Have I made a massive mistake..???

[Daytona]

She is 9 stone, the saddle has been address and he now in one fitting him. That video he was not long broken , I thought he off his back due to that ..??? But I could be way off the mark.

I use a massage pad on him before he ridden just to help warm him back up. I don't know maybe I am too big for him, no way I could get down to 9 stone as near 6th I'd look anorexic . My last horse was only 16hh light built and carried my fine so I assumed a 17h fella would be ok, it never crossed my mind I could be too large for him. Oh dear.

 

[Daytona]

6ft not 6th dam iPhone

 

[AshTay]

But Wagtails point was that at his age and stage of training he's not as strong as he will be so your plan to keep the eventer schooling him whilst working on your own riding sounds very sensible. You're not too heavy for him.

I've got a 6 year old 15.3hh tb x sec d. I'm 9.5 stone. His previous owner was considerably heavier. He rode him and had no problems but shortly after I bought him the physio did identify back problems and then I encountered behavioural problems when I didn't keep up enough regular work with him and he dropped muscle and became so weak that the vet advised I don't ride him until he's muscled up more again because he's currently just not strong enough. So he's had the winter off and we've worked on other issues from the ground and come spring I'll be spending weeks trying to build him up.

 

[rockysmum]

You dont need to get down to 9St, 11 Stone would be fine for a horse this size. So maybe let your eventer ride him while you loose a bit. In the meantime definately take lessons to improve your seat and "lighten" the way you ride. I would also get his back checked again, even if you have done so before.

Give him a small break from you riding. When you get on again he will have a lighter, more balanced more confident rider. He should forget any past issues, especially if any pain is sorted out.

 

[BBH]

Personally I think its too simplistic to say you are too large.

A big 16'2 WB should be able to carry someone of 13st and 5'10".

Some heavy riders ride ' light' and some light riders ride ' heavy'.

Too me its more about riding him to suit his needs as opposed to he can't carry you.

 

[FestiveBoomBoom]

He is very beautiful! But there is a lot of horse there. Having been in a similar position myself a few yrs ago, I have to say I decided to sell as I had just lost too much confidence. My horse knew this full well and fed off my insecurities. I'm not saying you should definitely sell, only you can make that decision but if your gut feeling is telling you it's not right, it's probably not right.

 

[YasandCrystal]

She is 9 stone, the saddle has been address and he now in one fitting him. That video he was not long broken , I thought he off his back due to that ..??? But I could be way off the mark.

I use a massage pad on him before he ridden just to help warm him back up. I don't know maybe I am too big for him, no way I could get down to 9 stone as near 6th I'd look anorexic . My last horse was only 16hh light built and carried my fine so I assumed a 17h fella would be ok, it never crossed my mind I could be too large for him. Oh dear.

For goodness sake you are NOT too heavy for him. Just look at all the very fine WBs ridden by men who must weigh more than 13st in many cases. It sounds like the problem is a combination of you 'riding heavy' due to his big movement and your imbalance and not being used to this. If you bounce in the saddle at all he is probably reacting to that and the pro rider won't be doing that. As someone else said you are very likely tense and he can pick that up. He is looking for calm ridden instruction. Don't be hard on yourself; you are doing the right thing by getting help and hopefully you can reach a point to enjoy him.
btw he's lovely and athletic and I can see that his movement would be hard to sit for anyone not used to that

 

[Mike007]

Dear OP, I really respect the open and honest way you are approaching this problem. You must be feeling totaly gutted. The first thing to consider isthat partly due to your injury and partly due to simply not being a professional rider,you are not as fit as you need to be. Weight is a relatively minor issue. Your friend has the advantage of being both fit and expeienced in dealing with the foibles of a young horse. You are quite literaly a sitting target. This lad of yours is always one step ahead of you .It is not a question of bravery or nerve, he is just quicker than you. So.... what to do? Well ifyou decide to persevere,you need to let someone else ride him for a while,but you must try to ride as many other horses and as often as you can and you must start seriously working on your own fitness and ballance. There are a good few serious eventers on this forum and I am sure they would all agree . It may well be that you have set yourself a task with this horse that is beyond you and if you did decide to sell,I am sure that any serious horseman would respect that decision as well.

