Is it wrong for a grown woman to ride a 12.3hh welsh A?

[khalswitz]

oof, still reeling from the thought of a shetland highland cross these threads rarely contain any middle ground-you either get people saying a 12h can easily take 13stone hunting or people saying anyone over 6 stone should be riding an ID.Of course we should all strive to be as fit as we can for riding but life isn't always perfect.

I don't think it would do the OP's pony any harm once in a while. as for all of you saying no 13.2 should carry this that and the other-what about Highlands?Haflingers?Fells? Dales? Or the small horse breeds such as Fjords and Icelandics? wasted on children IMO. frankly, to my mind the fact that adults don't ride ponies so much any more hasn't done ponies much good. Ponies need to work. My dad, who admittedly was a shortarse and skinny to boot but still an adult male, rode our old fashioned section c for years in the 70s, towing me around on a lead rein on my pony. noone back then thought it strange that an adult would ride a native.

I am an adult, 5'5 and have a monster 13.2h Exmoor for me, to hack and whatever else we feel like doing. He's being backed as a 5yo this year with a lighter weight rider initially, then I will be hacking him. My weight is my business but with tack, we'll be a couple of stone under the old stone per hand rule-he has great bone and a good front, built like the proverbial outhouse.

There are Exmoors doing endurance with adult riders all over the UK, plenty of Fells and itty bitty arabs doing it as well.

Exactly - I know 13hh icelandics that carry men of 15-18st on a daily basis, and are tolt racing too!!

To those talking about eventers - doing a tough sport will obviously want much lighter weights, and anything with a lot of tb is not designed to carry a lot of weight. Tbs are bred to go fast, not to carry weight.

People always say shires, Clydesdales etc are weight carriers - these horses are designed to pull weight, not carry it, and are often long in the back and unsuitable for heavy riders. However a highland is bred for deer stalking, so is bred to carry several full grown stags for hours up and down hills. Arabs are bred to carry men across long distances, dales and fell to be multipurpose riding and driving ponies for farmers in uplands, however many lighter cons are bred for driving, so can pull but not necessarily carry weight.

Equally I know individuals within a breed vary in what they are happy to carry based on conformation, veterinary issues, age, etc, so it becomes a guessing game. However I would expect a highland to comfortably carry more weight than an average lightweight hunter, and that more than a tb or blood horse.

 

[khalswitz]

Completely agree.

And I would hope that all those adults who ride ponies are sitting very light in the saddle, and making sure they are in two point position in trot and canter.

Nothing worse than sitting heavily in the saddle on a pony that is really too small to be carrying you.

I think you've never ridden a small pony from this comment. You have to do sitting trot as in two point they WILL get you off in trot if they spook or misbehave as you have nothing in front of you, and rising isn't nice as the stride is so short.

Riding a small pony is much harder than riding a horse, your balance has to be better and there is much less margin of error. If you are crap, you will fall off, certainly if they have any cheekiness at all...

 

[khalswitz]

OP is 11 stone, not 9. Also, I do wonder how people know ponies have a great time? We can only guess, I'd personally like to be on the safe side rather than risking a 12.2 pony not "telling" me that carrying 11 stone + tack is hurting.

How do you tell your horse is having a good time?

You assume that you know your pony well enough to tell when it is having fun - and our lot would be on their toes the minute we got on, because they knew they would get a decent hack and get a bit of fast work, which they didn't get with the kids as they were too strong.

You also tell by feel - tension, how they stride and length of stride says a lot (we watch like hawks at RDA to see how horses cope with heavy riders so you learn to see).

Like I said we would ride them for a period and then they were ridden by kids the rest of the year, so it wasn't a continual thing, however at our weight we wouldn't have been riding then permanently as I don't think that would have been fair. A 13.2 of similar weight carryin ability? Probably would have considered. Have certainly ridden 13.2 highlands that were adult rides cotinually an had not problems at all.

