Is your horse 'good to do'? And would you compromise on manners on the ground?

Girlracer

Girlracer

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I've been dwelling on this the past couple of days as i can imagine had i been asking friends and family to help out with the care of a fire breathing dragon after i broke my ankle in May the outcome may have been some what different.

But yesterday at 50% weight bearing i went and put a headcollar on my horse and he followed me into the yard and stood dozing whilst i groomed and trimmed and hobbled round on my crutches. And it got me to thinking, having had some what 'troubled' horses on the ground before i just don't think i would compromise on it again. Everything is so much more relaxing when the half a tonne animal you're dealing with is relatively sensible.

Of course as with ridden problems things on the ground can be improved if not totally fixed, but sometimes they're just wired that way aren't they?

There's nothing i can't do with my boy, and i've had no end of comments since he went on to full livery about how well mannered, easy and friendly he is. I do a lot on the ground with him though, so perhaps that has something to do with it.

Even down to behavouir at a show, he's foot perfect, all the time an it just makes it so much more enjoyable. I suppose if he wasn't just my pet it may be different and i would compromise so long as the horse was talented, but when it's for pleasure i don't think i would.

So is it something you're willing to compromise on?
 
Girlracer said:
So is it something you're willing to compromise on?
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Absolutely not. Never, ever, ever. My daughter (now eight) comes up to the yard with me and has done all her life. I could not risk having an ill mannered idiot on the ground. i don't mind if they are slightly more quirky under saddle but must be absolutely trustworthy on the ground. There is no excuse for bad manners, just people not taking the time to instill good behaviour. (Will probably get shot down for that!)

Running off to get tin hat now!!!!
 
No Im like you and much prefer calm manners on the ground. I don't mind him being a bit more spirited when ridden but i don't do bad manners on the ground- its just unsafe especially if you become injured or even if someone else has to turn out or bring in.
My lad was typical tb to begin with when turned out he danced down and tuck off as soon as in field- he is much better if not near perfect now tho after lots of ground work.
However at shows on the ground he can still be a bolshy ass so he gets a good verbal tellin off so he behaves himself!
 
One of mine is perfect, he's the sort of horse I can ask anyone to look after or do and know they will be fine. Dentists and vets etc comment on his manners and how easy he is.
The other is lovely as long as everythings going his way- On days its not he's really almost not worth even trying to deal with. Its an absolute pain in the back side.
Things you take for granted with an easy horse- going away for a week or even just a weekend Im now too scared to leave him with anyone "just in case"
Its a real hassle and certainly something id bear in mind if choosing another horse in the future (that said obviously I chose this one just viewed him on a good day!)
 
Seeing the above comms! I have tried to teach manners, and 99% of the time he's ok with me but when he's stressed everything he's ever been taught go's out the window.
 
Manners on the ground are far more importAnt to me than ridden manners - having dealt with a few bargy horses in the past I would never choose take one on again. My current mare is an angel to deal with ( apart from the odd marish ears back) and my mum's new gent is exactly that, a gent.
 
no, no compromise on ground manners (or ridden tbh) after a certain age and level of handling. My last horse was hot when ridden but on the ground my novice OH could do anything with him as could my mobility impaired step kids. Both my ponies are good on the ground as well. I'm a happy hacker/leisure rider and keep them at home, I don't need the grief of something thats a git on the ground.
 
I can't bear rude horses :eek::eek:

My cob was really bolshy as a baby baby but now she's got real respect for anyone on the ground, sometimes she has to be reminded but its rare. The welsh D is 3 and he has good manors too.
 
I wouldn't compromise on manners, my horse is handled by my dad who is 76.

I don't trust kids around her though, it's not her it's the kids.
 
No it's never something I compromise on. I expect all of my horses (including my very young foals) to stand quietly when I do whatever with them, I don't expect them to barge or be unmannerly and I do expect them to do what I ask of them. And they do, maybe not in the very early days of them coming here but within a month or so, absolutely I expect it every time!

I do sometimes think many of todays horse people undersell their horses and because they don't expect this or that from them they are just accepting of how the horse is and allow bad behaviour because they don't think they can change it as they don't have the knowledge/experience to change the pattern. I have all types of horses here, many with huge personalities and I can get a tune out of any of them because I'm very clear and concise about what I am asking, and as they are horses, they are generally very compliant. People should forget about negativities "ooh my horse won't do that" or "you're so lucky your horse is like that, mine isn't" ... it's all bologne if you ask me. Every horse can be shown the light! :) It's the handlers who seem to have the problem; a horse is just a horse.
 
hmmm, no I'm not keen on horses that are difficult to handle, but I have met and owned horses that I would describe as 'very good to do but...'

