How heavy is too heavy?

[bugbee717]

So my haffy was over 110 stone when I got him, 20 percent means he can carry 22 stone. He is now 75 stone so can carry 15 stone now. I had a lesson the other day on him for an hour we pretty much trotted the whole time, he was not even sweating one bit, it was also very hot. I am a balanced rider I am also 20 stone, I can run, I am very active having 3 kids working and 9 horses u have to be. We all view weight very differently, I don't look like the normal 20 stone person. I must add I would dream of getting on a fine tb.

 

[Spins]

When considering weight there's soooo much to take into consideration.. As regards to there being a 12stone limit for horse without considerable bone..I think that's insane..what about thickness of bone in ppl..you may think I'm crazy but I am built like a little 5'6 tank.. My hands and feet are bigger than my dads!!!! My wrists as thick as some of my more petite friends upper arms! When I am at my height of riding/fitness etc I weigh 13 stone I have no illusions as to my weight (i have piled on the pounds after a tough yr in college, slimming world here i come!!) but I would not consider myself too heavy to event my 16.2 tb and he's not a stocky tb.. So should I be limited to riding heavy weights and cobs??

 

[ozpoz]

I totally agree with Soulfull.

Force = mass x acceleration. ( Newton's 2nd Law, I think )
Add that to the possibility that the rider is slightly one sided, as most people are, and you are exerting quite a lot of force on a horse's back, ESPECIALLY at heavier weights.
And, if for some reason the horse and rider move in opposition to each other, which happens sometimes, then that force is magnified even more.

There are lots of people who don't want to know or think about this, unfortunately.

 

[PonyIAmNotFood]

Keep your horse fit and i doubt many would have problems carrying over 12st. At my rs there is no weight limit and the horses last, we have a 27 year old cob who carrys large weights and hasn't had a day lame in the 20 years he's worked there. These horses are kept very fit and healthy, hardly ever break a sweat and as a result can take the larger weights.

 

[Mitchyden]

I weigh 10st naked at the moment but am back on my diet as I'm normally 9 - 9st7lb.
My arab is only five and measures 14.3hh and carries me easily although i do feel guilty.

As an experiment I took my bathroom scales to the yard and weighed myself complete with body protector, hat, boots, chaps, synthetic saddle, girth and stirrups. It came to a grand total of 12st5lb!! Now I feel really guilty although even if i lose half a stone she'll still be carrying almost 12st.

 

[Captain Bridget]

I am 5'8 and 8st12 ish, the horse I ride is a 16.2hh french trotter, he's got quite a long back and his owner said he works better over his back with me than he does for her, she is taller and heavier than me. I've ridden many horses, down to an 11.2hh stocky pony who happily galloped full pelt with me, but that was a few years back and I wouldn't want to do that now.

 

[Wagtail]

So my haffy was over 110 stone when I got him, 20 percent means he can carry 22 stone. He is now 75 stone so can carry 15 stone now. I had a lesson the other day on him for an hour we pretty much trotted the whole time, he was not even sweating one bit, it was also very hot. I am a balanced rider I am also 20 stone, I can run, I am very active having 3 kids working and 9 horses u have to be. We all view weight very differently, I don't look like the normal 20 stone person. I must add I would dream of getting on a fine tb.

So was he 35 stone overweight or is he too thin now? You have to add 2 stone for tack too. I am sorry but man or woman, I think 20 stone is too heavy for any horse to be carrying.

 

[bugbee717]

No he was very overweight, the weigh tape would not go round him at all, he was ridden a lot more then than he is now, but what I do had improved his fitness. Which is the way forward with both of us. I am honest about my weight, most people think I weigh a lot less. Which really shows what people know about weight.

 

[BorgRae]

The subject of weight does worry me I must admit. Especially when I read these threads, and hear that 12st is the limit. I am 12st9lb. I ride a 15.1hh sport horse X. He is a stocky boy and has big bones, and after asking my instructor if I was too heavy, she replied no. I am a good balanced rider, but do still worry.

I have a very broad back and thick set bones, and yes although I could drop a bit of fat, (I am currently dieting and god what I'd give for a piece of cake!! lol!) I'll still weigh heavy.

