Help Humphrey

Looing at the video again it also seems that the horse is frequently bandaged and wearing a cool or magnetic (?) boot on his offside hind, while jumping (!) which does suggest that he may have issues with his soundness.
 
Palindrome: the horse is not emaciated. He was lean and unmuscled but if I saw him in a field i wouldn't be concerned. Was he ok to do such a ride? No, prob not. The bay mare not mentioned by the pro-Humphrey's was emaciated. Truely emaciated. I'm not one for sensationalising but she was 0.5/5 body condition.
 
I'm a bit confused, does the 15yo have the horse on loan or does she actually own it? And how long has she had the horse for?

In the video the older clips (last summer I'm assuming) he actually looks to be a nice weight but its the more recent clips where he looks very underweight which to me would suggest a bad winter with novice owners?? Agreed though he shouldn't of been on the ride in that poor condition but I have seen a lot worse.

What I can't get my head around though is that if what help Humphrey and pony girl say is true and the horse has been passed fit by 3 vets then why has it not been returned??
 
The girl rides him for his owner as far as I know, not 100% sure, but if you go on FB there is a page for him.
 
Kallibear said:
Palindrome: the horse is not emaciated. He was lean and unmuscled but if I saw him in a field i wouldn't be concerned. Was he ok to do such a ride? No, prob not. The bay mare not mentioned by the pro-Humphrey's was emaciated. Truely emaciated. I'm not one for sensationalising but she was 0.5/5 body condition.
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In the facts I agree Kallibear (may be not in wording, as I would still say he is very emaciated). If I saw him in a field, properly rugged according to temperature and thinking owners are doing all they can to put weight on him and have taken vet advice upon his lack of condition, then of course what more can you do? But he was clearly being worked hard.

I don't know at all about the rest of the story, I am just going from what we can see of him at the meet on the video the OP posted.
 
Palindrome said:
This horse is seriously emaciated, he should not be in any hard work. No matter how often the owner kisses him or how much they love him, they were obviously not taking good care of him. Really, they should be ashamed of themselves instead of posting stupid montage videos.

And those who confuse a fit racehorse or fit eventer with an emaciated horse? Come on, the only common point between both is seeing ribs, a fit horse has a good muscle coverage, this one is just very poor.
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This. I wouldn't say emaciated, but I would say very thin.

Long, hard winters are no excuse. We kept a TB considerably older than this one, who hunted all winter, looking in very good condition. It was hard work- the horse was a poor doer, and didn't enjoy his food- but it was doable without breaking the bank. Allowing a horse of any type to get to this stage of 'leanness' is not excusable IMO. If we could manage as novice horse owners with no guidance (he was our first horse, having only owned chubby ponies) then surely others can too?
 
Lolo I totally agree and if my horse was as poor as this i would take all the advise offered to me but you can only advise some people so much. Some people are just too ignorant to listen, give up on advise too easily or simply refuse to believe they just can't afford to care for the horses needs and carry on regardless.
 
Palindrome said:
This horse is seriously emaciated, he should not be in any hard work. No matter how often the owner kisses him or how much they love him, they were obviously not taking good care of him. Really, they should be ashamed of themselves instead of posting stupid montage videos.

And those who confuse a fit racehorse or fit eventer with an emaciated horse? Come on, the only common point between both is seeing ribs, a fit horse has a good muscle coverage, this one is just very poor.
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The above post by Palindrome is spot on. Just to add, the old excuse that it has been a long hard winter is a poor excuse. Horses should be fed according to the weather conditions and maintain a healthy weight no matter what the conditions throw at us. The proof of a good owner is mirrored in the condition of their horse, and in poor Humphreys case clearly he has not been receiving enough care.
 
justabob said:
The above post by Palindrome is spot on. Just to add, the old excuse that it has been a long hard winter is a poor excuse. Horses should be fed according to the weather conditions and maintain a healthy weight no matter what the conditions throw at us. The proof of a good owner is mirrored in the condition of their horse, and in poor Humphreys case clearly he has not been receiving enough care.
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Again, spot on.

http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/522926_3532436156696_736114745_n.jpg
This is a 25/26yo TB ex-racer, coming out of a winter of hunting and indoor SJ, taken at this time of year on the first sunny day. They've just been let out onto the summer grazing- he'd spent all winter in a mudbath or knee deep in snow. I challenge anyone to say that he looks anything other than in fantastic condition, regardless of his age.
 