 

[YasandCrystal]

Dear OP, I really respect the open and honest way you are approaching this problem. You must be feeling totaly gutted. The first thing to consider isthat partly due to your injury and partly due to simply not being a professional rider,you are not as fit as you need to be. Weight is a relatively minor issue. Your friend has the advantage of being both fit and expeienced in dealing with the foibles of a young horse. You are quite literaly a sitting target. This lad of yours is always one step ahead of you .It is not a question of bravery or nerve, he is just quicker than you. So.... what to do? Well ifyou decide to persevere,you need to let someone else ride him for a while,but you must try to ride as many other horses and as often as you can and you must start seriously working on your own fitness and ballance. There are a good few serious eventers on this forum and I am sure they would all agree . It may well be that you have set yourself a task with this horse that is beyond you and if you did decide to sell,I am sure that any serious horseman would respect that decision as well.

Extremely wise words

 

[Tammytoo]

I can only offer a couple of suggestions that might help your riding.

Pilates - this is a very good way to increase your core strength and also help with your fitness.

Neckstrap - If you loop your little finger under the neckstrap whilst trotting it stops your hands going up and down whilst trotting and gets you used to the feel of steady hands.

Also lunging without stirrups and reins as has been suggested, once your core strength has been improved.

 

[Rhandir]

just a thought, you say that you are 6ft .... I'm assuming that you are taller than the rider who is helping you and that you have longer legs than she does. I wonder if the fact that your leg aids are possibly applied in a different place, added to which is the possibility that he may not be accustomed to feeling anything in that particular area. If he is a sensitive soul he could well be over reacting to an unfamilar leg aid.

 

[Daytona]

Yes going to work on fitness, used to run marathons until 1 year ago and it's all gone by the waist side, fitness dropped and waist expanded. Have already booked in for some lunge lessons. Thought I was a light rider as my last horse was wrote off as a nut job but I slowly brought her back , she was just a scared sensitive soul and my instructor said I was a light rider as I was big on her and was always worried. I think my issue is balance and pure lack of knowledge on how to ride a youngster. He just won't tolerate error. But it's fair enough I don't blame him.

 

[Daytona]

I'm 5,10 she would be about 5,4 maybe. He is lunged for a couple of mins with stirrups down before anyone gets on him.

 

[Mike007]

Dont ride with long stirrups, you cant get away from a bronk and once they tip you forward you are history(or posibly even geography).Of course this involves strong leg muscles so again its the fitness thing.

 

[Wagtail]

But Wagtails point was that at his age and stage of training he's not as strong as he will be so your plan to keep the eventer schooling him whilst working on your own riding sounds very sensible. You're not too heavy for him.

Yes, that's exactly what I was trying to say. In a year or so from now, I am sure he will be fine with 13 stone. Also Rocksmum makes a good point, that it could be highlighting a possible back problem. We have a big warmblood here who developed a bad back due to saddle. Now, with a saddle that fits he is still throwing in a resentful buck or two when asked for collection, even though he is 16.3 and his rider is eight and a half stone. He does it even more with me, and I'm ten stone. He has had regular physio and is slowly recovering, but he is still exhibiting some soreness. My point is, that sore backs can persist even after the cause has been removed. Your horse would probably benefit from a few weeks just being worked in the pessoa for two to three weeks followed by a month or so of being ridden only by the lighter rider.

 

[Bernster]

I have to confess I skipped a couple of pages of this thread but there is def some wise advice here! I had a very similar experience to you a couple of years ago, bought a quality youngster (for a lot of money) who had been at a professional yard. Had a mixed experience but got bronced/bucked off 3 times in the first month. Fortunately I didn't hurt myself but it really scared me.

Although I could have continued, with a lot of help and assistance, I decided it wasn't right for me as I knew it could take a long time and I'd need so much outside help that it would be too costly, time consuming and ultimately I lose my confidence easily and I find it very difficult to get it back again.

Whilst I realise I 'gave up', I also realised that this is an (expensive) hobby for me and I want to enjoy it. I sent him off to a sales livery and he was sold very quickly to a more experienced home. I know I made the right decision.

