Help asking questions about a potential viewing

[Birker2020]

Dealer is kindly ringing me to discuss a horse who I very much like the look of on the video I was sent. I have written down some questions but wondered if you had anything that you would ask prior to viewing. I know that he’s done this that and the other, how long his owner had had him for, why he is being sold and how much for so don't need to ask these questions. I'm a bit out of practice, Bails was my 6th horse but all the others were bought in fairly quick succession, whereas had Bailey 17 years and out of practice!

My questions so far are:

What is his name?

When were the videos taken?

Does he have any physical issues/previous sick notes?

Presumably his tack is included. Anything else included?

Is he open to vet and is there someone that could ride him at the vetting?

Does he have any vices?

In terms of jumping, is he honest or does he need to be confidently ridden?

TIA

 

[ycbm]

Do you own the horse or are you acting as an agent for the owner?

If they own the horse the sale of goods act applies and you have 30 days to return it. If they don't, it doesn't, and you would be better off asking the questions of the owner, not the agent, because it's the owner you would have to sue if either they or the agent lies about the horse.

I'm puzzled why you would presume that his tack is included in the sale.
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[IrishMilo]

If it's a dealer I doubt tack is included.

- How long as dealer had him and why did owner sell to them
- Does he turn out alone
- What's he like to hack?
- What's his current routine and how many times a week are they riding him

If dealer is riding the arse off him and you only plan to ride twice a week you might get home a very different horse to the one you thought you were buying...

 

[[153312]]

Ask if it's vet history is available - ideally before asking if it's had any previous health issues.

 

[ycbm]

Ask if it's vet history is available - ideally before asking if it's had any previous health issues.

The current trick is to register at one vet for jabs and another for everything else, so both questions need to be asked.
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[sportsmansB]

I think if you are talking to a dealer, you don't want to lead them to the answer that you want to hear, as they will gravitate towards that if they are not the most honest
I wouldn't presume tack is included at all unless it specifically says so

I'd ask-
Full registered name and any competition history? Then you can look and see if there are any gaps in the record which flag potential lameness issues
What kind of a rider is he suitable for? What is his usual way of going? (forward, kick along, honest to a fence, etc) before you say what you are like / what you want
Any known medical issues, open to vet history from previous owner?
Any vices
The vetting questions
Does he hack alone and in company
Is he happy to leave other horses (you don't want a nappy one)
Does he need ridden every day

Just try not to lead them to the answers you are expecting as thats the one you'll get if they are a bit smart.

 

[Carrottom]

Does he load and travel well.
How much is his turn out currently. What is he being fed.

 

[ycbm]

Has he already been put through any vetting by a potential buyer?

An agent with a very good reputation who has been recommended on this forum recently explained to me a few weeks back that they will not take a deposit from a buyer but will accept every high enough offer made and put the horse through repeat vettings in the hope that it passes another time with a vet with lower standards or less experience.
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[Birker2020]

If it's a dealer I doubt tack is included.

- How long as dealer had him and why did owner sell to them
- Does he turn out alone
- What's he like to hack?
- What's his current routine and how many times a week are they riding him

If dealer is riding the arse off him and you only plan to ride twice a week you might get home a very different horse to the one you thought you were buying...

Damn it knew I needed to ask about hacking as its such an integral part of what I do. Thanks so much!

 

[Birker2020]

Has he already been put through any vetting by a potential buyer?

An agent with a very good reputation who has been recommended on this forum recently explained to me a few weeks back that they will not take a deposit from a buyer but will accept every high enough offer made and put the horse through repeat vettings in the hope that it passes another time with a vet with lower standards or less experience.
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I did wonder if this is something that happens.

I was told many years after I'd purchased my previous horse that if you are a seller you suggest to the potential buyer to use that vet. Whether they take you up on it or not is another matter, but apparently said vet takes brides from seller to pass the horse.

