Help needed with insurance following accident

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claireannejames

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Hi, my daughter is 16, was exercising a horse for a friend who is abroad for 3 months (friend is 21). She was riding this horse out on a hack (with permission) at the weekend, was thrown, horse then ran off crossed a road was hit by van. It was taken to horse hospital, miraculously seems OK after scans but obvs has run up £thousands in vet bills. Friends mum is now asking my daughter for a written statement of what happened for van driver insurance (van was write-off) and her vet bill insurance. My daughter is in the middle of GCSEs and I don't want her stressing about this. She started exams last week and has 3 or 4 more weeks of them to get through. Does she need to provide a statement? Surely if she's under 16 it's not legally binding anyway? And she wasn't riding when horse was hit as she'd fallen? Surely if horse's owner decided to allow another under 18 rider to ride off yard then that's their lookout? Don't wish to cause trouble over it, horse is lovely and thank god it seems ok, 21 year old owner is lovely, but the mum is dealing things whilst she's abroad.
 
Shouldn't take more than 10 mins for daughter to just write down what happened. This could well be required for both insurances, and could get really messy if your daughter won't provide this.

I guess when you say "her vet bill insurance" you mean the horses owner, and not that they are asking your daughter for a copy of her own insurance?

If it is for the owners insurance, and the vans insurance, I can't see what the issue is in writing down what happened. If she was asking your daughter to claim her own insurance, I can see how it could become a bit of a situation.

The easiest way to make this as smooth as possible for your daughter, is take the brief period of time it will take to write what happened, then let the insurers deal with it.
 
I can't quite understand why you're making a drama out of writing a statement: You've written most of it anyway, get your daughter go over it and sort out the fine details and sign it and it's all done. She was in charge of a horse that has caused multiple thousands of pounds worth of damage to itself and to a third party, surely the least she can do is enable them to deal with their insurance companies in a timely manner. Just be very thankful that your daughter wasn't hurt and unable to do her GCSEs'
 
Why would writing down what happened cause your daughter stress? She will be more stressed if she doesn't do it now, while it's fresh in her mind, and ends up being chased for it or getting dragged into wrangling with insurance companies at a later date. As it was an RTA I'd imagine at some point the Police will want to take a statement from her anyway surely?
 
Seems fair enough to me to want a statement of what happened, particularly if the insurance companies are asking for it. If you don't want daughter to get stressed about it due to exams, could you write something out yourself as presumably she has told you what happened? I presume they just want a simple statement of events up to the point she fell off since she can't be expected to know what happened afterwards.
 
I don't know the exact purpose as she's been contacting my daughter directly about it, on the day she was actually in an exam, and not me. This is the problem really, not the statement, of course I'll help my daughter to write that if it's needed, just wanted to know if in the circumstances it is needed. If so it will be done, but I don't want her hassling my daughter for it at the moment, she should be talking to the adult? I've now texted her and asked her to contact me directly about it and not my daughter, and I'll ensure she gets all the help she needs.
 
wasn't attempting to make a drama, just asking if insurers need a statement from an under 18 year old who wasn't riding at the time the accident happened, because she'd fallen off some distance back... the fall was pure accident, and noone's fault - horses were startled by another loose horse whose rider had fallen off previously and was running towards them. But yes I suppose they would want to know why it was loose. Advice on insurance needed not on anything else! So - it is needed? Then we will do it of course. Will her insurers pay out if the owner wasn't riding? We won't be sued or anything for costs will we?
 
chestnut cob I spoke to police at the scene, they said as it wasn't a crime scene they weren't interested from a police point of view, and wouldn't even be filing paperwork! They gave me an incident number though because I wanted to be sure someone had the van drivers details and they said they had them logged against the incident number.
 
Also, should I look into third party rider insurance for myself and my daughter, would it have helped in this case? Needless to say it hadn't occurred to me!!!!!!!!!!! but quite often my daughter is looking after other people's horses and riding them out when they go on holiday or whatever, would hate for their insurers to cause them any issue if (perish the thought) something similar were to ever happen to us again.....
 
I'd perhaps call round and speak to the other girls mum, texts are so easily misinterpreted! For a 10 min cup of coffee you could put your and your daughters mind at rest as to what is going on and who wants what and why. Ask the mum to deal with you not your daughter, then take 10 mins to write down what happened and get your daughter to sign it.


