Getting help? Why? Why not?

I have no problem asking for help when I need it, in fact I love lessons with a decent trainer even when things are going well; there is always room for improvement.

My problem is actually finding a decent instructor who isn't 300 miles away. Ok that's probably an exaggeration but there is certainly nobody within 30 miles that i would use on a regular basis and haven't found anyone else in a bigger radius either.

I was spoilt with my previous coach who was amazing and who improved me and my horse in some way every session but I moved away and can no longer get to her. Not sure anyone will measure up but I will keep searching for a decent instructor until I find one!
 
I think the finding the right instructor thing is going to bary for everyone though booboos, yes there are lots of good quality, and also lots of bad quality, instructors out there, but, people have different learning stykes as do horses. Just because a trainer offers lots of easily accessible clinics etc doesnt mean that everyone will click with them. Ok there are more to choose from to find the right one but i dont necessarily think its as easy as that.

For me, confidence cant be bought, and it cant be taught, so in that sense i have to muddle along til ive built it up, therefore once ive cracked that i can probably crack my current issues.
 
For a number of years I've 'gone it alone' or had the odd horse-trusted friend to assist but having had an injury to myself on the same day I got my new horse in mid Dec, I took a good hard look at what I had got to go ahead when the break had healed.
1. I was not going to be riding fit at all after losing crutches & cast.
2. I didnt know the horse at all apart from trying him
3. He is a relatively young, but very very green, but also honest horse.
4. Ref point 3, I was concerned that I might not help his education if I was at all wobbly or 'windy' on board - both of which could (and were/are) possible after a lay-off & previous horse which was a right nit.
5. I dont have 'facilities', thus making simple schooling difficult in a confined area if weather & ground conditions are bad (as they have been - all paddocks slippery with mud!)

The sensible side of me appraised my points above, so I contacted someone - who I feel I can already totally trust to help me and the horse 'get together'.

I'm not in a financial position to have regular on-going weekly sessions after a while (I had set a 'get me going' budget) but if the horse needs it, I'll try me best to keep on going :)
 
Lots of reasons I suppose! When I bought my youngster, I know lots of people at the yard thought I was " Over horsed" heard about people talking behind my back - what I put down to now as mostly jealously.

I at the time didn't want to ask for help there incase it was frowned or laughed upon. Thankfully I still have the same great intructor I did before I got my horse & she has been FAB... As has HHO which has really helped me...

However if at the time I'd been seriously worried about something physically wrong with my horse I would of course have asked, actually now have a good base of friends @ the yard I turn to for advice on anything - but took me ALOT of time to trust people if that makes sence.

TarrSteps said:
A genuine musing/query. . .

I've had a series of conversations today with people who have what I would consider quite serious but fairly straightforward problems with their horses. They had various reasons for not seeking help up to this point but I'm curious to know what people think usually stops people.

Is it concern over cost?
Not knowing where to look?
Previous negative experiences?
Pride?
Not knowing help is possible/available?
Concern that it's just going to a massive, complicated pain of a process vs just living with the problem?

Just curious what people's experiences and observations have been. I'm inclined to assume every problem has a solution, if I can just find the person who knows it and that solutions are cheaper than problems in the long run (whether I can/want to put the solution into effect might be a whole different conversation!) but perhaps that's not the majority view.
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showjumpingfilly said:
I think the finding the right instructor thing is going to bary for everyone though booboos, yes there are lots of good quality, and also lots of bad quality, instructors out there, but, people have different learning stykes as do horses. Just because a trainer offers lots of easily accessible clinics etc doesnt mean that everyone will click with them. Ok there are more to choose from to find the right one but i dont necessarily think its as easy as that.

For me, confidence cant be bought, and it cant be taught, so in that sense i have to muddle along til ive built it up, therefore once ive cracked that i can probably crack my current issues.
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Confidence is what you get when you are well taught in a constructive system knowledge brings confidence and knowledge is what you gain with training .
 
That's an interesting perspective, sjf. I firmly believe that true confidence is the result of good, reliable skills and, the next stage on, instinctive, reliable reactions. In horses and people. Otherwise doesn't it just go away again when things go wrong?

