Is he being naughty or does he have a problem?

[MrsJ]

Hi,

I have a little pony on loan for my daughter and she has ridden him in her weekly lesson without any problems (bar on week when he tried to buck her!!)

In the last week he seems to have become extremely grumpy in the school. We put him in there on Sunday and he refused to go into trot. No amount of kicks or whips on the bottom would get him to budge. If I stood in the centre of the school and picked up the lunge whip he would set off into trot but not without throwing his head down first.

I spoke to the YO about him and she had asked if we had noticed him having 'toilet' issues...i.e. standing for a long time needing a wee but not going. And yes we have!!

He did it again tonight, as soon as we put him in the outdoor paddock he grumpily stomped around, then stood for a wee, hardly anything came out...several good old pony club kicks later from my daughter he plodded off again, wouldn't trot, head down, bottom up! then stands for a wee again for a minute or so....

So my question is as the title suggests...is he being naughty or does he have a problem?

 

[AmyMay]

Well, the answer kind of seems obvious. Get a wee sample, speak to your vet, and get him checked.

Hope its nothing too serious.

Have you checked his pens for a bean?

 

[AmyMay]

Penis (sorry, bloomin phone).

 

[MrsJ]

Have you checked his pens for a bean?

???? what does this mean ????

 

[NooNoo59]

He has a problem get the vet

 

[MrsJ]

Penis (sorry, bloomin phone).

ah thank heavens....I'd have been crawling round his paddock in the morning looking for a bean!!!!

 

[Bikerchickone]

Agree with the others you need the vet out.

 

[MrsJ]

he only does it when he's put in the school.....doesn't do it when he's in his field....

 

[AmyMay]

But you said he did it in the paddock in your OP.

 

[MrsJ]

sorry I wasn't very clear.....I meant the jumping paddock. He only does it when he is being 'schooled'. Doesn't do it on a hack or when he's out grazing. Which makes us wonder whether he actually has a problem or whether he is being naughty

 

[AmyMay]

Well I guess the vet will tell you.

Let us know how you get on.

 

[maggiesmum]

Very rarely are horses just naughty, high spirited maybe, definitely worth a visit from the vet, incidentally kicks and whips on the bottom are likely to make him grumpy and unwilling - if your boss screamed instructions in your face how long would it take before you threw in the towel? Try thumping yourself in the ribs, after a couple of trys you tense against it, the horse does the same, its difficult to move forward freely when tense.

 

[MrsJ]

Penis (sorry, bloomin phone).

Very rarely are horses just naughty, high spirited maybe, definitely worth a visit from the vet, incidentally kicks and whips on the bottom are likely to make him grumpy and unwilling - if your boss screamed instructions in your face how long would it take before you threw in the towel? Try thumping yourself in the ribs, after a couple of trys you tense against it, the horse does the same, its difficult to move forward freely when tense.

Then how do you suggest she gets him to move forward. She gives him a couple of short kicks = nothing....a tap on the bottom with the whip = nothing.

 

[Booboos]

The first thing to do is to eliminate the possibility of a physical problem, so you need the vet out.

If he is fine then get a decent instructor to help you. There are ways of motivating a pony, e.g. giving him a more fun job to do, starting with a forward canter, trying a softer bit, etc. You may also need someone more experienced to pop on and remind him how to react to the aids.

 

[9tails]

Then how do you suggest she gets him to move forward. She gives him a couple of short kicks = nothing....a tap on the bottom with the whip = nothing.

If he's totally unwilling to move, the chances are that he's in pain. Get the vet. Don't hesitate until it's a major problem.

 

[MrsJ]

Booboos thats great thankyou. I got on him after he swiped the reins out of my little girls hands by throwing his head down on Sunday and then took off across the school. With me on him (and I'm not experienced by any means he was fine, worked on both reins in all paces and transitioned nicely. Which is why I'm not sure if he's just being a bit cheeky with what he can get away with!

We have only just put him on loan and I think (the potential medical problem aside) that he needs a stronger person to work with him and bring him on that my little girl.