However in my case the horse had a second vetting by a completely different vet and practice, in order to increase the insurance value some 3 years later and also passed.

 

[Birker2020]

issues
What kind of a rider is he suitable for? What is his usual way of going? (forward, kick along, honest to a fence, etc) before you say what you are like / what you want


Just try not to lead them to the answers you are expecting as thats the one you'll get if they are a bit smart.

Yes on the video he looks a bit kick along but then I need to lower my expectations in terms of what I can cope with now I am older and don't bounce so well so this might not neccessarily be a bad thing.

Yep agree re last sentence. Thanks.

 

[Xmasha]

The current trick is to register at one vet for jabs and another for everything else, so both questions need to be asked.
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Thats a really good point. Its just happened to someone. Horse failed a vetting, another friend found out that it had been vetted a month earlier, and it also failed that. iTs juts so wrong that some sellers play roulette with vettings

 

[Birker2020]

thanks everyone, going home now but will review and write down before she calls.

I honestly think this might be the one subject to viewing/riding/vetting. How many times have I said this now???

 

[Birker2020]

I'm puzzled why you would presume that his tack is included in the sale.
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Have PM'd you as don't really want to say too much

 

[Muddy unicorn]

Can you get confirmation of anything the dealer says in writing - in the form of a WhatsApp message will do - to avoid 'he said, she said' issues later if there are any problems.

When we were looking a few months back, I specifically asked the dealer if the horse we were interested in had had a recent vetting and she said no - only to be contacted by another forum member who'd had the same horse vetted three days earlier.

 

[Red-1]

Not about the viewing, but after, I leave a deposit not subject to 'passing' the vet, as this is subjective and they don't pass or fail anyway. I leave a deposit, returnable if the horse does not have a satisfactory vetting. So, for instance, I would not buy with a sarcoid, yet the horse could still be said to be suitable to event, so I would have to lose the deposit under the first wording, but not under the second.

I chat with the vendor, but then confirm all details in writing on wattsapp, so there are no 'misunderstandings' .

I ask about vet records, competition history, see recent video, nature of the horse etc. You do need to know if the dealer is the seller, it is more likely to be on behalf of someone, which has fewer comebacks. That isn't a deal breaker, I sold my mare like this, but I also expected to field questions from the buyer direct as the 'deal' is essentially between buyer and seller, not a third party dealer.

I also ask about travelling, for example, I only have a 3.5 tonne box which I wouldn't sell, so I needed to know that the horse will go in it and travel. When I bought Rigsby, it was on the understanding that the deposit and purchase price were both refundable if he wouldn't load and travel home. With my new one, I just made sure he had already travelled in the same type successfully. With previous horses, I would have happily changed the type of transport, but I am now very attached to my little box!

 

[sport horse]

Thats a really good point. Its just happened to someone. Horse failed a vetting, another friend found out that it had been vetted a month earlier, and it also failed that. iTs juts so wrong that some sellers play roulette with vettings

Because some vets are not that competant. Many years ago we had a horse fail a vet on flexion tests, for local level working hunter. We had the horse's feet x rayed and all OK. We subsequently sold it to Germany as a potential 3 day event horse with it passing very intensive vetting with a multitude of x rays at a top national equine vet practise. Several years later it was sold on to the German Olympic Federation and long listed for Olympics!

One point to note is that nowadays horses do not pass or fail a vetting. The vet will make comments on their findings and it is up to purchasers to decide whether to go with those findings or to walk away. Very often the more professional and higher level competition riders will take more of a risk if they think they can manage any issues. The more amateur riders tend to be more risk averse.

 

[PeterNatt]

Is he bombproof/spookproof when hacked out alone in heavy traffic? Also ask to see him being rudden out in heavy traffic.
Will he happily go first or last when being ridden in a group?
Will he live in a field by himsel?