Is your point that people have to be confident before they ask for help? That makes sense in a way, although I've found desperate people are often the most willing to make decisive changes! :)
 
TarrSteps/GoldenStar - I'm findin it hard to put what i mean into words -

I'm one of those people that gains confidence from doing something - like at the minute - the canter transitions (sounds a pathetic thing but asking for canter without a buck and riding through it if she does buck is more what im trying to achieve - once ive done a few successfully i'll have the confidence to do it again. Someone coming in and telling me the correct way to do a canter transition isnt going to make me confident. I need experience on my side. Try to think of it like pennies in a jar - the fuller the jar the more confidence, each experience is a penny. So, therefore, the more experience the more confident.

I do see your point GoldenStar, in that if you have the theory behind something working then why wouldnt in work so therefore you're confident it will work but i don't work like that. I'm a try and test it kinda girl!

Plus, you can gain confidence in the wrong methods too - some people are confident in punishing a horse to get the results they want - their confident but they aren't knowledgeable.

Personally, TarrSteps I feel I do need to be confident enough before I can ask for help. If I'm not confident enough to do the basics then I'd feel intimidated in asking for help to do something in particular. Like, an aim of mine is to jump a 140, but if I'm not confident enough to jump a decent round in a 130 (with or without help) i shouldnt be asking for help for a 140. I think i'm verging off on a massive obvious tangent now but i'm finding it hard to explain.
 
The cogs are really having to work now!!

I think I mean that - using the very foundations as an example - you get taught walk trot canter and a few small jumps. So you have that knowledge and yes, Goldenstar, you have that knowledge do x y or z, so are perhaps confident you are able to do x y or z. But until you practise you arent confident at doing x y or z. But once you are, then you can ask for help to tweak/further your knowledge of x, y or z.

So - you learn to jump a verticle, you practise jumping verticles, you ask for help to jump verticles better or bigger etc.
 
But what if you can't jump a vertical?

I think we're actually taking about two different things. . .you seem to be talking about polishing skills, about getting instruction to help polish or expand skills you already have.

I'm talking more about an actual problem or heading off a potential issue. So to use a variation on your example, I jumped a green horse recently for someone who had got him going well, out to lessons etc but realised she'd never had a session without at least one stop. When she came off she decided she wanted to get to the bottom of it sooner rather than later because she felt that was best for everyone's confidence and the horse's education. A few sessions and it was all good. The horse knows what to do, she knows why it was happening what to do to stop it cropping up again, and she and the horse only put a few black marbles in their jar. (Similar to the penny analogy but white marbles are good experiences, black marbles are bad ones. Every new question/experience/task pulls a marble out of the jar so you want more white ones than black ones!)

To use your canter example, would you really feel less confident if someone could tell you how to minimise or avoid the bucking then you practiced that? I'm not arguing, I'm genuinely intrigued!!

I think I must be really lazy! If there is an easier way to go, I'm there! :D But I'm confident in this approach because I know horses, as herbivores, like an easy life, too. So it comes down to that old chestnut, make the right thing easy and the wrong thing hard. :)
 
Yeah, me, tangent, over here a bit, nope bit more! I've deviated a fair bit I think! Which is why using what i said - you would know how to jump the vertical but the help would then polish your skills.

No no, I totally get where you're coming from so I definatelydon't think of it as arguing. I'm finding it interesting discussing it too!!

I guess with a problem, you can't learn it til it happens, so my point is probably irrelevant there.

I guess knowing it is fixable is a help in itself. I definately wouldn't ever feel less confident if someone told me that, but I wouldnt feel confident until it had worked and I could do that on my own. But then i suppose thats the same for most people.

See, I'm toying with the idea of someone else jumping on and showing me that it is doable. But although that may make me confident that horse can do it, it wouldnt make me confident i can do it.
 
Actually, a big problem of mine is no self belief/thinking i'm not good enough. I probably am fairly ok, and I've had fairly decent riders tell me I can ride and i'm effective etc but I find it hard to believe. Then, when there's a problem I have even more self doubt.

For example, a horse I had years back used to nap severely. Due to my age we used to have an instructor ride the horse and they ended up winning stuff or achieving good results, but that only made me think I wasn't good enough and I'd never be able to do it myself. (It didn't help when they then called me pathetic because i was 12 and terrified of the horse that knew it could stick its head between its knees and high tail off to its friends!!)
 
