Gastrogard experts :)

[Louby]

Just a quicky please
Today was day 1 and it didnt go too well with a stressy horse wanting breakfast and to go out. Can I give the syringe and a teeny teeny feed, I know its supposed to be an hour but Im thinking even a handful of nuts in a bucket will make her think shes been fed and hopefully she will wait patiently then for her breakfast an hour later??

 

[doodle]

I thought it was 30mins.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

The racehorses get just after their hay in the morning, hard feed was an hour or so before the hay.

 

[Louby]

Thanks for replying, vet said to give the gastrogard on an empty stomach, so Ive reduced her haylage (more hay like) slightly so shes hopefully eaten up and her stomach is emptyish by the morning, then to wait an hour before feeding with the Sulfracite sp Today caused more stress doing that as she wasnt a happy bunny. Ive read all different, some not leaving them with an empty stomach, 30 mins, 45 mins. Its such expensive stuff I just want to give it the best chance of working but this routine is pretty non manageable tbh!

 

[Louby]

The racehorses get just after their hay in the morning, hard feed was an hour or so before the hay.

So they get a feed, wait an hour, then hay and then the gastroguard straightaway ?. Her feed is basically fibre anyway. We usually feed then turnout, I think shes just miffed her routine has gone out of the window

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

No we feed hard feed at 6am, hay at 7am and gastrogurd around 15mins later on from the hay.

 

[doodle]

I go up and hope he has been waiting to go out rather than stuffing hay in! Give peptizole and leave him tied up for 30mins while I muck out. He then gets feed and turned out. First few days he had meltdown as he was used to going out as soon as I got there. 2 weeks in and he has worked out new routine although I am going earlier so turnout is around normal time.

 

[Louby]

Great thank you, so neither are on an empty stomach. I have no control over the others being fed or turned out unfortunately and its such a small yard she is the only one left in, so she is just going to have to get used to it. Im just trying to keep stress levels as low as I can as I think the stressing has contributed to the ulcers, although secretly hope the stressing is because of them!

 

[doodle]

It’s difficult when others on yard have a different schedule. That’s why I have to go up early as initially he was waiting after the others had gone out which caused huge tantrums!!

 

[Louby]

Just googled and this came up from a non UK Equine hospital. It would make life a lot easier!
It is imperative that this medication is not mixed with feed when administered and is given directly into the mouth. It is also advised to with-hold feed 30 minutes either side of giving Gastrogard, to maximise effect of the drug

 

[Goldenstar]

Go give the gastrogard then tie the horse up or try hand walking
or just give and leave and let her get on with it .
Its a complete pain I gave mine a small net of hay at midnight have the syringe at six and fed at seven .
Have you considered using the weekly injections instead ?

 

[Louby]

It’s difficult when others on yard have a different schedule. That’s why I have to go up early as initially he was waiting after the others had gone out which caused huge tantrums!!

Its a nightmare, Im happy to go up earlier but one horse on the yard is fed as soon as someone steps foot on there as it kicks the stable until it is fed, so whatever I do, this horse will have to be fed

 

[Louby]

Go give the gastrogard then tie the horse up or try hand walking
or just give and leave and let her get on with it .
Its a complete pain I gave mine a small net of hay at midnight have the syringe at six and fed at seven .
Have you considered using the weekly injections instead ?

They were mentioned but the vet said they prefer the syringe as the injections were large, milk shake like and lots object to it but it has been eft as an option. Im only on day one but trying to make it as stress free as possible. Im considering feeding first, then 30 mins later giving the gastogard and turning out

 

[Goldenstar]

There’s no point in doing the above it’s an expensive drug you need to administer it in the effective way .

 

[milliepops]

The horse next door to mine kicks off if he realises there's someone there, so I slip into the stable without turning the lights on to give the gastrogard then hide in the car out of sight until enough time has passed. It's working so far (though I'm doing very early starts )

 

[Louby]

Thanks all, sadly its not my call re feeding the horse that creates, otherwise I would sneak on at whatever time was needed. As soon as a car pulls on the yard, this horse starts, so no alternatives. I want this to work but was just seeing if there was a way round it as obvs stress is a factor Why is nothing straightforward

 

[Goldenstar]

Have you bought the whole course of gastrogard ?

 

[Louby]

Have you bought the whole course of gastrogard ?

Ive paid for 2 weeks atm, I know its 4 weeks course but unused drugs cant be returned so wanted to see how we got on. I have to give her Sucralfate too, 3 times a day in the feed.