 

[pennyturner]

I think you've never ridden a small pony from this comment. You have to do sitting trot as in two point they WILL get you off in trot if they spook or misbehave as you have nothing in front of you, and rising isn't nice as the stride is so short.

Riding a small pony is much harder than riding a horse, your balance has to be better and there is much less margin of error. If you are crap, you will fall off, certainly if they have any cheekiness at all...

So true!

I can also report that said small pony has a distinct preference for sitting, as it gets the weight off his forehand, and allows him to lengthen his stride and display his blistering extended trot.

Not many people can sit his trot though - legs too short, shoulder too upright, and too damn fast...

 

[khalswitz]

So true!

I can also report that said small pony has a distinct preference for sitting, as it gets the weight off his forehand, and allows him to lengthen his stride and display his blistering extended trot.

Not many people can sit his trot though - legs too short, shoulder too upright, and too damn fast...

Yeah - it's not an easy option by a long shot, you have to be very in balance and very correct. And the sitting trot builds core muscles for sure! However people who exclusively ride horses or large ponies don't really appreciate that... my 17hh TB is MUCH more comfortable, and is much more generous of little balance blips!

 

[Darremi]

I think you've never ridden a small pony from this comment. You have to do sitting trot as in two point they WILL get you off in trot if they spook or misbehave as you have nothing in front of you, and rising isn't nice as the stride is so short.

Riding a small pony is much harder than riding a horse, your balance has to be better and there is much less margin of error. If you are crap, you will fall off, certainly if they have any cheekiness at all...

I have never ridden a pony since I became an adult because personally I think it unfair to expect them to carry me. I think the fact you do sitting trot makes it even worse.

I just couldn't live with myself putting a pony through that. Why don't you just get a bigger horse that can carry an adult with greater ease?

 

[eahotson]

Your Exmoor sounds a cracker.Also agree that adults not riding ponies does the ponies NO GOOD at all. A good well built little native can be a family alrounder and will find a home much more easily and be able to eat grass, rather than be on a starvation padock its entire life if its getting plenty of work.A smaller horse is easier to mount and dismount as well.Some fine ponies can't carry weight well but the Exmoors, Highlands, Fells etc. can.If you carry the lighter the better argument to its natural conclusion you wouldn't even put a saddle on them let alone a person whatever weight.What would happen to them then?

 

[khalswitz]

I have never ridden a pony since I became an adult because personally I think it unfair to expect them to carry me. I think the fact you do sitting trot makes it even worse.

I just couldn't live with myself putting a pony through that. Why don't you just get a bigger horse that can carry an adult with greater ease?

I take it from that you didn't read my whole other post about some breeds of ponies being bred to carry more weight on their backs than many big horses? I'm not going to bother reposting. Also saying 'a pony' in general is a very vague term, as I'm sorry but a 14-14.2hh Highland could carry more weight than a TB eventer could!

And I do own a 17hh TB.

I didn't ride the ponies all the time - however if we hadn't ridden them, they would have caused accidents - they were far too strong and fresh for the kids when coming back into work, and being RDA ponies they had to be foot perfect when back in work. Us riding them during their 'fresh' period stopped all that - and they LOVED being ridden by adults as they could relax, have a spook or a buck with no pressure to behave like there was with kids riding, and they loved their fast work.

ETA: Regarding sitting trot, if the pony is being ridden forward into the hand, engaging the hind end and lifting the back, and the rider is balanced and actively riding the trot not thumping around, then there is no problem. It's if they go hollow that you'll have problems. However we also schooled our ponies to go 'correctly', which the kids couldn't do, so they gained skills when we were riding them too.

 

[JFTDWS]

I just couldn't live with myself putting a pony through that. Why don't you just get a bigger horse that can carry an adult with greater ease?

Does that apply to all ponies? 'cos I must be incredibly cruel to enjoy bombing around, jumping and schooling (yes, always sitting trot) on my 14hhers - and I'm not even a light or short adult

Khalwitz, I love those highland-shet-hybrids!

