Help to tackle council re road safety!

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mogadoga

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We have a blind corner next to our field- its used by us with horses, dog walkers, kids etc. The road comes from a NSLimit to 30mph. It is 30mph about 3-400 yards away from this bend. They still travel 50mph plus.

I contacted the council - i know the speeding issue is global and not just on this corner, but i suggested a mirror so that we can see and safely cross! You cant always see the oncoming traffic. As well as us being able to see- the cars will see us crossing and hopefully slow enough not to hit us.

I have had alot of near misses, and with a 16hh heavy cob the impact will be fatal for all involved.

The council have said no:
MAINTENANCE COSTS ARE TOO HIGH
The sun may cause glare
Drivers may not see bikes


Ive heard nothing so ridiculous- and asked if the price of a mirror is worth the price of a life or 3??

Whats got my goat more, is that about 1/4 mile along the road there is- yes- a mirror!!!!! Which has never caused any glare issues, or stopped a driver seeing a bike.

Please help- whats the best way to tackle this, i have not respond yet as i dont want to come across nasty and petty etc I want to get my point across in a respectable, adult manor!

Any ideas on ways to tackle this???
 
Is your problem crossing the road, or where your field gate is situated, or when you ride the road?

If it is crossing the road, move away from the bend before crossing if possible.
If your field gate is on the bend, can you move it and situate it in what you perceive to be a safer place?
If it is when riding the road, do you not think that if the council erect a mirror for you that it may snowball into you requesting a mirror at every bend you need to negotiate?

Do you have any accident statistics?
Most councils will only make changes to a road that has had many fatalities/accidents, they don't change signs/markings just because a few people write to them.
 
ask if you can supply and erect, authorities dont want to help horse riders, I have contacted them over severa things waste of time.
 
quirky said:
Most councils will only make changes to a road that has had many fatalities/accidents, they don't change signs/markings just because a few people write to them.
Click to expand...

Yes , improvements are only carried out after a number of serious incidents or fatalities.
 
The problem is riding BUT this can be avoidable and i do so when possible. And crossing - the gate is down the track off the road its the actual road- we can cross within a space of 3 meters and i cross at the furthest point from the bend but about 3m isnt a life saving distance for speeding cars/vans/bikes.
I said i would hapily pay for the cost of the mirror but they said about maintenance costs- i can wipe it with a flipping cloth if need be!!

The mirror along the road isnt even used, you can see clearly but it has been there for many years (before i can even remember)

Aside from just sticking one up myself i dont know what to do- and that will most likley be removed.
My granddad now retired was very high up on the council, i didnt want to but im thinking of asking for his help.

The annoying thing is, a freak accident occured a few weeks ago- the mayor's wife hit a horse (jumped out of a field) on a 60mph road, the horse rolled over the car and died, she was told that had she had a lesser car she would be dead. I didnt realise it was his wife until i emailed him. He said he would see what could be done and understood the concern as we are at a blind corner and she was not he knows how easy it is for alot of damage to be made by a small horse, to which i pointed out, most in our field are at least double that horses size.

The same man who i have spoke to replied and was really arsey with me. This is why i want help- its hard to reply without being arsey and personal back!! However i, and other users are going to report each and every speeding car on that bend we encounter.
 
DO ask your Grandfather. Am sure he does not want to see you killed on the road.
Write and rewrite your concerns to the highways bods in charge and send a copy to your MP and newspaper.
Sorry, I do not know if it would work, but for something as serious as this, I think it's worth travelling down every avenue.
Best of luck,
Teg
 
As well as your Grandfather, local MP, try your local Councillor as well, they can sometimes be useful in "encouraging" Council departments that something is worth doing! You should be able to find your local Councillor relatively easily on the Council website.
 
I have contacted the local MP who referred to this bloke. Then the mayor who again referred to this bloke!
Granddad going to read all emails, and advised to send a letter to this man and local mp outlining all issues, points made and replies ending on the note that i understand that not taking action is basically their way of saying they accept full responsibility for any accidents and harm caused to driver/pedestrians etc.

Obviously he will make sure its all wrote correctly lol!
 
Mikes Top Tip of the day, "When dealing with Councils, send all correspondance recorded delivery. Also in this case send a copy to the Borough Solicitors office ,and make sure that you put copy to... , on the letter. " . Lack of action after being warned supports the contention that they are negligent. They are only liable if they are negligent.Your recorded delivery letter is proof of that warning,AND THEY KNOW THIS.:cool: PS, The Borough Solicitor bit is very important, that way they cant weasle their way out by saying that some clerk didnt understand the legal implications.
 
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Write to the Parish Council and ask if they will send in a recommendation too. That helps.
Maybe meet some from the Parish Council at the field so they can see the problem.
 
Forgive me but as a driver (as well as regular on-60mph-road hacker) I'm not sure that I'd find a mirror that useful if doing 30mph. Certainly when puling out of a blind turning they can be helpful but on the main carriage way I'd almost think of them as more of a distraction than anything as you often (especially if they are at all cloudy etc) have to peer quite hard to see much thereby reducing your awareness of whatever else is going on around you.

