Have I made a massive mistake..???

[Daytona]

I have been riding since 4 years old with various ponys moving on to horses, competed as a child at PC, then RC moving on to BSJA with my last horse up to 1.05 so would say my riding is average , had quite a few difficult horses but decided this time I wanted to buy what I would class as a quality horse for the amount of money I could afford.

So I bought the 4 year old Oldenburg
gelding by indoctro which was
broken in but very green in Sept 11.
Two weeks after getting him he
threw me off on a hack , spooked by
a bird and started bronking and I fell off he trampled my by mistake
resulting in a crush injury to my leg
which then went dead and I needed
operation to remove dead tissue and
skin grafts and I decided to give him the time off as I was not able to
ride and thought it would do no harm
as he young. Anyway just before
Xmas decided to bring him back to work getting the Pro Eventer at my yard to it, no problems she rode him gently for a week and he goes like a dream for her so I got on , 1st time fine, 2nd and 3rd he tried to buck me off as soon as I sat on him, got saddle checked and it was not fitting well so got one that did, the eventer rode him again and he went great for her so I got back on and had lesson with her and he went ok. Got on again yesterday and he bucked me off really hurting my back giving me a scar inthe fact I worried about getting injured and can't afford another 2 months off work.

I think my riding is just not good enough for such a green horse I wish I'd left it to the professionals and bought say a 6 year old that was established .

I decided to but him on full training livery with this eventer for two months for her to get him going, hacking out etc.

But I wonder if I have taken on to much, he is a talented horse and a lovely sweet natured thing but I feel I'm too old to be getting thrown of horses all the time.

This is the first youngster I have had, have I made a massive mistake..???

Ps after bucking me off the eventer got on him and yet again he went like a dream,

 

[Miss L Toe]

It is easy to lose you inner confidence, but I think you can get it back, the best thing is to start of with breathing exercises, unmounted, breath in 12345, out 1 2 2 4 5, for a few weeks and you will relax. Do this all the time, when you are driving or shopping, watching TV and thinking about your horse.
When you decide to ride him only do so on a soft surface, and wear a neck strap, until you are happy, ask your instructor to lunge and to ride first and then lead him by just walking by his side, do a labarynth of poles at the walk, then trot poles and so on so he does not have too much time to think. I would keep working with him under supervision while he is in training you will feel happier if you can be involved in his progress, you can tack up and groom etc.
If you can get another pony to hack out and do some jumping, this will help you to keep fit.
You can still do ground work, lunging and long reining, and this will build confidence in both parties, it is possible he got a big fright when you had a bad fall, and as always, they remember the bad as well as the good.
I have been riding for 50 years and lost my confidence with certain horses several times, but the desire to ride is too strong to give up! If you are shaky just tacking up, maybe resort to yoga or hypnosis.
In the long term you may need to ask your eventer to ride him him in competition it is probably too early to "give up"
When you are ready to bring him home, cut out hard feed [Fast Fibre will provide his minerals], and do slow work so he does not get fit, it does not matter if he starts to look a bit "unfit", he will survive, you really want something you have to push along a bit for a while, let him have plenty access to turnout.
Later on, if you have access to a steep hill or a ploughed field this will help to take out the "pep" and "bronc".
Keep him on a calmer like Steady up by Feedmark.

 

[xspiralx]

What does the professional rider say about your riding?

It sounds like there must be something you're unintentionally doing that is causing him to buck, so perhaps the professional could help you overcome whatever it is and work with him better.

Regardless, there's no shame in selling him. If the pro rider gets him going well and out competing you could probably make a profit (or at least not a loss) on selling him, and buy something that suits better. It's not necessarily his age, but some horses are just more suited to professionals.

