Happy Days For ISH Breeders

i don't know and neither do you because the fact is you heard the rumour and i have heard the rumour i never once said i fully believed it but it would make alot of things make sence
the fact of the matter is there will never be peace on this subject because if it is in RDS or the steps in goresbridge their will always be some old man swearing that there is no way cruising is by sea crest
maybe me in 70 years time:o
 
I have a good story about Cruising to tell. I will reveal all tomorrow! ( I need to get the facts right) Eothain, this will please you

On another note, There are new pictures of Sky Boy and Taldi on the Kiltealy Stud website. We all know about Sky Boy, an amazing horse. But what about Taldi? He died of colic before his time but what a legacy he left (or could have left) Twinkle Bee CCI4* completed Badminton and Church Road Jumping nations cup for Argentina 1.60m course! What a loss!
 
Cruising = The reason I got into this business after finishing school.

I look forward to this story Grasshorse.

Rebel Mountain, can I call you Reb? It's shorter than typing out Rebellious Mountaineering friend. I brought up Samjemgee ages ago. Dublin 7 Year Old Champ 2009. Lanaken representitive 2009. Half brother to Flexible and Flexing out of former National Champion and by an International jumping stallion. What more could you ask for?
 
you can call me reb

i didn't know mary mccann stud him because lets face it she is one of those elite stallion owners in ireland who can make a medocre horse like great another is slyguff stud and kylemore stud
 
To be fair Reb, it's been mainly me and you keeping this going for a while. I reckon people have gotten a touch bored of it at this stage.

As for making mediocre stallions great, well there comes a time when stallions must stand on their own four hooves. It takes more than a stud to make a stallion great in my opinion.

As for the Warmblood books, well I know for a fact that the WSI is not interested in ever registering more than about 200 - 250 foals per year. It's almost a private studbook and to be honest, I wish them the very best of good luck. I can see myself signing up as a member at some stage to support them but I'll always be an ISH man. For the WSI is all about having a higher percentage of jumpers to foals registered than any other studbook. Their focus is second to none.

The SIES is a daughter of the AES and I must say, I was very excited about them earlier in the year but having seen their stallion approvals video, I have to say I was disappointed. I thought it to be a touch amateurish. I've a Baltimore foal to register with them this year and I do hope they become a success. Last year the AES was #24 in the WBFSH rankings for showjumpers. Who's to say the SIES will do any better? It does provide another registration outlet for breeders in Ireland however. That may be no bad thing
 
The thing is do we need another registration outlet though? The ISH studbook has improved the last whil, what with the trafficlight system and new grading systems etc. so why not just keep on improing the one we have instead of opening up new studbooks i personally can't see the need for-the ish by nature is a warmblood anyway-Id cold, Tb hot and all the varieties and vageries inbetween. so why a separate warmblood studbook? the ish is changing, not just a straight tbxid and everyone knows that so what are the advantages of a competing studbook? surely we should be pooling our resources to make the ish a super ass kicking studbook a la the KWPN ?why are you registering your foal with them and not ish? what is the benefit? jus interested to know!
 
Baltimore isn't registered with the ISH studbook so I can go AES or SIES because he's Approved Elite with them.

People have been giving out about the Horse Board/HSI for years now so with this new studbook after starting out they can take their ball and run over there.

As for the never-happy-unless-the're-giving-out-Irish Draught people, well it's my belief that they'll never be happy. With all the changes HSI has made to the ID Studbook and all the opportunities for crying that it presents to those wonderful custodians of the breed, I can see them being a headache we'll have to put up with for a long time to come.

Can someone pass me the Neurofen?!!!
 
ha ha yeah the ID people sure do keep the ISH on it's toes!! They're not really fans of change no offence to ID people out there!
I didn't know Baltimore wasn't ISH approved. Strange. Kind of shocking that you have to go to another studbook to register the little one though. It feels like they approve everything else sometimes...
 