I think that sometimes people are so invested in having a horse with a problem that they constantly focus on the problem and they wouldn't actually want someone else to fix the problem. Either they have done all they can think of to solve the issue and do not believe that someone else will be able to fix something they couldn't do themselves or the behavioural issue becomes part of the horse's personality and they don't actually want the problem to be solved.

I found with my own horses that relatively minor behavioural issues just become accepted as the norm and it just didn't occur to me to change the behaviour. Some things I just didn't realise how easy they were to resolve or I would have dealt with them much sooner ie you getting Fainne to stand in two sessions after 9 years of just ignoring it.

I have picked my battles over the years, worked on things myself and got professional help with the issues that had become dangerous but was unable to resolve myself and then worked around those I didn't need to resolve. Breagh's refusal to hack alone has bothered me for ages and I have the finances to deal with it, I have access to professional help, I've had lots of positive experiences solving her other issues and I know dealing with the problem would have made my life easier but still life has got in the way and probably having a consistent run of time to work on it is the main reason we haven't got round to it. Her phobias about certain things, ie scissors has been so time consuming to deal with I just gave up using scissors anywhere near her which is a real nuisance but not serious. I had Richard Maxwell help with her loading issues which was far from straightforward but a great success but then again he told me not to bother with her clipper phobia as it was a battle too far with a big horse and safer to just sedate her than work through it. I would love to solve the clipper issue but honestly I wouldn't feel happy putting someone else, even a professional, at physical risk dealing with something that I can do safely with sedation. I would love to be able to trim her beard though ;0)
 
Booboos said:
I think people in the UK are extremely lucky in the wealth of trainers easily available. Most top trainers hold regular clinics, all you have to do is sign up, and they are happy to help all kinds of riders and horses. More locally there are many decent instructors to be had and I've never had a problem finding someone decent willing to come to me, despite moving up and down the country frequently.

Compare the situation with France, at least here in the south. Within a 2 hour drive there is only one dressage instructor. Luckily she's lovely but if you didn't get on with her that would be it. In the two years I have been here there has been one visiting instructor clinic with very few places.
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I feel like this at the minute, Im in NZ and would not pay for below average or just technically wrong instruction at all!! I had some lessons with an eventer but even then that was mainly for some mindset help with a youngster as opposed to a training plan, Even then shes gone back to the UK :( Everyone is in the UK training and competing !The people I see who ride well at shows are incredibly overpriced for the instruction I have seen them receive. Dont get me started on registered and trained other professionals!:confused:
 
lucemoose said:
I feel like this at the minute, Im in NZ and would not pay for below average or just technically wrong instruction at all!! I had some lessons with an eventer but even then that was mainly for some mindset help with a youngster as opposed to a training plan, Even then shes gone back to the UK :( Everyone is in the UK training and competing !The people I see who ride well at shows are incredibly overpriced for the instruction I have seen them receive. Dont get me started on registered and trained other professionals!:confused:
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This for me too. I basically taught myself to ride when I was younger and then spent my teenage years on unsuitable horses with patchy instruction so I have many bad habits and really cannot ride for toffee at times as I have serious position faults. So now with current horse I am constantly striving to be better but finding a good instructor in my area is near impossible. Whilst our dressage has improved immensely with my current instructor I know fundamentally that there is more that I should be learning and a good instructor would be able to pick apart my position and help put it back together but instead it is all about the horse. Jumping is even more difficult as we are currently having issues and I really need the help but I just feel I'm not getting the right help as I haven't got much choice in the matter

With this though I think it is just that NZ does not have the wealth of instructors that the UK/Europe and there is a lot of dodgy instruction going on but that is not to say that there aren't very good instructors around (just none in my area really)
 
For me it was ignorance of what appropriate help could achieve and ignorance of what was available. After moving on from a dodgy riding school when I was about 15 I had mainly ridden for friends or, whilst at uni at a riding school, until i bought my first horse. I knew enough about the management side and have ridden a fair few naughty or young horses but it had never been just me having all the influence on the horse before.

I knew I wasn't overly experienced so had lots of lessons with experienced friends, my theory being, me and pony weren't at any kind of advanced level and my friends were more experienced than me.

