sandr
Well-Known Member
Start looking for a new yard was my first thought. I can understand restricted turnout for maybe just an hour or two, but no turnout at all is a complete nono fo rme.
Horse going completley mental(long sorry)
- Thread starter janet68
- Start date
BigRed
Well-Known Member
This is always the problem when you keep them in for a day because of the weather and that day stretches to several days and then they become too stupid to walk on a slippery yard and the problem gets worse.
Personally I would make a path with bedding and put him out, plonk boots etc on him and just go for it. B*****cks to what the YO says, I would be more concerned with my safety and my horses happiness.
Make sure you wear a hat when you lead him.
Personally I would make a path with bedding and put him out, plonk boots etc on him and just go for it. B*****cks to what the YO says, I would be more concerned with my safety and my horses happiness.
Make sure you wear a hat when you lead him.
V1NN
Well-Known Member
my god i feel really sorry for you, sunds like you are in a horrible situation. Going to tell you about this horse we once had at old yard i used to work at i dont want to upset you or nything it just that some of the things you mention sound very familiar. My old boss used to buy 4 ex racers every september from the racehorse sales one yr he came back with this huuuuuge bay gelding he was absolutely stunning. he had never been raced and now looking back its very obvious why. he was mental in the stable really dangerous, he was dangerous to lead he would rear constantly, getting rugs on him was something else my boss would hold him with a bridle on and a stick in his hand ready, and i'd attempt to put on rug oh so quietly. he was broken and i rode him a couple of times but he reared with me for no reason and i had my arms round his neck but he still fell over backwards, i got back on next day and he was fine for half an hour or so then rodeod me off - i never rode him again i refused to as he was a liability. we had back teeth saddle checks, vet checks etc everything fine he was only 5yrs old. we eventually sold him to a very experienced lady who bought him knowing all the problems and she wanted to start from scratch with him and rehabilitate him. she had him about 6months and phoned to say he'd dropped dead in front of her eyes when she was taking him in, she got him post mortoned and it had showed something on his brain a massive tumour or something so that explained everthing poor boy.
I dont even know if it can be done but can you get brain scans of horses? might be worth doing, only a suggestion. If he was mine i think i'd possibly if its possible find a grass livery and just leave him be for a year out to be a horse, he wold eventually get over the standing at the gate thing if he realised you werent taking him in. i'd be tempted to just do basics ie picking feet changing rugs etc but other than that just leave him alone. As for your current situation i agree with everyone sedation try a different 1. and somehow or another i'd find a way to get him to a field rugged up well and left all day, once back in just hay as feed and ad lib so he hopefully wont lose the weight. it sounds like a really awful situation i am wishing you the best of luck with your boy xx
I dont even know if it can be done but can you get brain scans of horses? might be worth doing, only a suggestion. If he was mine i think i'd possibly if its possible find a grass livery and just leave him be for a year out to be a horse, he wold eventually get over the standing at the gate thing if he realised you werent taking him in. i'd be tempted to just do basics ie picking feet changing rugs etc but other than that just leave him alone. As for your current situation i agree with everyone sedation try a different 1. and somehow or another i'd find a way to get him to a field rugged up well and left all day, once back in just hay as feed and ad lib so he hopefully wont lose the weight. it sounds like a really awful situation i am wishing you the best of luck with your boy xx
janet68
Well-Known Member
Sorry to sound abrupt but lucky you. The others on yard have been turning out but for his safety and mine i cannot bring him out on 3inch thick ice. And i would have to walk about quarter of a mile on it to his field twice a day
CBFan
Well-Known Member
I agree with others. in the short term, Cut out the mix and mollassed chaff - perhaps feed hi-fi lite and speedi-beet instead if you want to continue the routine of a bucket feed. add a calmer at a really high dose - everyone I know whos tried NAFF Magic calmer has had success with it so may be worth a go. and then swap to hay. - a snack ball will also keep him busy.
In the long term I'd look at moving him to a yard where he can live out 24/7 and I'd just chuck him out and do the basics with him and then bring him back into work after a few months of rest... I know of several 'problem' horses that this has worked for... they start to really crave and enjoy the attention when they are left to fed for themselves...