 

[Miss L Toe]

I don't think she is making him bronc by her riding style , he is remembering her as a rider, one who is uptight, and is causing him to be tense. If she start off by doing the cool down after he has been ridden and the eventer walks with her, hand on rein if necessary, he will calm down, He probably can't buck if his head is not down, but she will need to let him walk on a loose rein to cool down, maybe try holding hands in one hand and resting on the mane just above the withers, fingers under the neck rein [stirrup leather, not too loose],
PS if you take off the hind shoes you may be "in less danger"!!! Take all shoes off and he may behave better out hacking as he will have better grip on tarmac and be a bit more "aware " on gravel.
I think you will need to find a top instructor, try an II rather than an AI.
This is an opportunity to improve your riding, and you can do it even if you decide to sell in the end. Wear a BP every day, and wear gloves, to ride like a pro you need to think like a pro!

 

[Booboos]

Keeping him with a professional you trust sounds like the best plan for the moment. In the spring you can get back on him and see how things go. If the partnership is not quite there yet he will always be more sellable after the professional training. If she is giving you lessons then that's ideal as she can advise you on what to do/not do. Is it possible that you are a bit off balance at certain moments and that is scaring him into bucking?

 

[Daytona]

Hi she is based at my yard so he did not have to move or have his routine changed and I will still go up everyday. In not scared of him but yes I think I might become though if he kept throwing me off, he is 17h and still growing so a long way to fall. I have always got regular lessons and was on him. My last horse was very strong and lent on my so it's as if I had become used to using her mouth for balance, she
was a much smaller moving horse as well and when ride this
boy his trot feels massive
I'm tall and weight 13 stone the eventer girl is small and 9 stone
so I think if I lose my balance he would really feel it.

My main fault is my hands rising up and down as I trot.
I adore this horse he truely is the sweetest animal

 

[emmab13]

I ride for a living, and even I come across the occasional one that is just too much horse for me. We have a 17.1hh 5 year old Lux Z x Cavalier pain in the bum who is quick, sharp and naughty.

I can't tell him off how he needs telling as I'm too scared of getting fired off! Emabarrasing but true. I know this is different, as yours isn't naughty, but sounds quick and athletic, so when he does start there's not a lot you can do.

I have turned him away to 'come down', he was prepared for the sales and I think its cooked his tiny brain. After that I will have to grow a pair and ride it.

However this is my LIVING. Growing a pair is pretty much my only option! You're doing the right thing by giving to this girl to ride for a bit, and hopefully he'll forget about being a nob and you'll be able to, like others have said, cool down after the girl has ridden and build up from there. It may be a long old process, and at some point you may throw your hands up and sell him, but I think its too soon for that yet.

 

[Daytona]

But I just wonder if I have the ability to bring on a young one, will after two or three months of this girl riding him then helping
me daily with lessons etc be
enough , it's just so disappointing
to see him go Lovely for her then not so good for me. I just wonder if some horses are not suitable from a amature type rider like me, I bought him as my mare limit was around the 1.05 limit and I
want to move up to NC then Fox,
but maybe I'm kidding myself :-(

Does not help I lying in my bed in
agony , sorry just feeling sorry for myself.

 

[Miss L Toe]

My main fault is my hands rising up and down as I trot.
I adore this horse he truely is the sweetest animal

That is a biggy if it means you do not have an independent seat, get some lessons on a school pony without stirrups, you told us you were used to competing, I think you may have had a keen sort, so kept your balance with his reins. If you are doing this with a young horse, he will react.

 

[be positive]

This is something that often happens when moving onto a more talented horse, its movement is so much bigger than you are used to that it is causing you to a] lose your balance at times, b] probably try to, sometimes without realising, restrict its natural movement, this in turn will have the affect on the horse of it rather coiling up and at times letting go, thus the bucking.

The plan of schooling with the pro is a good one, whether you then keep or sell is a choice to make later. While he is being worked, if you can, get lessons on a big moving schoolmaster that will enable you to get the feel and improve your balance this will make the transition onto your horse easier, lunge lessons would be perfect if available.

 

[Silent Knight]

That is a biggy if it means you do not have an independent seat, get some lessons on a school pony without stirrups, you told us you were used to competing, I think you may have had a keen sort, so kept your balance with his reins. If you are doing this with a young horse, he will react.

As I was reading this I thought the same thing too. My dad had a saying ' green on green mkes black on blue'.