It wasn't until I was contemplating sending the horse to a pro as we weren't progressing due to my ineptness and if that didn't help I mentioned selling him. A good friend who works at our yard told me to speak to the YO about the trainer she had. No on our yard this trainer is only used by the YO and a couple of girls who BD or BE - so it had never crossed my mind to ask a proper expensive dressage trainer to help with my very basic level hairy pony. I was desperate so gave her a go, the first lesson was a revelation and we've gone from there. The difference has been amazing, we've still got a long way to go but I'm much more positive its possible. For me, I was just very ignorant of the difference a good instructor can make and the influence they can have.
 
I haven't read all the replies yet but my own reason for not getting help is lack of confidence. I tend to stay within my safety zone and if things are going well, I tend to not push for more for fear of upsetting what I have. I don't have enough confidence in my ability to progress further (tho i have in the past with a different horse) and so I tend to muddle on at the same stage for a lot longer than I should. It's not a fear of the horse misbehaving, me falling off etc. It's a fear that if I push things and do it wrong, that I'll mess up what we have already acheived, confuse the poor horse, make our lives more difficult in future. I know it's silly as you have to make mistakes in order to learn and a good trainer will see us through any problems but my lack of confidence makes me very reluctant to try.

I have in the past sought help with behavioural issues with my last horse as clearly what I was doing wasn't working and it did help, but as soon as I was comfortable with where we were at, I stopped the lessons etc. I guess what it boils down to is I'm scared of failure and what other people think of me :(
 
Chloe - yes my impression is that Germany is heads above the UK but I have no experience of the country. I always assumed France was a 'horsey' country but I was surprised at how different things are here.

Only one DR instructor for such a huge area is slim pickings indeed and if you don't get on with her or she reaches the limits of her knowledge, what do you do?? There is also less of a culture of learning, e.g. in the UK I would go to at least 2 conferences a year where trainers would demonstrate and explain their training ideas, which is important because you both learn and are inspired by seeing others ride well and improve.

We also have very few competitions, within an hour's drive there are just two competitions a year which is very depressing because there is so few chances to practice and get feedback from judges.
 
I haven't read the whole thing as I'm on my way out so sorry if I've missed a key point ;)

I think one of the issues is that people don't see a small problem as being a potential foundation for a bigger one and they think that they can solve the smaller one by speaking to people on forums, in basic conversation and may not mention it to their instructor as is not that big an issue.

For me, I'm totally open minded and will try anything. I'm not an expert, although have been around horses for years and I'm not stupid, and IMO there is always something to learn and I don't think I'll ever have the answers. I share my problems with people I trust and have been burnt in the past which does make me wary, however I can take someone mocking me for my choices as long as they are the best ones for the horse.
 
Out of curiosity, Booboos, would the situation be different if you jumped. The French production system - breeding, licensing etc - has been jumping based and I can't think of one current dressage.Master in the competitive school. (I'm not counting Karl, not because he isn't influential, but because I suspect his influence is mostly outside of France!)

I think it's true that regional limitations are much less an issue in the UK. There are lots of places in North America you'd drive days to find high level dressage instruction! There is much more a culture of being taught in more 'horsey' a areas though.
 
Oh for sure! Its not that everyone is useless, its the lack in sheer numbers, and ease of getting to people. Also for me is actually knowing who to go to and cutting through the BS surrounding a hype about the person of the moment!
 
I do think a large proportion of the problem is due to being 'out of the loop'. For example, when I'm in Cambridge I'm on a relatively small yard, but with a few knowledgeable people who know the area, the instructors, the venues etc, so if I stumble across a problem I can ask on of them to either help me directly or point me in the right direction. On the other hand, when the horses are at uni in Stoke, the yard is lovely with a knowledgeable YO in terms of stable management, but with very limited facilities and mostly happy hacker types - so little to no input in terms of any ridden issues. It also means there's no one to point me in the right direction in terms of instructors etc (plus the limited facilities makes having lessons an interesting affair as I'm not a fan of the deep sand school, and my horse has sort of taken over the schooling paddock for grazing) Luckily (via HHO recommendations ;) ) I have started having lessons with Mark at Ingestre Stables and am hoping he can point me in the right direction of an instructor to come out to the yard (no transport so can't take horse to him), but it's very easy to see how isolated you can become if you're not 'in the loop'
 
When I've spent a lot of money on help sorting problems, all there has been is either no improvement or some degree of improvement, sometimes on the way to discovering a big soundness problem. IME some improvement is not enough help, the problem is still there to be lived with, which I can't and sell. These days I'm resolved to do that in the first place.