In the long term I'd look at moving him to a yard where he can live out 24/7 and I'd just chuck him out and do the basics with him and then bring him back into work after a few months of rest... I know of several 'problem' horses that this has worked for... they start to really crave and enjoy the attention when they are left to fed for themselves...
nellieelephantxx
Active Member
If the farmer is worried about grit/salt on concreate, I went to the local pound stretcher and they had some ice melt in there,
It says that it won't damage concreate/tarmac etc and you could always show him the tub to prove its ok. It comes in small tubes but a few of them might be enough to make a bit of a path for you. It seemed to work ok on our yard not the best stuff in the world but if your really in a mess it might help.
Where abouts are you is there someone on here, or a very knowledgeable friend that could come and give you a hand with your horse on a regular basis?
It says that it won't damage concreate/tarmac etc and you could always show him the tub to prove its ok. It comes in small tubes but a few of them might be enough to make a bit of a path for you. It seemed to work ok on our yard not the best stuff in the world but if your really in a mess it might help.
Where abouts are you is there someone on here, or a very knowledgeable friend that could come and give you a hand with your horse on a regular basis?
alsxx
Well-Known Member
Whats he like normally when you lead him to and from the field? If he's normaly fine, then I would be inclined to have the vet out to sedate him, and then turn him out. It sounds like others are turning out despite the ice, but I understand that you don't want to take an excitable horse across an icy surface, so if by getting him out and letting him burn off some energy so that you can safely lead him to and fro, then I would try that.
Tickles
Well-Known Member
Boots for you and him. Hat for you. Friend to help. Lunge line to lead from so you can move back if necessary. Really best of luck with getting the YO to make a grit/straw/cleared path. If not it sounds as though you really probably should risk it without. Most horses are pretty careful once they realise a surface is slippy.
Obviously it is hard but keeping him in 24/7 is, very understandably, going to drive any sentient being crazy.
If you let people on here know where you are you might even find a HHO type willing to pop along and lead him with you the first time. I know it must feel like you're being a bit ganged up on in this thread but really, really people are trying to advise on what would be best for both you and your horse so I'm sure you'd get offers of help!
Obviously it is hard but keeping him in 24/7 is, very understandably, going to drive any sentient being crazy.
If you let people on here know where you are you might even find a HHO type willing to pop along and lead him with you the first time. I know it must feel like you're being a bit ganged up on in this thread but really, really people are trying to advise on what would be best for both you and your horse so I'm sure you'd get offers of help!
Flame_
Well-Known Member
Find a new yard. Any YO who prioritizes caring for his concrete over the customers safety and their horses welfare is not going to run a good set-up.
YO and staff attitudes are the most important thing about any yard.
YO and staff attitudes are the most important thing about any yard.
kick_On
Well-Known Member
I would also think about putting down a small path of dirty bedding , BUT allow it to freeze into ice SO there will be much better grip for horse so hopefully it will give you a path so you can get your horse out........
But chiffney, gloves, hats, lunge line, friend and dope (just horse???) and give dope to hungery horse plus put out in field lots of hay so hopefully his brain will look for food, instead of peeing around.
I hope it works out for you......
But chiffney, gloves, hats, lunge line, friend and dope (just horse???) and give dope to hungery horse plus put out in field lots of hay so hopefully his brain will look for food, instead of peeing around.
I hope it works out for you......
ladyt25
Well-Known Member
Sorry but you rpobabyl won't like my response! Obviously I don't know your exact circumstances but I would suggest a bit of elbow grease and a couple of hours clearing a path through the ice to the nearest turnout field!
We have our own stables (luckily) and ours have been turned out everyday. The yard bit got very icy - although ok when it snowed, once it iced over it was lethal. I initially filled up a bucket with road grit from the bin up the steep hill to our field but, after a bit my dad and I got to work with spades and cleared the ice! Yep, it was hard work but we did it!
I could not keep my horse in for that long, it's unfair so sorry but I think a bit of hard work will be better. Once you've cleared it chuck the grit down yourself, sod the farmer!
