horse hates being groomed/rugged, touched etc

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misst said:
So have I missed something? A horse on regular bute (and needing it for shoeing) is being brought back into work? He has had rearing problems in the past, an ill fitting saddle, and is used to being hit if things go wrong? I am confused as to why a vet would advise to hit a horse and I am confused as to why he is being brought back into work. All this screams pain and/or feed related problems. Alpha A is the worst thing I ever tried feeding - it made our sane pony completely bonkers. How much investigation has this poor horse had?
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He's not being brought back into work for a while. I'm looking into foods for the future when he is in work. I never hit him, I don't agree with it. But the vet hits him, she says he is very rude, same with physio, yo etc. He head butt's people, bites them for no reason, doesn't respect space etc. But I still wouldn't hit him, If he's got hold of my t-shirt, I will tap his nose and he let's it go, and I have to put my elbow in the way when I bend down or he gets my arse. I put him on alfa a as he was lacking energy and condition.
 
Tiddlypom said:
The bute was given for laminitis, wasn't it? Isn't that what the vet came out for to check his recovery from laminitis?

How did that go?
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Yes, he's better, she said to leave him in a few more days then turn him out on a small field. And leave him on bute till his shoes have been done. He has rather spicy on or trot up and decided hed like to have a go at dancing, and kicked me. It was my fault, I should've had him on a bridle.
 
Clodagh said:
I wouldn’t bother. I accept OP is very young but it’s just really, really depressing.
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I'm trying. We are looking into other vets for a scope. But like I said we are trying coligone first. And actually, his touching had got better with just positive reinforcement. No hitting, no treat. Nothing that anyone has said worked. But I decided to just do it, in a relaxed way, holding my hand on the spot I was going to touch before I massaged it. And he really liked it. I'm taking it slow.
 
axe1312 said:
Yes, he's better, she said to leave him in a few more days then turn him out on a small field. And leave him on bute till his shoes have been done. He has rather spicy on or trot up and decided hed like to have a go at dancing, and kicked me. It was my fault, I should've had him on a bridle.
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Did the vet not tell you that a laminitic shouldn't be given bucket feed while on box rest? I would expect that to be standard advice and the first thing the vet said.
 
axe1312 said:
I'm trying. We are looking into other vets for a scope. But like I said we are trying coligone first. And actually, his touching had got better with just positive reinforcement. No hitting, no treat. Nothing that anyone has said worked. But I decided to just do it, in a relaxed way, holding my hand on the spot I was going to touch before I massaged it. And he really liked it. I'm taking it slow.
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I read in post #13 (see below) that you aren't taking it slow
axe1312 said:
I played music, and was very patient, but didn't do anything slowly as that's what predators do before attack.
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If even half of all these threads are accurate, it's a recipe for [even more of a] disaster.

OP you obviously do not have enough experience or knowledge at this stage. Everyone needs to start somewhere but you appear to be surrounded by clueless, and cruel, numpties.

I appreciate being young, and not having good support around you leaves you in a quandary. It also leaves you in a position where you can't tell good from bad "advice" and recommendations, especially from faceless posters on an Internet forum.

Even more of a predicament is that you've acquired this horse and are now at the mercy of your parents funding it all whilst they aren't horsey.

Honestly the best thing would be for the horse to find an experienced home but 1) anyone with the right experience is unlikely to want to touch it and 2) I'm sure you'll say that you'll never part with him etc. It's all a bit of a mess.

I have no idea how you'd go about it but you need a good experienced horse person to help you and said person needs to do some straight talking with your parents to set them straight on the realities, and costs, of horse ownership.

You're only 15, can you join the local Pony Club and go with your parents to speak with the District Commissioner?

No vet should ever be telling someone to hit their horse. Perhaps a local DC could recommend a more suitable professional.

None of this makes any sense re vetting, history since and prior to you buying him, laminitis, vet instructions, vet/physio advice, YO, feed or management. Like said if even half of this is true you're in a real mess.

Can you show your parents what you've been posting on here and the replies? Perhaps things would go better if adults were involved and they asked directly for advice and a strategy for managing the horse.
 
Arzada said:
I read in post #13 (see below) that you aren't taking it slow
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I'm taking the whole process slow. But when approaching and touching him, I do it in a normal speed. As doing it slowly makes him feel like I'm creeping up on him. If that makes sense, sorry if I'm confusing
 
TPO said:
If even half of all these threads are accurate, it's a recipe for [even more of a] disaster.

OP you obviously do not have enough experience or knowledge at this stage. Everyone needs to start somewhere but you appear to be surrounded by clueless, and cruel, numpties.