Although I was coming to a point, on the medical side of things, where I thought vets don't actually fix anything, they just tell you what's wrong if you're lucky, but then there's rarely a lot they can do about it, so what's the point in spending £££s just on diagnostics? My faith was restored to a point when vet's fixed my arab removing his keratoma.
 
I think for a lot of people it is going to be money and possibly time. In addition some people might be shy in asking others for help not wanting to bother people especially if that person is busy or does not seem very approachable.

I think a lot of people are combining keeping a horse on a budget alongside a full time job so it is not easy to be able to afford lots of lessons or even sometimes even find the time to do the "home work" that you have to do after the lessons in order to improve.
 
SO1 said:
I think for a lot of people it is going to be money and possibly time. In addition some people might be shy in asking others for help not wanting to bother people especially if that person is busy or does not seem very approachable.

I think a lot of people are combining keeping a horse on a budget alongside a full time job so it is not easy to be able to afford lots of lessons or even sometimes even find the time to do the "home work" that you have to do after the lessons in order to improve.
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I don't understand that. Horses really are a hobby/pastime/sucker up of money that you have to always know you are always going to be learning with. Fair enough you may not be able to afford regular lessons but everyone can save up for say, 1 a month. Or query on here to find someone. Even if someone only ever wants to hack, lessons will still improve your experience. A long time ago I started riding a mare for friend of a friend. We came to a close as while yes, she had been doing horses for years, but was totally against any other ideas or suggestions. This meant looking at tack (her saddles didn't fit) or even how to ask the horses to start to work. Fully appreciate they were her horses but found it immensely frustrating that she really thought she knew everything. She is the only equine person I have ever met I learnt absolutely nothing from as well.

Advantages of being on a reasonably big yard is getting to see a lot of different horses. Also see a lot of youngsters in for backing and have learnt a lot from that.

I think the biggest problem for the vast majority of people is that while you may have a lot of experience, it will only have been with a few horses. True experience is riding, looking and caring for a vastly different array of animals. And being open to suggestions and learning!
 
Really interesting to read the replies above...

I think on a medical / management side, I have a level of confidence and expertise and know where to go for specific advice on specific issues - a network of trusted people. So that is easy.

Riding-wise, I am coming back to it after a long period where I rode maybe 1/2 dozen times a year. I am riding a home-bred 7 yo who is behind where he might be after spending his 5yo year recuperating from a serious degloving injury, who is at least a hand bigger than I like and who is, at the end of a long period of restricted and revolting turnout, feeling every one of his 25% TB genes :rolleyes: As a case in point, like a previous poster, canter transitions have become an issue for me. I had a lesson yesterday. At the beginning horse was very clear that leg meant "forward" and not "bend" or "move sideways". I got off and my teacher introduced him to the idea of lateral lunging - a new one on me - which really engaged his brain as well as his inside hind :D. (I should say also that the 5 mins he spent dolphin leaping and bucking on the lunge before being asked to work in the sheer joy of cavorting without the responsibility of a rider - he is a really kind horse which is why I ride him! - reminded me that it is no failure to take the "extra" out by lunging anyway.)

When I got back on, I felt for the first time from him the feeling of 51% outside rein, 49% inside rein and curling around and moving across from my inside leg that I remember from rather a long time ago ;) Didn't ask for canter because I didn't need to. I know what to work on to make it so that canter transitions will just happen without issue because I know what was making it an issue. I hope :D
 
Flame_ said:
When I've spent a lot of money on help sorting problems, all there has been is either no improvement or some degree of improvement, sometimes on the way to discovering a big soundness problem. IME some improvement is not enough help, the problem is still there to be lived with, which I can't and sell. These days I'm resolved to do that in the first place.

Although I was coming to a point, on the medical side of things, where I thought vets don't actually fix anything, they just tell you what's wrong if you're lucky, but then there's rarely a lot they can do about it, so what's the point in spending £££s just on diagnostics? My faith was restored to a point when vet's fixed my arab removing his keratoma.
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But there are very few things a vet can "fix"! If a horse has sustained an injury or has some sort of degenerative condition, like arthritis (which pretty much comes to us all) the vet can only treat as appropriate and then it's a case of, in the case of acute things, hoping that time does the rest or, in the case of chronic issues, finding a doable management program.