We have our own stables (luckily) and ours have been turned out everyday. The yard bit got very icy - although ok when it snowed, once it iced over it was lethal. I initially filled up a bucket with road grit from the bin up the steep hill to our field but, after a bit my dad and I got to work with spades and cleared the ice! Yep, it was hard work but we did it!
I could not keep my horse in for that long, it's unfair so sorry but I think a bit of hard work will be better. Once you've cleared it chuck the grit down yourself, sod the farmer!
Hovis_and_SidsMum
Well-Known Member
I feel for you. We're in the same situation. We are utterly stuck, the yard is sheet ice with snow on top then more ice. I can't get hovis to the field but am lucky that he's relatively calm inside. Even he is getting fed up though. When we do eventually get a clear day to get them out all hell is going to break loose i'm sure of that. Like the others have said I think it's just a case of clearing some sort of path, lunge line, hats, gloves and as much dope as you have.
That said be careful of him going loony. Our vet was down last night and was saying how badly they can tie up if they go looney tunes after being kept inside. He was called to one at our yard the other week after the 3 days we managed to get them out. The horse went loopy and then completely locked out his back end.
That said be careful of him going loony. Our vet was down last night and was saying how badly they can tie up if they go looney tunes after being kept inside. He was called to one at our yard the other week after the 3 days we managed to get them out. The horse went loopy and then completely locked out his back end.
janet68
Well-Known Member
Hi i am in lancashire I have just walked about a mile in knee deep snow to give him his net and does he appreciate it? NO he doesnt
janet68
Well-Known Member
Hi he is quite a hanful to lead in normal circumstances and is quite clumsy he used to slip and fall over when ground was wet and has he has already had a broken leg and dislocated hip i think this is the reason i am really scared to try and move him
Tickles
Well-Known Member
Hi i am in lancashire I have just walked about a mile in knee deep snow to give him his net and does he appreciate it? NO he doesnt
To be fair *he* doesn't know that you've done that just to get him the food he has everyday anyway. He just knows he is in solitary confinement in 'prison'.
But I (and the rest of HHO) do know. And do appreciate you!
Understand from his previous injuries why you'd be so cautious about ice. Perhaps as Lady T suggested digging out a path (which you then put the pound stretcher de-icer on?) would be best in this case. I'm too far away to help you but did clear a whole 20 horse yard last year with just one other person so you have sympathies at any rate! (RDA place so we couldn't just do a path.) On the plus side it is GREAT for burning post xmas calories...
To be fair *he* doesn't know that you've done that just to get him the food he has everyday anyway. He just knows he is in solitary confinement in 'prison'.
But I (and the rest of HHO) do know. And do appreciate you!
Understand from his previous injuries why you'd be so cautious about ice. Perhaps as Lady T suggested digging out a path (which you then put the pound stretcher de-icer on?) would be best in this case. I'm too far away to help you but did clear a whole 20 horse yard last year with just one other person so you have sympathies at any rate! (RDA place so we couldn't just do a path.) On the plus side it is GREAT for burning post xmas calories...
Lynds
Well-Known Member
if your farmer will not allow you to grit put sand down. it works too. You can get it cheaply from any builders merchants.
alsxx
Well-Known Member
Well then, in the nicest possible way, you are going to have to make a decision as to whether you continue to keep in or risk turning out. You have had lots of suggestions but it seems that all have been discounted. Unfortunately horses are animals and will do stupid things and will hurt themselves, and as much as we try to avoid these situations, you cant stop them from happening. If you cant live with the hassle they cause, well.....And I really don't mean that in a nasty way, but you really have had lots of good suggestions from people but have come up with reasons why none of them will work.
I know all about the hassle and worry they cause having had one of mine wrench his hock over the weekend on the hard rutted ground in the field - and he lives out 24/7 and so I very much doubt he was even hooning around when he did it. I've had to get him back out as keeping him in 24/7 wasn't doing him any good, and yes it was a nerve wracking hour or so whilst I waited around making sure he was ok!!!
