Horse went out on loan returned lame and loanee's asking for bond back???

vroutledge

vroutledge

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I loaned a horse out some time ago whilst i was studying and didnt have enough time to dedicate to him. i originally put him up for sale as i felt he had a lot to offer and was wasted in the field only being ridden at weekends, however i had someone ring me up begging to come and see him but that she had just got married so couldnt afford to buy him straight away.....she wanted to move him to another yard closer to where she lived so i said she would have to sign an official loan agreement and pay a bond of 10% his value just for my peace of mind. He was in very good condition and kept himself relatively fit, he was up to date on all vaccinations/teeth/womers/back etc he had just had a full set of new shoes on and had new saddle/rugs. the lady agreed and my horse went off to his new home........(day1)10am the next morning i received a phonecall from the lady saying my horse had bucked her off in the arena and frightened her..............i had told her not to ride him for at least a week and let him settle in (the arena was surrounded by paddocks with horse in) so she agreed not to try riding him again for atleast a week and then i had advised lunging him before hand when she decides to ride him.................(day 2) phone rings again this time he has apparently tried kicking her when she went in his stable to rug him up whilst he was having his breakfast.(he has never ever kicked and you could take his food away from him and he wouldnt grumble) so not sure what this is about....(day3) yet another phonecall saying she couldnt catch him and that she had to leave him out......(day4) you've probably guessed the pattern by now she rings again ( i know i said call if you have any problems but this took the biscuit) this time she had finally caught him and when leading him to the stable he reared with her and she got rope burn from him dragging her, then when she tied him outside his stable to brush him he apperently tried cow kicking her and biting her.............(day5) by now im am losing patience she was taking up more of my time with phonecalls than my horse did in the first place......she tells me she's had his shoes taken off whilst the farrier was at the yard because she didnt intend on riding him on roads so she didnt think he needed them (never consulted me and the fact he had shoes mainly because he had flat feet) ...........(day6) this time she rings to say he is lame, i asked what area she thought he was lame in and she said she didnt know but she thinks maybe his back.........i said if he is no better in a couple of days get the physio out for it then she said she had seen him slip and fall in the field. so i said he would most definitely need physio to take a look..............(day7) she rings to say she had been lunging him and he was really lame in his hind leg and that she still thought she would attempt to get on (no idea why) he bucked her off again...........she is now very shaken and i just said that enough is enough, my mum was sick of her stories, my horse was the kindest most considerate horse you could ask for he was easy to do in every way. i went to visit and she said she would have brought him in but he wouldnt be caught and tried bucking at her..........i shouted him from the top of the field and he looked up whinnied frantically and galloped lamely up the field......lead him in to the stable on the end of the lead rope no problems unrugged him brushed him whilst he fell asleep...she said he hadnt been this calm at all and she couldnt believe he was making her sound like a liar. i said to her what do you want to do? she said i will try another week and see what happens i replied saying dont ride him get the physio first and just spend time on the ground getting to know him..................phone rings next day saying he had kicked her and she was in tears...i just told my mum and we hitched the trailer and went to pick him up. when we got to the yard there was a group of women all who kept their horse at the same yard and they started verbally abusing me saying ive let her loan a death trap and that he needs PTS and that he is unridable and because i travelled him without travel boots i obviously didnt care about him (not the fact he's never had them on and would probably do more damage than going without for 15mins) it really upset me so i took him back off the trailer and got on him bare back in a headcollar with no hat on and the weather was a blizzard and he never battered an eyelid i jumped off and said i dont see any problem............i got home and the lady rang up about her bond demanding it back ........i said no way and she threatened to ring the police. he returned with a bad back, no shoes, he'd dropped weight and his saddle had a huge scratch on the seat which was in pristine brand new condition before it went and she kept his new full neck rug which cost around £120 ....................Do you think i should have given her bond back?????........Sorry for the rant and long story :-/
 
id be demanding the rug back and telling her to p**s off regarding her bond, she obviously lied about her experience or lack of. Id be sending her the bills for the treatment also!
 
£250 and the contract said that if the owner felt in anyway that the horse had not returned in the same circumstances/condition as it left that the bond would be void or something along those lines i dont have it with me to read it............bearing in mind i had the physio out and he had put his hip out (most likely down to slipping in the field) that was a nice £40 per session for 4/5 sessions (he'd had it done 3 days before he went to the loanee) then i had to have his shoes put back on and my farrier was most upset that she had undone all his work trying to correct his feet so that was £55 then the rug was brand new £120 and my new saddle had a scratch which was so deep i am unable to fix.
 