 

[Goldenstar]

That’s pretty standard treatment .
if you are really struggling after the two weeks ask again about the injections

 

[be positive]

I have only used it once and would go in give him the GG and then feed everything, giving him a tiny handful to keep him quiet, it worked fine as he thought he had been fed and was happy to be tied up so I could muck out and do other jobs in the 30 mins, as he was on box rest I fed him then turned out the rest while he was occupied eating breakfast, he had ad lib hay which was only taken out as the GG was given, as mine was caused partly by stress and partly by meds the last thing I wanted to do was stress him any more by restricting his hay.

 

[ycbm]

So if a top class racing stables gives it after the horse has had both hard feed and hay, is there any scientific basis to the instruction to feed on an empty stomach?

In the past I've given the enteric coated stuff direct in food and judging by the results it has worked fine. Is it the syringes that are a problem? Can you ask for the enteric coated balls in a packet instead?
.

 

[Louby]

Be Positive - thats what I would like to do, she was better this morning but still a bit stressy and Im trying to avoid as much stress as I can as I think thats possibly the cause of the ulcers or definitely contributed to them. Was the course of GG successful for you?

ycbm, shes fine with the syringe, she thought Id poisoned her this morning though lol. Its her not getting her breakfast with the others and then them going out makes her stress more. She would usually patiently wait to go out, so it must be the breakfast. I read on GG official drug info instructions that it must be given 30 mins before or after feed, its all so conflicting. Vet said an hour after to have a feed with the Sulfacrete in it, so whether that affects it too I dont really know.

 

[Ellibelli]

So if a top class racing stables gives it after the horse has had both hard feed and hay, is there any scientific basis to the instruction to feed on an empty stomach?

In the past I've given the enteric coated stuff direct in food and judging by the results it has worked fine. Is it the syringes that are a problem? Can you ask for the enteric coated balls in a packet instead?
.

Mahoganybay posted this link a while ago and if you have an hour and a half hour or so free it's really interesting and dispels a few myths about ulcers. Basically it's saying that if you give the full dose of Gastroguard you don't need to restrict food. However, if you do restrict food then you can get away with giving a much lower dose.

https://www.facebook.com/watch/live/?v=230187191387754&ref=watch_permalink


I've successfully treated two horses with ulcers giving them sucralfate mixed in their feed and a full dose of Gastroguard syringe immediately before their bucket feed. They were both on adlib haylage so would never have had an empty stomach

 

[be positive]

Mine was not scoped, long story, but showed numerous signs with the final straw being him seen cribbing with a very content look on his face so he started on GG the same day, the cribbing stopped within 24 hours and he has never done it since, he had a 4 week course on full dose then a reduced amount, as he was on box rest and had other issues going on we guessed it worked as he gradually relaxed so we had no reason to look into it further, at the time I was just trying to keep him as quiet as possible so there was no way I would have totally withheld food, it seemed to be counter productive.

 

[Louby]

Mahoganybay posted this link a while ago and if you have an hour and a half hour or so free it's really interesting and dispels a few myths about ulcers. Basically it's saying that if you give the full dose of Gastroguard you don't need to restrict food. However, if you do restrict food then you can get away with giving a much lower dose.

https://www.facebook.com/watch/live/?v=230187191387754&ref=watch_permalink


I've successfully treated two horses with ulcers giving them sucralfate mixed in their feed and a full dose of Gastroguard syringe immediately before their bucket feed. They were both on adlib haylage so would never have had an empty stomach

Thank you, I will have a look at the link now but maybe being Xmas Day will watch it properly tomorrow
Ive made her a tiny breakfast for tomorrow, incase the other livery is there before me, she will get the GG when I get there and her breakfast with the sucralfate a bit later and see how we go. Im sure we will get into a routine soon.

 

[Louby]

Out of interest, did anyone have an increasingly stressy horse that after treating ulcers became more chilled? Shes always had a tendancy to stress at the silliest things but shes definitely got worse. I just want my old horse back

 

[SEL]

Out of interest, did anyone have an increasingly stressy horse that after treating ulcers became more chilled? Shes always had a tendancy to stress at the silliest things but shes definitely got worse. I just want my old horse back

Stressy, unpleasant to be around is my mare's main sign of a flare up.

Food anxiety is a real problem with her and because stress needed to be kept to a minimum we didn't withhold breakfast. She was on a full tube though.

 

[Louby]

Stressy, unpleasant to be around is my mare's main sign of a flare up.

Food anxiety is a real problem with her and because stress needed to be kept to a minimum we didn't withhold breakfast. She was on a full tube though.

Thank you, shes on a full tube too, isnt particularly foody but hasnt been a happy bunny missing out at breakfast time. Tomorrow she has 2 breakfasts A tiny one to hopefully kid her and her proper one. Shes a bit wide eyed at times atm especially in the stable. Seeing though she decided a few months ago not to wee overnight! which is a real pita, Im wondering whether somethings frightened her in there so after watching part of the link above Im going to put a mirror up and see if that helps a bit.