 

[MrsJ]

If he's totally unwilling to move, the chances are that he's in pain. Get the vet. Don't hesitate until it's a major problem.

But he'll move when an adult gets on him, with just the use of leg and voice aids......confused.com

 

[TakeAChance]

Get him checked asap, horses can get cystitis and physical exercise (ie, being ridden) can make the symptoms worse.

 

[RainbowDash]

Hi,

As OP's have said get the vet out to rule out a medical problem.

If you're given the all clear have a chat with your instructor - it could be he's trying his rider out. Some ponies have a sense of humour and if they can get away with not working (esp. RS ponies) they will.

 

[Bobbly]

One of my boys when caught for work will instantly say 'I need a wee', sometimes he does a pathetic little wee, sometimes a lot or often, none at all. he does it when being led in, then again when we get to the concrete of the yard before he gets tied up. He also wee's in his stable when I arrive in the morning and at night when I go to do hay! (Maybe he thinks he's got to work again?) Not suggesting it's an aversion tactic, get him checked out first, but it might just be.....?

 

[Littlelegs]

Rule out the physical side first with the vet. Then worry about the riding problems. If current instructor thinks booting & hitting is the way to teach, get a new instructor too. They should be teaching her how to ride him forwards correctly.

 

[Sussexbythesea]

My old pony used to pretend he needed a wee everytime we were doing something he didn't want to do. There was always one ride where we rode down this hill and then turned around at the bottom and galloped back. He used to stop for a wee abour 3 times going down that hill but never did anything.

He also more embarrassingly do it virtually everytime I went in a showring but he never actually had a wee. So I would just stand in my stirrups while he got his todger out and while everyone stared and sniggered Of course I couldn't wallop him as that would look cruel so I had to wait it out whilst explaining to the judge that he didn't actually need a wee.

However if it happened today I would probably get vet to check him out before resorting to violence

 

[xxMozlarxx]

I think he's having you on..our pony used to regularly stop in the corner of the school and 'pretend' to wee...never did, if he could get away with it he would keep doing it. He tried it with me once and once only...it's a common evasion. He's never been checked by the vet and years later is still going strong.
He needed a smack with the whip to go forward as well. Typical behaviour from some clever ponies IMO...

 

[MrsJ]

Rule out the physical side first with the vet. Then worry about the riding problems. If current instructor thinks booting & hitting is the way to teach, get a new instructor too. They should be teaching her how to ride him forwards correctly.

thanks for the feedback littlelegs......so if a kick to move him on and if he doesn't respond to the leg a tap on the bottom with a whip isn't the way to get him moving, how should she be being taught to move him on?? Not a sarcastic comment...a genuine question..?

 

[RainbowDash]

thanks for the feedback littlelegs......so if a kick to move him on and if he doesn't respond to the leg a tap on the bottom with a whip isn't the way to get him moving, how should she be being taught to move him on?? Not a sarcastic comment...a genuine question..?

My Ponio doesn't react at all to side kicks. He will to gentle heel pressure to his sides and quick 'click click' and walk on etc - even going away from his hacking mates to a solo ride out. They're all different and ride differently for different riders (too many 'different's I know )

 

[Queenbee]

Op, ask yourself how sure you are that he's being a git, say for example you are 80% sure it's bad manners, 20% possibility he needs a vet... Then ask how confident are you in your own judgement, you are admittedly a novice. If I was only 5% sure it was pain or something that needed a vet... I'd probably still want a vet to check and I have 20yrs experience. You seem reluctant to get a vet yet you came on here for advice... What big deal is a call out and an examination fee for peace of mind? Especially with your limited knowledge base. As an owner i would also be less than impressed if there was a potential problem with my horse and the loaner failed to get it assesed, what's the worst that can happen, you pay the vet a few quid and get peace of mind and develop an action plan for dealing with the behaviour, or you find out there is a medical reason and treat it. Vets is in my opinion a win win situation. Just because a couple of people on here have has horses who did and were not Ill or in pain, does not mean your pony isn't. As you are responsible for the welfare of the pony you should call the vet, it could be any number of things.