To some extent it's the same with behavioural issues. I worked with a mare who was stunningly reactive to particular feeds. On the right feed she was infinitely more relaxed and trainable. I sold her with full disclosure and an adamant suggestion to not try to reinvent the wheel. What did the new owners do? Put her right back on the highest sugar and cereal diet available!!! Her jumping deteriorated immediately and her behaviour followed suit. They did not blame me in any way and, in fact, said they did not mind as they fed what they fed and were not willing to change. Alrighty then.:cool:

So did I "fix" the problem or not? Depends on how you look at it, I guess.


I think this is actually part of the discussion though - what does "fixed" mean and what is fixable? I don't know how you learn that without experience and I don't know how you get that experience without being exposed to literally hundreds, if not thousands of horses. If you have a problem, is it not worth going to someone and saying "I've got this problem. Do you think it's fixable? How would I go about that?"

Sometimes the answer is, "Yes, it's happening because of this so do this to solve it." Sometimes it is, "No, not fixable but manageable." Sometimes it is, "Don't bother, live with it," or even "Don't bother, be done." What's wrong with that? Surely you want someone helping you who is going to be honest? I think of that as exactly the reason to get help - if the horse is not doing what I want and I can't figure out why or how to sort it, I want someone who knows more about it to tell me if I'm wasting my time (and, possibly, mine and my horse's health and sanity).
 
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There is another thread on here about people being able to afford horses on benefits and how they are very careful with money so they have enough to have a horse I doubt they would be about to save the £25 a month required to have a lesson every month or if they had £25 spare it would be going into emergency funds for unexpected vets bills etc.

For some people lessons really are a luxuary.

Luci07 said:
I don't understand that. Horses really are a hobby/pastime/sucker up of money that you have to always know you are always going to be learning with. Fair enough you may not be able to afford regular lessons but everyone can save up for say, 1 a month. Or query on here to find someone. Even if someone only ever wants to hack, lessons will still improve your experience. A long time ago I started riding a mare for friend of a friend. We came to a close as while yes, she had been doing horses for years, but was totally against any other ideas or suggestions. This meant looking at tack (her saddles didn't fit) or even how to ask the horses to start to work. Fully appreciate they were her horses but found it immensely frustrating that she really thought she knew everything. She is the only equine person I have ever met I learnt absolutely nothing from as well.

Advantages of being on a reasonably big yard is getting to see a lot of different horses. Also see a lot of youngsters in for backing and have learnt a lot from that.

I think the biggest problem for the vast majority of people is that while you may have a lot of experience, it will only have been with a few horses. True experience is riding, looking and caring for a vastly different array of animals. And being open to suggestions and learning!
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TarrSteps said:
Out of curiosity, Booboos, would the situation be different if you jumped. The French production system - breeding, licensing etc - has been jumping based and I can't think of one current dressage.Master in the competitive school. (I'm not counting Karl, not because he isn't influential, but because I suspect his influence is mostly outside of France!)

I think it's true that regional limitations are much less an issue in the UK. There are lots of places in North America you'd drive days to find high level dressage instruction! There is much more a culture of being taught in more 'horsey' a areas though.
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To be fair I should say that things are much better near Saumur where there is a much higher concentration of horsey people and you get more professionals, more competitions, more experienced vets, etc.

Down here SJ is a bit better but not enormously so. The French have a slightly different culture to competitions. They are very expensive for the centres to put on so they don't usually make much money on them, whereas in the UK there are centres that run 1 or 2 competitions a week so they must be some profit in it for them. For dressage you need at least 2, mostly 3 judges per class and you need to run all the tests for each of the three categories if you run that category (so if you run Club which is about the same as unaffiliated you need to run all the tests in that category. They don't have as many as the UK, so there is one test at 'low' Prelim, one at 'high' Prelim, one at 'low' Novice, etc. if you see what I mean, but there are still a lot of tests).

Competitions do not take place over a half-day or day, but rather over 3-4 days and everyone stays over, doing multiple tests. So competitors are used to driving 3-4 hours to new venues to stay over for a few days, and each centre only runs one competition per year.