Anyway, good luck with your horse, I hope you get it all sorted out.
p.s. could you try bits of old carpet?
I know all about the hassle and worry they cause having had one of mine wrench his hock over the weekend on the hard rutted ground in the field - and he lives out 24/7 and so I very much doubt he was even hooning around when he did it. I've had to get him back out as keeping him in 24/7 wasn't doing him any good, and yes it was a nerve wracking hour or so whilst I waited around making sure he was ok!!!
Anyway, good luck with your horse, I hope you get it all sorted out.
p.s. could you try bits of old carpet?
Jericho
Well-Known Member
I am sure it has been said already but rug him up well, get an army of people to help, wear gloves, hat, back protector, put him in a bridle/ chifney/ rope over nose and lay a run way of straw / carpet / sand to nearest field and just leave him out with lots of hay (ideally with another horse if you can) until this weather passes. Both you and he will be a lot happier and safer. Even if he cant have a companion I would put him out anyway - better that than him going mental in stable.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
whatever past experiences I would be talking to my vet re sedation options if you arent going to turn him out.
chestnut cob
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Hi he is quite a hanful to lead in normal circumstances and is quite clumsy he used to slip and fall over when ground was wet and has he has already had a broken leg and dislocated hip i think this is the reason i am really scared to try and move him
[/ QUOTE ]
In the short term I would get the vet out to sedate him, or have some Sedalin sent over to you (give more than the 2ml the tube suggests!). It should stop him doing himself or others any damage for now.
I personally wouldn't try to lead him out to the field if he's difficult to lead anyway and you're scared of him.
Once the weather improves you need to work on his manners and get him leading properly. If you are scared it will make him worse. Horse whisperers are no use at all. If you're struggling then try a Kelly Marks Recommended Associate who will be able to work with you and show you where you're going wrong. I'm not a bunny hugger generally but I had one out in Oct 2008 to help me load my unloadable horse, who incidentally was also a nightmare to handle generally. She worked with me to show me where I was going wrong in my handling of him, and showed me how to deal with his general bad manners and rudeness (he was awful to lead, spinning round, rearing, would take off wherever he wanted to, wouldnt' stand on the yard at all, handy with his back legs...
, lead everywhere in a chifney or bridle). Had to lead him in a Dually for a good while after and a year or more down the line, I still do regular groundwork with him to keep on top of his manners, but he is now a dope on a rope. My non horsey and nervous dad led him in from the field on Xmas day! It sounds like the difficulty you have with general handling of him is making your current situation worse, so as soon as the weather and ground improves, you do need to deal, with that.
Hi he is quite a hanful to lead in normal circumstances and is quite clumsy he used to slip and fall over when ground was wet and has he has already had a broken leg and dislocated hip i think this is the reason i am really scared to try and move him
[/ QUOTE ]
In the short term I would get the vet out to sedate him, or have some Sedalin sent over to you (give more than the 2ml the tube suggests!). It should stop him doing himself or others any damage for now.
I personally wouldn't try to lead him out to the field if he's difficult to lead anyway and you're scared of him.
Once the weather improves you need to work on his manners and get him leading properly. If you are scared it will make him worse. Horse whisperers are no use at all. If you're struggling then try a Kelly Marks Recommended Associate who will be able to work with you and show you where you're going wrong. I'm not a bunny hugger generally but I had one out in Oct 2008 to help me load my unloadable horse, who incidentally was also a nightmare to handle generally. She worked with me to show me where I was going wrong in my handling of him, and showed me how to deal with his general bad manners and rudeness (he was awful to lead, spinning round, rearing, would take off wherever he wanted to, wouldnt' stand on the yard at all, handy with his back legs...
little_flea
Well-Known Member
Can you not put ice studs in front so you can get him to the field? It is not ideal to turn out studded but better than leaving him in by the sound of it.
Puppy
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
With a helper around could you even try walking him (with a hat and bridle and gloves and friend and anything else necessary to keep you safe) on cleared areas?
[/ QUOTE ]
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, do not try and lead him in hand!!!!!!!!
