How much rein contact?

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RIDMagic

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So I'm hoping for some advice. I have a 4 year old mare who can be a little lazy in the school. Not dead to the leg, but not moving forward with as much impulsion as she should. I have a lovely instructor who is very sympathetic and not a ‘whips and spurs’ person, which is great for me.

In my lessons, I am working on taking up the rein contact. I’ve always been terrible for having 'washing line reins', as I hate to feel as though I'm pulling on the mouth. The problem is that although my instructor assures me I am simply taking up a contact, I honestly feel like I’m really pulling on my horse’s mouth. I know it should feel like I have an elastic contact, but it really doesn’t. If I give away the reins completely, my horse just goes round with her head stuck out in front of her (in fact she does that anyway, but if I hold a stronger contact and gently ‘sponge’ the outside rein then she starts dropping her head, albeit inconsistently atm). I do ride with quite bulky rubber reins atm (only because they came with the bridle); I wonder if I was to buy some smaller leather reins it might make a difference to how it feels.

If I watch Carl Hester schooling his horses, he doesn’t hold a strong contact at all, in fact his reins are often clearly relaxed, yet his horses work in a lovely outline. Does this come through years of the horse learning to carry itself, then it becomes a natural position? My instructor did say that with a young horse, you often have to begin with a stronger contact in order for them to learn how to carry themselves and where their head should be. So I guess if I can just get my horse going on the bit then in time she will become softer?

Any advice would be appreciated. :)
 
An outline does not come from the rein, my instructor always used to say that contact is like holding your horses hand. IMHO 4 years old is too young to be looking for a consistent outline and I would be more worried about increasing her impulsion and getting her to move forward and off the leg. Outline can come along later.
Also I find it impossible to use those bulky rubber reins, try the half and half ones.
I assume you have done all the checks...teeth, back saddle?

Remember have fun too!
 
Thanks for that. I'm trying to get her moving forward by using my schooling whip to give her a tap as soon as she doesn't react to my leg, as I was finding myself nagging her with my leg. As you say she is young and I can't expect too much, but another thing my instructor said is that it's quite important to work on the outline from a young age otherwise they don't develop the necessary muscles and will find it more difficult to begin working correctly the older they get.

She has a new fitted saddle so all ok there, teeth have been checked.

As you say, can't forget to have fun!
 
Every horse works in an outline, just not necessarily the outline people want. As she's only 4 I would be working on strengthening her up from behind and don't worry about an outline, go with your gut, listen to your horse not your instructor. Do hacking, hill work, raised trotting poles, gymkhana games, western manouvres, anything to make her use her back end a little bit more
 
Thanks for the advice. The hacking isn’t great where we are, plus she is a bit nappy on her own (stubborn not scared, but we are working through it) but I can definitely try some raised trotting poles, jumping, lateral work etc. She can be a typical mare, can be stroppy when I put my leg on - nothing terrible, just ears back, tail swishing etc. The physio is coming out just to be on the safe side but we’re 99.9% sure it’s just stroppiness. She can be sluggish in the indoor school so I wonder if she finds it boring, even though we only go in there about 3 times a week. Any tips for motivating her and getting her moving forward would be great. At the moment I just ride her through her strop, and give her a touch with the schooling whip if she doesn’t listen to my leg the first time.

So should I just forget the contact for now, until I can get more impulsion? Another point – she lives out 24/7 and doesn’t have any hard feed so she may perk up a bit in winter when she’s in at night.
 
i can see what your instructor is saying about building the muscles early so its easier in later life. but it is more important for a horse to be moving forward. then you can build on other things. if the horse isnt going forward then when you ask for head carriage he/she is more likely to drag the back end and start leaning on your hands. i was always taught to start with the back end and the front will follow. i agree with the above statement about hillwork/hacking etc. maybe she is getting bored in the school. i dont ride my 12 yr old in the school more than once a week as he gets so bored and unresponsive. instead when we are hacking i will ask him simple things eg. his halts or when doing gates his leg yeilding and when we canter along paths i sometimes ask for change of pace (collection/extended) just to keep him interested and responsive. if i go on the same hack twice in a row he gets bored and a bit nappy so i try to mix it up as much as possible.

even if the hacking isnt great round your area you can try different approaches to schooling. like suggested some gymkhana games like bending may liven her up and make her responsive. if you think she will struggle try and make it easier for her, its got to be fun for her or she wont want to learn.
 
