Help Humphrey

Kelly1982 said:
Why has he not been returned then if no charges have been made?
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Good question we are still awaiting an answer for that to...

No care order notice was ever given previously to this day. No warnings.

Police were only there as they didnt like us filming it so police arrived and allowed us to as it wasn't against the law. Inspector told police this case was severe enough for a seizure. Vet report since he was seized says otherwise
 
Bit different when you are in that situation and don't know your rights till after...owner requested his own vet for 2nd opinion this was refused another right that was abused...
 
HelpHumphrey said:
Bit different when you are in that situation and don't know your rights till after...owner requested his own vet for 2nd opinion this was refused another right that was abused...
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Of course owner did not know what to do .
But if the police are there he would have had to comply he ought to have run his own vet stalled and got the vet there pronto they could not have prevented that and said to the police my own vet is coming please wait please give me your name and number so I can take this up later but it's easy to say from here.
But what have they done now have they got a solicitor to write to the SSPA demanding return of the horse on the basis of contrasting vets opinions.
 
Owner did not know he had a right for 2nd opinion till the next day...there is a lot we wished we had known that night as he would have never been taken...we want the public to know that this can happen to anyone and has been going on for a long time...
 
amymay said:
Interestingly they wouldn't be able to. As no paperwork had been produced, there would be no grounds for arrest.

It really doesn't get much simpler than that.
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The police can arrest you when they want it's is that simple they would simply say your behaviour was likely to cause a breach of the peace .
I have no idea in Scotland what the law says in paper work terms has to be given to to the keeper of a horse being removed and I suspect neither do you .
The inspector would simply lead your horse off you would attempt to stop them the police would arrest you .
 
I'm another who thinks there is probably more to this than we are being told. In my opinion he doesn't look sound in the videos and definitely looks uncomfortable jumping - rushing with his head in the air.

In all honesty he doesn't look like a rescus case to me weightwise - I've seen worse at riding schools. He could do with looking better if he's about to go on a long ride - but again I've seen worse.

I'd be really suprised if there wasn't something we've not been told about all of this. I'm also a bit suprised that there is a video montage all made up and ready to go.....but then I'm probably over thinking this as I'm not one for doing things like that - I know a lot of teenage girls are.

I just wonder whether either the rider or the owner or the yard owner had already had some dealings with the SSPCA and had ignored them.....? The other parties may not even have been aware?
 
Goldenstar said:
The police can arrest you when they want it's is that simple they would simply say your behaviour was likely to cause a breach of the peace .
I have no idea in Scotland what the law says in paper work terms has to be given to to the keeper of a horse being removed and I suspect neither do you .
The inspector would simply lead your horse off you would attempt to stop them the police would arrest you .
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Well no one in their right mind would allow someone else to take possession of their horse without any paperwork being produced.

And as I said - mine would not leave the property, police in attendance or not. The SSPCA have to prove their grounds for removal and the lack of paperwork means they are unable to supply that proof. The police would be obliged to prevent the removal of any animal without the correct paperwork being in place. Otherwise they are implicit in the theft of property.
 
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amymay said:
Well no one in their right mind would allow someone else to take possession of their horse without any paperwork being produced.

And as I said - mine would not leave the property, police in attendance or not.
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It would and so would you .
My experiance ( in England) allows me to know this is what would happen , you would be in a police car and your horse would be in the RSPCA transport .
 
The police were there to keep the peace if we had kicked off we would have been arrested the police did say that...you don't think when you are in that position why they don't have documentation...the way the owner was treated that night was disgusting they refused his civil rights and the horses! All he wanted was a rest!
 
For the last time SPCA inspectors have powers of seizure if an animal is deemed to be suffering or likely to suffer. This horse was removed legally.

If the owner has been interviewed under caution this would tell me you should expect maybe a summons any time soon. You don't get 'charged'. The reason the horse will not be returned is that if this is going to be presented as a possible prosecution to the fiscal office ( the fact the owner has been cautioned and interviewed tell me it will) is that both the horses are now evidence and have been seized as evidence. Animals under care as evidence are looked after properly, it would be highly unlikely they would be 'in distress'.
The owner or rider, which ever has been interviewed will have to hope that the fiscal office choose not to take the prosecution. If everything you are saying is true abd you can provide evidence to back that up you will get Humphrey back.of it was me I would concentrate my efforts in that.
 