Not to be negative, but It may well be the case that this horse is a project beyond your experiance. you need a serious talk with someone who knows you and the horse. Then make a decision. you have already had a serious injury from a spook, it would be a shame to lose your confidence totaly by being over horsed, however pretty he may be. I hope it all goes well for you.

 

[Daytona]

Yes I thought about this and have search the net no where can I get lesson on school master type horse (Aberdeen I am based) but I was even thinking of just going to local riding school for lunge lessons on a normal school horse
as hopefully even that will help
With balance. I do think I was
using my mares mouth to
balance on before as she always
had hold of me and I think this new boy is like no , get off..!!

I thought buying a bigger fancy horse would be easy and off I would go quite happy popping round the BS , how wrong was I.
I just hope I don't ruin what could be a talented horse, that's my biggest fear. Spoiling him ;-(

 

[Wagtail]

I have to ride horses for a living too and am not half as brave as I used to be. It is not that I am afraid as such, just that the prospect of getting hurt is unthinkable as I care for eight horses without staff and so it would be a real disaster for me if I sustained an injury that stopped me being able to do my work. In a way, it is similar for you as you cannot afford more time off work. Personally, I think that your horse is objecting to your weight. At only four, and green and probably unbalanced himself, he is probably resenting it. In a year or so when he has strengthened and become more balanced, then carrying you will be a breeze. So, unless you are prepared to have the eventer ride him for a considerable period of time (a year plus) until he has fully matured, then I would really consider selling him. I would get yourself a nice strong eight year old and start enjoying your competing again.

 

[be positive]

If there are no good schoolmasters around, it is something that is not easy to find, lunge lessons would help but get a really good instructor that knows what you are aiming for, pootling along on a horse with no movement will not help that much it will give you more confidence and improve balance but the step up to yours will still be huge, is there anything on your yard you could ride sometimes to help with the feel of a bigger moving horse?

 

[Daytona]

I think I thought I was a better rider than in fact I am...! ;-(

I will leave him in training with the eventer she going to get me back on him when she feels he more established inmean time I will go to local riding school for lunge lessons, if after all this he is too much horse I will sell him as I don't want to ruin such a lovely boy. I pray though it won't come to that, I will invest in weekly lessons for at least a year but I guess it depends if this fella will tolerate me on him until the lessons start to pay off.

 

[Daytona]

Hmmm not really any horse I can borrow at yard and my two friends who have big moving WB both horses are off for two months with injuries.

As for my weight it's something I am working on I'm 5,10 so dont
look fat but have gained weight
since stopping running , 2 stone
in a year which is not good but
now on a strict diet as getting married in May but I do also feel my core strength etchas been lost so I prob like a sack of tatties on the poor animal. So sorting my fitness is also something I am working on in this next two months the eventer is riding him.

Guess I will just need to see how this pans out but must say I am doubtful .

 

[be positive]

You have made the mistake of moving up in several steps rather than one or two, it happens frequently, you are not a bad rider just taken a step too far, bigger , younger, scopier , huge paces, are just too many new things in the mix one or two of these you probably would have managed with help. Hopefully it will work out but if you sell him it is not the end of the world you can still find your ideal horse maybe a year or two older or less talented that you can enjoy.

 

[charleysummer]

I bought my first pony (i'd had a couple of loan ponies to mess around on but nothing established! just bombing around having fun, before i knew the meaning of the word schooling lol) as a VERY green 5 year old, possibly younger, was a very dodgy sale. she had never seen a pole before, went round like a llama on speed that had lay funny on her neck in the night. I have posted a thread with pictures somewhere if you want to take a look for reasurrance!

She wouldn't bolt but would panic and trot sideways everywhere super speed, trying to get me off and she never bucked but if she knew how i'm sure she would have done. This went on for a while like this until I decided to fully educate myself on how to school- I didn't even pay for an expensive trainer, I read loads of schooling books published by proffesional dressage riders! I learnt to adopt a correct seat and balance her, never expected too much in one day- the main objective is to keep the horse happy and calm and never get in a battle. I actually spent a month walking on a smaller circle over a circle of poles she had to concentrate on getting over, then at the end walked her large once and finished, gradually building up my own confidence and her confidence in me so we could both relax. In my opinion you have overhorsed yourself, but so had I and to be honest it is the best thing i did as it taught me so much- I have a very good seat and it takes alot to get me off whereas before I was quite good at flying...

