Hoof Abcess and Poultice Questions

[Sooty]

I couldn't tell you how many times we have rung the vet for advice (and yes, it is a renowned specialist equine practice), and been told to give bute. This assumes that we have a supply of the stuff, which is surely the responsible thing to do? It is no different from keeping Ibuprofen in a home first aid kit.

 

[Tia]

Me too RHT. I have literally 2 buckets of bute, banamine, penicillin, broad spectrum anitbiotics, needles, syringes and many many other equine drugs on my farm.

How could anyone run a competent yard, full of horses, without having bute stored for emergencies??

 

[JM07]

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It is no different from keeping Ibuprofen in a home first aid kit.

[/ QUOTE ]

quite right, sooty.

 

[mollymurphy]

[ QUOTE ]

How could anyone run a competent yard, full of horses, without having bute stored for emergencies??

[/ QUOTE ]

If it was an emergency, we'd get a vet. I suppose you're nearest vet is quite far away compared to ours though??

 

[JM07]

[ QUOTE ]
Me too RHT. I have literally 2 buckets of bute, banamine, penicillin, broad spectrum anitbiotics, needles, syringes and many many other equine drugs on my farm.

How could anyone run a competent yard, full of horses, without having bute stored for emergencies??

[/ QUOTE ]

You tell me???

 

[Tia]

Oh no my nearest vets are only about 2 minutes away - 6 of them; all equine and all totally useless!

The vet I use over here is 40 minutes away. My vet in England was 15 minutes away, however I always always stored bute for emergencies....who's to say the vet will be able to get to you within 15 minutes if he is out on another emergency?

 

[mollymurphy]

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You tell me???

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I dont see what the big deal is?! If my horse needed drugs like that, i'd get the vet out. Even if our yard WAS full of drugs, i certainly wouldnt feel comfortable giving injections without being shown by a vet first.

And to get the drugs, the vet is a 15 minute drive away.

 

[mollymurphy]

But what emergency would require giving a sachet of bute before the vet arrived? Dont they take a while to kick in anyway?? Unless you're talking bute INJECTIONS???

 

[JM07]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

You tell me???

[/ QUOTE ]

I dont see what the big deal is?! If my horse needed drugs like that, i'd get the vet out. Even if our yard WAS full of drugs, i certainly wouldnt feel comfortable giving injections without being shown by a vet first.

And to get the drugs, the vet is a 15 minute drive away.

[/ QUOTE ]

i was replying to tia, MM

...she has a "few" ponies, same as me...

i think you are taking the right course of action with your girl though..you know her better than any of us...

 

[mollymurphy]

Oooops, sorry RHT!!

Look, if i'm honest we actually have several sachets of Danilon left over from Murph. But that's the only reason we have them - i would never have thought to keep stocked up. Always assumed i'd just get the vet if one of mine needed pain relief. However, looking at the poll in the NL, maybe i shall keep stocked up from now on!!

Moll seems much happier having had her shoe off. The heat has gone now too. Farrier tomorrow am, then vet in the pm if theres a prob.
YO's daughters' horse had one of those 'U'-shaped nails in her hoof this evening - was crippled with it, so i poulticed it and left her in until she can get there. Abscessed everywhere at the mo!!

 

[Tia]

A horse injuring itself to the extent that it requires immediate pain relief and the vet attending a colic emergency an hour and a halfs drive away.

I use powdered bute to stave off pain and banamine injections if it is an even bigger emergency to tide the horse over until the arrival of the vet. My vet will always tell me over the phone which one is best to use for the specific emergency.

I also use bute for minor lameness issues if the vet cannot being called until the following day.

 

[mollymurphy]

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I also use bute for minor lameness issues if the vet cannot being called until the following day.

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Our vet wont let us give bute in situations like that - says it masks the lameness and they need to see how lame the horse is without having had any pain relief.

 

[Tia]

Oh so what do you do to keep the horse pain-free overnight?

 

[mollymurphy]

Exactly! We dont give anything! I'm talking abscesses here by the way - Molly and Mo have both had them recently - both abscesses have been high up - Mo's was unable to be dug out and we'll find out about Molly's tomorrow.

 

[Tia]

Ahh cross wires here I think - I am talking about emergencies not on-going conditions.

 

[mollymurphy]

Oh right! Well if the vet couldnt come out, i'd drive the vets and pick some up. Emergency vets have always been able to though. Plus, there are 3 equine practices within 30mins of us, so one of them would be bound to be able to come.

Although tbh, i'm thinking i should stock up anyway. I only said i didnt have any because i thought puddicat would attack me if i said i did!!

 

[Tia]

PMSL!!! Oh well you might have to watch that Puddicat - she might be saving up info on us all in order to use it against us in a court of Law!

Of course then she would have to prove that anyone on here was telling the truth or just waffling a load of rubbish.....doubtful that the police will come and raid us all and throw us in prison for have a sachet of bute about our person!

 

[mollymurphy]

PMSL!!!

 

[JM07]

"She" is a "He", Tia........................

and i'm sure he isn't the only one on here who "saves" posts/threads for future use.

 

[Tia]

Gosh! He writes with such a feminine touch!

 

[the watcher]

[ QUOTE ]
"She" is a "He", Tia........................

and i'm sure he isn't the only one on here who "saves" posts/threads for future use.

[/ QUOTE ]

Now that has surprised me, I always though he was a she. In puddicat's defence (not that they need me to defend them) I usually find his posts very interesting and challenging, as well as being well thought out, so maybe the one on this thread was just an off day, we all have them.