I appreciate being young, and not having good support around you leaves you in a quandary. It also leaves you in a position where you can't tell good from bad "advice" and recommendations, especially from faceless posters on an Internet forum.

Even more of a predicament is that you've acquired this horse and are now at the mercy of your parents funding it all whilst they aren't horsey.

Honestly the best thing would be for the horse to find an experienced home but 1) anyone with the right experience is unlikely to want to touch it and 2) I'm sure you'll say that you'll never part with him etc. It's all a bit of a mess.

I have no idea how you'd go about it but you need a good experienced horse person to help you and said person needs to do some straight talking with your parents to set them straight on the realities, and costs, of horse ownership.

You're only 15, can you join the local Pony Club and go with your parents to speak with the District Commissioner?

No vet should ever be telling someone to hit their horse. Perhaps a local DC could recommend a more suitable professional.

None of this makes any sense re vetting, history since and prior to you buying him, laminitis, vet instructions, vet/physio advice, YO, feed or management. Like said if even half of this is true you're in a real mess.

Can you show your parents what you've been posting on here and the replies? Perhaps things would go better if adults were involved and they asked directly for advice and a strategy for managing the horse.
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My parents are aware of this. And they are considering the scope. But when all the so called professionals say he doesn't have ulcers, it's hard for them to trust me and Internet people. But we are looking into other vets that may be able to do a cheaper scope. They can afford it if they need to, but they are saving money where they can as he is already costing a hell lot more that we estimated. He reacts to a normal vaccination, so needs a more pricey one for example, and needs physio regularly.
 
Well OP I read the previous thread so I think I understand a bit more. TPO in particular has offered some seriously good advice re getting your parents on board with what is needed. I am sorry you are in this situation but I am so so sorry for your horse who is being badly let down by the people around you. I know it is scary for you but instead of keep asking questions that imply you don't want to listen to advice take a deep breath and perhaps ask one of the very very experienced people on here if they could PM you a little support. I bet they would :) .These problems aren't cheap to fix and maybe your parents cannot afford it but the horse has needs that are not being met. Being nice to him, bonding with him, spending time and understanding him are all good things - but they will never ever make him better, nor will wishing, praying or hoping. Horse ownership is stressful and expensive - I am sorry you are finding out the hard way xx
 
No "professional" can see inside a horse, hence the need for scopes to diagnose.

I've had horse diagnosed with ulcers, after scoping, that had zero symptoms but were scoped for other reasons and ulcers were found. Your horse is presenting as a typical ulcers horse. What you describe screams ulcers so how others are telling you that it's not possible is beyond me.

£360 isn't that expensive for a scope. I paid £246 last month but the horse was staying in hospital. £360 isn't unreasonable but you have to be aware that scoping is a diagnostic tool. If they find ulcers those will need treated and unfortunately will cost more than £360. Neglecting to fully investigate a horse due to cost isn't fair on the horse however hard a pill that is to swallow.

This sort of situation makes me so sad. I hope somehow there is some resolution for the horse. I've cross posted with misst who has said it much better.
 
ycbm said:
As far as I'm aware there are only two horse flu vaccines, Proteq (I think called Prevac as well) and Equip, and I've always paid a very similar price for each of them. What jab are you being told he needs?
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I don't know but it's about £30 extra. But he was out of date of his vaccinations so he had to have 3.
 
misst said:
Well OP I read the previous thread so I think I understand a bit more. TPO in particular has offered some seriously good advice re getting your parents on board with what is needed. I am sorry you are in this situation but I am so so sorry for your horse who is being badly let down by the people around you. I know it is scary for you but instead of keep asking questions that imply you don't want to listen to advice take a deep breath and perhaps ask one of the very very experienced people on here if they could PM you a little support. I bet they would :) .These problems aren't cheap to fix and maybe your parents cannot afford it but the horse has needs that are not being met. Being nice to him, bonding with him, spending time and understanding him are all good things - but they will never ever make him better, nor will wishing, praying or hoping. Horse ownership is stressful and expensive - I am sorry you are finding out the hard way xx
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Yes please, anyone who is very experienced please pm me. I'm so confused with everything, feeds, medical, riding all of it.
 
TPO said:
No "professional" can see inside a horse, hence the need for scopes to diagnose.

I've had horse diagnosed with ulcers, after scoping, that had zero symptoms but were scoped for other reasons and ulcers were found. Your horse is presenting as a typical ulcers horse. What you describe screams ulcers so how others are telling you that it's not possible is beyond me.