Good luck, just be safe! would like to see pictures too
Oh and I should probably add my mare is now very calm and works very correctly in a nice outline- took me a bit longer as she had a year off due to injury- but then this is another thing you could consider, not riding for a few weeks and just spending some quality time on the ground with your horse? really helped me to form a trust and bond, maybe lunge a bit.

ETA try and imitate what your trainer does in her riding style, I got someone out to ride mine once and videoed it, then got on her back and imitated her riding style- paying close attention to the feel on the bit and other small details. worked a treat !

 

[kirstyl]

In my personal opinion, I think you have been very brave and upfront admitting the fault really lies with your inexperience of young horses. Unfortunately it's not easy to 'imitate what your trainer does', particularly in the case of a big moving green WB who in all likelyhood is going to grow some more! Personally, I would allow this lady to continue riding him and sell him through her to an experienced home, and then spend some time getting yourself a more suitable mount that you can really enjoy and not feel worried and apprehensive every time you're going to ride. Best of luck, I really feel for you x

 

[Mince Pie]

Personally, I think that your horse is objecting to your weight. At only four, and green and probably unbalanced himself, he is probably resenting it. In a year or so when he has strengthened and become more balanced, then carrying you will be a breeze. So, unless you are prepared to have the eventer ride him for a considerable period of time (a year plus) until he has fully matured, then I would really consider selling him. I would get yourself a nice strong eight year old and start enjoying your competing again.

Wagtail strikes again! Surely a 17hh Hano can carry 13 stone!!!

OP, keep your horse with your eventer, get some lunge lessons at a RS, learn how to get an independent seat, ride your youngster under her supervision and in a few months you should be able to start progressing with the lessons on your own horse. I would be looking at at least 2 lessons a week if you can afford it at the RS - one lunge and one riding.
It will be a long year but in the end should be worth it

 

[ecrozier]

I think there has been some good advice in this thread.
I ended up with a similar story, very much a RC rider, jumped up to 90cm with my little 14.2 but never gone higher, and worked him to novice dressage from nothing, but then my Oh bought a rising 3 year old, kept him 6 months and lost interest so I took him on! We didn't quite realise what we had bought, he was meant to grow into a hack/hunter for OH but he's much better than that, my sj trainer reckons he's a 1m30 horse, and dressage trainer wants me to focus on BD.
It's taken a huge amount of work on my riding, and lots invested in lessons, but we are getting there. He's now successfully competing at the level my little horse is, but with scope to go way further.
I think as others have said if you are prepared to invest in lots of lessons and your yoUng horse being schooled that's great - don't let it be too long before you get back on him though as you don't want to get 'left behind' as he progresses. There is no shame in doing things slowly, better to profess steadily along the right path than whizz off along the wrong one!
Neck strap a good idea, and maybe as soon as you can get lessons with that eventer on your own horse or do they have one you could ride?
Equally, some people and horses just don't click and never will. Friend is sending her young mare away probably to be sold as they just haven't clicked, she has admitted she feels nervous getting on the mare, and this is after all supposed to be fun!

 

[Wagtail]

Wagtail strikes again! Surely a 17hh Hano can carry 13 stone!!!

Do you think a green unbalanced 4 year old is the same as a mature horse in its weight carrying ability?

And FTR I did not say he was UNABLE to carry the weight, I said he was probably RESENTING the weight. Big difference.

But if you want to go on thinking that all horses of a certain height irrespective of age or experience can happily carry the same amount of weight then go ahead.

 

[Daytona]

Yes I defo think I made a mistake buying a youngster like him , I just don't know how to ride him , in hindsight I really wish I'd got a older horse that was already jumping fox than thinking I could bring him up the height myself, my thinking was that I knew I would not try it alone but with the help of a instructor and weekly lessons I would get on ok - doh..!!

