Geert Wilders - should he be allowed into the UK?

Sooty

Sooty

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Wilders is a democratically elected Dutch MP who has made a 17 minute film called 'Fitna', which is a warning against what he calls 'Islamisation'. He wants to come to the UK and show it in the House of Commons. Well, it should help with any insomnia. However, it is obvious that the sole purpose of the film is to stir up racial hatred. You can dress it up any way you want, but that is what it is about; passages from the Q'ran read out, with (possibly inaccurate) translations and shocking images of violence. Nothing that we haven't seen before, but in this context, quite extreme. There is no final message, no suggestion as to what we should actually do to deal with this threat - although I imagine we are supposed to vote for Wilders, should we be Dutch. The film was released last year, and several others have been made in response. No religion stands up to close examination without acts of violence having been perpetrated in its name, and the purpose of this film is to further divide an already unsettled society.

Now there is talk of banning him from the UK. Much as I would like to see him banned, I think he would then become some sort of political martyr. I don't see his film as free speech, as stirring up racial hatred is a crime, and he is definitely doing that. I think he should come here and find out just what a sad, pathetic little man most right-minded people think he is. What scares me though is that some people, like one I was listening to this morning on a talk show, will find the film 'educational and eye opening'. I think we know what sort of people they will be...
 
Well if its only being shown in the H of C then not many people will see it anyway. If as you say he is a sad pathetic little man then there is little worry people will view him with any credibility.

Personally I think people have already formed their own views on Islam anyway.
 
It's available to view on the internet, and has been for some time. This is just the publicity it needs though!
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I think he should come here and find out just what a sad, pathetic little man most right-minded people think he is

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I think that there is probably an awful lot of support for his views...........
 
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Will banning him not gain him more support though

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Yes I think it will.

I don't know what the answer is really - do you give these fanatics a voice (after all we are all for freedom of speech) or is it considered incendury - and likely to incite violence - in which case he should be banned. Abu Hansa was silenced due to inciting violence. And I agree that was the right thing to do.

But these things then just get pushed under ground.

Religion - who said it was the answer to anything! ?
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I think he should be allowed to speak as long as he doesn't incite violence, if he reports on acts that have happened they will be in the public domain anyway.

I ditto AmyMay in that a lot of people will agree with him anyway, I personally would struggle to find any positives to say about Islam and I form my own views I don't need someone else to persuade me.
 
He is not reporting, he is putting a very unbalanced and simplistic view on the basis of Islam. Islam, like Christianity, is open to interpretation, and is fundementally a religion based on peace. Many Christian and Muslim prohpets are shared, including Jesus and Abraham. There is a lot about Islam people do not know, and only think that 'all terrorists are Muslims and all Muslims are terrorists'. No religion should be judged on the actions of its extremists.
 
Yes I agree with you I wouldn't base any views on extremism alone, but my views are based on insights whilst working with muslims in London. Many people bang on about Islam being a religion of peace but I'm sorry I cant equate that to what I have heard / seen from the ladies I have worked with.
 
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he is putting a very unbalanced and simplistic view on the basis of Islam

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And that is one of the main problems of fanaticism - there are no two sides, only one. There is no discussion, no debate - just statements of 'fact'.
 
That is interesting. Women do seem to be readily embracing new ideas about islam, such as wearing the hijab. A film of streets, restaurants etc in Caior which was taken about 40 years ago showed all the Muslim women in Western dress. There seems to be a distinct move by Muslim women to reclaim their identity through dress, although the exact words of the Qu'ran which relate to this are impossible to accurately translate.
 
I think we should become a islamic state then at least we will know what to do and how to treat women and animals , laws will be more positive and we can enjoy public stoneings and we can all live happly ever after... allah is great ...death to the infadels...
 
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That is interesting. Women do seem to be readily embracing new ideas about islam, such as wearing the hijab. A film of streets, restaurants etc in Caior which was taken about 40 years ago showed all the Muslim women in Western dress. There seems to be a distinct move by Muslim women to reclaim their identity through dress, although the exact words of the Qu'ran which relate to this are impossible to accurately translate.

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Yes they are doing what their menfolk are telling to do IE
walk behind men and not drive cars ,and in the more extreem states not allowing girls to be educated, having books or music
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Plus there is a lot of money behind some of the extremists. Petrol dollars are funding an awful lot of printing.

[/ QUOTE ] good point sooty... Yes and a very good reason to find alternatives to oil
and fast... we are giving money to people who basicly hate us and dont share our values or democracy...
 
Urgh, this guy is suck a f&#&ing W@#&#%!! There are no words strong enough. There was outrage over here when he released it and they upped the national security alert as well. He is really really really hated by every dutch person I know. Not sure whether he should be allowed in the UK or not (freedom of speech and all that) but I assume the the majority of the UK would feel the same way as the majority of The Netherlands do!
 
Just found an interview of him on youtube seems make his point well, not yet found out what is supposed to be wrong with him or most of what he is saying ... any ideas ????
 
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Oh lets see... he wants all immigrants to be run out of Holland... Hitler anyone?

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Oh maybe he should join a uk trade union thats what they seem to want here at the moment british jobs for british workers etc.....
 
I think things are hard here at the moment because of the struggling economy and especially with all these redundancies, when there are too many people perceived to be biting the cherry and there isn't enough to go round this sort of thing is inevitable.
 
Interesting to hear from someone who has to put up with him on a daily basis! I do wonder how he got elected though, but there is only one of him. I guess we have the odd vile racist MP over here, but I couldn't name one. What worries me is that people will take his divisive tripe seriously.
 
There is freedom of movement to work within the EU, and that cuts both ways. There are plenty of Brits who have made their home and work in Spain, France etc. I do not hold with all this insularity; I think the job should go to the person who can best do it.
 
Have you actually seen Fitna because I have? It is approximately 17 minutes long and shows parts of the Koran interspersed with newspaper clippings showing/describing acts of violence and/or hatred by Muslims and deals with the influence of Islam on the Netherlands.

There is footage of the 9/11 attacks, the Madrid train bombings, stills of the London bus and underground carnage. It illustrates the murder of Dutch film director Theo Van Gogh, speeches by Ibrahim Mudeiris threatening to rule the entire world and of Abdul Rahman Saleem speaking in English of taking over the USA! the UK! Europe!

The final segment of the film deals with issues related to Islam in the Netherlands, their opposition to democracy, Islamic views on homosexuality and women's treatment in Islam. A Dutch Muslim expresses his desire to enact honour killing if his mother or sister commits zina, the Islamic concept of extramarital sex. ." Another states that adulterers must be "stoned" to death. A graphic image of gays being hanged. A series of clips show Female genital cutting, a decapitated woman's head lying on a floor, and a woman dressed in a burqa being shot through the head by a man.

So all of you interested in banning this man make sure that you do not indulge in extramarital sex, you are not gay, you accept genital mutilation if you are a woman, you approve of being subjugated and you obey the Koran but most of all get informed.
 
sadly the same sort of people who tryed to apease hitler are now trying the same failed policy with islam bending over backwards to accomerdate and suck up to it... and it wont be happy untill it has conquered the west ....I would say Geert Wilders is a brave and wise man in standing up to this "faith"
 
Yes I did watch it. I thought it was pure propaganda; unoriginal and inaccurate. This film is not designed to illuminate and educate, it is designed to scare and divide. All the footage appears to have been gleaned from YouTube, there is nothing new and no guarantee that the translations (which are notoriously difficult because of the language the Qu'ran is written in) are accurate. I have no sympathy with the perpetrators of any atrocities, whatever their faith.
 
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