£360 isn't that expensive for a scope. I paid £246 last month but the horse was staying in hospital. £360 isn't unreasonable but you have to be aware that scoping is a diagnostic tool. If they find ulcers those will need treated and unfortunately will cost more than £360. Neglecting to fully investigate a horse due to cost isn't fair on the horse however hard a pill that is to swallow.

This sort of situation makes me so sad. I hope somehow there is some resolution for the horse. I've cross posted with misst who has said it much better.
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Yes that is what the vet said. That's why we trying his coligone first, if it makes no difference, then the vet said it quite unlikely he has ulcers.
 
axe1312 said:
Yes please, anyone who is very experienced please pm me. I'm so confused with everything, feeds, medical, riding all of it.
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Just bumping this in the hope that TPO ycbm or one of the other really experienced people on here see this :-). There are some seriously good people here axe and I know you can get some support xx You can usually just PM someone direct if you want their help x
 
axe1312 said:
I don't know but it's about £30 extra. But he was out of date of his vaccinations so he had to have 3.
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If you don’t vaccinate with a booster within a year to the day, you have to start all over again which is the course of 3 you’re referring to.

Re: the £30 extra part- we alternate boosters between flu only and flu with tetanus the next year- I wonder if this is the extra. I can’t say I’ve ever noticed a price difference between the two with my vets though….that said, I have three so there’s a lot going on and perhaps I haven’t noticed.
 
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Re: your vet OP, I wonder if it might be worth asking on a Facebook group in your locality which vet are recommended in your area? There’s a couple of things you’ve posted (hitting the horse, not advising withdrawing hard feed, behaviour) that I’d be less than impressed with. Everyone will of course have their preferences for vets, but there may be common themes/ common names being liked/ disliked if you ask around?

ETA: it’s so important to have a good working relationship and respect for your vet- at times they literally help us evaluate and face life and death decisions- there are a few I absolutely will not entertain (except for dire emergency!) but others I respect the world over and would trust my life to. You should feel in good hands, and if you don’t, find one you do!
 
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axe1312 said:
Yes please, anyone who is very experienced please pm me. I'm so confused with everything, feeds, medical, riding all of it.
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Axe you need someone who is there in person with you, possibly different people for the different things you need to know about.

The forum is great for learning things but there are too many gaps in your knowledge as a very novice first time horse owner for it to be safe for you to rely on a forum. You've no idea on a forum if anyone has the experience to really help you, and anyone who says they can sort out your issues without seeing you and your horse in person probably shouldn't be trusted.

Whereabouts are you, roughly? Somebody may be able to help or point you towards someone who can.
 
I agree with ycbm about not relying on a forum but You can be pretty sure that if most/multiple posters are saying the same thing, you can trust that it is worth trying.
So;
no hard feed for a recovering laminitic,
no alfalfa, if you need a chaff to feed bute in, use a small amount if a grass chaff, such as Emerald Green
No Likkits, or molasses in any form
Push for ulcer investigations
Ask for local recommendations for a reliable equine vet
Are all things that multiple posters have advised
 
Pearlsasinger said:
I agree with ycbm about not relying on a forum but You can be pretty sure that if most/multiple posters are saying the same thing, you can trust that it is worth trying. So;
no hard feed for a recovering laminitic,
no alfalfa, if you need a chaff to feed bute in, use a small amount if a grass chaff, such as Emerald Green
No Likkits, or molasses in any form
Push for ulcer investigations
Ask for local recommendations for a reliable equine vet
Are all things that multiple posters have advised
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Agree, and I have advised Axe to scope when she PMd me for advice.
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Melody Grey said:
If you don’t vaccinate with a booster within a year to the day, you have to start all over again which is the course of 3 you’re referring to.

Re: the £30 extra part- we alternate boosters between flu only and flu with tetanus the next year- I wonder if this is the extra. I can’t say I’ve ever noticed a price difference between the two with my vets though….that said, I have three so there’s a lot going on and perhaps I haven’t noticed.
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No it's definitely a different type. He reacts to one type so we have to use a different more pricey one
 
ycbm said:
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Axe you need someone who is there in person with you, possibly different people for the different things you need to know about.

The forum is great for learning things but there are too many gaps in your knowledge as a very novice first time horse owner for it to be safe for you to rely on a forum. You've no idea on a forum if anyone has the experience to really help you, and anyone who says they can sort out your issues without seeing you and your horse in person probably shouldn't be trusted.

Whereabouts are you, roughly? Somebody may be able to help or point you towards someone who can.
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King's lynn, norfolk
 
OK you are too far from me but maybe somebody can make some recommendations who you should contact. Anyone?
.
 
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