Yes the horse looks poor, but wouldn't it be in their best interests to educate and advise the owner rather than take him? There must be something else going on that we aren't being told, authorities don't just come and take animals for no reason.
 
Norfolk Pie said:
I've avoided commenting so far, but would just like to raise the following points, as unfortunately those associated with this horse are not making themselves look very knowledgable IMO.

I totally understand that the young girl who owns /rides him must be heartbroken. However, I agree with others on here who say that from the recent videos that horse is not in a fit condition to take part in a ride. It has been a long winter, and as an older TB he may well have struggled. But part of our responsibility as owners is to ensure our horses are fit enough for the work asked of them.

I actually don't particularly advocate the use of weave grills. However, a horse that doesn't weave won't be distressed by it being fitted, and in one video clip it is implied the horse doesn't weave. There are too many unknowns to judge, or worry, about that factor - eg is it fitted to the stable as standard? Is the horse spending more time stabled because it is on box rest due to unsoundness, and therefore a little fractious?(I didn't think he looked distressed on the SPCA yard, but the last thing you want with an unsound horse is it continually transferring weight from one leg to the other on a stable floor)


It is not possible to tell if a horse is lame by watching it on a short video clip on a circle in walk - hopping lame (eg abscess etc) yes, but not in many cases where a horse might be notably unlevel trotting up. The horse was not taken on a ride in walk, he has been on a fast ride and thefore the assessment would need to more appropriate. My old horse is arthritic and will not cope with trot work(and therefore is not asked to) but would certainly walk a circle looking sound :) when multiple limb lameness is involved, it becomes even more difficult to tell, and many horses actually look "sound" because they are equally "lame' in all their legs. However, I'm afrid in my opinion there are instances in the videos (inc jumping ones) where the horse does look lame.

With regard to the other concern, I don't assume the muck trailer is perminantly parked in front of the stable? Just a convenient peace of video footage for an understandably upset family.

I do sympathise with the situation, as it must be horrible for all involved - I also do not, on the whole, have a high opinion on welfare charities, so I am not saying that what they've done must be right - but from watching the clips, I have to say if it was my horse out on loan, I would be picking it up immediately - I'm sure there are plenty worse off all over the country, but that doesn't actually make the type, quantity or quality of work this horse is being asked to perform, correct.
I hope it is all resolved to everyone's best interests (most importantly the horse) but perhaps an honest look at whether Humphrey should really being asked to undertake this level of work is required? Sometimes it is possible to not see something so close, which is obvious to outsiders?
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excellent post


Many yards have anti weaving grilles fitted to the stable doors as standard. Its not something I particularly like but it causes the horse no harm or distress. The owner should not be trying to use this as ammunition against the sspca.
 
justabob said:
Lovely Lolo, as they should look.
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Thank you. He was hard work, but worth it!

CobsGalore said:
Yes the horse looks poor, but wouldn't it be in their best interests to educate and advise the owner rather than take him? There must be something else going on that we aren't being told, authorities don't just come and take animals for no reason.
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But then, educate how? How far does this go? You look at that horse, and if you think he's in correct condition then you need to go right back to basics. It's very sad he's been removed, and if it's all as said on here with no other reasoning then sure, it's unfair he's been removed. But equally, if you don't know that he is poor then you shouldn't own a horse. Especially not an older one.
 
Been reading through this thread and agree and disagree with points.
I wouldn't say that this horse is seriously emaciated, look on google or even horse welfare cases and you will see an emaciated horse, they can hardly stand! So for this horse to still be galloping around the field and jumping etc maybe he doesn't get hard feeds maybe he's just on grass all year round through winters and all, Each to their own but he's obviously on the thin side I agree and looks like he needs a few good feeds.
There must be more to what meets the eye I would think, if something doesn't ring true its probably coz it doesn't. But that girl looks like she loves that horse, has she had horses before? I'm not excusing it but maybe she doesn't know better and the owner of this horse can't afford to keep him properly.
 
