Have I made a massive mistake..???

imr

Well-Known Member
Joined
2 February 2009
Messages
931
Visit site
I just wanted to say that I think you have done the right thing at the moment. I feel for you. But, baby horses can be tricky and they certainly are not like grown up horses. Everyone falls off baby horses and they do things becasue they don't understand, they get nervous or they are naughty. If you look on the CR thread about stallion quirks you will see a few people saying indoctro babies are tricky !

You may well get to grips with it, or you may decide not to. Either way, what you have done right now is sensible, and in a couple of months you can try again and reassess how you are doing, with the help of the eventer. In the meantime it would be good to get on something which will give you confidence.

On the saddle etc, I am heavier than you and my 17h baby is just fine. But, saddle was made for her and flock settled, so got saddler out again to redo - mad ea huge difference - it needs to be flocked pretty firm and as it had settled it got too soft and so the balance changed and the saddle started to shift, making her a bit uncomfy and meaning she was carrying my weight further back, and hence was obviously a bit uncomfy. Saddler said it would not have been so obvious with someone lighter - so worth having the flock re checked too.
 

ecrozier

Well-Known Member
Joined
20 October 2006
Messages
6,174
Visit site
Ok, reading further posts from you I am going to slightly revise my original opinion! It sounds like he is SERIOUSLY sharp, unlike my lad who although he has big movement and a massive buck on occasion, we have never had to treat him quite that carefully. As a keen amateur I'm not sure I would have the time/inclination to deal with that kind of horse- but that's not to say you couldn't deal with any talented youngster, I don't know of many that are that sharp....
 

Daytona

Well-Known Member
Joined
11 August 2008
Messages
3,201
Visit site
Hello yes getting saddle checked again on 23rd Jan to see if it not right will buy a new one made for him, currently using someone else's saddle that fits him. I don't think he is sharp but can only compare him to my last horse who at times was dangerous but only because she got so frightened she would freak. I do agree there was no need for the bucking me off other day we had only walked half a circle, I will also get his back checked to be sure and his teeth where checked mid dec just before he was re backed. And all was ok with the teeth.
 

Squeak

Well-Known Member
Joined
6 April 2009
Messages
4,219
Visit site
As IMR just said Indoctro horses are normally professionals horses. They are usually very sweet on the ground but quirky to ride so I imagine that if he is good for the eventer then he is just quirky which is probably extentuated by greenness and he will probably always be like this. Alot of people have problems even with older Indoctro horses and they usually have a very extravagent jump as well, which is again not easy.

With regards to weight he is 17hh this should be no problem, especially as Indoctros are usually particularly strong through their back. However obviously each horse is an individual and he is young but I think you could be going on a wild goose chase with backs, saddles and physio's etc.

It sounds like you have just taken too many steps in one go: a youngster, a big moving horse and a quirky professionals ride. It is up to you what you want to do, you can keep the horse for a year or something whilst it is being schooled by the eventer but you would have a year of having to pay for riding school lessons and paying for someone to school your horse whilst probably being unable to compete or even ride it. Yes you might learn alot but you also might just never get on with him and only get hurt again and waste alot of time, money and heartache. Personally I would find it very difficult to give up BUT from an outside point of view keep it for a few months till the market gets better and then you can see if anything changes and then get something that you can enjoy now rather than hypothetically in the future.

P.s. he is gorgeous by the way!!
 

Daytona

Well-Known Member
Joined
11 August 2008
Messages
3,201
Visit site
Hello well here is a update 3 months on..! He was with event we girl for 2 month but then she had to go away to help a Infernational rider prepare for all the big events this year, she did not feel he was ready for me yet so I then put him to a dressage rider for past month. He was quite tense through his back when being mounted for a while
and although he did not buck he
did round his back up a bit. We
got teeth, saddle sorted. Physo
out twice. And now this is no
longer a problem you can jump
on him no problem. I have lost
1stone I have also spent a small
fortune on lessons on Advanced
dressage horse and some lunge
lessons and also got some
lessons on some friends horses.
The dressage rider got me back on my boy a couple of weeks ago , had a few lessons and do far do good, they also been hacking him out alone and he been perfect even cantering across some fields. I am going to hack him tomorrow and Sunday and they will accompany me on another horse then Sunday tea time I am taking him home. So far all is rosy . I will keep up with weekly lessons with dressage rider. The eventer even took him to his first show a 60cm unaffliated SJ and he was good as gold, popped round everything perfect. So looks like I'm keeping the big man after all yippeeeee...!!!
 

