Horses that kick

[Bonnie Allie]

Having just returned from the dr getting my leg seen to where I was kicked by my friends horse, I’m wondering how the heck a horse can get to 15yrs old and still be a kicker.

I love my friend and am delighted she has moved back to our area after living over 1000km away for the past couple of years. She is well educated, smart and an absolute gun rider in eventing. I enjoy her company and invited her out for a hack post Christmas.

We (hubby and I) buy all our horses as youngsters and bring them on ourselves. Manners are everything and the must be able to hack out in company, calmly, relaxed and not be a clown as we ride on road as well as in the bush. (Forest). Our horses do not kick - ever! They are not even allowed to pull faces at other horses when they are under saddle.

So I guess I was complacent and we were riding side by side chatting when her horse swung his arse and really kicked. No warning.

Luckily he connected with me, not my horse. The force of the kick punctured a hole in my Ariat chaps, my breeches and ripped a hole in my (new) long socks and then a deep hole in my skin. This horse really meant it - this was not a warning.

Because it happened quickly and her concern was for me (I swore like a sailor - using the f-word as a verb, adjective and adverb) the horse couldn’t be disciplined as it was too late.

She wants to ride together regularly but I’m going to have to insist her horse is schooled to ride in company. I feel mean but I think I have to for safety - what do you think?

PS: she offered to buy me new chaps, breeches and socks as well as pay for my x-rays and tetnus shot. Of course I refused - but the thought was well received

 

[White Horse2]

Glad you're ok, I think that often it's the rider rather than the horse, I used to ride out regularly with a horse with sharers, with only one particular rider was the horse competitive, ie kicky, racey, had to be in front, pulling faces etc, never did this with any other rider

 

[Lois Lame]

She wants to ride together regularly but I’m going to have to insist her horse is schooled to ride in company. I feel mean but I think I have to for safety - what do you think?

I think you are wise.

 

[Frano]

I think you need to have a good talk with her about this. Is her horse known for this? Were there subtle signs you both missed. If this kick really came out of no where then it would be hard to relax when riding with this horse. Hope you are okay.

 

[Winters100]

Poor you, and glad you are OK. Truthfully if the horse is 15 I don't think he will ever be able to be trusted. By all means he should be schooled, but going forward be very careful. If it were summer I would wonder whether he had been bitten or stung by an insect, but at this time of year it is hard to see what could cause such behavior.

 

[Gingerwitch]

all I can think is....and if he had connected with your horses leg. No way would I be within 2 horse lengths of this animal, so unless you were prepared to shout all the time I am very sorry it would be a no from me. Did she not worn you ?

 

[twiggy2]

It happens but that does sound extreme, some horses never manage to cope hacking with horses they do not know.
Some don't cope with being so close and without the interference of riders on board would choose to avoid confrontation and keep a distance.
I would offer her one of your horses to hack out with you on but would not hack with this horse again, that sort of Injury takes the fun out of a hobby.

 

[shortstuff99]

One of my horses will kick (or try) to kick others when riding. I've tried everything possible but unfortunately it is a deep set fear she has of other horses. Made worse by her being attacked in a warm up last year. I can't blame her for wanting to now defend herself. All I do now is not let us get in that situation in the first place. Beating or punishing her for it is only going to make it worse.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I’d speak to her first. It may be if your horses don’t know each other that it came out of the blue to her aswell and was unexpected.
I had a horse for years who one day randomly kicked out at a friends horse when we first rode out together. I had no reason to ever suspect he may have done it and after that was of course careful but he never attempted it again.

 

[Red-1]

It would depend on the reaction of the owner, but if they didn't have a robust plan to stop it happening again, I would not ride out with them.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I hope your leg heals well and quickly.

When I first learned to ride I was taught not to get too close to other horses. IMO, if a horse lashes out like that it is the riders' (of both horses usually) fault. It's fine to ride close to another horse that your mount knows well but why on earth would you get close to a horse that yours barely knows on the first ride together?

 

[milliepops]

One of my horses will kick (or try) to kick others when riding. I've tried everything possible but unfortunately it is a deep set fear she has of other horses. Made worse by her being attacked in a warm up last year. I can't blame her for wanting to now defend herself. All I do now is not let us get in that situation in the first place. Beating or punishing her for it is only going to make it worse.

yes I have one that I have to be careful with in company who similarly lacks confidence, she will strike out in front as well as (rarely) threaten behind. it's easy to manage though, just by keeping her in her own space and staying aware, I also inform anyone I ride out with never to let them sniff noses because that's guaranteed to get the front legs going. with a few ground rules in place it's 100% managed. i think the OP's friend could do similar if they were that way inclined, but you do have to take compete responsibility for your horse rather than just casually hope for the best.