Wow, alot went wrong in 7 days!! I think i would deduct the cost of having his shoes put back on from the bond and return the balance. He could have hurt his back anywhere and that is bad luck. Pay the balance, with a letter explaining why you have deducted the money, keep a copy and then put it all down to experience.
(OP posted while I was replying)
quote: .bearing in mind i had the physio out and he had put his hip out (most likely down to slipping in the field) that was a nice £40 per session for 4/5 sessions (he'd had it done 3 days before he went to the loanee)
Was he being treated for something else if the physio had been out?
Oh, meant to say, tell them you will be picking up your rug asap. If they no longer have it deduct that from the bond too (sorry, have just reread the first post)
 
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My god the woman sounds a nightmare, what a story. Depends on the amount of money your talking about, considering the short length of time your horse has been gone, the shoes off - which I would be so cross about, not knowing she was doing this or having the permission to do so, the retention of the rug, the Physio costs etc, etc,. she probably doesnt have much of a leg to stand on. The shoe removal could have caused the lameness or contributed to it anyway, who knows. Sounds like your horse was traumatised if all the alleged incidents took place. I dont think the Police would be interested to be honest. Ask your Mum to take legal advice and tell this woman you are doing so, a letter from the Solicitor should sort things and may cost less than returning the bond. Check the terms of your Loan agreement, it may work out that she gets a portion of the bond back after deductions of Physio, saddle repair (did you have any photos of it before it went?), Farrier costs etc.

Hope it works out for you.
 
Depending on how much the bond is i would use it to put your horse back in the condition he went to her in - ie, full shoes, physio, vet for lameness and the petrol to pick him back up :D
 
It's not that he came back lame or thing were damaged/or not returned it was the fact that she had made him out to be such a nasty horse that upset me the most i'd had him from being 5 months old and he was the love of my life and i thought by selling/loaning him it was the right decision so that he wouldnt be just getting older and fatter in a field.
 
depending on your contract, the bond is there for just this sort of thing, take the costs incured out (farrier for reshoing, physio, replacement rug, cost to repair saddle (scratches canbe dealt with easily) & getting it checked that its not damaged internally & then she gets the remainder back.

my last loan (many years ago) kept 1/3 of the deposit/bond due to my delightful big brother slamming the boot shut on saddle the day we packed Tom up to take home! never bothered me as that was the point of it.
 
Sorry, but what exactly was the bond paid for ? Some sort of financial deposit to make sure she was serious about loaning him ?
 
Izzwizz said:
My god the woman sounds a nightmare, what a story. Depends on the amount of money your talking about, considering the short length of time your horse has been gone, the shoes off - which I would be so cross about, not knowing she was doing this or having the permission to do so, the retention of the rug, the Physio costs etc, etc,. she probably doesnt have much of a leg to stand on. The shoe removal could have caused the lameness or contributed to it anyway, who knows. Sounds like your horse was traumatised if all the alleged incidents took place. I dont think the Police would be interested to be honest. Ask your Mum to take legal advice and tell this woman you are doing so, a letter from the Solicitor should sort things and may cost less than returning the bond. Check the terms of your Loan agreement, it may work out that she gets a portion of the bond back after deductions of Physio, saddle repair (did you have any photos of it before it went?), Farrier costs etc.

Hope it works out for you.
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i'd only had it a month and it was made to measure because he had changed shape so much from his previous saddle........and i had only ridden in it on weekends so about 7 or 8 times in total
 
He could have slipped anywhere so that's not her fault. How much weight can he really have lost in 8 days? I would ask her for the return of the rug and remove the cost of the shoeing and then give her back the difference and be thankful you have your horse back reasonably unharmed. I assume she has plenty of witnesses to the horse's "dangerous" behaviour so you may not do too well if she decides to go to Court
 
Aoibhin said:
depending on your contract, the bond is there for just this sort of thing, take the costs incured out (farrier for reshoing, physio, replacement rug, cost to repair saddle (scratches canbe dealt with easily) & getting it checked that its not damaged internally & then she gets the remainder back.

my last loan (many years ago) kept 1/3 of the deposit/bond due to my delightful big brother slamming the boot shut on saddle the day we packed Tom up to take home! never bothered me as that was the point of it.
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i dont know if you saw my previous comment but i worked out total costs and she would technically owe me about another £150
 
Izzwizz said:
My god the woman sounds a nightmare, what a story. Depends on the amount of money your talking about, considering the short length of time your horse has been gone, the shoes off - which I would be so cross about, not knowing she was doing this or having the permission to do so, the retention of the rug, the Physio costs etc, etc,. she probably doesnt have much of a leg to stand on. The shoe removal could have caused the lameness or contributed to it anyway, who knows. Sounds like your horse was traumatised if all the alleged incidents took place. I dont think the Police would be interested to be honest. Ask your Mum to take legal advice and tell this woman you are doing so, a letter from the Solicitor should sort things and may cost less than returning the bond. Check the terms of your Loan agreement, it may work out that she gets a portion of the bond back after deductions of Physio, saddle repair (did you have any photos of it before it went?), Farrier costs etc.

Hope it works out for you.
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This. Also why did she keep the rug?
 