Mike007

Well-Known Member
Joined
28 May 2009
Messages
8,222
Visit site
You have made my day. I am so pleased to hear about someone who has sensibly worked through a dificult problem. Of course ,horses being horses , your lad will have further challenges to throw at you ,but you now understand how to deal with them. Well done!:)
 

Daytona

Well-Known Member
Joined
11 August 2008
Messages
3,201
Visit site
Thanks guys still early days but heading in right direction. Dressage lady does not want us to canter for two months as thinks he not strong enough and wants to build our confidence up. Lots of walk and trot and pole work mixed with plenty of hacking is what we to do. She said he is quite a sensitive horse and is not to be rushed, so I going to do exactly as told and take my time , we have years ahead to worry about jumping and competitions. So I pretty pleased , I know I'm not going to be some great rider after all it's only a hobby but I'm trying my best and hopefully me and the big man work out as he is such a gem, everyone who meets him loves him. Both the trainers who have rode him loved him , his nature is superb. :)
 

Daytona

Well-Known Member
Joined
11 August 2008
Messages
3,201
Visit site
Thanks guys, just went our first hack since the accident , have to admit I was nervous but he was a good boy and feeling even more positive now, guess I just need time to get to know him and rebuild the confidence I lost.
 

YasandCrystal

Well-Known Member
Joined
27 April 2009
Messages
5,588
Location
Essex
Visit site
Oh well done, what fab news. Very brave and dedicated of you to stick with his training and your training. I am extremely pleased for you :D:D:D
 

Pale Rider

Well-Known Member
Joined
15 June 2011
Messages
2,305
Location
Northern Spain
Visit site
I've read quite a few of the posts on here, but not all, so someone may be thinking along the same lines.

Firstly, a lot of these WB horses, which are bred so massive nowerdays, look big but are really quite immature, they seem to be backed and brought into work quite young for the size of them and I feel could do with a bit more time.

I was told by a Dutch friend the other day that the average age of a Dutch WB before they are finished (retired or PTS), is 6 yrs old. (His figures not mine, and he is in the buisness), Something is obviously wrong if so many horses are being finished at such a young age to affect the average in this way.

In essence, I think that continental horses are brought into work too soon and need time to mature.

As a rider, you need to be riding fit, weight not being an issue unless very heavy, provided you are fit.

Bringing on a green horse is not a job for a green rider, and a project like this would benefit from someone who has brought on a lot of this type of horse, and brought them on successfully
 
Last edited:

YasandCrystal

Well-Known Member
Joined
27 April 2009
Messages
5,588
Location
Essex
Visit site
I've read quite a few of the posts on here, but not all, so someone may be thinking along the same lines.

Firstly, a lot of these WB horses, which are bred so massive nowerdays, look big but are really quite immature, they seem to be backed and brought into work quite young for the size of them and I feel could do with a bit more time.

I was told by a Dutch friend the other day that the average age of a Dutch WB before they are finished (retired or PTS), is 6 yrs old. (His figures not mine, and he is in the buisness), Something is obviously wrong if so many horses are being finished at such a young age to affect the average in this way.

In essence, I think that continental horses are brought into work too soon and need time to mature.

As a rider, you need to be riding fit, weight not being an issue unless very heavy, provided you are fit.

Bringing on a green horse is not a job for a green rider, and a project like this would benefit from someone who has brought on a lot of this type of horse, and brought them on successfully.

I agree with this. I also believe it is the norm with WBs for riders to expect too much too soon. They don't mature until 7 or 8 years old so why back them at 3 and start competing at 4?!

I think the OP has made a great effort on her part to get the horse brought on by some pros and meanwhile improving her own riding ability. If she remains this dedicated she will imo get on and grow together with this horse. She sounds sensible as does the advice her instructor is giving her about taking it very slowly with this horse. She may have bought unwisely, but all credit to her to seek advice and act on it.
 

Bernster

Well-Known Member
Joined
14 August 2011
Messages
8,129
Location
London
Visit site
Just read through this thread again, looking for the update :)

Really useful stuff on here and am so pleased for OP that things are going well. You did the things I knew I should do, but decided not to, when I got a sharp youngster a while ago. And good on you for persevering - I reckon your riding will come on hugely with all this hard work. Would be lovely to hear how you get on.