OK here we go, not quite sure where this is going to go so bare with me and sorry if I go of on tangents. Shouldn't have left this so long as have so much to say and so many questions to ask and answer that I don't know where to begin.


All the way through this thread I have felt soooooo much passion running from these pages and the common denominator is that all who have been involved with this thread want the same final outcome for the ISH (traditional or modern), but as we all know there is more than one way to skin a cat (or a horse in this case), there will ALWAYS be differences of opinions on how to get to that point, how we (by we I mean YOU over in Irelandnot me here in Surrey) got to that point in the past and what to do to change it now.

I would like to first start by pointing out that I have not once during this thread put any of the mentioned horses down, this is because I really do feel that all of them have a place as ISH's or in breeding them, my personal choice would not be to mix the WB's with ID's or IDx's but I do understand why people do and that it does produce a exceptional sport horse, as gadetra has said essentially the ISH is a WB anyway, but it is a specific WB that is the produce of Ireland and you (the Irish) should be proud of that fact.

It has been stated that to get the jump and agility back into the ISH that you need to add European WB (which as I understand it was based on the traditional ISH bred by your fore-fathers), surely adding a few more crosses of good TB as most of the EWB's have you would get the same outcome?

This takes us onto the TB and where the good ones have all gone. Surely this is a prime example of what will happen to the ISH. It seems to me (but I will stand corrected) that the Irish TB has been selectively bred to produce predominantly small, weedy flat horses now and it is a struggle to find a good HIS type, big, upstanding TB stallion. This was a conscious decision at the time based on monetary gain and short-sightedness and now you have lost the substance and stamina that will be hard to put back. If the same happens to the ISH how many of you will be sitting there scratching your heads in 50 yrs time asking where did all those good ISH stallions go, as breeders you have to look further down the line than the next 15 years and what will be competing, there really is no quick fix in breeding!!

On to the ID. The ID as I see it should never have been pushed as a competition horse, it is a utility breed that can do many jobs well, but it was not originally bred for a sole purpose such as jumping, eventing etc. As a utility breed it should therefore be a good starting block from which to breed your competition horses when crossed with the TB (or EWB, ISH or whatever), but without those heavier more traditional types you will only end up like the Irish TB that so many of you have already stated are hard to come by now.

Don't sacrifice the traditional ID or ISH or discard it as a has-been, take the equine knowledge that has been passed down through generation after generation and use it to your advantage, don't buy into the latest trends just for a quick buck (or Euro), take your time and put your production skills into something that has always and will always be yours, think longer term not just long term and then maybe you will start to (albeit in a fare few years time) have something to be proud of again and that something will not be something that just anyone can breed or be off the back of some other nation it will be all yours....... the traditional ISH:)

I should become a motivational speaker shouldn't I ;)

One parting bit of knowledge for all you ID and traditional ISH enthusiasts

A successful person is one who can lay a firm foundation with the bricks that others throw at him or her.
 
Beautiful. Welcome back to the party Simsar!

I'm already asking where did all the good ISH stallions go!!! Never mind waiting for 50 years.
As for our thoroughbreds, well we have the best thoroughbred industry in the world and are no longer looked at as the poor country cousins, so something must have been done right. 'Twas Dr Vincent O'Brien that got the ball rolling on that one.
As for being proud of what we have, I'll be proud when we get back in to the Top Ten in the WBFSH rankings and our young stallions are once again elligible to go to the Zwolle Stallion Show.

I'm so glad to have you back Simsar, I missed you
 
You may well have the best TB industry in the world but as i said where are all the HIS types now, the ones that are so important to SPORTS HORSE breeding??? Time was when all the good SH TB's came from Ireland and the UK now horses like Watermill Swatch have to be sourced abroad, why did we not have the foresight to keep these types for our SH industries, if people looked further than the next foal then we might be in the postition that the European countries are now and then we might still be in the top ten WBFSH rankings surely????