 

[khalswitz]

Does that apply to all ponies? 'cos I must be incredibly cruel to enjoy bombing around, jumping and schooling (yes, always sitting trot) on my 14hhers - and I'm not even a light or short adult

Khalwitz, I love those highland-shet-hybrids!

They were horrendous. WAY too strong for a kid, they were great for RDA but off the lead rein they took the mick with kids... however just slightly too small for us to be comfortable riding them continually. They really suited small teenagers, but unfortunately didn't have the scope (would jump a round of 2'3 with a light teenager but that was their limit) to keep the teenagers interested. Not really a particularly useful mix... at least a full Highland is an acceptable adults pony!! (And I do love Highlands... particularly your Fergs )

 

[pennyturner]

I have 6 children. We all ride together, on a mixture of large and small ponies. The smalls are ridden mostly by children, and driven, and they go out no more than twice a week. They live out in a semi-feral herd (horsey holiday camp?), and look put-out if they're not chosen to be ridden.
I don't think they suffer, and if they did, I'd never catch them.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

Animal cruelty

 

[khalswitz]

Animal cruelty

But looks like 1st place animal cruelty so well done

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

The shetland is 10.2hh.

Dartmoor - 12.2hh

Fell - 13.2hh

None of these ponies are kids ponies!

 

[MotherOfChickens]

Your Exmoor sounds a cracker.Also agree that adults not riding ponies does the ponies NO GOOD at all. A good well built little native can be a family alrounder and will find a home much more easily and be able to eat grass, rather than be on a starvation padock its entire life if its getting plenty of work.A smaller horse is easier to mount and dismount as well.Some fine ponies can't carry weight well but the Exmoors, Highlands, Fells etc. can.If you carry the lighter the better argument to its natural conclusion you wouldn't even put a saddle on them let alone a person whatever weight.What would happen to them then?

exactly, because they are less fashionable they are worth less and because adults won't ride them, they get a reputation for not being good for kids, its a vicious circle and not good news for our native breeds. I would rather take an exmoor/icelandic/fell hacking cross country (I dont tend to do manicured tracks) as I would rather ride something that hasn't had all self preservation bred out of it and something I can hop on and off with ease.
and many ponies will tell you exactly then they aren't happy!

 

[khalswitz]

The shetland is 10.2hh.

Dartmoor - 12.2hh

Fell - 13.2hh

None of these ponies are kids ponies!

Are you quite small? You don't look overly large on either your Dartmoor or Fell, and not hugely so on the Shetland. The Fell especially looks very chunky and a great example of a short pony type being bred to carry adult weights.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

I'm 5'4". The ponies are all built like the proverbial outhouses - as wide as they are tall lol! The darty is a true bred on the moors pony and the fell was born and raised on the fells. The shetland came from yorkshire lol! But I do have a shetland from shetland and she is chunkier again!

 

[khalswitz]

I'm 5'4". The ponies are all built like the proverbial outhouses - as wide as they are tall lol! The darty is a true bred on the moors pony and the fell was born and raised on the fells. The shetland came from yorkshire lol! But I do have a shetland from shetland and she is chunkier again!

They look fab. I LOVE seeing well-schooled adult's ponies - just a different kettle of fish to a kid's pony.

 

[Gloi]

Has anyone actually met one of these ponies that has a bad back from adult riders, except for ones used in riding centres full of beginners? I used to do some endurance on my Fell and he always passed the vet after having happily done 30 miles and my current Icelandic is still raring to go at 25 having carried me since he was first broken in, including over 1000 miles last year.

 

[khalswitz]

Has anyone actually met one of these ponies that has a bad back from adult riders, except for ones used in riding centres full of beginners? I used to do some endurance on my Fell and he always passed the vet after having happily done 30 miles and my current Icelandic is still raring to go at 25 having carried me since he was first broken in, including over 1000 miles last year.

RDA and riding school ponies, yes - but I think that is as much to do with carrying beginners who are unbalanced and can't help the pony, and working lots of hours in an arena, as to do with weight.