It will be more fuss and hassle not to do it - even if it isn't strictly needed by anyone and the other lady is just covering her back by getting as much down on paper while it's still fresh just incase in 3 months time the insurance people suddenly want a description that will be hazy by then.

IMHO it sounds like you are worried the owner/ owners mother might be looking to make a claim against your daughter - even if that is the case the 10 min cup of coffee will get the facts on the table and you can find out a way to move on without worrying. If you/ your daughter is a BHS member no harm in letting them know what's gone on and if insurance companies start sniffing around you can direct them to yours and all the legal insurancy people can fight it out amongst themselves.
 
I'd be inclined to look into rider insurance of some kind either way, if she's riding horses for other people then you might want the peace of mind that should she have an accident, she'd be covered for public liability and personal accident.

As for the statement, I would have been surprised if you hadn't been asked for one - after all they can't ask the horse what happened ;)

Agree that she shouldn't be contacting your daughter at stressful times, but I would guess it hasn't been a walk in the park for the other parties involved either. Hope you get a speedy resolution.
 
It is always advisable to have 3rd party / rider insurance - however in this case it shouldn't make a difference provided the owner of the horse was adequately insured (most insurance companies will cover other riders on the horse provided riding with permission).

A statement of what happened will definitely be needed for both parties insurance companies. Get your daughter to write it now while fresh in her mind & be very thankful no one was hurt!
 
As someone else mentioned, it was a road traffic accident so chances are police will be involved if they are not already. Yes she had fallen off before the horse and van collided, but the horse was technically in her care at the time out on the hack (with the owners permission) so to make life easier for everyone involved a statement would be a very wise thing to do. That way it helps the owner with their insurance claim, it will help the van driver with their claim and it will help the police.

However you raised the point 'will the insurers pay if the owner wasnt riding' - in my experience no they wont. The owner is responsible for informing the insurance company if there are other people riding the horse, you can get additional riders added to the policy (like you would with car insurance adding a driver). If there is no money exchanging hands in return for riding (i.e. if your daughter wasnt paying or being paid to ride) then there wouldnt normally be any issues in getting her added to the policy.

So it depends if the owner told the insurers that your daughter was riding or not, and then check all of the small print in their insurance certificate - that will decide if they'll pay out or not. The van driver couldnt sue you, as its the owners responsibility to have appropriate cover as it was their horse that caused the damage. And I dont think the owner would have a leg to stand on trying to sue you for their horse's veterinary costs, its their own fault if they didnt have the right insurance in place before they allowed another rider to ride out on the roads.

But always as a rule something worth having is riders insurance if you are riding other people's horses frequently - there are plenty of companies that do this for not a lot per month, and it gives you all sorts of cover including personal injury on a horse that isnt your own, plus public liability insurance. So if your daughter rides other people's horses often I'd get that set up for her. Wont cost you much and gives you peace of mind.
 
Insurance companies will want statements from everyone involved and any witnesses. They will need one from your daughter, as she was in charge of the horse when the incident occurred. Some companies provide a form to fill in.

All she needs to do, is write down what happened and when, sign it and send it off. You might hear back, you might not, depending on what the two (I'm guessing both parties are insured) insurance companies decide on.
 
I have every sympathy with minimising distractions for your daughter during the exam season. I suggest that you draft out the statements yourself, based on what your daughter has told you, and ask her to check them over early in the upcoming Bank Holiday weekend. Then they can be signed and sent off.
 
claireannejames said:
Also, should I look into third party rider insurance for myself and my daughter, would it have helped in this case? Needless to say it hadn't occurred to me!!!!!!!!!!! but quite often my daughter is looking after other people's horses and riding them out when they go on holiday or whatever, would hate for their insurers to cause them any issue if (perish the thought) something similar were to ever happen to us again.....
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She should be covered by the owners insurance since she had permission, but obviously depends on the details of their insurance. If this is something she is doing regularly I would get at least 3rd party liability cover for your daughter just for your own piece of mind. One good way to do this is through the BHS gold membership, it is usually good value and as a bonus the money is going to a good cause and you get the magazines etc.
 