It's nice to be back too;)
 
I feel the life support having to come off this thread, it's sitting back up again now!

Just one very quick post before I head for a Dominos pizza, the John Magnier's and co in Ireland are involved with thoroughbred breeing. The German Coolmore equivalent is Paul Schockemole. The Belgian equivalent is Leon Melchior. We have no millionaire backbone in the Sport Horse business here. People can try to name the few wealthy Sport's breeders in Ireland but they couldn't tie some of the European's shoelaces. It's an unfortunate fact. So basically, the Thoroughbred breeders from the past who bred the big, rangy, tough horses you're talking about had to survive. So they did what they did and we are where we are. Like I said before, the blood we need must come from abroad. Likely to be France. Selle Francais or Thoroughbred, it doesn't bother me. It wasn't about short or long sightedness. No one could afford to do anything other than sell!!!

I didn't use Watermill Swatch on my Classic Vision mare after. I used the newly approved Thoroughbred stallion Sirillio. A german thoroughbred owned by the same family who own Tamarillo. In fact, Sirillio has covered all the female Tamarillo clones! Hopefully I'm on to a winner.

1 quick question, where oh where oh where is Hilly? I miss the thinly veiled barbs that were thrown at me!!!
 
Nice stallion I looked at him on Bridgehouse's website before he was graded, glad I did as i wouldn't have looked at him twice from the pics on the HSI site. Now I might have asked this before but didn't Bridgehouse used to stand a grade A TB stallion, I am certain he stood there in 2008 at least, what happened to him???
 
To be honest, I really can't see the value of the new warmblood studbook, especially when the IHB appears to be increasing its flexibility.
 
Eothain said:
I feel the life support having to come off this thread, it's sitting back up again now!

1 quick question, where oh where oh where is Hilly? I miss the thinly veiled barbs that were thrown at me!!!
Click to expand...

Come on Hilly, Eothain wants sharp things thrown at him!!! :D
 
Bridge House Stud don't own their stallions. They just stand them at stud, though having said that they do own a large share of Dow Jones Courcel. The owners of said thoroughbred sire developed his own place a bit and now stands him there.

He hasn't got many jumpers. You'll see plenty of pretty boy show horses by him and plenty of eventers in the future but I doubt you'll see him with an international G.P winning son or daughter.

Sirillio is a beautiful horse. He has a lovely dainty head and big strong backside. The only thing I don't like about him is his big thick mane. Not really a problem though!

I'm a bit annoyed that I didn't use a horse they had down there called Vincenzo. He died of colic in the winter of 2008, three days before he was due to travel back to Belgium to compete in the World Cup circuit with a chap named Jos Lansink. Vincenzo was a full brother to McLain Ward's two time olympic gold medallist Sapphire. The Belgian's flew over here last year to register all his foals in the BWP studbook. They didn't want to lose that bloodline. So in a few years when the Vincenzo/Cruising stock are cleaning up around the world and the BWP shoot to #1 in the WBFSH rankings, at least we can say they should be Irish!!!

Have you seen the stallion Riverland Roi on the Bridge House website? I lurve that horse
 
I only ask about him as a friend used him in 2008 on an ID mare and they are REALLY happy with the colt they got from that cross, she is a real old nags-woman and she thinks alot of the colt even now as just a yearling, will be intersting to see how he turns out in the long run.

Will just go and take a look at Riverland Roi now and then come back, you have to remember that we don't hear about alot of these stallions over here untill they are being well used over there, especially when you have that many horses that a yearly holiday to Ireland is out of the question as you'd just buy more:eek:!!!!! and I don't know many WB bloodlines although I am learning fast :D
 
Riverland Roi seems a nice chap, got a grand jump on him and from what I can see from the pics is generally quite pleasing on the eye, but I don't like his back hoof-pastern axis, could just be a dodgy photo. Has he done anything more than what his results state???
 
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