Found a cat

[Shady]

Stanley has had his house invaded. Some don't mind, most do. Just stay calm and keep giving him lots of attention . I know it's difficult and some can get a bit aggressive with their owners as they rightly blame them for the nasty thing that has arrived in their space.
It's a time thing with measured kitten interaction . Both will be feeling unsettled.
Kitten is young Chaps and just left the nest. You have a mix of very affectionate but sensitive breeds and they ' need ' more when little.
It's sometimes the price you pay for having such a tactile loving cat when older. He is looking for comfort from you, which is a lovely thing as some hide away and I'm not sure which way is best to handle it though i'd be inclined to give him what he needs for comfort at this stage. He should settle in a few weeks but they do love their owners so I would imagine you may get a kitten hat or scarf if he shares your bedroom !
I usually buy 2 and always cage at night when they first arrive for 2/3 weeks , then they go into the general mix of cats and dogs and I leave dried down at night. I don't have them in my bedroom when I sleep as they wake up and play !

Yes I'd like to see the pedigree but only if you have time! xxxx

 

[chaps89]

Oh yes, there's absolutely no rush to mix them and I can completely understand Stanley's nose being out of joint.
I would love to have a different room or space for a cage for kitten as I haven't ever found allowing cats to be on the bed to be a way to get a good night's sleep!
Our flat is fairly open plan - entrance into lounge and kitchen, then doorway into the hall which opens into the bedroom and en-suite bathroom.
Stanley is most settled in the lounge, which is why kitten is in with us.
Tbh, mostly he nestles in the crook of my arm or neck and curls up and sleeps so he's no bother, I just feel for him as clearly his attempts to suckle are a bit fruitless but obviously coming from feeling a bit insecure, which is completely understandable.
Mind you, OH did take this video at about 12.30am... I have suggested maybe we don't encourage play time on the bed - although as you can see I am oblivious anyway

 

[Shady]

OMG Chaps he's so adorable. Are you honestly asleep with that little demon jumping everywhere, lol

I'm adding this video for you to see what Robs kitten is like at the moment. I'm pretty certain Vanessa was also asleep before she or her partner took this!!!!
Hope it works . Romance has the biggest ears iv'e seen in years ,but I have to say your kittens are impressive!

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=672893773219320

 

[chaps89]

I was absolutely asleep and totally unaware I was being used as a kitten climbing frame
Oh my gosh, her ears are huge bless her! She's very pretty ?
Stanley likes to sit and groom you too, he can get a bit dribbly though ??

 

[chaps89]

I am one very tired sleep deprived person.
It started at 5am waking me up to suckle. Now it's become 3am. I can settle him then it starts again at 4am.
The only way I can ignore him is to hide completely covered by the duvet and keep it pressed down around me as he's desperate to get in.
If I move him off me he just keeps coming back.
I wondered if it was because he's hungry so the last 2 days he's had extra food including a very late night feed at after midnight. No difference (other than a very round tummy!)
He never suckles during the day, he's happy and content exploring, playing, cuddling. But during the night he goes frantic trying to suckle me - never my OH.
I gave in last night and came and slept on the sofa, and had the best nights sleep since he arrived, with Stanley cat curled up next to me.

I've googled but can't find advice on anything similar, most people say their cat seems quite calm when they do it but he is frantic and distressed and then I get distressed.

Google suggests this usually happens if they're orphaned/weaned young. He self weaned at 5 and a half weeks onto the adult cats feed. Breeder started him on kitten food but he'd just go and eat the adult food so he just gets kitten vitamin supplements to go with it. He's been on the same food and tablets and 4 feeds a day so same feeding routine since arriving.
He was with mum when they were shut downstairs overnight so it is fully possible that he was still having night time feeds but apparently mum was fairly fed up with them by the time he came to us - he's now 14 weeks so I can't imagine mum still feeding?
We also wondered if it was because he's cold so shut the windows and turned the heating up a bit but that's made no difference (other than for us to feel like we're cooking!)
Anyway, sorry just needed to ramble and get it off my chest as I feel rubbish about it.

In brighter news, kitten now has a name - Frank! We have 2 old men cats ?

Obligatory photos!

 

[Meowy Catkin]

Look at them eating by each other, excellent.

I'm sorry that you are having such issues at night, I've not had that myself so can't suggest a fix. Sorry.

The only thing I can think of is that maybe once the two boys can be together without supervision, things will improve? Our adult male cat used to be a very active 'parent'.

 

[BeckyFlowers]

Do you have Feliway plug-ins going? They may help both of them settle.