 

[Orangehorse]

I have always wondered how to stop a horse from kicking. I once had a mare that would kick, human or horse, but I was aware of it and managed it as far as I could, but it was wearing when in company. I think with her it was plain defensive, but she meant it, it wasn't a warning, unlike a pony mare I had who would give a small buck as warning if something came to close, but she didn't lash out. I have had other horses and ponies that never ever threatened a kick at another horse.

But I always wondered, how do you train a horse not to kick?

 

[Landcruiser]

I have seen horses kick each other suddenly with no perceptible warning, always at events where the horses are strangers to each other. At a funride a few years ago, a mounted rider was kicked in the head by another horse, knocked out completely. Seeing these incidents (and having had my own horse kicked by a stranger's horse whilst riding alongside at a funride) I'd always recommend keeping a safe distance between horses, unless you already know they get along - and even then, it's not 100% certain nobody will kick.
I've had my horse 11 years, he has never ever kicked or even lifted a leg except in play with my other gelding. But there's always the possibility that he could, he's physically capable. You can never be 100% sure.

 

[Griffin]

I own a kicker. When I first got her (she was about 5), she would kick out at any horse she was unfamiliar with and occasionally with humans too. With her is it defensive because she was at the bottom of the pecking order in the field initially and lacked a lot of confidence.

However, as she has got older and has had compassionate and consistent care and riding, she now very rarely kicks. I think because she feels safer and more confident, she feels less need to defend herself. I would never trust her 100% not to kick though (particularly if a vet comes out to treat her and dithers) and I always warn people that she might. We also always wear a red ribbon in company to warn other riders to keep their distance.

 

[gemisastar]

Mine will, very, very occasionally do a warning bunny hop type of kick if another horse gets too far up her backside. Apart from shouting at her when she does it I'm not actually sure what I could do to stop it, although I do tell strange riders to give her space and if I'm at an event put a red ribbon in.

 

[milliepops]

But I always wondered, how do you train a horse not to kick?

if it's not something that has been nipped in the bud when the horse was a youngster than I think like any other undesirable behaviour - firstly try to not put the horse in the position where it feels compelled to kick, and if it does so "inappropriately" by which I'd mean, in a situation where the horse wasn't needing to defend itself, then to quickly reprimand it. i think you need to know the horse to understand they whys and wherefores for each individual really. but mine, for instance, knows not to ever lift a leg to a person and also has no need to because it's strange horses that she is scared of. If she ever did I'd tell her off immediately.

 

[Lipglosspukka]

I'm actually of a different opinion to others. I don't think it would put me off riding with her. I would just be more mindful. More space so the horse is not put in that situation again. We are all well used to being two metres apart, what harm is another meter or two gonna do ?

 

[milliepops]

the issue is that the other horse's rider needs to acknowledge the need for space around their horse first. the OP can't just give extra space if the other person keeps coming into it (same as getting crowded out at the supermarket )

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

the issue is that the other horse's rider needs to acknowledge the need for space around their horse first. the OP can't just give extra space if the other person keeps coming into it (same as getting crowded out at the supermarket )

I read OP more that she is used to riding alongside her OH on horses that she knows well and expected to be able to do so with an unfamiliar horse, who objected. But certainly both riders need to be aware

 

[milliepops]

OP says the friend with the kicking horse wants to ride out together more often which is what I based my reply on so horse and rider will be familiar if they go out again.

 

[Gloi]

Keep the OPs horse in the lead and now you know the horse kicks keep them well away from each other. If you can introduce the horses unmounted in a safe environment and they get to know each other the horse may no longer need to feel defensive.

 

[Leandy]

I would ride with her if I could trust the friend not to let it happen again. It would be a good idea to discuss how to achieve that eg she always needs to stay a bit behind you and you both need to be aware of staying sufficiently far apart. I wouldn't be impressed with someone who just let this happen and did not react quickly enough to reprimand the horse however. I would have to query how experienced she really is. Kicking should be zero tolerance territory, whether the horse is a known kicker or not. It seems you were both a bit complacent and taken by surprise. In a situation such as working in at a competition, I always tell people that it is their own fault if they get kicked because if you make sure you don't get within kicking distance of another horse it cannot happen. I suppose the exception to this would be if something runs backwards into you.

 

[Shysmum]

My advice is to steer well clear. Having had a pony's leg kicked off by a known kicker, in the field, I would never go near a kicker again. Sounds like you got away lightly ?

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

Having just returned from the dr getting my leg seen to where I was kicked by my friends horse, I’m wondering how the heck a horse can get to 15yrs old and still be a kicker.

I love my friend and am delighted she has moved back to our area after living over 1000km away for the past couple of years. She is well educated, smart and an absolute gun rider in eventing. I enjoy her company and invited her out for a hack post Christmas.

