I need advice on how to fatten up my 16yr TB! Please help me to help him...poor boy!

Personally I would talk to Baileys with regard to a proper feed regime...Im not knocking getting general advice from a forum as I do just that. What I wouldnt be doing is trying get someone to give you a specific feed program for your horse...none of us can tell what your horsey really needs as for starters we dont know what he looks like in 'real' life and we dont know what type of work he is doing etc. General advice is great but I would be getting in touch with someone like Baileys and listening to the vets advice which sounds like it made alot of sense!
 
redriverrock said:
Personally I would talk to Baileys with regard to a proper feed regime...Im not knocking getting general advice from a forum as I do just that. What I wouldnt be doing is trying get someone to give you a specific feed program for your horse...none of us can tell what your horsey really needs as for starters we dont know what he looks like in 'real' life and we dont know what type of work he is doing etc. General advice is great but I would be getting in touch with someone like Baileys and listening to the vets advice which sounds like it made alot of sense!
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Your very right and I've found this forum extremely helpful..thanks guys. I'm awaiting a reply from Baileys website as we speak...10days apparently! I've spent the evening researching all the feeds people have mentioned on here and I am going to make a few changes straight away as it seems people agree that What I'm feeding him is actually giving the opposite effect as he's burning it off by being stressed!

Anyway, I've decided on

Alfa A oil chaff
Baileys topline cubes
Baileys outshine
Naf pink powder


Going to work out the amounts and obviously introduce slowly. I'll give him a bucket of fast fibre and grass in the night with his normal haylage and hay.

Hopefully Baileys will make any tweaks! Thanks for all your help guys! muchly appreciated!
 
That sounds like pretty much what Ive planned to do with Grape when my current feed is on the way out (though I will still have her on linseed by then !) - fingers crossed it works for us both !!!

Good luck !!!!

(and actually - speaking to a feed company is probably a fantastic way to go, its the same with everything - ask 10 people you will get 11 answers, all different and you have to cherry pick the bits you want and tweak as nececcary.!!)
 
I know its difficult to wait but Baileys are normally pretty quick, certainly never the 10 days they say! Until you speak to Baileys Im not sure I would change things to much (except for upping the hay and turn out) just in case they advice something totally different and your horsey has to cope with several changes in diet, which in itself can cause problems. Also Baileys will advice to introduce changes slowly
 
Just a point on the linseed

Make sure its the micronised linseed. If you just buy raw linseed it needs to be cooked or I believe its actually poisonous, or certainly not good for them.
 
rockysmum said:
Just a point on the linseed

Make sure its the micronised linseed. If you just buy raw linseed it needs to be cooked or I believe its actually poisonous, or certainly not good for them.
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Thanks my love, I shall remember that one. My childhood cob used to live off grass and forage in the winter! This is all one hell of a confusing palaver for clueless me but I think I'm heading in the right direction now.

Micronised linseed or baileys outshine...hmmmm.
 
micronised linseed is cheaper :) but not always that easy to find if you're not in the southern/eastern part of the country.

Going back to the ready mash idea - Rowan Barbary now do Solution Mash which is very low starch/sugar and high oil and (according to my boys) very tasty! If you can get it, it might be a better route than fast fibre. Also has lots of vits/mins and added yea-sacc.

Can you give him haylage in the field? - let him nibble more during the day.

good luck!
 
I have a skinny TB ex-racer and after talking to various rehoming charities & feed companies changed him onto baileys no4 and outshine which has made the world of difference. He's now on 1 Stubbs scoop no4, 1cup outshine, a handful of Alfa A and a splash of sugar beet twice daily. I rang baileys up and they were very helpful, they keep a note of what your feed discussion so that you can contact them again for further advice if you need it. I'm going to give them another ring now that we are going into winter as the grass has little goodness in it to see if I need to tweak his rations again, but this is the difference it has made;

Taken in may (I bought him mid April)

image-1.jpg.html


Taken in October

image.jpg.html
 
Have you wormed him?
Also I would put oil in his feed. Extra calories without the bulk.
Personally id up the fast fibre as I find this fed liberally can put weight on poor doers.
Also what about a balancer or multi vit.