I have had a look online at the actual legislation in Scotland on animal welfare. I found this ,REMOVING ANIMALS IN DANGER

An animal health and welfare inspector from a local authority, a member of the State Veterinary Service, an authorised inspector from the Scottish SPCA or a police officer can remove a protected animal if a vet certifies that the animal is suffering or is in danger of suffering. However, where urgent action is necessary the animal can be removed without waiting for a vet. Dependent offspring can also be removed. For example, if a cat with a litter of young kittens is suffering or in danger of suffering, then the mother cat and her kittens could be removed by an inspector or police officer.
CARE NOTICES

Rather than taking people to court for failing to ensure the welfare of an animal, inspectors may issue care notices to the person responsible for the animal. These notices can be used if the inspector believes that the person responsible for an animal is failing in his or her duty of care to secure the welfare of the animal. A care notice will give the person responsible for the animal time to correct the situation. Unless there is a valid excuse, it is an offence to fail to comply with a care notice. A care notice would not normally be used in cases where a person was suspected of causing an animal unnecessary suffering. This is from the Scottish Executive booklet caring for animals http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2006/10/13113744/1 .So, as far as I can see the SSPCA were very heavy handed here , and I have seen them do far less for a horse that was far poorer . I'm not even sure if that owner was served a care notice, just told to stable and feed more.
 
Natch said:
public staements were made about both Amersham and the recent rescue from Caephilly shortly after the removal of equines but while there were live investigations going on.
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Those were large scale welfare cases which were high profile and where a large number of animals were involved. This case is only really just coming into the public eye and really, it's a small scale case.

I don't really know what to think... there must have been some valid reason why the two horses were taken, the sspca could not just seize the animals with no reason. I do agree however that they should have given the valid paperwork at the time.
That leads onto why were both the horses taken? To me, it suggests that there may have been an issue with the stabling or the land which had not been rectified after a warning?
Humphrey does look in pretty poor condition and is most probably due to the poor winter, however, in that condition he should not have been working at the level he was.

I am only speculating here...

There is a more sinister theory which is buzzing around in my head, but I don't want to get the stick for it, so in my head it shall stay.
 
Ok here goes....there have been a few false accusations on here, no horses from that yard were hacked there or back, please get your facts correct before making theses statements. I am not the owner due to legal reasons he can not comment but everyone that witnessed this seizure can...no documention was produced that night or to this day! Owner was interviewed under caution but wasn't charged for anything and still hasn't...vet reports have been produced to say this horse was not emciated what so ever so choose what you believe with that. He was seized due to lameness which a spiteful person who the owner knows of and is a pathetic excuse for man reported him to be lame before the ride started just because he holds a grudge with the owner for leaving his yard 3 years ago, many witnesses and videos say otherwise and I'm sure the marshals would have noticed and asked the horse to be pulled out of the ride? You are all more than welcome to your opinions and if you believe hes emciated so be it but qualified vets say otherwise....yes he doesn't look great when being seized, he's just done 5 hour common ride been loaded which took 40mins due to another lorry almost hitting him then to get home and then to be put through the whole process again with a severe heart murmur?? The murmur has now been deemed minor so was only elevated due to the stress from almost being hit by a lorry....people are saying there must be more to this story...there isn't this is why everyone is so outraged and gone public with it all
 
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amymay said:
He looks awful.



In that case why did the owner allow the horse to be removed? I certainly wouldn't have.
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You can't stop your horse being removed Amymay , if you end up in this situation the only thing you could do is get your own vet to the scene ASAP if your own vet would give a contrary view to the SSPA view you might have persuaded the police that the horse should not be taken .
The horse does not look great it's condition is awful he is however not in fine fettle either.
I don't see a police officer in the video in England if the police are not there you could simply refuse and get your horse home pronto.
I have seen far worse dealt with with advise and follow up visits.
 
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He doesn't look great BUT having been to view numerous ex racers just being shed from various racing yards he doesn't look any worse than those I've seen from some very well respected trainers. Whilst I'm not condoning his weight I think removing the animal is an extreme reaction and a bit odd it does all come across as a bit dodgy somehow? I've seen far far worse being left by animal charities
 
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