 

[chaps89]

They've been really good, Stanley has done 2 very mild hisses but otherwise they're pretty good next to each other.
We've been site swapping, we're doing it for a bit longer today and then shall do introductions tonight or tomorrow I think.
Stanley seems more settled today too which is good.

I'm very much hoping they will become friends and not just tolerate each other, and that that will help with night times too. I'm not doing very well on 4 hours sleep a night so I really hope it helps and doesn't take too long! In all other ways it's been going really well, I think it's fair to say it's one problem we never envisaged having though.

We have Feliways plugged in, 1 in each room

 

[Blanche]

I had a litter of kittens come to me with their mum. They would all get around a fluffy cat bed and suckle on it together, around lunchtime everyday. They stopped sometime after they turned one. They had never been separated from mum at all, I think some are just suckers and separation from mum has nothing to do with it.

I find Pet Remedy much better than Feliway. You can get a spray, plug in and wipes. I tend to just use the spray as you can put it exactly where you need it. I have a cat who is funny about the back door so spraying it around it helps. It does smell weird but don’t really notice it now.

 

[FinnishLapphund]

Only because a behaviour is more likely to occur if a cat/kitten has been weaned early, it doesn't mean other cats/kittens can't do it. Besides, it doesn't happen to all kittens weaned too early either.

Cilla the moggy was definitely weaned too early. When we found her she was around 4 weeks old, so cold, and starved, that the veterinarian couldn't get a temperature reading on her, because her temperature was lower than their thermometers (they tried 3 different ones) could measure. And that was even though she had been laying next to a hot water bottle since we found her, for around/over 1 hour!
Her mum had probably been run over, or taken by a fox, but considering that Cilla was truly just skin and bones, it couldn't have happened the day before we found her. Yet, she never suckles on anything.

Anyhow, I know Shady is probably correct about Frank simply seaking comfort from you, but after 35+ years of cat owning, I have a strong tendency to presume that cat's have a plan with everything they do.
This thing that Frank frantically tries to get to you, so he can suckle on you in the middle of the night, but doesn't bother your OH, makes me suspicious. I mean, if Frank does it because he needs some comfort in the middle of the night, then when you left to go to sleep in another room, shouldn't he seek that comfort from your OH in your absence?
Could it maybe be that he does it to you, because he senses that you're more likely to put up with being his nighttime entertainment center? And that every time you give in, and gives him attention in the night, tells his stubborn determination that if I only persevere, she will cave-in.

Regardless of why he does it, instead of turning your bedroom into a sauna, could you perhaps get a hot water bottle, wrap it up in a towel/put it inside a pillow case, and place it next to where Frank likes to sleep.
Maybe try arranging a fleece blanket over his sleeping spot, so it resembles some type of igloo cat bed.

Shady's way of letting new cats/kittens in the beginning sleep in a cage over night, sounds like a good option. Trying Pet Remedy, instead of Feliway, as Blanche suggested, might also be a good idea, to see if that works better on Frank.

Or you will simply have to work on your ability to turn your duvet into a cocoon for humans.

 

[HashRouge]

Chaps is he suckling on your PJs? Sorry, not trying to find out if you sleep in the buff ?. I ask because our cat (another Stanley) is a suckler but it tends to be on particular materials. If you pick him up wearing a fluffy dressing gown, for instance) he will always try to suckle. So it might be to do with you wearing something that he likes the feel of. Our Stanley is 14 and still suckles, but he was an abandoned kitten and was hand reared from 3 weeks. Usually when he tries to do it I move him gently till he stops and the he always falls asleep, but sounds like that might not work with your chap.

 

[Keira 8888]

He is gorgeous.

View attachment 52203

Hahahaaaa! This would def be me!!

 

[Kay Burton]

Chaps is he suckling on your PJs? Sorry, not trying to find out if you sleep in the buff ?. I ask because our cat (another Stanley) is a suckler but it tends to be on particular materials. If you pick him up wearing a fluffy dressing gown, for instance) he will always try to suckle. So it might be to do with you wearing something that he likes the feel of. Our Stanley is 14 and still suckles, but he was an abandoned kitten and was hand reared from 3 weeks. Usually when he tries to do it I move him gently till he stops and the he always falls asleep, but sounds like that might not work with your chap.

This happens if the cat has underfed the kitten. Cats also need breast milk in childhood in the right amount. If a kitten is not fully fed by a cat, it may behave strangely throughout its life (sucking on clothes, being very greedy for food, etc.).

 

[HashRouge]

This happens if the cat has underfed the kitten. Cats also need breast milk in childhood in the right amount. If a kitten is not fully fed by a cat, it may behave strangely throughout its life (sucking on clothes, being very greedy for food, etc.).