Good luck
 
ekitteridge said:
I have a skinny TB ex-racer and after talking to various rehoming charities & feed companies changed him onto baileys no4 and outshine which has made the world of difference. He's now on 1 Stubbs scoop no4, 1cup outshine, a handful of Alfa A and a splash of sugar beet twice daily. I rang baileys up and they were very helpful, they keep a note of what your feed discussion so that you can contact them again for further advice if you need it. I'm going to give them another ring now that we are going into winter as the grass has little goodness in it to see if I need to tweak his rations again, but this is the difference it has made;

Taken in may (I bought him mid April)

image-1.jpg


Taken in October

image.jpg
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I wonder whether the problem is he is having too much sugar which is unbalancing his hind gut and making it difficult for him to absorb food properly. My TB used to struggle to keep weight on. He also had dreadful feet and could be very irritible. I did a lot of reading about hindgut function and lesrnt that horses are evolved to derive energy from fibre, not molasses or grain. The research I read suggested that hay and unmollased sugarbeet were ideal. I switched him to:

Ad lib hay
Unmollased sugar beet (kwikbeet is lowest sugar) (a scoop twice a day)
Micronised linseed (a mug twice a day)
A little scoop of yeasacc once a day to support hindgut function and a scoop of prohoof for his feet.

He is like a different horse, he is a great weight and is calm and settled. I appreciate it sounds counter intuitive to cut the sugar of an underweight horse, but actually you are allowing the horse to digest food in the way nature intended. Overload their system with sugar and it can't cope properly.
 
You can get micronised linseed for about £25 for 20k sack and Brewers Yeast (very good for optimum digestion of food and has calming properties) for £45 for a 25k sack, which will last probably nearly a year, by mail order from Charnwood Milling.

No garlic!

Have you considered that he may have ulcers? If he was a racehorse in a former life that is a 90% chance that he will have had them. Being fed a weight gain diet with lots of sugar will really aggravate them. Fibre, fibre, fibre is the way forward. I would however try him with hay rather than haylage, as haylage can be quite acidic and not too good for some tummies.
 
Tammytoo said:
Have you considered that he may have ulcers? If he was a racehorse in a former life that is a 90% chance that he will have had them. Being fed a weight gain diet with lots of sugar will really aggravate them. Fibre, fibre, fibre is the way forward. I would however try him with hay rather than haylage, as haylage can be quite acidic and not too good for some tummies.
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Completely agree with this :) Not just gastric but hind gut too. If he were mine he would ave no cereal or mollases whatsoever.
 
It sounds as though you won't get anywhere until he chills out a bit - he's just burning off all that food in moving around. Agree with cutting right back on sugar (agree with the poster who said switch to hay - that made a big difference to mine) and think about adding something like magnesium to stop him being so stressy?

Is there anything in his daily routine that you can change to make him more relaxed? Would he be better in a quieter box on a quieter part of the yard - or somewhere where he can see what's going on and doesn't worry that he doesn't know what's happening? Does he like the horses on each side of him? Are there any silly things happening like other owners feeding right outside his box, etc?
 
Chellery1 said:
Anyway, I've decided on

Alfa A oil chaff
Baileys topline cubes
Baileys outshine
Naf pink powder
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please don't get baileys topline cubes!! gave my tb that and she lost condition if anything! awful and full of starch and sugar not good for them at all. mines a poor dooer and going on to alfa a oil, speedibeet, micronised linseed, seaweed, brewers yeast. much more fibre and oil and low starch and sugar!
 
I have used Ready Mash Extra and Linseed on my 17yo TB and 30yo tb with what can only be described as magic outcomes. Plus I also have the added benefit of better feet, we have growth lines coming through, can't wait till the new growth hits the ground.
 
Sugar_and_Spice said:
Pink Powder is a powdered balancer (Blue Chip is pellets). I'm not sure if powdered balancers contain the protein or not.
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Pink powder contains SOME vits and minerals, and yeast. It does not contain sufficient vits and minerals or protein to be used as a balancer. It's not very good for anything in my opinion. If you want it for gut health, fed brewers yeast. If you want it for vits, minerals and protein, feed something that has them all, not just the cheapest few :o

Chellery1 said:
Your very right and I've found this forum extremely helpful..thanks guys. I'm awaiting a reply from Baileys website as we speak...10days apparently! I've spent the evening researching all the feeds people have mentioned on here and I am going to make a few changes straight away as it seems people agree that What I'm feeding him is actually giving the opposite effect as he's burning it off by being stressed!

