Insurance renewal - does this sound reasonable?

[ownedbyaconnie]

My insurance is due for renewal with PetPlan (Equine) for Rosie. For 2020 I paid £518 for the year which had increased from the previous year which I was fine with because they had paid out in 2019 for her tooth extraction with no fuss so was happy with the service and happy to pay an increased premium as my claim was for £1,500.

Got my renewal through for this year and it's up to £572 with no new claims etc. Is it starting to get a bit pricey? She's insured up to £3,500 vet fees with a £500 excess and for activities up to and including riding club activities, unaff jumping etc.

I'm torn because they were good with paying out, especially as teeth are a bit of a weird area but as I am going to be going on maternity this year I could do with reducing my costs!

Checked my exclusions and it says "resulting from or connected to skin disorders" - absolutely no idea what that is about as I have never had the vet out for any kind of skin issue and "resulting from or connected to mouth and oral disorders, associated and affecting to tooth 109" - I can't work out if the latter means only tooth 109 is excluded (which is fine because the tooth is no longer there!) or if all teeth are now excluded?

If you think I should shop around, any suggestions?

 

[milliepops]

an increase of c£50 seems very acceptable to me! I'm expecting mine to go up £100s!

I'd ask for an explanation about the skin exclusion. My vets have to send a full clinical history with any claims, so is there something skin related that she's been treated for in the past? or noted on her record. might be incredibly minor. in which case you could ask vet to write a letter contesting the exclusion.

 

[Michen]

No, thats very reasonable!!!

On the suggestion front though, I insured Bear with the insurance emporium (basically e and l). I cannot fault them, they paid out quicker and with less hassle for 2 claims (choke and a liver problem) than any other insurers I've ever used. And they are about a third of the price.

 

[milliepops]

re the teeth, i would imagine, say the tooth that would have been opposite 109 has problems, that they might attribute it to tooth 109 (and its absence) - caused by uneven wear or something. That wouldn't be covered, because it's associated with 109. Even though the tooth isn't there any more it's a related problem.

 

[criso]

insurance has gone up a lot so what you are paying isn't excessive however I don't think it hurts to look around.

I've had good service with seib, shearwater and equicover though I don't think the latter exist anymore.. And NFU but they tend to be expensive.

With the tooth, it comes down to anything that could be related to the original tooth issue. If you made another claim on the mouth, they would look closely to see if it could be linked to that tooth and you might need the vet to prove that it was not in a way that you would not if you have never made any claim for teeth.

I would query the skin disorders, I had breathing excluded one time and it turned out that a tub of Ventipulmin for my other horse was on the wrong bill but it was fine once the vet clarified.

 

[AdorableAlice]

Whilst we are talking insurance. I have an uninsurable mare who is ridden by a couple of friends who help me with all the work on the yard.

Which company would you recommend for me to insure the mare for 3rd party only to include ridden by someone other than myself. The other horses have their own full insurance.
Thanks for any thoughts.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

No, thats very reasonable!!!

On the suggestion front though, I insured Bear with the insurance emporium (basically e and l). I cannot fault them, they paid out quicker and with less hassle for 2 claims (choke and a liver problem) than any other insurers I've ever used. And they are about a third of the price.

So I actually just did a quick quote with insurance emporium and they've come back with £36 a month for £5,000 vet fees which sounds great! Have you had a renewal with them yet? Wondering if they will just bump it up massively after I'm not a new customer anymore.

Will give petplan a ring re the skin exclusion because I have never even had the vet out for anything remotely related to skin! She's had the vet for her tooth and for some eye drops when she stabbed herself in the eye with a bramble trying to get to the berries and that is it for the last 3 years. Probably jinxed it now!

 

[ycbm]

Whilst we are talking insurance. I have an uninsurable mare who is ridden by a couple of friends who help me with all the work on the yard.

Which company would you recommend for me to insure the mare for 3rd party only to include ridden by someone other than myself. The other horses have their own full insurance.
Thanks for any thoughts.

Ask your loaners if they have their own third party insurance on a horse policy, AA. Most people who have a horse policy do.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

re the teeth, i would imagine, say the tooth that would have been opposite 109 has problems, that they might attribute it to tooth 109 (and its absence) - caused by uneven wear or something. That wouldn't be covered, because it's associated with 109. Even though the tooth isn't there any more it's a related problem.