 

[Laurac13]

I would also ask to see his passport that will give you a bit more info check his injections are up to date and if it’s the same vet stamp every year good chance the horse has been in same home and not passed around !
I was caught out by this once when I bought from a dealer and by not checking ! The horses jabs were out of date and all previous owners had passed him on after a year he had vices which were not disclosed too and he was downright dangerous to ride and handle

 

[Muddy unicorn]

I would also ask to see his passport that will give you a bit more info check his injections are up to date and if it’s the same vet stamp every year good chance the horse has been in same home and not passed around !

definitely this! A friend asked to see the passport at a viewing and a previous (poor) vetting certificate fell out which the seller had 'forgotten' about ...

 

[eggs]

All the above plus:

Does the horse have any vices?

Has the horse been seen to head shake? (got caught out on this one once when buying late autumn but found it out in the following spring)

Does the horse have sweetitch?

If there are any health/behavioural issues that would be a deal breaker for you ask about them specifically rather than as a general catch all question

Is the horse good to catch / clip / farrier / load ?

 

[The Irish Draft 2022]

I am probably to late

Why is he for sale ?

What is the lowest you will to take for him?

What has he done in the past ?

What is he like to hack out ?

Is he okay to be turned out with other horses?

any vinces or bad habits?

can he be ridden in open spaces ?

 

[Uliy]

Also, always put the dealers name into Google and Facebook! It’s amazing what you can find!

 

[Melody Grey]

Has the horse been presented for a vetting recently and if so, what was the outcome?

 

[Melody Grey]

Does the owner insure the horse for veterinary cover and are there any policy exclusions?

 

[Birker2020]

Thank you so much for all your comments, I spoke to the dealer and its full steam ahead to a viewing at the weekend, I've been assured he's not been advertised yet and won't be till after I've seen him so its not an issue. The dealer is so nice, she was lovely on the phone and we went off on a bit of a tangent.

I am so excited, but he seems just what I am looking for. I also rang my vets for a provisional date for a vetting and they can (as things stand at the moment) do one for me early in the week. Partner thinks I'm jumping the gun but I really think this opportunity is fate. His name is fate too.

Arrgh I can't explain anymore at the moment because I don't want to give too much a away or tempt fate but I feel dizzy with excitement, along with crippling anxiety where my legs go all weak and I can't breathe properly a bit teary because I feel like I am betraying Bailey in some weird way.

Anyway will keep you updated. Thanks again, I managed to ask the relevant questions so know he's suitable for me to view and I will ask the rest when I get there. Positive vibes appreciated.

 

[Birker2020]

Can you get confirmation of anything the dealer says in writing - in the form of a WhatsApp message will do - to avoid 'he said, she said' issues later if there are any problems.

When we were looking a few months back, I specifically asked the dealer if the horse we were interested in had had a recent vetting and she said no - only to be contacted by another forum member who'd had the same horse vetted three days earlier.

Yes I hear what you are saying. Usually I randomly film the horse being brushed and tacked up whilst going through everything in detail, does the horse rear, does the horse bolt, does the horse buck, is the horse good to catch, etc, etc, etc. Then I have it on film.

 

[tda]

Has he already been put through any vetting by a potential buyer?

An agent with a very good reputation who has been recommended on this forum recently explained to me a few weeks back that they will not take a deposit from a buyer but will accept every high enough offer made and put the horse through repeat vettings in the hope that it passes another time with a vet with lower standards or less experience.
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?

 

[paddy555]

The dealer is so nice, she was lovely on the phone and we went off on a bit of a tangent.

the big question is not if she is nice and goes off at a tangent. Of course she is and does and wants you to buy a horse from her. To me the question is how nice and helpful she is going to be if you get him home and something turns out to be not as described or you need to return him. Does she have others who you could exchange with, is she likely to return your money and does she even own the horse.
I have become very cynical from some of the stories on here of people excited to see and buy their horse only to find that is when the problems really start.

 

[splashgirl45]

lots and lots of good vibes and fingers crossed he is the one!!!