get mine to a level of fitness to be able to do a 90? He's a 13.2 cob so will never event but as I said he is a fatty and I prefer him to be very fit to (a) help combat the waistline, and (b) make him more responsive to ride as the fitter he is the more forward going he is.

 

[wench]

Few years ago (same horse in my previous post) was eventing fit... he was used on working livery in the riding school, would get anywhere between 4 - 6 hacks a week, most of them at a decent pace. I was fit enough for riding cantering on these hacks, he was very well behaved out hacking.

Put him on an XC course, and if he didnt want to play ball, I was out of breath by the second XC jump... I didnt have time to work on my own fitness, due to long hours at work, plus riding, meant no real time for the gym. I guess the only way to have worked my fitness up in this scenario would literally have been to go to an XC comp every weekend...

 

[Darremi]

I agree with that! My lad isn't forward going at all so I need to be fitter than normal to keep him off my leg (he's not an eventer but I try to keep him 'eventing fit' as he's a porker!).

It's been said here that hill work is hugely beneficial to fitness, and I'm sure that a while back a poster mentioned that they managed to get a horse 80/90/100 fit without any fast canter work due to the steep hills they were using instead. How big is the impact? What would be the difference in routine for a horse living in a flat part of the country aiming to do a 100 vs a horse in a very hilly part of the country also doing a 100? I have access to some very steep hills but can't really do much more than walk/trot up them, although I also have access to a sand gallop which I am aiming to use once a week, what would you say I need to be doing to get mine to a level of fitness to be able to do a 90? He's a 13.2 cob so will never event but as I said he is a fatty and I prefer him to be very fit to (a) help combat the waistline, and (b) make him more responsive to ride as the fitter he is the more forward going he is.

What is his current weekly routine?

 

[Elvis]

I've found this really interesting to read. The amount of fitness a horse needs to finish a 1DE feeling well is far more than most people (including myself) think.

What I found interesting watching my own horse finish his first 1DE (Pre-Novice) is that mentally it takes a lot out of young/green/inexperienced horses. Despite being physically fit, having plenty of training in each of the disciplines, and being a very laid back chap in competition atmospheres, you could tell he was mentally tired by the end of the day. He'd enjoyed himself but it is a lot of questions to ask of a horse all in one day.

 

[Mince Pie]

What is his current weekly routine?

2/3 hacks a week including the sand gallop which is an hour trotting, cantering and if I can get it, gallop. All hacks include steep hills. He then gets 2 hard, hour long schooling sessions a week, 1 easy session a week (young, novice sharer) and 1 jumping session a week.