Yes this would all make sense, he's quite an odd cat! He and his siblings were found on a rubbish dump at 2-3 weeks old and were very, very ill immediately after being rescued. Two died, 3 survived. He's incredibly affectionate though, lovely boy.

 

[Shady]

Just got back on line after 5 days with no phone
Ok so it's not getting better but worse Chaps. I get the whole wean thing , not enough milk etc, but looking at Franks progress size wise he has never been a kitten depraved of milk at the most important time or food in general. There is a look to kittens that have gone short. This was a first litter from a young healthy cat who was almost certainly producing enough milk for 3 babies, that's a small litter. She was also never taken away from the kittens and although i'm sure she was sick of them hassling her at almost 3 months they would have been topping up past weaning for weeks .
( Bear in mind there's probably British in the mix somewhere and they are pigs. Rex's are known to be greedy and will over eat.)
I'm going to have a chat to my friend Wendy who was a breeder for nearly 40 years. See what she says but I would guess it's still an insecurity thing and in the day it's bright , he's distracted by toys and noise and you guys if you're around , Stanley too, but at night it's quiet and there's nothing to interact with and no siblings or mum to sleep with . You are the next best thing to mum and you are there
I would buy one of those really snugly covered or semi covered beds and cage him at night in the front room with Stanley if nothing else is working. You can't go without sleep.
Something like this
https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/cat_beds_baskets/cat_dens/cat_dens/37430

I do like the hot water bottle idea in somewhere really cosy so would try that first but I have a feeling that he will still prefer you.
He will grow out of it as he becomes friends with Stanley

 

[Shady]

Just adding a little extra to my above post as I had a message from my go to friend as mentioned above . Direct quote from her as it's easier.
' Agree ,don't think little Rex has been deprived, more likely he wasn't weaned from Mum before he left. Always think it unkind to suddenly take them away from their mother and send them off to a new home all in a matter of hours. I'm afraid the 'suckling' behaviour is his only source of comfort for now. Not sure how long he's been in residence but as long as he's eating, using his tray etc., it would be better to give him a cosy bed at night-time and leave him be. I'm really not that au fait with the breed and you do get the odd kitten that is OTT . Yep, expect he'll be a right pain for the first few nights/weeks but worth it in the end. Didn't the breeder provide a blanket from home to help him settle? '

I don't know if this helps you Chaps but I think he's going to need a little more time to settle at night . Bit like puppies really, some aren't bothered and some cry all night. xxxxx

 

[chaps89]

Sorry to have gone quiet, I was sleep deprived and changing jobs and haven't had any head space for reading your helpful replies and taking them in.

He has a covered bed, but both cats ignore it. However he does like to sleep under the duvet. Not sure I love this!

He came with a pillowcase that smelt of them, I like the hot water bottle idea too.

He is very greedy/hungry - he gets 2 trays of wet food a day (split between 4 meals) and the occasional handful of dry food that he gobbles up. Side question - at what point do we wean him onto bigger, less frequent meals?

I have started sleeping with a long sleeved top on which seems to have helped, also I'd get out of bed to just give a clean walk away and that seemed to break him out of it.
Last night we both slept through for the first time. I really really hope it wasn't a one off! If not I really think we'll look into a little cage and bed for him at night time.

We had successful introductions between the cats on Sunday.
We'd done lots of site swapping, scent swapping and they were eating happily alongside each other either side of the curtain.
All went well Sunday and Monday with some nice playtime and the odd snuggle with each other, but Tuesday we hadn't played with Frank enough and he just kept going at Stanley who started hissing at him and he kept going back for more. I know a bit of hissing is to be expected but Frank was being too big for his boots and ignoring the leave me alone signals that Stanley was giving out
So we have split them up again and will go back a few steps.

 

[chaps89]

He didn't sleep through the night last night.
BUT he didn't try and suckle, he was just mewing and purring loudly/being a bit active and very hungry, despite a decent sized handful of biscuits at midnight.

As an aside, I don't advise playing peek a boo with a feisty kitten behind the curtains. I should have known better, I got well and truly 'got'!

 

[Shady]

Well that's a bit better Chaps. You will get there!
I'm surprised you still have curtains if you had 2 they'd be swinging from them for sure!

