Kauto doing dressage

As much as I respect Paul Nicholls as a trainer, who wouldnt, I do find that he comes across as arrogant and lacking in humility. I have no idea what is best for Kauto Star as I have not been involved with him other than seeing him on the racecourse. What does strike me however is this is a very unpleasant falling out between an owner and trainer that has become public knowledge and has soured for me a wonderful partnership between the trainer, owner and KS. I can not imagine this scenario ever happening at the yard of Nicky Henderson........the gentleman. Whatever the outcome I wish KS the most successful new career.
 
You make a couple of interesting points justabob


You're quite right, none have us have been personally involved with the horse. Paul Nicholls and his team have looked after him for 8 years though

I'm sure feelings are running high as Kauto Star is obviosuly very special to a lot of people. Tweeted an hour ago by PN

"Lots of reaction re K Star but i am very happy that he is going to a great home to be looked after by top people. He will be fine."


And if you think this doesn't happen at other yards, you've not been around racing!! Trainers and owners will always disagree but we're talking about a horse of legendary status and we live in a digital age - hence this falling out is a little public!
 
No axes to grind for either owner or ex trainer but really don't see why KS should not have a crack at another career. No one is expecting him to be at Rio ridden by Carl Hester but equally, good training and he should be able to step up the grades. Proper training will also help the horse from a gymnastic perspective as well. Think the slight pop and suggestion that either Laura Collett or Yogi Bresner would not do the best for the horse is unfair as well. KS is a well loved horse. The public will be keen to see what he does next. I for one, was more interested as why he is going down the dressage route and not say, teamchasing and hunting like Denman. And if CS really felt KS was a good dressage prospect, I would suggest he would have sent the horse to a dressage and not eventing person.

So, good luck with KS. I look forward to seeing how he goes in his new career.
 
What I don't get is why everyone has a go about racehorses not getting a second chance at a career and end up shunted from pillar to post because their racing owner only cares about winning and then one is sent by his owner to a top class yard, top class rider, world class trainer and everyone is up in arms saying that he should never have left the racing yard! Twitter has gone wild and I do agree that some of the things that have been said by Niccols and his staff on their really should have been kept private.

Either which way the horse is getting a well deserved second chance in the best possible way.
 
As an owner of an exracer who was neither successful nor had a long career like Kauto Star, I would consider a win in a walk and trot dressage test as an amazing thing and a successful transition!

My exracer had an automatic adrenaline response to being around groups of horses, had no idea what his feet were doing, couldn't bend, couldn't concentrate. I would definitely consider it a success to go in and do a quiet, obedient test in a completely different field to what he was trained in. If I even got around any test without a nap, spook or messing I'd be happy!
 
paddi22 said:
As an owner of an exracer who was neither successful nor had a long career like Kauto Star, I would consider a win in a walk and trot dressage test as an amazing thing and a successful transition!

My exracer had an automatic adrenaline response to being around groups of horses, had no idea what his feet were doing, couldn't bend, couldn't concentrate. I would definitely consider it a success to go in and do a quiet, obedient test in a completely different field to what he was trained in. If I even got around any test without a nap, spook or messing I'd be happy!
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Exactly paddi. Even more so when they have been racing 8 or 9 years, the transition to cope with another discipline is a huge achievement, be it a walk and trot. Mine retired at 12 and has his mind set on staying a racehorse!!
 
Double_choc_lab said:
It does make me laugh when Clive Smith says that others such as Neptune have made a successful transition into dressage FGS he's won an unaffiliated walk and trot test - WOW.
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So what if the horse is cared for and happy and relaxed with life who cares if it's at a low level .
At least they have an owner enaged with providing them with a comfortable and happy second life.
I don't think it's a given that not racing and living on a training yard is necessarily the best retirement option for any horse even if it's the yard he's knows .
KS has not exactly been advertised FOC to any numpty who wants him I think YB and LC can more than manage to handle this.
 
Dangerous thing is Twitter. Things typed in the heat of the moment. No doubt Team Dicheat are feeling raw & sensitive but sometimes saying nothing is the best policy & in this instance a little reflection time would have been most appropriate. Because its certain now that Kauto will never return to Dicheat soon or in the distant future when real retirement beckons and I find that the saddest thing. Whether he's right for dressage or any other non-racing career only time will tell but give Clive Smith credit for at least seeking out advice from one of the very best in the business. I wish the old warrior well & look forward to hearing how he goes.
 
Dreadful decision. Kauto Star owes nobody anything least of all his owner!
Is he seeking yet more accolades for himself?
Kauto should have stayed at Nicholls's yard with the people that love him and know him best of all!
He would have had a job to do there and retirement could have happened gradually even if he was not racing on the track.
He is one of the best chasers we have seen for a few years and he should have been treated as such!
 
Fantasy_World said:
Dreadful decision. Kauto Star owes nobody anything least of all his owner!
Is he seeking yet more accolades for himself?
Kauto should have stayed at Nicholls's yard with the people that love him and know him best of all!
He would have had a job to do there and retirement could have happened gradually even if he was not racing on the track.
He is one of the best chasers we have seen for a few years and he should have been treated as such!
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How on earth has he been badly treated ?
 
justabob said:
Crikey! they all have to start from the beginning. How mean spirited of you. :mad:
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I wish Neptunes all the best - he was a favourite of mine having seen him win first time for PN. I was stating that Clive Smith seemed to be talking about a new "career" and was really emphasising dressage and there is a whole world of dressage between walk and trot and high class BD. I wouldn't image Laura Collett would start out at the lowly levels in which some of us mere mortals compete. I just think that Clive Smith was somewhat over emphasising the level that Neptune had reached.
 
christine48 said:
Maybe they are considering an eventing career for him. I'm sure he'll receive the best of care in Laura' s yard.
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I think it's much more likely that they have just sent him to some very experianced people who can assess how the horse will take to a different type of work with an amazing trainer and rider he's not at at lot of risk is he.
This all very sad, professional stable staff taking to twitter and the like , not good ,undignified.
 