I have met a handful of horses that were funny with people that they didn't know or didn't like. One of the most chronic biters I have ever met would try and rip the face off someone he didn't know or didn't like who went in his stable or tried to put a rug on him. In the first two weeks I was working with him he had one of my finger nails off because I wasn't quite quick enough getting my hand out of the way. However, once he decided you were alright he was very good to do - he would stand calmly tied up for hours while you plaited him, groomed him, tacked him up, bathed him; he picked his feet up for you on a voice command; he would load himself into a lorry; and he wasn't at all bargy. I certainly wouldn't have objected to owning him.

I have also met a lot of horses that are good to do but require 'management'. They relied a lot on their routines and would become very stressy and difficult if you upset the system, but they were very good to handle as long as they were carefully managed. I would rather not own a horse like that anymore because I need a horse to be fairly flexible to my lifestyle and working arrangements, but when I was working with horses I certainly didn't mind them at all.

Horses for courses I suppose :)
 
Ned is not 100% on the ground, but he's getting better :)
So long as I can see improvement, then yes, I guess you can say I 'put up' with it. I don't let him do things, but he can be tricky. Little by little, I'm working to get myself a Neddy I can be comfortable with anyone handling :)
 
Nah said:
Ned is not 100% on the ground, but he's getting better :)
So long as I can see improvement, then yes, I guess you can say I 'put up' with it. I don't let him do things, but he can be tricky. Little by little, I'm working to get myself a Neddy I can be comfortable with anyone handling :)
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:) and this is another good point. Everyone has different ideas of what good manners actually are (leaving aside vet/farrier procedures)-so if you take on an older horse, its probably just behaving in a way that previous owners didn't mind or maybe even rewarded and they have to get used to what the new owner expects/wants.
 
Nope ! Makes life so much easier, Tess ambles slightyl behind you, really calm and cool on the ground. Young Dolly is taking after her and i would expect nothing less than fantastic :) Having recently started riding a friends TB who is seriously lacking some ground manners it has made me appreciate having something that knows the boundaries on the ground !
 
Absolutely not something id ever compromise on stable and ground manners. I can leave old ladies door open whilst I'm in the tack room, brushing up and she has never in 10 years barged out. Only thing I can't do is tie her up for too long, she pulls her self off !
 
my lad has great manners, i can ground tie him in a field, do various things to him, but if the wrong person deals with him then he is a *****.. think rear up at said people.

or if hes having a tantrum then hes more than able to throw himself around a stable and double barrel it.. yet im daft enough to walk in a stick a rug on him.. whilst telling every one not to stand in the door way due to back feet flying..

he is just a horse and it comes down to the person to blame if an incident happens.
 
I'm not so sure that it is a case of not taking time to instill good behaviour. I think some horses have some hangups that just can't be solved no matter how hard you try. Archie is fine to lead, load, shoe, worm, do his teeth, even pull his mane so has obviously had time spent on him to instill that in him, both before and since I bought him.

However, he HATES being brushed. I think he's a really ticklish horse and he gets himself in such a state. He's never aggressive, he just won't stand still, shakes all over and stamps his feet. I spent hours thinking that he needed time and 'teaching some manners' when I first had him and tried all sorts from bribery and distraction to natural horsemanship methods and clicker training but he'd get himself in such a state that everything else would go out of the window. He'd then also be grumpy and skittish to ride.

I soon realised it was never going to happen so I learned how to do things his way! I use a rubber mitten, only brush his tummy if I really have to (just rub my hands over it to loosen any dirt) and do his ears last and very, very quietly. It may take a little bit longer (especially as he's grey and loves the mud:rolleyes:) but we get there doing things his way and it means he stays calm for being ridden. Everybody who deals with him knows what he's like and how to handle him so I don't worry about leaving him with people who know him.
 
I love having a quiet mannered horse now, my previous horse who I still have, was a nightmare in any stressful situations, I don't think it's something that could be trained out if him, it could maybe be dampened down but that's it.
 
It really depends on what you consider the line in manners that you wouldn't have crossed.
2 of mine have impeccable manners by anyone's measure, perfect to deal with & handle by anyone.
The 3rd is a work in progress but I've reached a level now where I'm happy even though its far from perfect. This horse came to me with several habits that were dangerous. He would rear & box out at you when you went to catch him, leading he would whip around & bog off, he also had no comprehension of personal space & would just walk 'through' you if you were in the way.
The rearing has gone as has the whipping round, in fact I would say now that he is safe to handle. He can still be a bit forgetful about respecting space & requires patience for the farrier but like I said he's a work in progress :)
 
Mine is one those good to do most of the time. 9 times out of 10 he is good to do & anyone could handle him. That 1 time out of 10 I do label him as 'dangerous' because he WILL kick in your direction & you have to be very aware not to let yourself get into this position. He is misleading because he is so good the majority of the time people get lulled into a false sense of security & have a real shock when he has 'one of those days' Nowadays if he's in that kind of mood I don't even bother getting him out of the field, it's not worth the arguments, most of it is he either gets cross/indignant about something or stressed/worried, both result in the same behaviour from him, ignoring it is the only way forward, he'll be fine the next day & at 17 he's not going to change, it's just who he is & I am very careful to tell anyone who may come into contact with him what he is like.
Potential new horse is only young (4) & as current owner put it - nicer to be on top of riding than handling at the moment! Very in your face, nippy, fidgety. Never nasty or unsafe tho but he will be doing an awful lot of groundwork if/when he reaches me that's for sure!
 