Thanks all for the suggestions and help. Eeeek that the insurer won't pay out if my daughter wasn't a named rider - oh my gosh the vet bill will be horrific, the poor poor owner. Horse has already had body scan and 4 days inpatient stay. I very much doubt she would have added her to her policy. Also, sometimes my daughter lets other people ride our loan horse off the yard. That will have to stop!!!! Very good point. Plus I will check our loaner has named us both on HER insurance as riders. Why do we always have to find all this stuff out the hard way eh.
 
claireannejames said:
Also, should I look into third party rider insurance for myself and my daughter, would it have helped in this case? Needless to say it hadn't occurred to me!!!!!!!!!!! but quite often my daughter is looking after other people's horses and riding them out when they go on holiday or whatever, would hate for their insurers to cause them any issue if (perish the thought) something similar were to ever happen to us again.....
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I don't want to sound harsh, but you probably should have looked into it before now. BHS gold membership will provide it fairly reasonably. Having said that you might find your house insurance will cover liability claims - it's worth looking into.

You seem to think that because they're asking your daughter for a statement they're implying she was at fault. I certainly don't see it that way (and from other replies I don't think anyone else is). They're simply trying to establish what happened. I understand you're anxious about it and yes, horse's owner (or mother in this instance) could come to you, but maybe she doesn't have your details. I don't think being defensive about it is the way to achieve minimum stress for you daughter. Give them your number, and ask them to contact you, as daughter is in the middle of exams so shouldn't be distracted. But get her to write that statement asap. It might even help your daughter to deal with what must have been a traumatic situation. That could well be the end of it as far as your involvement goes.

Something similar happened to me when I was just 17. A van failed to give us enough room overtaking us and splashed my horse drving through a puddle. He spooked and hit the van causing £700 of damage to the van (20 years ago so probably a lot more today). He, thankfully, just singed some of his luxuriant winter coat on his rump. He was very fit at the time and had tensed his muscles with the spook so just bounced off. Mum helped me, but I sorted it out. I know she's your baby but she's not really a child now. She could be driving in a few months and she'll have to deal with things then. There's only so much you can do to look after her. I certainly wouldn't write it yourself. She has to do that, she's the only one with a first hand account. Hope it all works out for all involved.
 
Rider insurance is a good idea if your daughter is going to ride others' horses regularly.

I rang my insurance to tell them when I had a sharer (who wasn't named on the policy) and they said they would be covered. So hopefully that will be the same for the horse owner. Perhaps you can explain your daughter is doing exams and will get the statement to them at the weekend so they can sort out their claim.

Glad everyone was ok :)
 
Annagain - The owner's mother has my number and has done all along. She may not realise she's in the middle of exams, in which case hopefully she'll be alot more understanding. I'll call her later and find out what we can do to help. My daughter is stressing every time she thinks about it, she's already gone through it several times and also with the mother a couple of times. So yes the statement will not really help as it will just be re-living it for the 5th or 6th time. But yes we'll do the statement together tonight, better to get it out the way quickly and hope it all goes away :-( She's a very mature girl but she's in shock too and she IS still a young teenager not an adult. She can't drive without an adult instructor in the car for another 2 years so not really accurate that she'd have to deal with insurance issues as an adult in a few months anyway.

So sorry about your accident, must have been even more terrifying as you were on the poor horse. I can't imagine. Glad you were OK. In our case, there was no fault on the van driver, he wasn't going fast and he didn't stand a chance as the horses flew out into the road from the bridleway, poor guy.
 
claireannejames said:
Annagain - The owner's mother has my number and has done all along. She may not realise she's in the middle of exams, in which case hopefully she'll be alot more understanding. I'll call her later and find out what we can do to help. My daughter is stressing every time she thinks about it, she's already gone through it several times and also with the mother a couple of times. So yes the statement will not really help as it will just be re-living it for the 5th or 6th time. But yes we'll do the statement together tonight, better to get it out the way quickly and hope it all goes away :-( She's a very mature girl but she's in shock too and she IS still a young teenager not an adult. She can't drive without an adult instructor in the car for another 2 years so not really accurate that she'd have to deal with insurance issues as an adult in a few months anyway.