We (hubby and I) buy all our horses as youngsters and bring them on ourselves. Manners are everything and the must be able to hack out in company, calmly, relaxed and not be a clown as we ride on road as well as in the bush. (Forest). Our horses do not kick - ever! They are not even allowed to pull faces at other horses when they are under saddle.

So I guess I was complacent and we were riding side by side chatting when her horse swung his arse and really kicked. No warning.

Luckily he connected with me, not my horse. The force of the kick punctured a hole in my Ariat chaps, my breeches and ripped a hole in my (new) long socks and then a deep hole in my skin. This horse really meant it - this was not a warning.

Because it happened quickly and her concern was for me (I swore like a sailor - using the f-word as a verb, adjective and adverb) the horse couldn’t be disciplined as it was too late.

She wants to ride together regularly but I’m going to have to insist her horse is schooled to ride in company. I feel mean but I think I have to for safety - what do you think?

PS: she offered to buy me new chaps, breeches and socks as well as pay for my x-rays and tetnus shot. Of course I refused - but the thought was well received

sorry to hear you got kicked,, My friend got kicked three weeks ago by someone's horse, and she fractured her tibia and fibula open fracture.

 

[Micropony]

I would ride with her again if she is prepared to acknowledge the behaviour is a problem and to agree a plan to ensure everyone stays safe in future, i.e. keep a safe distance between horses. Riding upsides one another close enough to be in kicking range when your horses aren't used to one another could be considered by quite a lot of horses to be a bit of a liberty.

If she thinks it's a non-issue and isn't prepared to take reasonable precautions I would steer clear though. I hacked for years with a 'friend' who has appalling hacking manners and could barely control her horse. She would never admit it was a problem or change her behaviour in any way, and gradually and without me realising it, it has completely shaken my confidence and enjoyment of hacking, even though we're now on different yards and no longer ride together. More fool me.

Hope your leg heals quickly with no lasting damage.

 

[Whoopit]

My friends horse does this.

it doesn’t kick its long term stable mate but any other horse it’s extremely unreliable. He’s generally quite a nice chap (a d1ck as he’s never properly told off) but I don’t trust his back end at all even though he’s only ever kicked other horses, he isn’t a consistent kicker but he does kick. Not at all trustworthy for not decide if to start kicking people!

I just wouldn’t ride out with this horse - it honestly isn’t worth it.

 

[LadyGascoyne]

Mimosa tried it a few times - she kicked out at me once when she didn’t want to be caught, and she kicked at Milagra when I was catching her.

I really didn’t hold back on my opinion on kicking. Mim (luckily, as I have the upper body strength of a noodle) isn’t the sort of horse you ever need to smack. If I yell “Mimosa!” and growl/hiss/launch/clap at her like a crazy person she gets the message.

I think one of the reasons it stuck is that I didn’t let it go, I chased her right away and kept chasing her off when she tried to approach. I held her off for quite a significant period of time until she was really worried and clearly desperate to come back.

She hasn’t done it again so it seems to have worked. I know she was 3 so was very impressionable but I do think that ensuring that the message back to the horse is “respect my personal space and keep your feet to yourself or I will cast you out of my yard and throw you to the wolves” helps.

I don’t think a short, sharp smack necessarily gets them to rethink their position.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Mimosa tried it a few times - she kicked out at me once when she didn’t want to be caught, and she kicked at Milagra when I was catching her.

I really didn’t hold back on my opinion on kicking. Mim (luckily, as I have the upper body strength of a noodle) isn’t the sort of horse you ever need to smack. If I yell “Mimosa!” and growl/hiss/launch/clap at her like a crazy person she gets the message.

I think one of the reasons it stuck is that I didn’t let it go, I chased her right away and kept chasing her off when she tried to approach. I held her off for quite a significant period of time until she was really worried and clearly desperate to come back.

She hasn’t done it again so it seems to have worked. I know she was 3 so was very impressionable but I do think that ensuring that the message back to the horse is “respect my personal space and keep your feet to yourself or I will cast you out of my yard and throw you to the wolves” helps.

I don’t think a short, sharp smack necessarily gets them to rethink their position.

I agree. Our first horse kicked out towards me the first time I tried to catch him. I reacted instantaneously and he never did it again. But that is a very different scenario from a horse that kicks defensively. Both riders should be aware enough to ensure that it never happens.

 

[scruffyponies]

Having taken on several kickers over the years, it is something that usually goes away once the horse is settled and confident which may take a while. That said, one of mine still takes the occasional (once or twice a year) pot shot at the one behind if he feels boxed in.
Keep your distance and/or ride up-sides where they can get used to working together.
Much less of a worry if they're not shod.