Must admit though, that saving posts is just a bit too anal for me - anything that winds you up is best deleted and forgotten.

One of mine has been troubled intermittently with what appears to be an abscess. It flares up from time to time, if you weren't looking for slight lameness you might hardly see it in him. It feels like it is very high, the temp difference if difficult to detect by hand but can be measured with one of those ritzy laser thermometers (+3 degrees). I do have somebody coming out in a couple of weeks to do more exploratory work on it, unless it flares up in the mean time.

 

[rforsyth1984]

Who would have thought an abcess post would turn into such a debate?!

Have to say, I do not agree with stockpiling bute, for several reasons:

1) if a horse is lame enough to require bute, in my opinion it needs the vet and masking the lameness is unhelpful
2) long term use of bute is contra-indicated
3) what may appear to be a bit of lameness that will clear up could be something worse, and by buting up for a few days, thus delaying calling a vet could allow a condition to get worse
4) pain is a survival mechanism and alleviating pain is not always the best thing if the horse then causes more damage with increased mobility

There may be other reasons that I cant think of now, but Im sure some people will agree with the above.
That said, I would be lost without this forum. I know that advice given is not always helpful for whatever reason, but I personally find peoples replies interesting and comforting when my horse is ill/injured. Obviously my vets advice is the advice I follow. Also, I find with my own horse, I dont always see the wood for the trees... for example the shoulder injury I was convinced my horse had, obviously turned out to be foot related (probably, vet still isnt sure!) as people on the forum suggested.Also, advice for keeping him sane on box rest has proved invaluable!

I guess I can see why the forum could be 'dangerous', perhaps if someone was to naively take everything suggested as gospel, but I really dont think many people do that? And its only an extension of asing people on the yard for their advice, which I think everybody does?

In conclusion? I appear to have no conclusion. In fact, i think I may have confused myself?!

 

[MotherOfChickens]

[ QUOTE ]
Who would have thought an abcess post would turn into such a debate?!

Have to say, I do not agree with stockpiling bute, for several reasons:

1) if a horse is lame enough to require bute, in my opinion it needs the vet and masking the lameness is unhelpful
2) long term use of bute is contra-indicated
3) what may appear to be a bit of lameness that will clear up could be something worse, and by buting up for a few days, thus delaying calling a vet could allow a condition to get worse
4) pain is a survival mechanism and alleviating pain is not always the best thing if the horse then causes more damage with increased mobility

There may be other reasons that I cant think of now, but Im sure some people will agree with the above.


[/ QUOTE ]

at last, someone else talking sense.I fail to see that unless you live really out in the sticks (which doesnt mean 20miles from the nearest vet) that there is any real need for 'emergency' oral bute.
Puddicat misread a post, it happens. He is IMO, one of the very few people on here who talks rationally and if guilty of copying and pasting, its not from some random Google search like some people.

 

[Tia]

LOL!! Love your last sentence

.

Anyway, you're right. Forums are useful for certain things - in most situations people are only giving their own experiences of such matters.

With respects to the bute conversation; I didn't see anyone saying that they just give bute? I was under the impression that everyone who answered this, along with on my poll, told us that they kept bute at home in order to use in an emergency once they had called the vet.....and only under veterinary instruction? I certainly do - my first port of call is to telephone my vet, who gives me instruction over the phone to tide the horse over till he can make it out, or if it is not an emergency then he may not come out, but will say to give a short course of bute, take horse off bute and see how the horse is in a few days; then phone him back to give an update on the situation.

I'm not sure anyone said that they just give it off their own back, but I could be wrong.

 

[rforsyth1984]

Sorry Tia, I may have jumped to conclusions a bit. I do know of people who just give bute off their own backs and got the impression thats what the stockpiling is for... I suppose if your vet kows you are keeping a stash and you seek their advice prior to giving any, the risks are reduced.
My vet (and my previous vets, so 3 of our local practices) would not allow stockpiling and always insist on visiting before they give out bute. Even then, they give you just the right amount for the number of days the horse should be on bute. I assumed this was the case with all vets?

 

[vicijp]

Only the vets that are desperate for the visit fee.

 

[Guinness]

how is molly? did you manage to get the abcess drained?

 

[mollymurphy]

[ QUOTE ]
how is molly? did you manage to get the abcess drained?

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Nope! Farrier couldnt find anything - reckons it might just be a badly bruised sole that is now almost healed. She wasnt reacting to the pincer tests and he failed to find any heat. He re-shod her and she seemed much better (practically sound - i wouldnt have seen the lameness had i not have been deliberately looking for it). However, she's lamer again today, so it looks like the vet wont just be out for vaccination boosters.

Possible that she's just a bit foot-sore after being shod on an already-bruised foot, but we'll see. Stress!!!

Thank you for asking though!

x

 

[rforsyth1984]

vet couldnt find an abcess in my boy, no heat, no reaction to pincers, she told me to wet poultice for a few days and hey ho, a load of pus came out today!
Get your vet to take another look when they come to do vaccs, can sometimes take a few days for an abcess to appear if its a deep one.

 

[mollymurphy]

That's what i thought, but she's been lame for getting on for 2 weeks now. Had a poultice on for over a week, but nothing happened. One day she seems loads better, the next day she's back to square one.

There's no heat or swelling or signs of anything anywhere! I'm so confused!!! She's NEVER been lame before.

I'm glad you got pus though! I wish we had!

x