Anyway, I've decided on

Alfa A oil chaff
Baileys topline cubes
Baileys outshine
Naf pink powder


Going to work out the amounts and obviously introduce slowly. I'll give him a bucket of fast fibre and grass in the night with his normal haylage and hay.

Hopefully Baileys will make any tweaks! Thanks for all your help guys! muchly appreciated!
Click to expand...

You don't say what quantities you are feeding, but one thing in my experience Bailey's nutritionalists are not good on, they're not good on advising you on QUANTITIES. Your horse's stomach is the size of a rugby ball, and he hasn't evolved to eat meals, so if you feed any higher quantity than that at a time it'll get pushed straight through the stomach into the small intestine, which disrupt your horse's friendly bacteria and generally interferes with digestion and absorption. So I would favour feeding small feeds, as frequently as you can. I know you're already feeding three times per day, but the size of each feed is too big IMO :o It seems counterintuitive but you'd almost be better off still feeding three times a day but half the quantity each time :o
 
There is another feed that will help and that is Simple Systems.A total forage feed.

There has been a long post on Arabian Lines about a mare called Paris and how she went from 350 odd Kgs to her correct weight of 480 kgs. Paris was in a very bad state and the EMWS (Equine Market Watch Sanctuaries) turned her around.


I would still say give Baileys a ring.
 
Well here is what I've decided on after speaking to nutrionalists and a vet...and all of your helpful advice on here!

I've realised that before I can even get weight on him I've got to chill the poor boy out so I'm going back to basics.....ie cut out all the sugar I can. He's no longer getting haylage or the Allen page weight gain(which does the exact opposite to what it says....it's useless!) and I've cut out the molasses chaff! All that sugar in the feeds are making him sooo fizzy around the yard that he's burning off everything I'm putting in by being stressed! Sort of counter productive eh?! Lol.

He's now just getting ad lib hay, fast fibre with cod oil, pink powder (just because I had some lying around). I've also bought the magnitude calmer to just help with things!

I've ordered Rowan Barbary ready mash solutions which looks to have everything he needs...it's 15% oil , high fibre and protein, while being low sugar and starch. I'm going to feed this with Alfa a oil 3 times a day. Nice and basic!

I shall let you know how I get on.

Cheers :-)
 
This is what's he's on 3 times a day...

1 large scoop of molasses chaff
1 large scoop of Allen and page weight gain mix
1/2 a large scoop of Allen and page fast fibre
Cod liver oil, vegetable oil and garlic

I would change the chaff to dengie Alpha- Oil then take out the cod liver and veg oil and change the fast fibre for sugar beet shreds (fed warm) then consider adding a good balancer like blue chip

In his stable at night he has

2 massive nets of haulage
1 stuffed manger of hay
1 bucket of ready grass

Take out the ready grass and only feed twice a day so he is hungry and ready to eat at feed times
 
Well guys,

I left the yard this evening with a MASSIVE smile on my face! After 36hrs off the sugar my horse has chilled out to the max!!! He's loving the new solutions ready mash. I've bought magnitude calmer so hopefully that will help and I'll see the results in the next few weeks.


Now he's calmer....I hope this feed bulks him out!

Fingers crossed,

X
 
I am sooo happy and yes, alot calmer. The highs and lows of horse ownership eh. I brought him in to quite a busy yard this evening and he just munched his dins...no prancing or naughtinesslike normal! I put him in the stable and he weaved for possibly 10secs and then just stopped! Everyone was like...wow!!! I can't wait to see what he's like in 2 weeks? If he puts on abit of topline it will feel like I've won the lottery lol!


X
 
I think you just have to be patient...topline will take time and work but at least he is more settled and showung his true personality. I am a firm believer that most TB's are actually pretty sane and reliable once we learn how to keep them happy. Sounds like you have the makings of a lovely horse :)
 
Oh, he is sooo lovely and a real gent! The problem was when he started to drop weight I was advised a certain feed....which I then fed more of when it didn't work...then I added haylage!!! I was actually just feeding him more sugar and starch which made him high as a kite. He burnt off all my efforts in prancing a dancing and being a nutter. I had the best intentions!

Will let you know how he progresses.
 
sorry I assumed your chaff was alfalfa. In that case dump the molasses, it can have a very similar effect.

We put weight onto our oldie with soaked grassnuts and grass chaff with speedibeet and linseed oil.
 
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