We found the 13.2hh to 14hh Highlands could carry more weight than the 14.2-15hh cobs, and way more than the 15.3hh TB - he was for kids or lightweight adults only. You can see when they find a weight too much, and it is even easier to see with beginner or RDA riders on board.

None of the privately owned ponies ridden by adults I've met, even into old age, have had back problems. I've met far more ponies still going into old age than horses tbh!!!

 

[mudmudmud]

I used to regularly ride a 12.2hh Welsh B, I was about 8 stone and 5'4ft. There was no one else small enough or capable enough to re-back and school her.

She's never seemed to have trouble carrying me and would happily jump upto 90cm with me on with room to spare and could have easily gone higher but we didn't want to push her.

 

[babymare]

i am proud to say i was senior gymkana champ 3 years runni g at RC on daughters chunky shettie. had a blast and trust me the little ****** didnt suffer

 

[cambrica]

Has anyone actually met one of these ponies that has a bad back from adult riders, except for ones used in riding centres full of beginners? I used to do some endurance on my Fell and he always passed the vet after having happily done 30 miles and my current Icelandic is still raring to go at 25 having carried me since he was first broken in, including over 1000 miles last year.

I came back on to this thread to comment on this point exactly. Having owned a fair few M&M's over the years and known many many more, I can't actually remember any having bad backs! Unlike the TB/Warmblood types.

 

[melbiswas]

A few years ago I used to wince at the sight of an approx. 10/11 stone Mum hacking and schooling her daughter's very naughty Welsh A that they used to show. He was still quite young. I think he was about 11.2. Two homes later I heard that he was found to have back problems when they were trying to get to the bottom of his behavioural problems.

 

[Gazen]

I am 5'2" and about 9 stone. I rode my 12.2 New Forest until she was in her mid 20's with no issues. It is sad to say that there are a lot of badly schooled ponies out there *because* adults don't ride them and school them properly and get them out of bad habits they have picked up from being ridden by children who aren't strong enough for them.

 

[Patterdale]

If pony isnt complaining then i dont see the harm.

He probably won't 'complain' as they generally don't/can't.

IMO 11 stone is FAR too heavy for a 12.2 pony. Just because he CAN, doesn't mean he SHOULD.

I am 5'2 and usually 9 stone. I often ride ponies but I would consider myself too heavy for a 12.2, especially on those fine legs. At 11 stone, I'm afraid it wouldn't even enter my head.

Just my two pennarth!

 

[cobgoblin]

He probably won't 'complain' as they generally don't/can't.

IMO 11 stone is FAR too heavy for a 12.2 pony. Just because he CAN, doesn't mean he SHOULD.

I am 5'2 and usually 9 stone. I often ride ponies but I would consider myself too heavy for a 12.2, especially on those fine legs. At 11 stone, I'm afraid it wouldn't even enter my head.

Just my two pennarth!

I agree, 11st is far too heavy.

 

[Kokopelli]

I'm still shocked people think 11stone is okay for 12.3 pony with fine legs! All these photos posted are of smaller riders or chunkier ponies. It's horses for courses, I'm sure some ponies are fine to carry 11st but the OPs doesn't look the sort.

And yes I know of a few ponies with incredibly bad backs from riders who are too heavy. An example was my 12hh games pony who I had when I was a teenager had an awful back when he came to me. He had only been ridden by a 10st man as he was too mental for kids.

 

[windand rain]

I have never ridden a pony since I became an adult because personally I think it unfair to expect them to carry me. I think the fact you do sitting trot makes it even worse.

I just couldn't live with myself putting a pony through that. Why don't you just get a bigger horse that can carry an adult with greater ease?

I find that rather odd to be honest I would far rather see a heavy rider on a small stocky pony with a short back short strong flat boned legs and a barrel frame than see one on a tb or arab at 16hh with long badly conformed legs and a long back and in many cases well under weight with poverty lines
How can you tell I have been watching local showjumping today

 

[julie111]

I agree with windandrain, a short backed, stocky pony is more capable of carrying a bit of weight than a fine legged longer backed horse!