With a helper around could you even try walking him (with a hat and bridle and gloves and friend and anything else necessary to keep you safe) on cleared areas?
[/ QUOTE ]
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, do not try and lead him in hand!!!!!!!!
Lippyx
Well-Known Member
Oh what a horrific situation you are in!! I really feel for you!!
I don't beleive what the farmer is saying about the grit ruinning th concrete.... it doesn't seem to harm the roads and pavements when the road gritters go out there!!!?
I would arrange to get him in a field and if he will, stay there until the snow has stopped! Use sedation if necessary, and all the help you can get from friends. Draw up a plan or who is doing what and who stands where etc on the yard. You could sprinkle grit down just before you move him, and then swep it straight back up, if the farmer is so worried!
I can't believe the farmer would rather have a dangerous, slippery yard, and the possible risk of a claim, than possibly have to repair damaged concrete??!! It doesn't make sense. Really tell him your concerns, and try to get your friends to make him aware also!! Let us know what the out come is!
I don't beleive what the farmer is saying about the grit ruinning th concrete.... it doesn't seem to harm the roads and pavements when the road gritters go out there!!!?
I would arrange to get him in a field and if he will, stay there until the snow has stopped! Use sedation if necessary, and all the help you can get from friends. Draw up a plan or who is doing what and who stands where etc on the yard. You could sprinkle grit down just before you move him, and then swep it straight back up, if the farmer is so worried!
I can't believe the farmer would rather have a dangerous, slippery yard, and the possible risk of a claim, than possibly have to repair damaged concrete??!! It doesn't make sense. Really tell him your concerns, and try to get your friends to make him aware also!! Let us know what the out come is!
NELSON11
Well-Known Member
I agree, dope him, sod the farmer and try and make a pathway and get him out even if just for an hour or so, give both you and he a little bit of respite. Wouldn't try walking him around, as not safe. May just take the edge off him if you can even get him out for an hour or so. Good luck
Puppy
Well-Known Member
Lippyx, please can you make your signature smaller? It's rather huge at the moment. thanks
Witchy
Well-Known Member
I agree with LadyT - clear yourself a path and grit it. Sod the farmer. He CANNOT expect you to manage this horse in those conditions. Just do it.
Um, do you actually ride this horse? Have you had him long/is he totally different under saddle? I know of a grey that is a savage git but under saddle he is so into his work.
Please please do yourself a favour and do what you HAVE to do for your horse. These are extreme conditions and the farmer cannot expect you to do everything by the book. Clear a good path, grit it and when you are happy its safe get the horse out and leave it out! Get a dually headcollar or chifney and get somebody else to help you take him out, one on each side if you have to.
Good luck
Um, do you actually ride this horse? Have you had him long/is he totally different under saddle? I know of a grey that is a savage git but under saddle he is so into his work.
Please please do yourself a favour and do what you HAVE to do for your horse. These are extreme conditions and the farmer cannot expect you to do everything by the book. Clear a good path, grit it and when you are happy its safe get the horse out and leave it out! Get a dually headcollar or chifney and get somebody else to help you take him out, one on each side if you have to.
Good luck
Tickles
Well-Known Member
Puppy - I agree that if handling problems are more general this might not be good. I've done it with RS types/ex racehorses/flighty arabs when iced up but never anything that wasn't generally good-ish (bit bargy/bite-y/handy with feet at most) to handle. You're probably right for this particular circumstance.
Puppy
Well-Known Member
IMO it applies for ALL horses that have spent a considerable amount of time stabled. I'm afraid I will never do it again, regardless of how well behaved the horse normally is. It's just a recipe for disaster!!
I had to walk my horse in hand (vet's recommendation) after an op and 3 weeks box rest. She is generally a sweetie pie to handle, and prior to us walking out she'd been tied on the yard for a couple of hours being mucked out/groomed/tail & feet washed etc, all standing quietly. However, it was nearly the death of me, and through her excitability (not malice) I got double barreled in the face. I broke most of the bones in my face, and had fractures through to the brain, but I'm flipping lucky to be alive!! That was Christmas 2008 and I am still in constant pain, unable to work properly, suffering from whiplash, scarred, waiting for more surgery etc etc.