That is what I was thinking. The EDT thinks her fractured tooth was likely a genetic weakness and that they often work in pairs so there is every chance the opposite tooth will also go at some point but I am hoping now we're on 6 monthly check ups as opposed to yearly when they found it, that the op wouldn't be as expensive as the last one which was £1,800 so even if it was excluded I am comfortable paying it. The op involved having to cut through her cheek to chisel the rotten tooth out and lots of xrays to ensure they had got every tiny scrap out, so wasn't your standard sedate and whip out job!

 

[milliepops]

So I actually just did a quick quote with insurance emporium and they've come back with £36 a month for £5,000 vet fees which sounds great! Have you had a renewal with them yet? Wondering if they will just bump it up massively after I'm not a new customer anymore.

Will give petplan a ring re the skin exclusion because I have never even had the vet out for anything remotely related to skin! She's had the vet for her tooth and for some eye drops when she stabbed herself in the eye with a bramble trying to get to the berries and that is it for the last 3 years. Probably jinxed it now!

E&L seem to be better these days than they used to be but many vets won't deal with them direct (mine won't) so you'd have to settle the bill yourself and then wait for the claim money to be paid to you. that might not be an issue for you, it is for me, i need the claim to be paid direct to vets as don't have the ££ available otherwise.

 

[Michen]

So I actually just did a quick quote with insurance emporium and they've come back with £36 a month for £5,000 vet fees which sounds great! Have you had a renewal with them yet? Wondering if they will just bump it up massively after I'm not a new customer anymore.

Will give petplan a ring re the skin exclusion because I have never even had the vet out for anything remotely related to skin! She's had the vet for her tooth and for some eye drops when she stabbed herself in the eye with a bramble trying to get to the berries and that is it for the last 3 years. Probably jinxed it now!

Nope no renewal yet.

 

[ihatework]

So I actually just did a quick quote with insurance emporium and they've come back with £36 a month for £5,000 vet fees which sounds great! Have you had a renewal with them yet? Wondering if they will just bump it up massively after I'm not a new customer anymore.

Will give petplan a ring re the skin exclusion because I have never even had the vet out for anything remotely related to skin! She's had the vet for her tooth and for some eye drops when she stabbed herself in the eye with a bramble trying to get to the berries and that is it for the last 3 years. Probably jinxed it now!

Ive taken a gamble with my young event horse and gone with E&L. They are happy to massively under insure. So last year as a 4yo, insured for £500 and with 5k vet fee cover the premium was £22/month and I’ve just had a renewal in (no claims) at £25/month.

But, I know how to play the insurance hoops to the letter and I can pay bills upfront and happy to argue the toss afterwards.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

I'm happy to pay upfront, I was v surprised when the vets were happy to be paid by the insurer but that's the only time I've ever had to claim horse wise and suppose I am used to small animal vets where they want the cash straight away, sometimes even before!

Thanks everyone, I think I will swap to E&L as the extra £1.5k in vet fees is very appealing, I've always felt a bit nervy about only have £3.5k as know how quickly fees rack up.

The dog and cat are insured with Bought by Many and I am just praying they one day do Equine as I would swap at the drop of a hat, we've claimed twice with the dog and it was so effortless and stress free and they only upped the premium by £20 for the year!

 

[Michen]

I do think it’s important to have a way of paying bills upfront regardless of who the insurance company is if you possibly can. Whether that’s an emergency credit card etc. Some practices in an emergency for example require payment before releasing the horse or even treating it eg colic surgery deposit. Also you can never assume the insurance will pay out, particularly now.

I don’t feel comfortable leaving my vets potentially waiting for money when the responsibility is on me to pay the bill, not between vet and insurers.

 

[milliepops]

I do think it’s important to have a way of paying bills upfront regardless of who the insurance company is if you possibly can. Whether that’s an emergency credit card for example. Some practices in an emergency for example require payment before releasing the horse. Also you can never assume the insurance will pay out, particularly now.

I don’t feel comfortable leaving my vets potentially waiting for money when the responsibility is on me to pay the bill, not between vet and insurers.

if that's in response to my post, I could scrabble together the money to cover whatever they've been in for, (always because you only really get agreement in principle before sending the claim in) but it would be credit or borrowing elsewhere and having gone to the bother of paying up for insurance, I'd prefer to use that direct rather than take on debt to sort it.