Another weird difference is that there aren't that many people doing the lower tests (Prelim to Medium level equivalent). You see a lot of people doing Ad Med to PSG but the level is horrific, not just bad but the movements are unrecognisable as such. The Amateur category goes from an easy Elem to PSG but there are no limits to what you can do, so one day you can do the PSG and the next the Elem.

Our particular area apparently has a specialty for breeding the Anglo-Arab for eventing (if I didn't grossly misunderstand a recent discussion with my farrier!). I can't quite see how they event as the ground is awful, but apparently that is what there is most of. Weirdly though whereas eventers in the UK tend to spend a lot of time on just SJ or DR, here they go straight for eventing.

Nobody knows Karl round here even though he is based a few hours away. I know of at least one instructor following his training methods (about 2.5 hours away from me) but if you ask at RSs or riders nobody knows him.
 
TarrSteps said:
A genuine musing/query. . .

I've had a series of conversations today with people who have what I would consider quite serious but fairly straightforward problems with their horses. They had various reasons for not seeking help up to this point but I'm curious to know what people think usually stops people.

Is it concern over cost?
Not knowing where to look?
Previous negative experiences?
Pride?
Not knowing help is possible/available?
Concern that it's just going to a massive, complicated pain of a process vs just living with the problem?

Just curious what people's experiences and observations have been. I'm inclined to assume every problem has a solution, if I can just find the person who knows it and that solutions are cheaper than problems in the long run (whether I can/want to put the solution into effect might be a whole different conversation!) but perhaps that's not the majority view.
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This is a sort of question I've been researching for the last 4 years due to my work so here are some of my musings on this :)

From my experiences and observations, the problem of seeking help by many riders boils down to negative experiences - personal and of others who share them.

In general, I believe the riders not getting help they need is more an issue on trainers/instructors side. They ought to educate & mentor the type of riders they want to teach, whether it's beginners or 3/4* ammie riders, and like this, limit the amount of negative experiences.

Perhaps as a result of this lack of clear path as to who is best suited for whom, first thing that seems to repeat itself over and over is that riders don't understand who to go to, how the riding education works and who has the pedagogical capacity to teach which kind of rider.

It seems that it's the self-taught riders and intermediate riders who are most often going it alone. Ammie Pros and novice riders are often hungry for improvement and knowledge so try their best to get it.
The first group listens to opinions of the second group and often goes by it even though the goals and type of instruction needed for each varies.

Here are some issues I noticed over last years that in my opinion contribute to riders avoiding help:

+ intermediate (even some advanced) riders who train for achievement and fun and who are in it mostly for the love of the horse can be set on seeking help from "top-riders-top-trainers". With some exceptions this can often cause problems as priorities of a trainer who is used to training other professionals will have certain views on management, psychological toughness (in both horse and rider), planning rider's training; they will be expecting certain input and even sacrifice for the sport.
These riders would be better off finding flexible instructors with a genuine passion for parting knowledge well, whether these are good BHS instructors or other freelance instructors regardless of type of qualifications. Instructors who school many horses well AND can part knowledge well. Instructors with decent foundations, both theoretical and practical.

These riders, after their experiences, share their opinions among friends, on forums, chats and the false info spreads that training kills your confidence, kills fun, destroys your horse, pushes you beyond what you are ready for etc etc

+ self-taught riders with good general feel for own horse(s) wanting to solve some technical issues/educate their seat who seek help from "good riders"...These "good riders" often focus primarily on the horse, they "ride the horse from the ground with certain type of instruction" and the actual rider gains very little. Once the rider realises this they lose the willingness to seek more help, they don't think a "BHS instructor" or some other trainer is good enough for them, they want a "good rider" to teach them but "good rider" couldn't help them so nobody can...

+ self-taught riders as above but going to radical trainers who disregard the feel/knowledge the rider already has and try to change them as quickly as possible. Trainers of this sort often do it so it looks like they offer good value for money, so many things to do, so many corrections offered...Rider loses their confidence and as most of the time that was all they had and all their horse believed in, they go down the hill pretty fast.

As to the argument of lack availability of good trainers/lack of transport/high costs - there is a growing number of online training available with many unknown but fantastic coaches waiting to give their advice and guidance for a fraction of a cost of weekly lessons. All it takes is some application to the task and those who really want to improve or fix a problem will take advantage.
Sure, in this option, nobody is going to get on anyone's horse and demonstrate but then again, many riders don't want this in the first place...
 
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