How much?

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dwmd

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13.2hh, gypsy cob, rising 9
Ride & drive. Green in cart, only really plodded in it. Great in traffic, pretty much bombproof only has a startle every now and then but no major spooks. To ride he is off the leg but a very leg on ride, once he's going he has fun. Green as grass, no knowledge of schooling. Only really cantered out in company, not in school. Can pop a log but unbalanced. Amazing personality, always trying to cuddle and sweet as anything! Real in your pocket once he likes you. Good for barefoot farrier, okay for dentist, needs twitch for legs & belly/ sheath to be clipped, can't do face even with twitch, manageable for sheath cleaner. Only kicks during clipping/ sheath cleaning never any other time. Never bitten. Can have a little bit of a buck when excited in canter, has a history of having a rear in him but very very seldom ever happened & not recently. Can be nappy, will spin to go home if he can get away with it but perfect once hes told who the boss is!
 
Hes going to be a difficult sale. If he rears he shouldn't be driven so its unlikely anyone will want to continue that. It sounds like he needs a very competent small adult or teen to bring him on but those sorts of people don't want to spend a lot and quite often prefer the flashier types. The fact he's a sweet person will go in his favour though. Is he negative for PSSM?
 
If he was chonky enough, then he sounds like something I would probably have for myself.

Assuming these rears are not dangerously high, then I would take a punt at £1500.

ETA: this is assuming he only has a barefoot farrier because he has cracking feet and doesnt need shoes and NOT because he would deck someone trying to put shoes on him 😅
 
Your not retiring on it, but something to someone with the knowledge to deal with the bucks and rears and school on to a level they want him to be, ie balanced over fences and schooled enough to attend a low level clinic or pop round a small course.

I think @Jenko109 suggested a fair price.
 
Jenko109 said:
If he was chonky enough, then he sounds like something I would probably have for myself.

Assuming these rears are not dangerously high, then I would take a punt at £1500.

ETA: this is assuming he only has a barefoot farrier because he has cracking feet and doesnt need shoes and NOT because he would deck someone trying to put shoes on him 😅
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Thanks. Yep rears are not at all dangerously high, never reared in the trap. He would go with full wardrobe including cart. Don't think his feet are cracking, very slow growing & flat for his type though, bit of a t*at for farrier! Forgot to mention, had a few bouts of lami, needs careful management. Had locking stifle as a youngster which flared up last time he had a week off (over winter). Genuinely lovely pony, very eager to please. Can carry 11.5 st
 
I'm Dun said:
Hes going to be a difficult sale. If he rears he shouldn't be driven so its unlikely anyone will want to continue that. It sounds like he needs a very competent small adult or teen to bring him on but those sorts of people don't want to spend a lot and quite often prefer the flashier types. The fact he's a sweet person will go in his favour though. Is he negative for PSSM?
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Not been tested; doesn't rear anymore really, only did it when napping under saddle or for farrier. Angelic & docile otherwise usually, great to catch, tack up, lunge, groom, feet etc
 
I'm Dun said:
Hes going to be a difficult sale. If he rears he shouldn't be driven so its unlikely anyone will want to continue that. It sounds like he needs a very competent small adult or teen to bring him on but those sorts of people don't want to spend a lot and quite often prefer the flashier types. The fact he's a sweet person will go in his favour though. Is he negative for PSSM?
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Why is rearing a hard no for driving but bucking is not? I would have thought bucking was riskier as could get a leg over the shafts or tangled in traces
 
dwmd said:
Not been tested; doesn't rear anymore really, only did it when napping under saddle or for farrier. Angelic & docile otherwise usually, great to catch, tack up, lunge, groom, feet etc
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It doesnt matter. If something has reared it shouldn't be driven, so no one is going to drive that sort of pony. Napping and spinning can be another huge issue as that's how carriages get tipped up.

Id test for PSSM and have the pony schooled and the issues sorted. It will make him much easier to sell and potentially get you your money back.
 
FieldOrnaments said:
Why is rearing a hard no for driving but bucking is not? I would have thought bucking was riskier as could get a leg over the shafts or tangled in traces
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You can get a bucking strap to supposedly stop it being an issue. My mentor had her leg smashed to bits by a bucking pony in a carriage so I wouldn't touch a bucker unless it was an easily solvable issue. But rearing is an absolute no. You don't want to be sitting in a carriage and have a horse come over on you, or have one rear and spin and tip the carriage up.
 
Jenko109 said:
Oh...

My opinion has changed dramatically now you have mentioned lami.

I'm afraid I would now agree with AmyMay. A few hundred quid at best. It's just too much stress for me to want to deal with.
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I had agreed with your estimate until further information was given. I would say top whack of £500 with FULL disclosure given.
 