 

[Michen]

if that's in response to my post, I could scrabble together the money to cover whatever they've been in for, (always because you only really get agreement in principle before sending the claim in) but it would be credit or borrowing elsewhere and having gone to the bother of paying up for insurance, I'd prefer to use that direct rather than take on debt to sort it.

Not really, just a general post as some may assume that having an insurance company who your vet is happy to deal with direct, means you don’t need to have any available funds.

That may not be the case if your horse ends up in a large referral practice requiring life saving treatment.

 

[milliepops]

Not really, just a general post as some may assume that having an insurance company who your vet is happy to deal with direct, means you don’t need to have any available funds.

That may not be the case if your horse ends up in a large referral practice requiring life saving treatment.

Oh sure. I'm registered direct with the referral practice partly for this reason (partly after seeing awful delays in local mixed practices referring! )

 

[AdorableAlice]

Ask your loaners if they have their own third party insurance on a horse policy, AA. Most people who have a horse policy do.

The horses are not loaned, they are just being exercised for me.

 

[Orangehorse]

Friend took her horse to a hospital for suspected colic and they wanted her credit card for £3,000 before they even looked at the horse, I suppose it was a referral practice.

In the end the horse didn't have an operation, and she had a refund very quickly.

 

[Michen]

Oh sure. I'm registered direct with the referral practice partly for this reason (partly after seeing awful delays in local mixed practices referring! )

Your post did mention you wouldn't have the ££ available so worth people understanding that regardless of insurance there do need to be some funds available immediately for certain situations... I didn't even know about hospitals taking up front payment until a couple of years ago and I'd have really struggled at times to even put down a £1k deposit from a CC at the time.

I would also be whacking it on a credit card etc. IMO, if an insurance company hasn't paid within a month (where you could then pay the card off interest free), then that's too long to ask a vet practice to wait for their money also.

 

[criso]

The horses are not loaned, they are just being exercised for me.

When I was sharing NFU and Petplan used to offer Rider policies, I'm sure others do. As long as you are not paying them to ride in which case I think they would be considered professionals and have to have appropriate insurance as part of their business.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

So I rang petplan and amended my policy so I now have £5k vet and £145 excess. Premium obvs went up a bit but I'm happy paying more for more if that makes sense!

 

[chaps89]

For the OP - I used to work for PP equine a fair few years ago now. They always used to exclude the removed tooth - the exclusion should be relevant to the original issue. Whilst the tooth has been removed I guess there is a small chance of fragments being left behind or the site absessing, hence the exclusion specific to the removed tooth. Very unlikely to cause an issue in reality!
For skin I'd just ask them why its there - either a mistake when the tooth exclusion was applied in which case they should just take straight off or something in your vets notes when the tooth claim was received, in which case it can probably be reviewed with a further letter from your vets (specific wording might be needed)

For @AdorableAlice Petplan (and other companies) offer rider insurance plans - it will cover them as a rider on any horse they're riding with the owners permission so long as no payment is involved. It will cover public liability, personal accident, dental and possibly things like tack or emergency vet fee cover (For if horse is injured whilst they're riding and vet has to attend as an emergency) it's not very expensive, about £8 a month I think?
Or you could insure the horse with no vet cover and limited £ value for death and just add personal accident and public liability on and that will be specific to the horse and extend to anyone riding/handling her, usually about £150-200 a year so works out a bit more expensive and usually gives less detailed cover than a rider specific plan.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

I asked about the skin actually! Turns out in her vetting the vet had mentioned some scabs along her rump which were from (or at least I was told) her journey over from Ireland. She's never had anything like it since so I have asked them to review it. I thought maybe it was some weird blanket exclusion as she is grey and they were thinking of melanomas but apparently not!

 

[ycbm]

The horses are not loaned, they are just being exercised for me.

Sorry, replace that with riders, the point still stands.

 

[Merry neddy man]

Whilst we are talking insurance. I have an uninsurable mare who is ridden by a couple of friends who help me with all the work on the yard.

Which company would you recommend for me to insure the mare for 3rd party only to include ridden by someone other than myself. The other horses have their own full insurance.
Thanks for any thoughts.

I think BHS gold membership, and the Harry Hall gold plus may cover this.

 

[bouncing_ball]

The horses are not loaned, they are just being exercised for me.

My BD membership includes 3rd party liability, which covers my horse ridden / handled by anyone with my permission on a non professional basis. Covered both sharers which I had confirmed by email at the time.

 

[AdorableAlice]

Thank you all, really helpful and I will get the bouncing bog trotter covered.