I'm now about to get a second horse as a step up from my current bombproof allrounder, and am going to be much more sensible than I was with the youngster, and put all the good advice on this thread into action :)
 

Jojo_Ire

Member
Joined
28 June 2010
Messages
18
Visit site
Just reading through this thread and you are getting lots of advice. My opinion for what its worth is that having asked the question, you have already admitted to yourself that at present its not working for you.

I got great advice a while back from my trainer - I am an amateur rider, decent enough but with contact/hand issues, which creep in if I'm insecure or nervous and balance off my hands, but the advice is this... If you want a horse to enjoy ride a horse that makes you happy, and as an amateur it should be fun. If its not, its time to consider admitting the horse is just not for you.

That said, I've bought a youngster/green horse which is being schooled alongside me riding it a few times a week. I knew it was a project and for me its about my mare's temprament. She's more powerful than any horse I've ridden, but so far her temprament has been great. She'll throw the odd spook, and is green and tense, but ideally good natured. If she starts misbehaving then she is not the horse for me and I'll happily find her a home with someone more experienced. I know that both her and I need work, but I'm riding her and enjoying her, and she's a project, which I hope after a few more months I will be out competing again in affiliated dressage.

Ask yourself are you having fun, enjoying yourself, enjoying your riding? Despite your horse being lovely in character, you do need to enjoy riding him. Best of luck and if you do decide to sell, there's no shame in being honest and finding yourself the right partner.
 

Daytona

Well-Known Member
Joined
11 August 2008
Messages
3,201
Visit site
Sorry never seen your questions asking for a update again, well another 2 months on and we just starting to learn canter

http://youtu.be/y1CPPlotce8

have alook for yourself

so so please. love this boy to bits, he such a gentle dude.

We have even started some jumping last week, tiny x-poles but again just taking it slowly slowly with him

here is some trot work again

http://youtu.be/LQLq626en-A

these vids were from tonight

he just back in work 3 weeks after 4 week break as he had some chill time in the field after 3 months work with the two pro riders, just to let him reflect on his work lol :)

he has come back into work, more settled and feels stronger.

we getting on fab - so glad i stuck with it, still getting lots of lessons etc and will continue to do so for a least a year i think.

also totally hacking out now as happy as larry , even been out a fair few times alone and he was a total dude.
 
Last edited:

brighteyes

Pooh-Bah
Joined
13 August 2006
Messages
13,029
Location
Well north of Watford
Visit site
Do you think a green unbalanced 4 year old is the same as a mature horse in its weight carrying ability? :rolleyes:

And FTR I did not say he was UNABLE to carry the weight, I said he was probably RESENTING the weight. Big difference. :p

But if you want to go on thinking that all horses of a certain height irrespective of age or experience can happily carry the same amount of weight then go ahead.

I was just thinking that's 4st difference - maybe nothing like his max carrying capacity but he may very well be noticing this and may even have slight back issues that are exacerbated by the heavier rider?

Jesus everyone. It's just an observation!

Having seen the vids I can see the problem...
 
Last edited:

La Fiaba

Well-Known Member
Joined
9 November 2010
Messages
598
Location
Tuscany
hosteldog.blogspot.com
What a good horse you have there, so glad you are both getting on better now :)
If I was your instructor I would have you ride in a running martingale though, so your hands don't interfere as much with your horse's mouth. Just until you learn to move your body without moving your hands. Hope you have lots of fun with him :)
 

OFG

Well-Known Member
Joined
6 July 2011
Messages
541
Location
South West
Visit site
Ooh, he's lovely.

Glad that you are getting on better with him and are taking advice etc.


The only comment I would make (and please dont take it the wrong way, its just my observation on the short vid clip provided) is that you rock quite a bit in the canter work and tilt forwards. Now, this could be due to the way he moves and without riding him personally it is difficult to know. Perhaps work on sitting stiller and quieter as lots of movement could be unbalacing him when he is trying to work his own co-ordination / balance out.

Fab horse though :cool:
 

charlie76

Well-Known Member
Joined
27 March 2006
Messages
4,665
Visit site
I'm pleased that you have made progress with him. Imo and please don't be offended, it looks like you are struggling with his movement. You have your hands a bit too high for both his and your stage in training at the moment. It is causing you to loose your balance and being such a sensitive horse he reacts to your movements. Usually with resistance.
if he was mine I would have my stirrups shorter so in the canter I could take a lighter seat when he gets tense and have a lower hand to help with your balance.
 
Top