BigRed said:
Sorry, but what exactly was the bond paid for ? Some sort of financial deposit to make sure she was serious about loaning him ?
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People i know have had bad experiences when loaning and horses returned in bad conditions and items broken or not given back so i did it purely as a precaution...the lady seemed so genuine and nice at first but the day i picked my horse up she was awful...it upset me so much with it all..the bond was £250
 
jrp204 said:
Any chance his new saddle could have caused his problems?
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it was made to fit his shape and the saddler said it fitted perfectly and he rode like a dream in it....it was his hip that was out not his back and the physio after said his back was strong and not sore just his hip that was out.
 
vroutledge said:
i had the physio out and he had put his hip out (most likely down to slipping in the field)
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Horses don't put bones out. But that aside - if the horse slipped in the field, that is not her fault.

then i had to have his shoes put back on and my farrier was most upset that she had undone all his work trying to correct his feet
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So she had the shoes taken off and barefoot trim given?

All sounds might odd..............:cool:
 
vroutledge said:
i dont know if you saw my previous comment but i worked out total costs and she would technically owe me about another £150
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Send her an itemised invoice, totalling what it cost you to return the horse to the condition he left you in, less the amount of the bond, send a covering letter, refer her to the contract t's and c's and ask for payment by return.

On another note... how did you let this moron take your horse in the first place?!
 
What horsegirl said.

Plenty of ppl (including many on here) have been scared by a new horse in unfamiliar surroundings.

If your contract said he was to be shod then deduct the cost of that. If not then just give her the money back. (Less the cost of rug if that doesn't get returned).

What she feels/says about your horse won't be improved by you 'cheating' her out of her deposit.

At the end of the day, whilst what happened wasn't by any means ideal she hasn't harmed your horse and has kept in regular contact. In fact she was even prepared to stick with it for a little while longer.

Be happy horse is back home safe :-)
 
amymay said:
Horses don't put bones out. But that aside - if the horse slipped in the field, that is not her fault.



So she had the shoes taken off and barefoot trim given?

All sounds might odd..............:cool:
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this is what i dont understand why would she have his shoes removed when he'd only just had a new set??? he had another 5/6 weeks wear in them......the physio just said it was his hip that he had injured usually caused from slipping in the field.
 
vroutledge said:
this is what i dont understand why would she have his shoes removed when he'd only just had a new set??? he had another 5/6 weeks wear in them......the physio just said it was his hip that he had injured usually caused from slipping in the field.
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To me this just sounds as if the girl thoroughly over horsed herself. She can't have done much damage in 7 days and I imagine that your horse will return to his normal self now he's home.

So, give her a buzz. Arrange to meet up to return the bond and collect your rug.

And as for the tack - that's a tough one, as some people are just so careless. I expect your saddler will be able to do some sort of repair work on it though.
 
Dizzle said:
Send her an itemised invoice, totalling what it cost you to return the horse to the condition he left you in, less the amount of the bond, send a covering letter, refer her to the contract t's and c's and ask for payment by return.

On another note... how did you let this moron take your horse in the first place?!
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its amazing how people can pretend to be...she was really nice and seemed ever so genuine and she came to see him twice, she rode him in the arena and her husband a complete novice eve had a ride and then the next visit she hacked him out........some of the responses on here have made me feel really bad that i havent given her the bond back but at the end of the day this is a horses life......and fair enough she wasnt to blame for him putting his back out but it was under her care and she was full loaning him and agreeing to pay all cost by moving yards
 
Why did she say she was keeping the rug?

I would ask for the rug back and say you will refund the bond minus the cost of shoeing and possibly the cost to repair the saddle. He could have done his back anytime (as it was only 8 days) and not really her fault if he slipped.
 
I appreciate everyones coments and opinion but unless you were in my situation you dont see the stress this has all caused...... the bond was £250 not alot really considering i have spent more than this on his physio since returning which a lot of you keep pointing out that she wasnt to blame but at the end of the day she had taken my horse out on full loan and she wanted to move yards and treat him as her own with a view to buy once she had saved some money....i have asked her about the rug and why she never returned it and she said she cant find it(?????)
 
vroutledge said:
I appreciate everyones coments and opinion but unless you were in my situation you dont see the stress this has all caused...... the bond was £250 not alot really considering i have spent more than this on his physio since returning which a lot of you keep pointing out that she wasnt to blame but at the end of the day she had taken my horse out on full loan and she wanted to move yards and treat him as her own with a view to buy once she had saved some money....i have asked her about the rug and why she never returned it and she said she cant find it(?????)
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I don't deny that it must have been stressful for you.

Put it down to experience and move on.
 
Sarah sum1 said:
Why did she say she was keeping the rug?

I would ask for the rug back and say you will refund the bond minus the cost of shoeing and possibly the cost to repair the saddle. He could have done his back anytime (as it was only 8 days) and not really her fault if he slipped.
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I mentioned before i had purposely had his back and shoes done before he left ready for his new home.
 
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