I would echo the £500 with full disclosure, and I think even then you'd be lucky to get him a good home at that price which is what would worry me. For my peace of mind, and if I had it, I'd be spending some money getting him out and less green and a bit more educate, give him a fighting chance
 
I once had a pony whose rearing (from lack of confidence) tapered off by the age of 5 and was gone to never appear again by 6. But he didn’t change home and I would not have sold him - it would probably have reappeared if he had changed home as he would have felt less secure. He was, for us, as an adult, the pony you could put a beginner on and he would teach them to ride (he did, more than once).

Anyway…

On price I don’t know but I can tell you what I have bought recently for comparison:

£1k (last summer)
13.2hh 8yo mare. Tanks off with novices in the school but fine with a competent rider. Spooks like anything - big leaps across the track/road/field. Had to be re taught how to canter properly and how to go in an outline. Basically sweet with farrier, vet, dentist. Easy to handle if you are confident, pulls to grass if not. Bombproof in the heaviest of traffic and with sheep/cows etc. Doesn’t jump high but seems to have an idea how to turn corners etc and does lock on. Snaffle mouthed. I was told doesn’t buck which is half true - she only bucks if you tell her to put more effort in when she feels she IS trying her hardest. Awful to clip at first as she is allergic to some clipper oils and she remembers - once you are 5min in and it’s not itching she relaxes and stands still. Basically safe for a small competent adult who doesn’t mind a spook that never goes anywhere much, while being fun and sparky to ride with an endlessly willing attitude in the school. I absolutely adore her!

I have just seen a similar sized mare advertised this year for slightly more - hacks beautifully with a novice child, green in the arena, lacks fitness, naps a bit (in ad, probably a lot in reality!).

I also took on one a few weeks ago for my son for the lower end of people’s estimates, because the pony was dangerous on the ground but sweet (albeit very unfit) to ride. She’s everything we needed and is quickly becoming much easier to handle - but we are an experienced home who take on ‘interesting’ projects as a matter of course.

Yours needs an adult rider and an experienced home, who will understand he will probably revert to rearing on the huge upheaval of change of home and are happy to deal with that. Problem is he’s small and has little actual schooling - those will combine with the negative aspects of his ridden work, plus the laminitis management, to leave what is probably a lovely pony in the right hands as being worth very little in terms of price.

To ensure his future I would be tempted to get some decent schooling by a pro into him if you can afford it, and to get him used to other people/perhaps change of home if he went away for schooling. I find the tricky ones move home more successfully with lots of exposure first to other people and places. If you could eliminate some of the issues and present a beautifully schooled pony who probably won’t become wildly unsettled on change of home, then his future would be more assured.
 
It sounds like a few weeks in an experienced home being properly worked and assessed could work out this pony’s value. He sounds super green and slightly confused. But if he is really a napping bucking rearing tricky to shoe one even with correct work then you’re not looking at much.
 
After catching up with comment I think I'd be inclined to loan him to someone experienced with the option to buy at an already agreed price further down the line if pony and loaner are happy. Sounds like with the lami and the locking stifle he is going to need careful management and wouldn't suit the majority of homes. For instance I give my horses most of the winter off as I'm not able to ride in daylight and I'm not a fan of getting wet and cold.
 
RE the bucking & rearing, he has only ever reared when that was the only place to go, never been big or dangerous just a moment of him saying he doesn't know what to do! Bucking only ever happens in canter and just when he is having the best time ever, he is ridden by a 6yo girl off lead rein in walk & trot and is angelic.
 
I think sadly you're going to struggle in the market to sell your lad - cobs usually are gone like hen's teeth, but sadly he has quite a few issues from what I've read (lami, rearing, locking stifle) which would put a lot of people off (including me).

I would say an absolute maximum of £700 with full disclosure and assuming he'd come with all tack, cart etc.

Would it be possible to send him away for some schooling - or perhaps have a friend help you school him? It would help to increase his value a bit to say maybe between £2,000 and £3,000 but again sadly the lami, rearing and locking stifle are going to be a problem for most people, unless someone experienced buys him, as it's quite a lot to manage.

Maybe a good idea would be what @dorsetladette has said and loan him to someone, full disclosure and if all parties are happy, sell him further down the line - that way both parties know exactly what they're getting themselves into, have enough time to adjust to any issues that could arise and you'd get to know the potential new owners quite well which could help put any worries at ease :)
 
I would be cautious of selling this horse cheap.

There are a lot of dreamers about who will snap up the chance to buy a cheap ridden pony without any real consideration of his health problems and how he needs properly managed. Also because he’s a sweet boy they won’t consider how his behavioural issues could escalate in the wrong hands. They will just want a horse they can ride and being a few hundred quid will mean he’s easily purchased.