This may not be the case for you as you may feel there is enough there that you want to persevere. And good on you if you do. But if you feel in your gut that you're not well matched, please don't feel bad about acknowledging that so that both you and he can find a better match.

 

[Daytona]

So much conflicting advice, some say stick with it some say cut your losses.

It's the same advice I'm getting, some at yard say sell him. A local SJ guy I know who teaches me says wise up, keep him I can ride him it's just a phase ,

Arrrggggg just don't know what the right thing to do for me and the horse. I defo going to stick the 3 months training out with the eventer girl and just see how I get on then, I will easy sell him as he a nice beast and with her of been schooling him I can't see any reason why he would not sell. But I really don't want to as his nature is 1 in a million , he such a big cool dude to be around. But I will put his needs before my own.

 

[be positive]

Having seen the video, he was probably a lot greener than you would expect of a 4 rising 5 year old, the way he was ridden will not be helping you, as I am sure is now the case he is finding his strength and balance and going in a more correct open frame.
If he is as you say a lovely boy on the ground, stick with it for now, go with the plan and you will be able to make a more informed choice in a few months. If you go with the selling option there is no need to rush anyway as he will sell more easily, and for more money, with some experience and a record under his belt.
In the meantime the lessons etc will all help to prepare you for whichever route you take.
Good luck and enjoy being an owner for a while.

 

[Daytona]

Thanks be positive , I'm just mad at myself. We know why we think he bucked yesterday, when I or the pro girl mounts him he is held then walked forward being held then asked to halt and walk forward again using voice then repeated slowly for a circle slowly applying leg till he happy with leg then ground helper let's go, well I though oh he will be ok and never done the walk halt thing and as soon as my leg touched him he bronked, maybe a over reaction from him maybe I was too hard regardless it was a stupid mistake from me to assume he would be ok and is basically down to my lack of knowledge on riding youngsters , I need to do exactly as told instead of assuming he will be ok.

 

[Meowy Catkin]

Thanks be positive , I'm just mad at myself. We know why we think he bucked yesterday, when I or the pro girl mounts him he is held then walked forward being held then asked to halt and walk forward again using voice then repeated slowly for a circle slowly applying leg till he happy with leg then ground helper let's go, well I though oh he will be ok and never done the walk halt thing and as soon as my leg touched him he bronked, maybe a over reaction from him maybe I was too hard regardless it was a stupid mistake from me to assume he would be ok and is basically down to my lack of knowledge on riding youngsters , I need to do exactly as told instead of assuming he will be ok.

This has swung it for me.

Your number one priority is to not have another bad accident. I would get the event rider to bring him on to sell and then get a showjumping schoolmaster/mistress that you will be able to compete at the level you want.

If he does end up being right for you after the schooling then keep him.

 

[Bernster]

I think it's to be expected that you'll get conflicting advice. Everyone can take a different view and there isn't necessarily one right or wrong answer. But you've had some good suggestions, tips, support etc., and it really is up to you at the end of the day, taking into account views but basing your decision on what you feel is right as no-one knows the full story but you, and everyone has a different personality.

But hopefully you've had some useful stuff on here. For me, I think this forum works where I work out what the right answer by reading the different views and seeing which makes me feel more comfortable (it's a bit like I know the right answer really, and trawling through the posts helps to crystallise it). Best of luck whatever you decide.

 

[emmab13]

OP, he sounds SHARP! If you've already lunged him, then got on and as you've walked off he's bronced you off, he does sound as if he's either a bit full of his own importance or very very sensitive.

He may well grow out of it with regular consistant work, and be exactly the horse you wanted when you bought him.
Equally he may not.

You are doing the right thing, and 3 months in a young horse's career can change a lot, but I think after 3 months of work on both you and him it would be time to make a decision either way.

 

[Flame_]

Two weeks after getting him he
threw me off on a hack , spooked by
a bird and started bronking and I fell off
he tried to buck me off as soon as I sat on him
Got on again yesterday and he bucked me off really hurting my back giving me a scar inthe fact I worried about getting injured and can't afford another 2 months off work.

Too right, I'd have binned him off by now. Pros can make all sorts of b'stards look easy. Life's too short and its too easy to end up with serious permanent injuries to be repeatedly thrown from horses. Get rid and go and buy a nicer one that doesn't try to dump you on the floor.