Regarding food. I hate advising on food intake as I can't see him, but he's growing rapidly now and I have to be honest I always leave a bowl of really good kitten munchies down for youngsters and then give 3 meals a day. Quantity varies but I guess 1 pouch 3 times a day of something like Royal Canin kitten, Concept for Life or Felix kitten. ( not the best I know ) or I buy the little tins of Animonda Carny and use maybe 1-11/2 a day and gradually increase to 2.
I would probably up his dried intake Chaps if you are only giving the odd handful. Also if he's got good solid poos I add chicken or / and fish periodically.
When to change is also difficult and personal to each cat or person. I always give 3 meals a day. The last being just before I go to sleep after giving the horses their hay. Cats are rounded up and they get 2 pouches divided by 3 cats and a bowl of munchies left down.

 

[chaps89]

He climbs everything but the curtains! He is well established at being a shoulder cat now too, and is a quick learner - 'off' has, touch wood, been established in a day or two!

I'm not sure if I think you are a genius for getting 2 so that they can play with each other, and therefore tire themselves out, or if you're just a little bit mad

His breeder was right when he warned us he is a greedy grubster. He eats anything! He is learning manners about not scrounging when we eat but I think that one might take a while to stick! 3 meals a day is feasible, it's the lunchtime one that can be a bit hit & miss depending on work.

We separated them for a few days then re-introduced them.
Poor Stanley! I think Frank is boss already. We were all snoozing happily on the sofa earlier, Frank climbed over to Stanley, I'm thinking how cute, he's gone for a cuddle. Oh no, the little horror just started biting Stanley quite hard and persistent too.
We made a box for Stanley so he has a safe space to escape Frank - he's terrified of it and Frank loves it, of course! We've also put cat furniture up on the walls, Frank is quite fond of climbing so that's been a success.

Anyway, there's not been enough photos I don't think so here you go:

 

[Shady]

Oh I love him, he is fabulous.
All sounding perfectly normal Chaps
Honestly you are doing really well and although I obviously feel sorry for Stanley as fierce kittens are harder work you are all making good progress and they will be friends for sure. No way would any of my grown up cats have tolerated a kitten hanging off their necks and the fluffies I have are soft as hell. Stanley is a star.

Food situation is normal too in that he wants what you have. I have had some that try and get on the plate , literally swipe the food off and one Siamese had to go in another room and would hang off the door handle trying to get back in........it passes in a few months.
He is looking great weight wise. Just leave extra dried down when you're at work.

Iv'e now got the date for pick up of my two Chaps. It's on the 3rd of December
I am of course completely mad when it comes to cats but 2 kittens are easier for sure, they can however do an enormous amount of damage zooming around !
I am starting to remove certain items but in reality most of my stuff has been stuck back together more times than I can count and my once beautiful Italian dresser is beyond hope!

Please keep the photo's coming . I know i'm not the only one who loves to see them . xxxxxx

 

[chaps89]

Trouble


I nearly decapitated the poor creature the other day lifted the mattress to tuck the bed sheet under, unbeknownst to me, he was under the bed and stuck his head up between the slats and I obviously put the mattress down and he was stuck. Thankfully he's vocal and let me know what I had done very quickly so no harm done, but goodness me, heart stopping moment.

We are now alternating, one in the lounge and 1 in the bedroom, we swap which cat goes where each night.
Frank still doesn't sleep through if he's in the bedroom but seems to settle if he's in the lounge.
They are getting on ok, but whereas we could distract Frank from Stanley initially, now Stanley is far too exciting and it's hard to keep Frank interested in a toy if he's getting boisterous. Stanley occasionally wants to play but would mostly be happy to groom Frank and cuddle. Frank then gets quite bitey and it escalates but he goes back for more.
I feel bad, I wanted Stanley to have a play mate and I adore Frank but I feel like we've just caused alot of upset so far, I sort of thought almost 3 weeks in we might be able to leave them unattended together by now, but maybe that was optimistic?
I suspect his little boy bits may come off a bit sooner than we had originally hoped/planned to see if that calms him down too (not till just before Christmas so he'll be almost 5 months by then?)

 

[chaps89]

Iv'e now got the date for pick up of my two Chaps. It's on the 3rd of December

Oh how very exciting. Has Romance remained Romance or has she had a name change? Really looming forwards to your photos.
Luckily we don't have anything as remotely nice as an Italian dresser for Frank to destroy, but you sound very calm about the impending chaos!

 

[FinnishLapphund]

Someone said it took 6 weeks for their old cat to accept the newbie.
With the exception of when my first puppy arrived, and we had 3 adult cats, one of them was not only very territorial, she also hated dogs, so we split some rooms in two with puppy pen net, puppy on one side, cats on the other, and had it like that for about 5, or 6 weeks I think, other than that time, new puppies usually from day one spends their time partly free indoors, partly in a puppy pen, and I have to admit that usually new cats/kittens in our house spends max 3 days partly separated from the rest, and after that we just let them get on with it.