I have no idea what he’s worth, probably not a lot but I wouldn’t sell him for under £1000 unless it was a LWVTB to the right person.
 
dwmd said:
RE the bucking & rearing, he has only ever reared when that was the only place to go, never been big or dangerous just a moment of him saying he doesn't know what to do! Bucking only ever happens in canter and just when he is having the best time ever, he is ridden by a 6yo girl off lead rein in walk & trot and is angelic.
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it doesnt matter. Legally rearing is a vice you have to disclose. A hang over from an old law I think. But most people wont touch a rearer. Horses who rear always have it as an evasion, it never goes. So you get a new saddle fitted, it doesn't fit and pinches, he's going to rear then, or something scares him, he's going to rear then. Schooling would iron a lot of his issues out, but you wont get your money back from it, as well as declaring the rearing he's had lammi which is a nightmare to manage on a lot of livery yards so again puts most people off.

Loaning carefully is your best bet.
 
maya2008 said:
I once had a pony whose rearing (from lack of confidence) tapered off by the age of 5 and was gone to never appear again by 6. But he didn’t change home and I would not have sold him - it would probably have reappeared if he had changed home as he would have felt less secure. He was, for us, as an adult, the pony you could put a beginner on and he would teach them to ride (he did, more than once).

Anyway…

On price I don’t know but I can tell you what I have bought recently for comparison:

£1k (last summer)
13.2hh 8yo mare. Tanks off with novices in the school but fine with a competent rider. Spooks like anything - big leaps across the track/road/field. Had to be re taught how to canter properly and how to go in an outline. Basically sweet with farrier, vet, dentist. Easy to handle if you are confident, pulls to grass if not. Bombproof in the heaviest of traffic and with sheep/cows etc. Doesn’t jump high but seems to have an idea how to turn corners etc and does lock on. Snaffle mouthed. I was told doesn’t buck which is half true - she only bucks if you tell her to put more effort in when she feels she IS trying her hardest. Awful to clip at first as she is allergic to some clipper oils and she remembers - once you are 5min in and it’s not itching she relaxes and stands still. Basically safe for a small competent adult who doesn’t mind a spook that never goes anywhere much, while being fun and sparky to ride with an endlessly willing attitude in the school. I absolutely adore her!

I have just seen a similar sized mare advertised this year for slightly more - hacks beautifully with a novice child, green in the arena, lacks fitness, naps a bit (in ad, probably a lot in reality!).

I also took on one a few weeks ago for my son for the lower end of people’s estimates, because the pony was dangerous on the ground but sweet (albeit very unfit) to ride. She’s everything we needed and is quickly becoming much easier to handle - but we are an experienced home who take on ‘interesting’ projects as a matter of course.

Yours needs an adult rider and an experienced home, who will understand he will probably revert to rearing on the huge upheaval of change of home and are happy to deal with that. Problem is he’s small and has little actual schooling - those will combine with the negative aspects of his ridden work, plus the laminitis management, to leave what is probably a lovely pony in the right hands as being worth very little in terms of price.

To ensure his future I would be tempted to get some decent schooling by a pro into him if you can afford it, and to get him used to other people/perhaps change of home if he went away for schooling. I find the tricky ones move home more successfully with lots of exposure first to other people and places. If you could eliminate some of the issues and present a beautifully schooled pony who probably won’t become wildly unsettled on change of home, then his future would be more assured.e will not end up in any home that is less than perfect. He has been put on full loan to us. Have been working on him a few months and this is his description prior to being brought on. Reason for thread is he was for sale prior to loan for quite a lot & want to know rough value
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He is on full loan with us now. I have been building him up over the past few months and wanted some impartial guesses! Thanks all.



Now he can wtc in the school, still not yet fabulously balanced/ no outline, still quite heavy in the hand, does try and nap to the gate but it isn't awful and all four feet stay on the ground.

No bucking while cantering through fields with others, I personally believe he was just not strong enough to canter properly so just got legs in a muddle trying

Clipping is being worked on, doesn't need twitch for body only legs, belly & haven't attempted face.

Groundwork: Established side pass, hind yield both ways, parks at mounting block, changes direction on lunge without being stopped & turned, comes to call, picks up feet with a tap, can flex head to pressure, stands still and waits on his own when told to stand

Now regularly ridden off lead by 6yo and very respectful & docile

Napping has totally gone, never appears with me however novice friend rode him whilst I walked with them & he ended up tanking off (getting her off) as she allowed him to spin etc - my fault for not grabbing him but didn't expect that of him, usually looks after his rider.

He has only ever reared twice that I've seen and both were pathetic! About 30cm off the ground then straight down. Happened the first time we split up with someone out hacking, and when being desensitised to clippers.