Isn't Yogi setting up as a retrainer of racehorses, as an aside? He surely wouldn't rush this decision, knowing if it goes tits up there'll be a lot of people saying "I told you so"...

In terms of injuries, our ex-racer came out of racing with some pretty serious problems. He's fit and healthy and eventing at BE100, looking to move up to Novice now. He's 12, and absolutely loves his new career. I think the idea that KS has done one job and now he can't do another is a bit short-sighted really... He's not exactly old, and I think he might enjoy the attention. He seems a bit similar in temperament to Reg, who is thriving on his second career.
 
Double_choc_lab said:
I wish Neptunes all the best - he was a favourite of mine having seen him win first time for PN. I was stating that Clive Smith seemed to be talking about a new "career" and was really emphasising dressage and there is a whole world of dressage between walk and trot and high class BD. I wouldn't image Laura Collett would start out at the lowly levels in which some of us mere mortals compete. I just think that Clive Smith was somewhat over emphasising the level that Neptune had reached.
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Sorry Double_choc_lab. My reply was harsh. These ex-racehorses are never going to be Grand Prix horses, they have had their career and anything else is a bonus. Perhaps Clive Smith does not know much about dressage. :)
 
justabob said:
Sorry Double_choc_lab. My reply was harsh. These ex-racehorses are never going to be Grand Prix horses, they have had their career and anything else is a bonus. Perhaps Clive Smith does not know much about dressage. :)
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Has anyone said that he's aimed at GP ?
No .
 
I look forward to hearing about Kauto's retraining. I don't think it will be helped if he has to make appearances at Sandown, Kempton etc! My ex racer at 10 is starting to become more acclimatised to the world of dressage but think he could revert quickly if I returned him to the racetrack!
 
justabob said:
No, and neither was I. Are you queen of this forum?
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What on earth does that comment mean if KS's owner or the owner of any horse what's them to be retrained to to do any job that their buisness I can't think of anyone in world more suited to oversee this than YB
I can comment on any post I like if you have a problem with it that your problem not mine.
 
The Nicholls yard have kept the horse sound and healthy for 8 seasons which speaks volumes for their general horse management. They know what they are talking about with the horse and only have his best interests at heart and I fear for him now.
 
Quatrefoil said:
The Nicholls yard have kept the horse sound and healthy for 8 seasons which speaks volumes for their general horse management. They know what they are talking about with the horse and only have his best interests at heart and I fear for him now.
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You fear for a horse who is at one of the topyards, under expert supervision from top trainers who understand both eventing/ dressage and racing (as I understand she has regular lessons with him) with one of the UKs best riders?

Blimey.
 
I can't believe that someone fears for Kauto when he has gone to a highly professional yard with a world class trainer! Would you rather he got bumped on to some random? Or go Point To Pointing with some random amature jockey? Or stand around in a field bored out of his skull?

There will be so much pressure on Laura and Yogi because Kauto isn't just any old exracer and they will be minutely scrutinized so they will be going OTT in his care I expect!
 
Quatrefoil said:
The Nicholls yard have kept the horse sound and healthy for 8 seasons which speaks volumes for their general horse management. They know what they are talking about with the horse and only have his best interests at heart and I fear for him now.
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Yes the Nicholls yard have did an excellent job keeping him sound and fit, that was what they were comissioned to do in his racing career, but IMO looking at him,he is a horse who neeeds a less stressful job now, and i think it would be wrong to deny a horse who obviously needs a job, the chance of another career, albeit at a much lower level
To assume no other experienced team of skilled professionals can work with this horse is very blinkered and to imply the owners dont also have his best interests at heart is wrong.
 
marychristmas said:
Yes the Nicholls yard have did an excellent job keeping him sound and fit, that was what they were comissioned to do in his racing career, but IMO looking at him,he is a horse who neeeds a less stressful job now, and i think it would be wrong to deny a horse who obviously needs a job, the chance of another career, albeit at a much lower level
To assume no other experienced team of skilled professionals can work with this horse is very blinkered and to imply the owners dont also have his best interests at heart is wrong.
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Agree agree agree!. At 11 he still has a long life ahead of him and why not see what else he can turn his hooves to? Actually think Laura Collett is coming quite well out of this as she has not been seen to be involved in any of the spats going on. And actually as a top class eventer, is an excellent person to assess and retrain a top class racehorse.
 
marychristmas said:
Yes the Nicholls yard have did an excellent job keeping him sound and fit, that was what they were comissioned to do in his racing career, but IMO looking at him,he is a horse who neeeds a less stressful job now, and i think it would be wrong to deny a horse who obviously needs a job, the chance of another career, albeit at a much lower level
To assume no other experienced team of skilled professionals can work with this horse is very blinkered and to imply the owners dont also have his best interests at heart is wrong.
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I absolutely agree :) I also think that yet again 'twittering' is doing no one any favours :eek: I am really looking forward to reading of his progress.
 
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