So sorry about your accident, must have been even more terrifying as you were on the poor horse. I can't imagine. Glad you were OK. In our case, there was no fault on the van driver, he wasn't going fast and he didn't stand a chance as the horses flew out into the road from the bridleway, poor guy.
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Sorry I just read mine back and it sounded harsher than I meant it to. If I'd said it in real life itwould have been accompanied with a hug! It was over so quickly I didn't have time to be frightened really. I was a mess an hour or two later and then picked myself up and sorted things out. The van driver was horrible about it, insisted it was all my fault and also didn't want to go through insurance so was putting pressure on us to pay to repair the van. When we insisted on insurance we discovered he wasn't supposed to be driving it on a Sunday as he was only supposed to use it for work. Not sure what happened to him on that front but once we'd done the statement and sent it off we didn't hear anything until we had a letter from our insurance (pony club membership) saying it was all settled and insurance companies had decided he was liable as had failed to give us enough room. This is why I said it could well be the last you hear of it and could be the start of you putting it behind you.
 
claireannejames said:
horses were startled by another loose horse whose rider had fallen off previously and was running towards them.
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Do you know whose the other loose horse was? It seems it was that one that started the whole chain of events, maybe the insurance company should know that.
 
Personally I think asking a 16 year old to write their own statement is a step too far. As an ex Police Officer I would write people's statements for them, using questions and answers to elicit the relevant information.

Sadly I was also the victim of an 80 year old drink driver who inserted his car up by horse's Jacksie, and therefore had to write a statement for that. From my own experience you have to be very careful what you write down not to be later found liable for something! Fortunately for me I had the knowledge and experience to get it all down correctly.

I would say though, that it WAS the start of being able to put it all behind me. Once it was in writing I could let go of it in my immediate recall memory.

In retrospect it is a pity that the Police did not "take" the accident as then they would have done the statement.

With regards to your daughter I would consider paying someone to take the statement with her. There are adverts for equine solicitors in the back of H&H, and it *may* be worth having an appointment, getting the statement done by a professional, so all points are covered so your daughter is in no way liable. Once the statement is done it is sorted.

If you want any more support feel free to PM me.
 
I would listen to Red-1 if I were you.

If the owners insurance is not valid with your daughter riding then they will be having to pay for the damage to the vehicle as well as the vet bill and might have no alternative but to claim against your daughter. If your daughter doesn't have public liability insurance then it could be an expensive business.
 
claireannejames said:
wasn't attempting to make a drama, just asking if insurers need a statement from an under 18 year old who wasn't riding at the time the accident happened, because she'd fallen off some distance back... the fall was pure accident, and noone's fault - horses were startled by another loose horse whose rider had fallen off previously and was running towards them. But yes I suppose they would want to know why it was loose. Advice on insurance needed not on anything else! So - it is needed? Then we will do it of course. Will her insurers pay out if the owner wasn't riding? We won't be sued or anything for costs will we?
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If the horse owners insurance doesn't pay out for some reason, maybe if they only cover the owner not other riders, then yes the van drivers insurance or the driver themself could decide to come after you for compensation. Whether they would be successful or not I can't say. What I would think is if the insurance companies want a statement off your daughter they would contact her themselves. Since when do insurance companies ask a third party (horse owners mother) to gather written statements for them? I would be careful if I was you, but I am a naturally suspicious person :p
 
Don't panic! Your house contents insurance may wel lcover you if there are any problems but there probably won't be.
For the future I would join your daughter to the BHS or WHW, both offer insurance with their top level membership and both are good causes in their own way.
 
A few years ago my daughter was riding one of my horses. The horse spooked, dumped my daughter, got onto a main road and was in collision with a car. Police were on the scene and road closed for two hours while vet was in attendance.

Luckily my daughter was covered by my BHS gold membership. I had to give a statement detailing the circumstances, and from then on everything was dealt with by the BHS. The car was a write off but thankfully I didn't have to pay out a single penny (£5000 claim).

At no time did the police ask for a statement, just advised to sort out through insurance.
 
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Sugar_and_Spice said:
What I would think is if the insurance companies want a statement off your daughter they would contact her themselves. Since when do insurance companies ask a third party (horse owners mother) to gather written statements for them? I would be careful if I was you, but I am a naturally suspicious person :p
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what a good point... but then I feel like not giving her the statement she's asked for would cause unneccessary aggro as others have pointed out. I think she's just trying to pre-empt the situation. But yes, odd. Spoke to her this evening she says it's because the Van driver is trying to claim for his van. I don't know if it's his insurers needing the info or why she's the one asking.
Also checked out BHS gold and not as expensive as I feared, I will compare with WHW, thanks for that info. Also I sometimes take my younger daughter who is 9, off the yard on a lead rein. I wonder how insurance would deal with that if anything happened, if she's on the lead rein do I still count as the 'named' rider for insurance?
 
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