 

[Littlelegs]

It depends on a few things. You can reschool pony & rider but some kids ponies are just brilliant at being confidence giving plods, or have done it so long it would be daft to change them, so when child needs something with a bit more go the child moves onto another pony.
It can be the child, legs too high or low to be any use, holding reins too tight, not asking right in the first place. Pony making general objections to style of riding. ( I know a few who turn stubborn if the rider is too aggressive/ bossy in their manner)
Then the pony, it could just be bored with doing the same work every day & switched off. Or too unfit for what's being asked. They should move forwards from a squeeze, if they don't it could be because its so used to being kicked its literally dead to the leg. Then hitting works for a bit till it goes dead to that too. And it could be that he isn't schooled at all & hasn't got a clue what it is you want. Or it could be a combination of any of the above or all of them.
How you fix it depends on why its like that. Really you have to get the pony actually wanting to go forwards, so fast hacks in company, fun rides etc. So it moves without you nagging. Then introduce light leg aids that it responds too.
Sometimes the odd exception doesn't listen for any reason other than it doesn't want to when you squeeze, in that case one kick or a tap is fine, if its done rarely it will respond instantly. Continually it will learn to ignore it. Without seeing your daughter riding the pony its difficult to give specific exercises. From the sounds of it pony either needs reschooling. Or daughter needs to move up onto one that is more suited to helping her progress. Either way she needs a decent instructor to help her do that. It's not either yours or daughters fault so its not a criticism of either of you, but any instructor who teaches children to sit & kick & hit is no good.

 

[xxMozlarxx]

I think the key here is that you are clear he only does it when being schooled..not when hacked or out in the field, and not when someone else rode him if I've got that right, If he had a physical problem which made him do this when ridden he would be likely to do it regardless and even more likely with someone heavier on him. Is he drinking and weeing normally otherwise, his bed normally wet? Many ponys arent keen on the school, often they're just bored with it. Maybe stick with the hacking for a while and school while you are out?
In terms of smacking, if he won't go off a light squeeze try a firmer squeeze, then a firm tap behind the leg, you want him to really shoot forward, once he has done this it is really important to repeat the leg aid. Check out Jane Savoie for how to get a horse off the leg, she and most other top trainers will recommend starting with a light aid and building up to the stick, then repeating the leg once you have got the response, it needs to be systematic, too often children are taught to boot boot boot smack smack smack with no real progression so the pony understands what is being asked.
The other issue is that ponys easily work out the riding ability of the child and work accordingly. Hope you get it sorted.

 

[Welshie Squisher]

I'd be bankrupt if i got the vet everytime one of mine was naughty or refused to move forwards or napped.
Clever sods that know every evasion technique in the book

I have in the past fallen for this theory of bad behaviour must equal pain, why take the chance it's'just a few quid....
Well it's'not is it, it's'a 100 for callout and basic examination for starters, and in one year i lost count on the call outs, and bugger all wrong.

Nothing but cheeky ponies and I now have the sense to realise if a pony strides out ears pricked hacking then they are 99% of the time taking the pee when napping in a school.
Being able to make such judgements comes with experience. Ask your YO, experienced friend etc, someone who can actually see the pony, they'll know pretty much straight away if you've a cheeky pony.
All of what you say suggests pony is taking the pee

It's'easy for others to say get the vet to anything and everything, they're not paying the bill!

 

[Queenbee]

No, I'm not paying the bill, and as I have a level of experience id probably be better placed if it were my horse to make a decent assement but even op admits to her limited experience and having only ridden for 18 months. I'm not one to go running to the vet, I generally only do this when I am sure they need clinical attention, which other than this last couple of months has actually been a handful of times over the yrs (I've been very lucky) not all fees are as extortionate as yours, I pay about 30 for call out and exam. Would you as an owner be happy that someone wasn't sure what was causing the behaviour but hadn't called the vet? It's all very well suggesting that you as an experienced horse owner may not call a vet, but we are not talking about an experienced horse owner, and as such extra support should be sought. I'd also be contacting the horses owner and asking whether the pony had a history of this behaviour