My boy gets worked 4-5 times a week, for no more than 45 mins to an hour... So as someone else said, I guess that does mean he has 23 hours off a day

 

[PonyIAmNotFood]

The general thing on here appears to be that the heavier you are as a rider the less your horse should do which in my opinion is completely backwards!! The horse should do MORE than average to equip him for you, whether that's ridden once and lunged, hacked in hand, long reined etc. or ridden twice, once by you and once by a lighter rider so he's building up the muscle required to stay sound and fit for you. Once sound and fit it's very easy to keep them there yourself and I don't believe that horses equipped and prepared properly (which should be any ridden animal anyway, whatever your weight) should struggle or have long term issues with over 12st. The issue is plonking that weight on an unfit, unequipped anima, that's when you get long term damage and lameness.

 

[xRobyn]

Unless you are a woman under 5'4" then 12st is ridiculous imo!

Generalisations are difficult. If we're talking over 20st then no, I don't believe 'they' should ride, but I wouldn't have said at 12st you should start to think about your weight! Maybe 15st+ but a well built, fit, correct weight horse with good confo shouldn't struggle with a 12st rider IMO (but of course this is again a generalisation).

Should we at all ever try to generalise? Horses weight carrying ability OR rider weight limits.

I do always smile at people under 10st who comment, especially when riding something over the height of 14.2hh

 

[Megibo]

OP i ask this a lot....

i've got a tough overgrown Welsh C (she's a 13.3 D technically)

i'm 5ft 3

weigh 12 stone....

however, despite her being tough as old leather and carrying me without blinking, i AM doing something about my weight for my height because according to national statistics or whatever i shouldnt weigh over 10st 7.. i'm aiming to lose three stone.

 

[PapaFrita]

So my haffy was over 110 stone when I got him, 20 percent means he can carry 22 stone. He is now 75 stone so can carry 15 stone now.

The 20% rule applies to the ideal weight, there are considerations like fitness and conformation as well, and of course some people ride light and others don't. A very overweight horse will already be carrying unnecessary weight, although the way it's distributed will be easier to carry than if localised in one spot in the form of a rider.
Most native ponies are bred to carry HUGE weights in relation to their own size.

 

[Hippona]

5ft 5 and about 8 st10 right now.

I have a 15hh arab and a 13.3hh highland.

Neither buckle at the knee when I get on ....

 

[Kirwil]

I'm a bit nervous about exercising my brothers pony, he's 11.2 and I'm 5'6 and I reckon fully clothed plus a saddle it'd about 8 1/2 stone on his back. I've met the girl that backed him and she's a lot shorter than me, I think maybe the same weight but I didn't want to look rude and ask her. The last time I rode a Welsh A regularly I was about 5 1/2 stone soaking wet! The child he's intended for is about 4 stone and will not be jumping just walked out on a lead rein, I'm thinking should I get other small people to exercise him to keep his fitness and skill level up and me just stick to schooling him from the ground? I don't want him to be uncomfortable.

 

[Megibo]

5ft 5 and about 8 st10 right now.

I have a 15hh arab and a 13.3hh highland.

Neither buckle at the knee when I get on ....

8st 10 is not alot, my 13.3 still manages to take off with me and not break a sweat i dread to think what she'd do if someone under 10stone got on! of course, i am aiming for 9 stone myself but i've seen her with light light riders and they have trouble holding onto the leetle madam

 

[xRobyn]

I'm a bit nervous about exercising my brothers pony, he's 11.2 and I'm 5'6 and I reckon fully clothed plus a saddle it'd about 8 1/2 stone on his back. I've met the girl that backed him and she's a lot shorter than me, I think maybe the same weight but I didn't want to look rude and ask her. The last time I rode a Welsh A regularly I was about 5 1/2 stone soaking wet! The child he's intended for is about 4 stone and will not be jumping just walked out on a lead rein, I'm thinking should I get other small people to exercise him to keep his fitness and skill level up and me just stick to schooling him from the ground? I don't want him to be uncomfortable.

Do you have a photo? So long as he's fit and has good confo he should be fine with you!

 

[welshcobabe]

As a 5,1 rotund person my fresian x irish draught carries me very well it does cause amusment with my riding pals that my feet come just below the bottom of his saddle cloth but he was only supposed to be 15 hands but he grew and grew to a very solid just a smidge under 16 hands

 

[ozpoz]

As i said, people just don't want to know about being too heavy!!!!

Why is it so hard to recognize a horse moving freely, using his whole back and swinging along ? It simply doesn't manage this with an overweight rider on board.