RE lami, he had some pedal rotation but is perfectly sound now and the management is getting easier, has shown no signs of it this winter or spring so we believe his new workload is enough - his grazing is unrestricted at the moment, however he will be restricted in spring. Locking stifle hasn't caused an issue after a week of inhand, but he didn't get any other time off when it was cold (as a preventative)

Great to catch, tie up, tack up, hacks alone and in company, no bite, never kicked until we tried to clip legs & never would; very genuine chap. Have begun some jumping, absolutely loves it and has quite a smooth jump if ridden into it properly.

Freejumped down bounces & single fences up to 70. Only been jumped under saddle up to around 40 as he is still very new to it.



In contrast what do you reckon he would be worth now? Only asking we would be interested in buying. Thanks all!
 
Putting in a buck going into canter isn't unusual with a young pony and given your description, I would not consider him to be a bucker.

Likewise, lifting front feet barely off the ground when first faced with being left alone during a hack would not lead me to call him a rearer either.

Although he may be safe enough for the kids to pop on in a controlled environment, it does not sound like he will ever be a childs pony.

The clipping would not be a deal breaker for most people. Inconvenient if you have to sedate to get the job done properly, but not the end of the world.

The Laminitis though. It just slashes his worth for most people. Dramatically.

If you like the pony and want to keep him, going in with your eyes wide open knowing selling him on in the future (should you ever need to) is going to be a hard slog, then maybe offer £800.
 
Jenko109 said:
Putting in a buck going into canter isn't unusual with a young pony and given your description, I would not consider him to be a bucker.

Likewise, lifting front feet barely off the ground when first faced with being left alone during a hack would not lead me to call him a rearer either.

Although he may be safe enough for the kids to pop on in a controlled environment, it does not sound like he will ever be a childs pony.

The clipping would not be a deal breaker for most people. Inconvenient if you have to sedate to get the job done properly, but not the end of the world.

The Laminitis though. It just slashes his worth for most people. Dramatically.

If you like the pony and want to keep him, going in with your eyes wide open knowing selling him on in the future (should you ever need to) is going to be a hard slog, then maybe offer £800.
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Totally agree re the bucking and rearing! I do understand your point. To be honest, I may be biased but I reckon he would be a cracking older kids pony (thinking like 9yo ish) and I don't agree that he is only worth triple digits! The market is mental right now and considering he is ride and drive and safe enough for a kid?! Am I insane? Maybe I haven't done him justice! He is brilliant, always canters over to meet you, wicked at learning stuff, really willing, always down for a good canter but equally okay to just have a plod. I suppose now I am thinking I can see why he wouldn't be worth much but he is a wicked little pony, and he has a decent jump on him, hacks alone and in company, doesn't hot up in fields, perfect on roads etc!
 
dwmd said:
He is on full loan with us now. I have been building him up over the past few months and wanted some impartial guesses! Thanks all.



Now he can wtc in the school, still not yet fabulously balanced/ no outline, still quite heavy in the hand, does try and nap to the gate but it isn't awful and all four feet stay on the ground.

No bucking while cantering through fields with others, I personally believe he was just not strong enough to canter properly so just got legs in a muddle trying

Clipping is being worked on, doesn't need twitch for body only legs, belly & haven't attempted face.

Groundwork: Established side pass, hind yield both ways, parks at mounting block, changes direction on lunge without being stopped & turned, comes to call, picks up feet with a tap, can flex head to pressure, stands still and waits on his own when told to stand

Now regularly ridden off lead by 6yo and very respectful & docile

Napping has totally gone, never appears with me however novice friend rode him whilst I walked with them & he ended up tanking off (getting her off) as she allowed him to spin etc - my fault for not grabbing him but didn't expect that of him, usually looks after his rider.

He has only ever reared twice that I've seen and both were pathetic! About 30cm off the ground then straight down. Happened the first time we split up with someone out hacking, and when being desensitised to clippers.

RE lami, he had some pedal rotation but is perfectly sound now and the management is getting easier, has shown no signs of it this winter or spring so we believe his new workload is enough - his grazing is unrestricted at the moment, however he will be restricted in spring. Locking stifle hasn't caused an issue after a week of inhand, but he didn't get any other time off when it was cold (as a preventative)

Great to catch, tie up, tack up, hacks alone and in company, no bite, never kicked until we tried to clip legs & never would; very genuine chap. Have begun some jumping, absolutely loves it and has quite a smooth jump if ridden into it properly.

Freejumped down bounces & single fences up to 70. Only been jumped under saddle up to around 40 as he is still very new to it.



In contrast what do you reckon he would be worth now? Only asking we would be interested in buying. Thanks all!
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I would offer £1k max. You did all the work!
 
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