As I said I'm not the owner...the owners concentrations are fully on that, we just want to advise the public this can happen to anyone and what there rights are..a petition will be going out for the government to investigate the sspca activities especially when they abuse someone's rights so we want awareness for that...
 
How have they abused the owners rights? How are you advising anything?
I find the ignorance on the FB page astounding, why don't you point out on there that the SPCA didn't need a warrant?
 
MillyMoomie said:
How have they abused the owners rights? How are you advising anything?
I find the ignorance on the FB page astounding, why don't you point out on there that the SPCA didn't need a warrant?
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If its decided that there is not a case to answer the owner will I imagine be entitled to attempt to recover the costs he has run up fighting for his horse back whether or not he will he wil be awarded them I dont know , I suppose it willbe down to how savvy his solicitor is in these types of cases .
 
You clearly haven't read everything on facebook and many people have a different opinion to you as they know more about this as they live local. If you read it an independent vet has since been in since he was seized and said he isn't severe enough for a seizure to have taken place. The inspector was overzealous that night...he had a right for another vet to come in for 2nd opinion on that night! This was refused! How has this not abused his right?
 
HelpHumphrey said:
You clearly haven't read everything on facebook and many people have a different opinion to you as they know more about this as they live local. If you read it an independent vet has since been in since he was seized and said he isn't severe enough for a seizure to have taken place. The inspector was overzealous that night...he had a right for another vet to come in for 2nd opinion on that night! This was refused! How has this not abused his right?
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The FB is a little hard to follow, to be fair. And of course people will always have differing views (as evidenced on this thread).

I've been reading about a couple of cases this morning where horses died because the SSPCA didn't act full stop. So there has to be some comfort to us animal lovers that in this case they have taken steps to remove an animal they deemed to be at risk (seemingly supported by the independent vet (not being severe enough for seizure can still mean an animal is at risk)).

It's also interesting that a couple of locals have also posted on here seemingly in agreement with the seizure as they know a little more of the situation than the majority of us.

So, for me - whilst I understand your distress - I'm glad that the SSPCA have taken action on a case(s) they deemed necessary. I very much hope that the resulting investigation ends up with the best scenario for the horse(s), (whatever that might be).

All to often we slate the welfare organisations for doing sweet FA. This time, they may just have got it right.
 
Does not matter the least what an independent vet has said except that the owner can use the vet as an expert witness. Still does not mean that the horses were not removed legally, all I have been able to see on FB is a misrepresentation of facts.
 
Plus HelpHumphrey it appears that the many of the negative comments are removed (as is your right) on the FB page, so we are not sure exactly HOW many 'locals' may have a different opinion.
I agree with AmyMay, what ever is best for the horse.
 
But aren't there some locals who seem to know about the situation and were against the seizure?

It would be really foolish of me to comment much more as I honestly can't get my head round this case. I do know some people who've had horses taken away and haven't kicked up any sort of fuss at all, so I don't know if that says something about the people trying to get him back?
There's clearly some sort of 'history' here and I'm not sure we'll ever know the full story.
 
MillyMoomie said:
You are thinking of the charity commission.
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I am yet to read the rest of the thread but i cannot stress enough, this is NOT true!! I am very close with the girl and her family and i know that all they want is their horse back. The SSPCA are still to come up with a reasonable, backed-up excuse as to why the horse was seized, as vets giving Humphrey the all clear cannot back up their original reasons for seizure. To say something like that in a situation like this is just disrespectful. I certainly wouldn't like to read someone saying anything like that if my horse had been taken without reason.
 
Sorry i havent read the whole post (i will be)

But i think people have missed the fact that at the end of the day this horse is a TB and we have had an AWFUL winter (which is on going and no doubt been worse in scotland) so he isn't going to look absolutly great! but from what i saw he looked like an older TB enjoying his life (in the videos)

I feel awful for the girl in question who's horse has been taken away as i would be absolutely heart broken!! But the missing of paper work is what has got me?? i thought they had to give you a letter first stateing you aggree to making changes to help the horse? Hmmmm.. i think the SSPCA have questions to answer about the paper work...
 
LittleBecky said:
But i think people have missed the fact that at the end of the day this horse is a TB and we have had an AWFUL winter (which is on going and no doubt been worse in scotland) so he isn't going to look absolutly great! but from what i saw he looked like an older TB enjoying his life (in the videos)
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Providing the horse has been fed and managed in accordance with what the weather is doing then there is absolutely no reason at all why this horse shouldn't look in tip top condition.

Being a TB is not an excuse for looking poor.
 
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