Why don't people spend more time just watching how horses move??
Then they would understand why many professionals and private owners alike are careful about what they will ask their horses to carry.

Re. the 11.2 lead rein - no, it isn't a good idea to ride more than occasionally.

 

[Wagtail]

As i said, people just don't want to know about being too heavy!!!!

Why is it so hard to recognize a horse moving freely, using his whole back and swinging along ? It simply doesn't manage this with an overweight rider on board.

Why don't people spend more time just watching how horses move??
Then they would understand why many professionals and private owners alike are careful about what they will ask their horses to carry.

Re. the 11.2 lead rein - no, it isn't a good idea to ride more than occasionally.

Agreed. I think around one sixth of the horse's (ideal) weight is the best guide. But also people need to take into account, age, conformation, fitness and breed.

 

[Wagtail]

OP i ask this a lot....

i've got a tough overgrown Welsh C (she's a 13.3 D technically)

i'm 5ft 3

weigh 12 stone....

however, despite her being tough as old leather and carrying me without blinking, i AM doing something about my weight for my height because according to national statistics or whatever i shouldnt weigh over 10st 7.. i'm aiming to lose three stone.

It's not an easy thing to do. You must let us all know how you get on. Well done for making the decision. I remember going on endless diets in my late teens. It was so depressing! Mind you, once I started eating healthily I managed to keep the weight off and still fit in my size ten jods. Good luck!

 

[Leah3horses]

Is there still a fashion for people to be 'over horsed' size wise? A few years ago when I was last on here, there were lots of petite ladies with huge warmbloods? I'm in no way petite lol at 5ft 8 and 13 stone but my Sasha Tank is a Clyde cross of 650kg...but only 15.2, looks and ride much bigger because of her huge frame I've ridden a 14.2 Dales who was a fab weight carrier.

If you look at horses in America, paints,quarter horses etc, none are over 15hh and they aren't as big build as our natives..but they were bred to carry fully grown men all day, for weeks on end (cowboys). To some here they look under horsed, but I think it's our fashion to be over horsed. Any UK strong native pony with decent bone above 13.2hh ish should be able to carry an adult easily.

IMO 20% of the horses weight does apply to fine TBs etc..but not to our natives/IDs/heavies etc...I'd say more like 33% for them..remember their weight is evenly dispersed over 4 strong legs and they are capable of carrying much more weight than most here seem to think..look at Arabs for another example...Champion Endurance Arabs again carry fully grown men at speeds over 100km..I think the current world record holder horse is a little over 13.3hh, and not particularly chunky,just very good dense bone.

Don't think there would be many cases where you'd have to worry about top end weight with our natives, proportionate to height and build of the horse. In all reality, with respect, it's highly unlikely my horse would be expected to carry a 30 stone rider, which is what I'd say her high end rider weight would be

 

[Megibo]

It's not an easy thing to do. You must let us all know how you get on. Well done for making the decision. I remember going on endless diets in my late teens. It was so depressing! Mind you, once I started eating healthily I managed to keep the weight off and still fit in my size ten jods. Good luck!

Thanks Wagtail, i'm thinking by the time i've lost 42 pounds i'll be able to afford a treeless saddle!
I'm moving into the yard (we rent a small private one) for two weeks so all i can do to entertain myself is the horses, exercise and dog walking! it'll be like army camp, LOL-and limited food of course. should be a good kickstart to losing weight...

 

[Leah3horses]

I agree with Janette on this...
"Shires are strong for pulling, but not always for carrying heavy riders"

the same goes for any of the heavier breeds...I think they were all bred for the plough & not for riding?


& I agree with Benson21 about it seems only the female riders are criticized for being "heavier" .....it's so not fair!!

Erm and which horses were originally bred for riding???! They evolved to run free, not carry riders, we have hijacked them for that I have always had heavy horses and heavy crosses...it is totally untrue that they are not riding horses.They are the hardiest, most versatile riding horse in my experienced opinion. Mine even jumps and everything

Humans didn't evolve to sit at computers all day every day but we do...with respect,please file 'heavy horses were bred for ploughing therefore don't make good riding horses' in the old wives tales section along with 'a dog should have a litter before being spayed' and 'your face will stay like that if the wind changes '!!