Could you consider asking whoever owns the land the mirror would have to be on (in conjunction with council) about erecting a mirror for crosser's (rather than driver's) use? Or moving/erecting warning sign-age for the entrance to whatever you're crossing to?

Blind bends/bridges/turnings are a constant menace, I really wish drivers would consider keeping their stopping distance less than their visibility distance... you never know when there'll be a broken down car/fallen tree/rider around a corner.
 
Tickles said:
Forgive me but as a driver (as well as regular on-60mph-road hacker) I'm not sure that I'd find a mirror that useful if doing 30mph. Certainly when puling out of a blind turning they can be helpful but on the main carriage way I'd almost think of them as more of a distraction than anything as you often (especially if they are at all cloudy etc) have to peer quite hard to see much thereby reducing your awareness of whatever else is going on around you.

Could you consider asking whoever owns the land the mirror would have to be on (in conjunction with council) about erecting a mirror for crosser's (rather than driver's) use? Or moving/erecting warning sign-age for the entrance to whatever you're crossing to?

Blind bends/bridges/turnings are a constant menace, I really wish drivers would consider keeping their stopping distance less than their visibility distance... you never know when there'll be a broken down car/fallen tree/rider around a corner.
Click to expand...

Its for the pedestrian NOT the driver which i have said and re-said to this pain in the backside man, but he is always turning everything into the motorist. But its us not the drivers, it wont slow them or stop them etc, its so WE can see them and stand half a chance that way. Its on a road not anyones land- infact the area it would attatch belongs to the old railway lines, there are two things blocking the view- the hedge grow which we can tip toe and see glimpses and a listed 'building' its a shed baisically part of the old railway crossing which means we cannot see at all. This building causes issues coming up the road and crossing, BUT its much easier to see when doing this, the problem is coming up the track from the field, or as a walker coming up the lines from the bridleways. The idea is- the drivers wont ever slow down, its rare they turn this bend at 30mph, as a horse person and driver even i go around the bend slowly and hate it cos i know i could still catch someone however i take the bend at 20mph or slower for the above reasons first mentioned. As a driver the mirror isnt much use, as a pedestrian (ive spoke to other users, dog walkers, lone walkers, people needing to cross with children/prams) it will mean they we can see the oncoming traffic and wait rather than using our ears and hoping for the best. Its not so bad with the dog, as i can run with the dog, the horse on the other hand has about 5ft behind me that is an easier target.

Sorry long and begining to ramble.

On the subject- i have asked and been ignored- IF a driver comes around the corner over the speed limit and hits us, injury or death is caused- who is to blame?? My granddad who has worked high up in the council for years has told me that this is the basis for the argument, put them in a liable position and when something happens we can say 'we told you to help with a solution'

Going back to see him tonight with draft letter :) ...why oh why did he retire lol
 
Thoughts so far:

Get your local Councillor on side
Speak to your BHS Committee for your area or flag up with Safety Dept at BHS Headquarters

In my area a number of locations with livery yards/riding schools have the triangular warning sign with ridden horse inside.

Letter to local papers
Get on local radio
 
You need your local councillor to push this. He will be able to push for some 'personal' schemes, as in schemes in his area. If you can help him with publicity afterwards, he again may be more inclined to help you. You wont get a mirror, they are not regarded very highly these days. Most you see are privately erected on private land.

Do remember that council have a very shrunken pot of money to cover road schemes, & they will prioritise this according to accident statistics. I know what you are saying, totally agree, but it is almost as though they will only act in retroospect after a serious (not near miss or minor injury) accident (known as a KSI - kiiled, serious incident). Near misses don't count, & as someone who used to be on the other side of the fence dealing with such situations & enquiries, you get switched off to the phrase 'accident waiting to happen', as potentially every piece of road is.

They have acknowledged the risk & usage by dropping the limit from 60 to 30. Your best bet is to try & get them to enforce it. Ask for a monitor to be placed on the road, to record the speeds of vehicles just before the corner & after, over the course of a week. If you can do this, & it supports your claim then you can go further. You need the 85th percentile (speed of the vehicle at the 85% highest speed) to exceed the 30 limit by a significant amount.

If it supports you, you could go for a horses, pedestrains in the road or pedestrains crossing warning sign, & a 'SLOW' painted on the road & a '30' painted where the speed limit changes. If there is a suitable parking bay beyond then you can ask for the site to be added to the mobile speed camera placement list. If there is space, & you can campaign hard with your local councillor, go for a pegasus crossing (push button traffic light crossing for horses), but you need enough space for a waiting area & need to provide evidence of high usuage.

If I can be of any help, just let me know. Not quite what you wanted to hear, but I hope it can help.
 
Ask the councillor to meet you and walk with you when you are bringing the horses in.
Some people in my area got some councillors to actually ride/walk with their horses when crossing a dual carriage way.Result was a horse crossing with a set of traffic lights. They also repositioned a bridleway gate further back and created an L shaped exit to a busy road and cut back all the hedgerows.
Sometimes seeing a problem first hand can make a difference.
 
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