When Berta the Cornish Rex came, it took 3 days before she stopped attacking the 2 bitches whenever she saw them, who would have happily allowed her to be an honorary dog, but she could not fathom why the 2 moggies didn't instantly love her. I think Berta nearly developed stomach ulcers while she for several months kept trying to sleep cuddled up with the moggies, and both the moggies kept telling her that even though they could play a little, around ½ a metre away was their minimum acceptable level of sleeping close to another cat.
I think we took Berta to the veterinarian 2 or 3 times, and came home with stomach medicine. We kept thinking 'How stupid can she be, certainly now she must understand that No means No', but the answer was very stupid/stubborn, and she kept trying on, and off, for months.

Basically, I think that Stanley wants to groom, and cuddle with Frank, and sometimes play with him, sounds extremely positive. Hopefully Frank calms down a bit on the play front.

 

[Shady]

I agree with FL regarding Stanley and Franks relationship at the moment. Very positive and I would be pleased with it after only 3 weeks.
Don't feel bad Chaps. Frank is just a baby and wants to play . If Stanley really resented him, you would know, trust me. They will be friends when Frank calms down. He's just being a normal Rex kitten .
5 months is fine for castration if that's what you want to do. x

 

[Shady]

Oh how very exciting. Has Romance remained Romance or has she had a name change? Really looming forwards to your photos.
Luckily we don't have anything as remotely nice as an Italian dresser for Frank to destroy, but you sound very calm about the impending chaos!

I gave up worrying too much about my possessions years ago!. I'd prefer it if they didn't trash the tv or laptop but the rest of my furniture ( bar a few antiques) was past it's best after the first Siamese double act joined the household 30 years ago.
I was about 18/19 when I visited a Siamese rescue and I can still close my eyes and see this wonderful old woman in this exquisite country cottage surrounded by dozens of Siamese cats. Every bit of furniture was damaged in some way and everywhere you looked there was a cat staring at you. She just didn't care . I remember thinking , oh my bloody god, look at that once priceless coffer and those gorgeous shredded curtains. LOL, I should have known better than to think my house would escape such carnage !

Just to add I don't encourage cats scratching furniture, wallpaper and breaking everything in sight, but sometimes, no matter how many rules you try and put in place and how many activity centers you buy, there is nothing that stops a couple of Orientals when they are on a roll!

I think Romance will become Rosie. x

 

[horseman1985]

What a cutie!

 

[Crazy_cat_lady]

Oh look at the little Seal Point! Glad to hear their relationship is going as smoothly as it can, Gary aka the Vile Alley Cat had his little boy bits removed between 4 and 5 months as I was getting a little girl kitten so didn't want any potential "incidents!"

Any more photos?

 

[chaps89]

I gave up worrying too much about my possessions years ago!. I'd prefer it if they didn't trash the tv or laptop but the rest of my furniture ( bar a few antiques) was past it's best after the first Siamese double act joined the household 30 years ago.
I was about 18/19 when I visited a Siamese rescue and I can still close my eyes and see this wonderful old woman in this exquisite country cottage surrounded by dozens of Siamese cats. Every bit of furniture was damaged in some way and everywhere you looked there was a cat staring at you. She just didn't care . I remember thinking , oh my bloody god, look at that once priceless coffer and those gorgeous shredded curtains. LOL, I should have known better than to think my house would escape such carnage !

Just to add I don't encourage cats scratching furniture, wallpaper and breaking everything in sight, but sometimes, no matter how many rules you try and put in place and how many activity centers you buy, there is nothing that stops a couple of Orientals when they are on a roll!

I think Romance will become Rosie. x

Rosie is such a lovely name
We have voiles on the windows as well as curtains. Luckily the curtains are still intact, the voiles are suffering a bit now though!
This is the first year we have space for a Christmas tree as 1 of the drum kits is at a friend's, but I have refrained as I can't see it lasting very long ?

He has learnt to jump on the kitchen counters. Not by jumping on them, but by climbing up the oven gloves which hang on the oven door handle. Monkey or cat?!

I think we are getting there. They curl up and sleep together alot now. Frank is getting better at leaving Stanley alone now if he doesn't want to play and better at subjecting himself for a groom.
Stanley loves to groom us all - for Frank it's usually his ears, and, um, his bottom that get cleaned ?

He now knows that scrounging isn't allowed and can stay in the room whilst we eat but we've not quite mastered feeding them in the same room yet - they would both rather eat the others food ?

Stanley's turn for clean ears


He's very good at keeping me company and snuggling whilst I work

 

[Meowy Catkin]

Fabulous update! They like each other!