 

[Meowy Catkin]

OP, he sounds SHARP! If you've already lunged him, then got on and as you've walked off he's bronced you off, he does sound as if he's either a bit full of his own importance or very very sensitive.

He may well grow out of it with regular consistant work, and be exactly the horse you wanted when you bought him.
Equally he may not.

You are doing the right thing, and 3 months in a young horse's career can change a lot, but I think after 3 months of work on both you and him it would be time to make a decision either way.

Too right, I'd have binned him off by now. Pros can make all sorts of b'stards look easy. Life's too short and its too easy to end up with serious permanent injuries to be repeatedly thrown from horses. Get rid and go and buy a nicer one that doesn't try to dump you on the floor.

I have to agree with both of these comments.

I also want to state that although I havn't had a huge amount to do with warmbloods (I've mostly delt with arabs, PBA's and TB's) this behaviour is not typical for a young, recently backed horse.

 

[FestiveBoomBoom]

But I really don't want to as his nature is 1 in a million , he such a big cool dude to be around. But I will put his needs before my own.

Just quickly, I worked at a racing yard for 6 months last yr as a physio. The vast majority of horses I treated were an absolute delight to handle on the ground and most were young colts and fillies. However, under saddle it was a completely different matter and the sweetest on the ground could turn into the sharpest most vile creatures - broncing, bucking, rearing, spinning, bolting, you name it, I saw it! This wasn't a pain reaction either as most were just routine checks, they were just very hot to ride. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't think you should let the fact that he is sweet on the ground cloud your judgement. Afterall he was bought to be a riding horse and he has tried some pretty dirty tricks so far. As for broncing the minute your leg touched his side, that would be a deal breaker for me.

 

[be positive]

Thanks be positive , I'm just mad at myself. We know why we think he bucked yesterday, when I or the pro girl mounts him he is held then walked forward being held then asked to halt and walk forward again using voice then repeated slowly for a circle slowly applying leg till he happy with leg then ground helper let's go, well I though oh he will be ok and never done the walk halt thing and as soon as my leg touched him he bronked, maybe a over reaction from him maybe I was too hard regardless it was a stupid mistake from me to assume he would be ok and is basically down to my lack of knowledge on riding youngsters , I need to do exactly as told instead of assuming he will be ok.

This is a rather extreme reaction, I may do this with a youngster for a few days but not after all this time, he needs to be desensitised to some extent, the rider must now start to cut back on this routine if it is just the horse being precious and not a response to pain.

 

[Kenzo]

Sounds like he needs a bit more time under saddle with one good rider, he's young, fresh in the game, quirky, sensitive and sussing things out, sometimes a horse needs to find himself or herself with one rider before they will chill out and progress.

Obviously you may need lessons to teach you how to ride and ask a young horse, but there will be times when he'll be testing you out, or feeling confused or just down right silly. It's unfortunate that you have had bad falls and injured yourself but you have to be prepaired to get chucked off when you have a youngster, sounds harsh (don't mean it to ) but ***** happens.

The one thing you can do is try to prevent it happening as much, so don't get too disheartned, have some regular lessons, let him be schooled on for a while and grow up a bit, everything will fall into place eventually, just give it some time.

Good Luck.

 

[Daytona]

Thanks everyone your input is appreciated I will see what happens over next three months and keep you posted if it worked out or the boy got sold on.

 

[planete]

I used to work with two and three year old thoroughbred race horses. Very, very sharp, but your horse's reactions when first mounted were not the norm in horses who had been ridden for some time and we only routinely took the kind of precautions you say you have to use with cold backed horses. I would strongly suspect a back problem of some kind. Your trainer is better able to keep him balanced than you are when riding but she still feels she has to go through this routine to get on him so it is not just your weight that seems to worry him. And I do not think it is sensitivity to the leg as you say he is lunged with the stirrups down.

 

[.Redmerl]

I know it's not nice having something your not enjoying, and they still cost the same as an enjoyable one. There is nothing wrong with deciding you want to sell or that you want to stick with it. I had one that was hard work with minamial reward, heartbreaking horse. Swopped for some thing sweet but far less flashy. I'm happy to say I inherited something that was too much