Insurance for horse sitter?

[AshryOTTB]

Hi,

I have been looking after 2 horses that are on DIY livery at a yard i work at. The horses are owned by an older lady 70 or so who recently had a fall, so i am looking after her horses until she is better (with her permission of course). The gelding is retired so all i do with him is catching grooming mucking out ect. however the mare is in light work so i hack her around the village and occasionaly a little schooling or polework, we dont jump.

The yard owner and i had an argument yesterday as she is not happy with me looking after the horses as i am uninsured. Both the horses have their own insurance with public liability, question is: do i need insurance to look after these two, if so what sort?

 

[Merry neddy man]

Check with the owner, politely say what the yard owner has said and enquire about her policy, SHE is probably insured but is the insurance valid when another person (YOU) is handing her horses. Ask her to check and ask HER to confirm to the yard owner that you are covered, and show her a copy of the insurance . If you are not then take out your own policy, ( which every owner should have) . It's not expensive and loads of places cover 3rd party insurance, BHS, harry hall, etc. Be very calm and polite don't go upsetting the horse owner or the yard owner.

 

[Sossigpoker]

Yes you need a groom's insurance. The horses' public liability won't cover you.

 

[Sossigpoker]

Check with the owner, SHE is probably insured but is the insurance valid when another person (YOU) is handing her horses. Ask her to check and ask her to confirm to the yard owner that you are covered, and show her a copy of the insurance . If you are not then take out your own policy, ( which every owner should have) . It's not expensive and loads of places cover 3rd party insurance, BHS, harry hall, etc.

If you get paid to look after someone's horse , those policies won't cover you.

 

[AshryOTTB]

What policy do i need then?

 

[AshryOTTB]

I do get paid to look after them, but theres no contract or anything

 

[Red-1]

I do get paid to look after them, but theres no contract or anything

The fact that there is no contract is, in fact, worse as I suspect that you are therefore also not paying tax etc/declaring the earnings?

Could you not swap for something, as in rides, or the favour returned when the owner is fit again?

The YO is correct that the horses may not be insured whilst someone is being paid to look after them. YO is looking out for the other liveries and anyone else who is there.

I am also unsure why there was an argument? It is YO's yard so if the YO doesn't want people looking after others' horses that is their prerogative, insurance queries aside.

 

[Tiddlypom]

You already work on the yard, but are being paid to look after these horses outwith your employment by the yard?

What does your work contract say?

You seem to be acting as a paid freelancer when looking after these horses, so would need your own commercial groom's insurance. BHS third party does not cover paid grooms. Contact SEIB et al to enquire re the rates for groom's insurance (not cheap).

The yard owner can refuse you permission to act as a freelancer on their yard if they wish.

 

[Auslander]

You should have your own insurance
Why are you arguing with the YO? If she isn't happy that you are looking after these horses without being insured to do so, that's 100% her prerogative in her own yard, and she's correct.
Also - was she part of the discussion about getting you to do the horses? A lot of yards specify that services are available, and take a dim view of other people being brought in to do something that the yard could be doing. I don't have DIYs, so it wouldn't be an issue on my yard, but I have taken a dim view in the past of liveries bringing someone in to clip their horse (which is a service I provide) without asking me first, leaving hair everywhere/poo stains on the yard, using my electricity and even helping themselves to my coffee!

 

[Goldenstar]

I am with Auslander why on earth are you arguing with the yard owner .
A third party being paid by someone who is not the Yoer to care for horses on a commercial yard must be insured .

 

[AshryOTTB]

I wasnt happy with the way she approached the subject, i turned up and she immediately found me and told me i couldnt touch the horses. The yard is DIY only so now no one will be looking after them, hence the argument. I am not employed by the yard either i help out on a sunday mucking out a few boxes but this isnt paid, sorry about the bad wording/confusion.

 

[blitznbobs]

It probably depends on whether you are being paid or not - if you are being paid then you definitely need insurance- if you are not and are doing a favour for a friend then the old lady needs insurance

 

[Rowreach]

I wasnt happy with the way she approached the subject, i turned up and she immediately found me and told me i couldnt touch the horses. The yard is DIY only so now no one will be looking after them, hence the argument. I am not employed by the yard either i help out on a sunday mucking out a few boxes but this isnt paid, sorry about the bad wording/confusion.