Well I have lernt my lesson and would never try to bring on a youngster again, I can see how it could go horribly wrong , I defo think a horse like him should be left to the Pros, I feel though I have caught it early enough with asking for help that hopefully I have not done any damage to him , I have rode him a few times and he gone well for me in a lesson but clearly he needs his education taugh by someone how knows what they doing. I going to give it to summer by then he will be hacking out alone, jumping and of been to some small shows so hopefully I will have a better understanding of the type of horse he going to be. His temperament is very laid back and nothing bothers him from the ground so I hoping as he gets more established he is not sharp to ride etc. This eventer girl is going to be honest with me and if she tells me he not for me I will take her advice , she knows what she is doing. So going to see what happens over next three months. In mean time try to improve on my balance. Just booked lunge lesson at local riding school

 

[Daytona]

Dont worry I can shift at least a stone off me in one month, I'm used to extreme diets , should get back down to 11 stone in 2-3 months , it's something I'm working on .

Yes eventer girl for one month will teach me everytime I ride him in the school, I won't be left on my own with him. Then that will be three months with her, but if it going right and I starting to gel with him I will keep paying her to help me and will also get het to still ride him weekly until summer time so he still getting good education. Then come summer time it will be make or break ...! I will decide with her input if he a horse I can manage. That's the plan anyway.

 

[Daytona]

This is him, I put this videos on before and it generated the whole draw rein debate so of you might remember.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQZ4rlekTzk&feature=youtube_gdata_player


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hI4pewuwplo&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

[BBH]

I think its very reassuring the horse goes well for the eventer lady as at least you know he's not a complete nutcase.

I think as he grows stronger and you more capable combined with support you will both be fine.

 

[Daytona]

Thanks bellsbaublesholly no he defo not a nut case a sweet natured boy who just clearly gets confused and upset when a sack of tatties gets plonked on his back :-(

He goes lovely for that girl, really forward and free movement not
all curled up and stuffy like that
sale video. She is a cracking
rider and do a super job with him,
I just wished I could ride like her :-( sniff sniff

 

[Wagtail]

Thanks bellsbaublesholly no he defo not a nut case a sweet natured boy who just clearly gets confused and upset when a sack of tatties gets plonked on his back :-(

He goes lovely for that girl, really forward and free movement not
all curled up and stuffy like that
sale video. She is a cracking
rider and do a super job with him,
I just wished I could ride like her :-( sniff sniff

I expect you are a lot better rider than you imagine and once you shift a few pounds you will feel even better. A few of us could stand to lose a few pounds * looks down at the Christmas spare tyre*

 

[rockysmum]

Before you discount the weight issues, and I am not saying he wont carry you, I'm sure he will. Can you make a guess at how heavy the eventer is.

A good rider usually rides "lighter" anyway, if she is also significantly smaller than you, it might be highlighting a problem.

Could a heavier rider plus your saddle not fitting very well have caused some pain issues which he is happier to tolerate with the eventer than you.

I know our wamblood mare is much happier with my 8 stone daughter than she is with heavier riders, and I am not aware of any physical problems with her.

And I'm not trying to make you feel guilty, I'm a heavier rider too.

 

[AshTay]

Before you discount the weight issues, and I am not saying he wont carry you, I'm sure he will. Can you make a guess at how heavy the eventer is.

A good rider usually rides "lighter" anyway, if she is also significantly smaller than you, it might be highlighting a problem.

Could a heavier rider plus your saddle not fitting very well have caused some pain issues which he is happier to tolerate with the eventer than you.

I know our wamblood mare is much happier with my 8 stone daughter than she is with heavier riders, and I am not aware of any physical problems with her.

And I'm not trying to make you feel guilty, I'm a heavier rider too.

I also noticed in the second vid that the rider keeps his weight out of the saddle in canter and in the few seconds (!) of walk at the end the rider is sat very defensively. Maybe he is very sensitive through his back and that's why he seems happier with a much lighter rider.