I feel very strongly that walking in hand after box rest is asking for injury. Like I say, I'll never do it again.
I had to walk my horse in hand (vet's recommendation) after an op and 3 weeks box rest. She is generally a sweetie pie to handle, and prior to us walking out she'd been tied on the yard for a couple of hours being mucked out/groomed/tail & feet washed etc, all standing quietly. However, it was nearly the death of me, and through her excitability (not malice) I got double barreled in the face. I broke most of the bones in my face, and had fractures through to the brain, but I'm flipping lucky to be alive!! That was Christmas 2008 and I am still in constant pain, unable to work properly, suffering from whiplash, scarred, waiting for more surgery etc etc.
I feel very strongly that walking in hand after box rest is asking for injury. Like I say, I'll never do it again.
soph21
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Hi he is quite a hanful to lead in normal circumstances and is quite clumsy he used to slip and fall over when ground was wet and has he has already had a broken leg and dislocated hip i think this is the reason i am really scared to try and move him
[/ QUOTE ]
Toatlly off topic, I really dont know what to suggest in your situation
But why the hell has he always been such a loon? have you let him walk all over you for the last 5 years??
My horses wouldn;t dare do this kind of stuff to me
I apologise now if I have mis read or missed a post on mental/behavour problems
Hi he is quite a hanful to lead in normal circumstances and is quite clumsy he used to slip and fall over when ground was wet and has he has already had a broken leg and dislocated hip i think this is the reason i am really scared to try and move him
[/ QUOTE ]
Toatlly off topic, I really dont know what to suggest in your situation
But why the hell has he always been such a loon? have you let him walk all over you for the last 5 years??
My horses wouldn;t dare do this kind of stuff to me
I apologise now if I have mis read or missed a post on mental/behavour problems
sarahHugo
Well-Known Member
I really feel for you as it's obvious that you care for this horse very dearly.
I can also vouch for a Kelly Mark's RA. My mare was horrible when I got her with kicking,barging and rearing. I got somebody out who taught me about simple body language and how to use a dually/groundwork exercises
Like you, I am not one to give up. In less than a year she is out showing and everyone comments on how sensitive and responsive she is. All from halter work.
Just be really careful. My mare used to be a vicious kicker and last year she caught my knee resulting in surgery for a very bad fracture. Like you, nobody would touch her with a barge pole and one mistake has caused me lots of pain and misery.
She too can be very funny about people in the stable. I now always put her dually on and attach and hold a long rope. She thinks she is loose, but If she does try to bite (which isnt often now) I give her a tug and back her away to re assert my authority. If she spins, I can apply pressue and pull her round. Its unacceptable behaviour and as I have learnt - very dangerous.
Perhaps contact your vet and speak to a professional about the situation. There are RA's on Kelly Marks website.
Providing there are no underlying issues, I am convinced most horses can be improved. Despite my bionic leg!! I am very proud of our progress
Best of luck and stay safe xx
I can also vouch for a Kelly Mark's RA. My mare was horrible when I got her with kicking,barging and rearing. I got somebody out who taught me about simple body language and how to use a dually/groundwork exercises
Like you, I am not one to give up. In less than a year she is out showing and everyone comments on how sensitive and responsive she is. All from halter work.
Just be really careful. My mare used to be a vicious kicker and last year she caught my knee resulting in surgery for a very bad fracture. Like you, nobody would touch her with a barge pole and one mistake has caused me lots of pain and misery.
She too can be very funny about people in the stable. I now always put her dually on and attach and hold a long rope. She thinks she is loose, but If she does try to bite (which isnt often now) I give her a tug and back her away to re assert my authority. If she spins, I can apply pressue and pull her round. Its unacceptable behaviour and as I have learnt - very dangerous.
Perhaps contact your vet and speak to a professional about the situation. There are RA's on Kelly Marks website.
Providing there are no underlying issues, I am convinced most horses can be improved. Despite my bionic leg!! I am very proud of our progress
Best of luck and stay safe xx