What is the yard's general policy then when an owner is unable to do their own horse/s (ill, in holiday etc)?

 

[AshryOTTB]

What is the yard's general policy then when an owner is unable to do their own horse/s (ill, in holiday etc)?

friends or other liveries look after but never usually paid. I am given a small amount of cash as i will be caring for them every day for at least a few months taking a substantial amount of my time.

 

[irishdraft]

Probably best if you explained the situation to the horse owner and asked her to pay for insurance to cover you whilst she is unable to do her horses herself. If the YO doesn't provide cover herself for these situations how does she expect a long term problem to be covered ? or maybe she's annoyed she wasn't asked first to cover possibly. Just saying you cannot touch the horses sounds a bit unreasonable in the circumstances.

 

[Sossigpoker]

What policy do i need then?

Like I said earlier, you need a groom's insurance to receive payment from looking after anyone else's horse

 

[blitznbobs]

friends or other liveries look after but never usually paid. I am given a small amount of cash as i will be caring for them every day for at least a few months taking a substantial amount of my time.

Then you definitely need insurance you are now running a business

 

[AshryOTTB]

will groom insurance cover me riding the mare too? and what company would you recommend?

 

[Tiddlypom]

SEIB insurance brokers are worth contacting, they are very reputable and have a groom's policy which covers riding. It is unlikely to be cheap.

Groom Insurance - SEIB Insurance Brokers

Being a freelance groom can be incredibly rewarding. Our specialist, flexible insurance for grooms will give you the peace of mind you need, knowing that you have the right cover in place so you can focus on running and growing your freelance business.

www.seib.co.uk

 

[AshryOTTB]

how much would you estimate, i cant really afford insurance if its going to be more than what i get for looking after them.

 

[Rowreach]

Have a look at the Grooms Association website and check that the horses’ owner has suitable public liability insurance. It’s not as expensive as you might think.

 

[Tiddlypom]

In this case, assuming that she is your only client and as you're doing it to help her out, IMHO you'd be justified in asking the owner to cover the cost of the premiums.

 

[AmyMay]

We pay £160 a year for our business insurance from Clivertons. This includes public liability and covers me for horse care should I wish to do it.

 

[Melody Grey]

As said by others, you definitely need insurance if money is changing hands. Ensure you’re charging enough to cover both this and any tax and NI contributions the additional self employment may attract.

I may be an outsider on this but for me, either with my horses or any other part of my life, there is either proper employment of someone insured to do that task or genuine favours where absolutely no money changes hands….if someone is paid to clip, they’re insured, transport, teaching, whatever, all insured- just not worth the risk in my opinion.

 

[Melody Grey]

In this case, assuming that she is your only client and as you're doing it to help her out, IMHO you'd be justified in asking the owner to cover the cost of the premiums.

You could try to get a short- term policy to this effect?

 

[AshryOTTB]

As said by others, you definitely need insurance if money is changing hands. Ensure you’re charging enough to cover both this and any tax and NI contributions the additional self employment may attract.

I didnt want to charge anything, the lady insisted on giving me something for the trouble, as i said it is only a little cash

 

[Melody Grey]

I didnt want to charge anything, the lady insisted on giving me something for the trouble, as i said it is only a little cash

It’s not a case of how much money it is, rather that it’s money at all.

 

[AshryOTTB]

It’s not a case of how much money it is, rather that it’s money at all.

if got her to stop paying me would i be covered by her insurance. ive had a look and grooms insurance would cost me more than i get paid

 

[Melody Grey]

if got her to stop paying me would i be covered by her insurance. ive had a look and grooms insurance would cost me more than i get paid

I think you’d have to check/ have her check with her insurer to be on the safe side?

 

[AshryOTTB]

I think you’d have to check/ have her check with her insurer to be on the safe side?

i know she is using petplan which includes everything except for loss of tack and vehicles