No no way!! All my horses have learnt to be very well mannered'

I so hate it when novice owners say 'oh he was badly treated'. Arghhj NO he wasn't he is a thug and you let him get away with it

Don't get me wrong I don't mind at all the novice owner who learns and does something about it.
 
Most of the horses I've bought have been ignorant pigs, it doesn't take long to sort them out tho. I am a dog trainer and I see and sort the smallest indiscretion before it escalates, with my dogs and horses.
 
I wouldn't compromise on a horse that has bad manners on the ground (rearing, kicking, dragging, biting etc), it wouldn't be enjoyable with something that was potentially dangrous to handle.

My mare is a complete angel to handle and yet I have had a friend come up and say how rude my mare is just because she will seek an eye contact with you and will hold her nose to your face.

She doesn't nudge or anything she just likes to have her nose blowed on and kissed, so holds her nose up to your face and waits.

I think it depends entirely on what people consider rude. As to whether I would compromise on it.

Neburu
 
I have no choice I have a Spanish that is dangerous to handle hes quick and sharp and in the wrong hands lethal hes had a bad past. He better than he was but hes always going to be untrustworthy but what else can I do sell him and let someone else get hurt Pts young horse when ridden is good I just keep my wits about me and only have people with lots of experience handle him.
 
soulfull said:
I so hate it when novice owners say 'oh he was badly treated'. Arghhj NO he wasn't he is a thug and you let him get away with it
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But what if they actually were? I've always known Ned was abused, but I've only just recently found out the horrors he endured. Which is why I say I do put up with it to an extent. He's an older horse, who's never learnt proper manners. His manners are actually very good considering, though I will never stop trying to make him better until I think he's 100% though.
He will stand while I fling a rug on him, he'll put up with me brushing and fussing him and picking his fronts out and I can do anything around him when he's eating. The only things he's bad with now is standing 100% still and being tacked up. The worst he does is fidget back and forth. The only thing he's REALLY bad at is having his hinds picked up, it's one of the only things we haven't got over, but can check they don't have stones etc in when he's relaxing.

Just realised that sounded like I was having a go - I wasn't, I promise!
 
Nah said:
But what if they actually were? I've always known Ned was abused, but I've only just recently found out the horrors he endured. Which is why I say I do put up with it to an extent. He's an older horse, who's never learnt proper manners. His manners are actually very good considering, though I will never stop trying to make him better until I think he's 100% though.
He will stand while I fling a rug on him, he'll put up with me brushing and fussing him and picking his fronts out and I can do anything around him when he's eating. The only things he's bad with now is standing 100% still and being tacked up. The worst he does is fidget back and forth. The only thing he's REALLY bad at is having his hinds picked up, it's one of the only things we haven't got over, but can check they don't have stones etc in when he's relaxing.

Just realised that sounded like I was having a go - I wasn't, I promise!
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We have a few come from racing yards and they are gits, and my last coloured was beaten about a lot, but IMO it shouldn't be an excuse or a let up.

None of ours are flip-flop-safe, they don't amble behind me and if I am half asleep I will pay for it at some point during the morning, but they are all sensible and well mannered. Everything has to be done at a purposeful pace for them, they will stand but when they are on the move it is not four paces behind me on a lead rope, and when the latest arrived he was very very sharp, he has mellowed to life as a "pet" but still sees the need for things to be done in a purposeful way.

I like things like that though, never allows me the room to become complacent with them.
 
if you look through some of my old posts from nearly 5yrs ago you will see what sort of horse I used to own. He is now a million percent better. He is safe to lead, safe to go in the stable with,safe to handle on the ground and safe to ride. However in his case we think he had a combination of abuse and also of people that were scared to handle him. He is still distrusting of men and if they are too hard he will attack rather than get himself hurt but on the whole he is brilliant around everyone and now has learnt that most people are nice and have no intentions to hurt him. He no longer pulls faces let alone bite or kick which he did when i first had him. People who have known him a long time can't believe it is the same horse that I brought. He has gone from being the horse nobody wanted to go near to the horse that people fall in love with.
 
I've always thought it perhaps the next most important thing after sound and healthy, and good at, and enthusiastic, about its job. So not all that important, but saying that I always pick horses with sensitive, more towards nervous than cocky, personalities. I don't click with pushy sorts that need bossing, riding wise or on the ground, so I supposed its all interlinked and comes down to having the right horse to work with overall.
 
LOL Puss, I'm old and (relatively) sensible now so I'll have to say no thanks. ;) Just read your other post, your horse sounds like he's got plenty going for him, send him to a pro to sell for you! :)
 
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