I'm going to quote directly from Gerd Heuschmann's 'Classical Dressage vs. Modern Dressage' because it's a wonderful book with a lot of very valuable information on training horses young and old :)

The Training Scale

1. Rhythm
2. Looseness
3. Contact
4. Impulsion
5. Straightness
6. Collection

The Young Horse

One thing is certain: the initial training stage should be basic and unspectacular. It should only serve the purpose of strengthening skeletal muscles, developing forwardness, and building a positive relationship between horse and human. [...]

The first goal of the young horse is to be happily moving forward in rhythm. It should be allowed to carry its head and neck in a position that's as free as possible. the way this is accomplished is with soft, elastic, and even contact between the rider's hand and the horse's mouth.

As the foundation for work to follow, the first three elements of the training scale - rhythm, looseness and contact - should be achieved within the first one and a half years, but it is inappropriate to adhere to a rigid time frame since many individual traits of the rider and the horse greatly influence the development of the pair.


I hope this helps :)
 
RIDMagic said:
In my lessons, I am working on taking up the rein contact. I’ve always been terrible for having 'washing line reins', as I hate to feel as though I'm pulling on the mouth. The problem is that although my instructor assures me I am simply taking up a contact, I honestly feel like I’m really pulling on my horse’s mouth. I know it should feel like I have an elastic contact, but it really doesn’t.
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The part in bold is telling. I entirely agree that you shouldn't be pulling them into a contact but equally you can't let them slope around with the reins slack. Think of it as any impulsion you do manange to create then dribbles out their nose if you've not got a contact.

I suspect your instructors trying to teach you to keep ANY contact at the moment and if a strong contact makes you pick the reins up, so be it.
You're absolutely right, the contact shouldn't be a hard pull but there should BE one. It does take a long time to develop and remember and requires absolutely independent hands from seat

Ditto the suggestions about going forwards. It's very hard to practise a good light contact if they feel like the handbrakes stuck on.

How about getting elastic inserts? They will give you an idea of how much 'pull' to take as they're meant to stretch a little but not max out.

I've schooled quite a few similar horses and I take a soft consistent contact but otherwise ignore their head carriage and work entirety on riding them forwards, rhythmically and making sure they're straight (so even reins and no twisting the head or body to a prefered side). Forget about ' outline' as that can only come correctly once they're going forwards.
 
All these suggestions are great, thanks! I am very conscious that I shouldn't be trying to ask her to work in a 'proper' outline when she's not moving forwards energetically, and I suppose it's a fine line between containing the energy and just killing it even more.

Those elastic reins sound like a brilliant idea for me, if only to help me get a feel of how it should be. Although the Carl Hester ones are expensive! I presume there are others...?

Do you agree that a horse will become lighter and softer in the mouth the more supple they become? So you may need to hold a stronger contact with a younger horse (presuming they are working forwards with impulsion) until they learn how to carry the rider?
 
RIDMagic said:
As you say she is young and I can't expect too much, but another thing my instructor said is that it's quite important to work on the outline from a young age otherwise they don't develop the necessary muscles and will find it more difficult to begin working correctly the older they get.
Click to expand...

Completely agree with your instructor. If you teach the horse to work correctly from day one in a frame relevant to it's level of training it learns that it is expected to go like that. If you let them go round with their head in the air then suddenly decide that because they're now 5 (or whatever age) you are going to ask for an outline the horse will likely argue because you are suddenly changing your expectations.
 
Most horses will take a light contact, but you have to really avoid getting into that habit of pulling, as every horse will just pull back. Even my youngster, who is a big lump, will ride on a very light contact, but if you do brace your hands, he will lean on them. You still need a contact, but you shouldn't be holding the head down - imagine you're holding a baby bird that you don't want to escape, but you don't want to harm it. That was how it was described to me and seems a good analogy.

It shouldn't feel like you're pulling back on the reins at all, more like holding them in place. Get the reins to the correct length, hold them in place (but gently, still follow the movement of the horse, just try not to slip them, that's my worst habit) and ride forwards into it, using little tiny squeezes on the reins (and I mean very light, just with one finger) to get her to relax her jaw, and then a half half if she comes above the bit.
 
maybe you're a closet western rider? I used to feel exactly the same, but in western your reins will be LOOSE! Making the transition was like coming home for me, I had an english dressage western lesson the other day and constantly had to be told to keep my elbows in and 'take a contact'. By the end I'd got it but my god, i felt like I was holding the horse's head up for it!?
 
RIDMagic said:
Do you agree that a horse will become lighter and softer in the mouth the more supple they become? So you may need to hold a stronger contact with a younger horse (presuming they are working forwards with impulsion) until they learn how to carry the rider?
Click to expand...

NO.
 
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