 

[Leah3horses]

So was he 35 stone overweight or is he too thin now? You have to add 2 stone for tack too. I am sorry but man or woman, I think 20 stone is too heavy for any horse to be carrying.

That's rather a sweeping statement.my horse wouldn't even notice 20stone on her back . Haffies have got to be one of the stongest, toughest horses you can get...they evolved being a working horse, pulling and carrying huge loads up and down MOUNTAINS!! They have very dense, strong bone and a low centre of gravity. With respect please please think about what you are saying, (not you personally, everybody)as if you haven't got the experience or knowledge to back it up, it can come over as sheer ignorance.

 

[firstponyMinto]

Erm and which horses were originally bred for riding???! They evolved to run free, not carry riders, we have hijacked them for that I have always had heavy horses and heavy crosses...it is totally untrue that they are not riding horses.They are the hardiest, most versatile riding horse in my experienced opinion. Mine even jumps and everything

Humans didn't evolve to sit at computers all day every day but we do...with respect,please file 'heavy horses were bred for ploughing therefore don't make good riding horses' in the old wives tales section along with 'a dog should have a litter before being spayed' and 'your face will stay like that if the wind changes '!!

Ooooopsss.......sorry if I've offended you.......

 

[Leah3horses]

Ooooopsss.......sorry if I've offended you.......

No, not at all offended, just trying to educate against old wives tales and share my experience and knowledge, which is part of being on this forum People can have different opinions, doesn't mean if we don't agree we are offended But I do think opinions should be based on facts or experience Thank you for taking the time to post , but no apology needed

 

[Kirwil]

Do you have a photo? So long as he's fit and has good confo he should be fine with you!

As i said, people just don't want to know about being too heavy!!!!

Re. the 11.2 lead rein - no, it isn't a good idea to ride more than occasionally.

He's not fit, he's fat and has only been very lightly schooled as young and been brought on steadily. I have found 3 children who want to ride, one of whom is a bit older and more experienced to go off lead rein. I can't put my brother on him until he understands he has to be peaceful around horses. I put my sister on him bareback today, she is just under 8 stone and he didn't behave any differently to when I took him out in the morning with no rider but it was just a stroll.

What would consititute occassional? Once or twice a month? Should I wait until he's fitter, using a small rider until then? I've seen so many people saying how natives are good weight carriers but his back is near enough level with my hips and I swear I'll crush him.

 

[Janette]

The point I was making, was that some people assume that because a horse is strong in one role, it can carry large weights.
However, It just occurred to me, that Shires were used in the early days for Knights in full armour, to fight and joust with.

I weigh considerably more than 12 stone. My horse is 14.2. Her heritage is Dales pony x with Gypsy cob. She has 9" of flat dense bone. She does not struggle one jot. Her back is fine. She has a touch of arthritis in one hock (she's 14) and I put that down to her tendency to lower her croup and piaffe/passage when stropping because we are not going as fast as she would like.

I think people under estimate a horse. When a troop horse is stood for 8 hours on sentry duty, carrying a man in full ceremnial rig weighing in at around 20 stone (inc tack) do people worry about the weight it is carrying? I think not.
HW hunters carry more than 14stone for a day, galloping and jumping over heavy, uneven ground. So why aren't the 'anti's ' protesting against this aswell as the future of the fox?
Horses which race over jumps carry 12stone - at speed.

I have always been told that a native pony can carry 1 stone per hand of height, so you people who weigh 9stone dripping wet, and are worried about riding a Welsh Sec A..... They were bred to carry shepherds up mountains, as were the Shetland Ponies.
Dales and Fells were Draught ponies, for carrying the iron and lead down from the Pennines. Dales Ponies would carry the shepherds in winter, along with a bale of hay over the tops to the sheep.

Wonder how much Oli Townsend weighs, and if he worries about doing courses like Badminton because of his weight and the effect on his horse?

 

[ozpoz]

You can easily work from the ground with a lead rein, if yuou don't feel right for him - he needs to learn to go by voice, to do his job, so lunging and long reining will get him fit without the worry of doing his back in.
i realise not everyone feels this way , but to me, if the picture is wrong then there is something wrong - and I can't see 8i/2 stone on 11.2 lead rein and think it looks ok!

And the old "Arabian and fully grown man hundreds of miles easily thing" - yes, they are famous for having dense bone, and yes, the average Beduoin male is probably well under 12 stone