Kauto Star to dressage star?

CS owns the horse, he can do as he likes.

I can imagine the uproar on here if a poster came on saying that other people were telling them what they can/should do with their horse.

Nobody else's business.

I can sympathise with PN in as much as he knows the horse and none of us think anyone else can look after our equines better than we can.
 
Well the only thing I can be sure of is that Laura Collett has handled the outrage quite gracefully and not become involved in any of the spats. She has thanked PN for how well KS was and how well he feels. I wondered about sending him to an event rider for dressage but then thought that as an eventer, she probably has more exposure and experience of reschooling ex racers. Just my thoughts. Either way, I very much look forward to seeing how he progresses and think its great that he will still be shining in the public eye.

I don't care for the dismissive comments about dressage riders either. As correctly stated, you can find good and bad in every discipline. In this instance, I think you would be very very hard pressed to find a bad word against LC (and I neither have any connections or know her!)
 
Clodagh said:
I met Red Rum when he came to my Grandpa's 60th Birthday Party, I know it sounds a bit humiliating but he loved it and looked very happy. He came in to the function hall and walked around, graciously allowing people to talk to him. He knew he was a super star, like i'm sure Kauto does.
(I don't think Rummie ever opened supermarkets? Could be worng).
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Maybe not a supermarket but he opened a betting shop in Potters Bar once!

I am sure he will be looked after, whatever his next role in life is.

xxx
 
Miss L Toe said:
I can provide video evidence if you want, taken from videos of top dressage people demonstrating their schooling of young horses. Not u-tube clips when no one islooking.
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That doesn't really prove anything. Because for every video you show me of a dressage horse that's never turned out, I can show you one of horses that are:rolleyes:

For every video you show me of Rollkur or the like, I can show you one where this practice is not being used.

For every video you show me of 'aggressive' schooling methods, I can show you one where the horse and rider are beautifully and softly in harmony.

As for submission...........
 
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Cooperfam said:
I'm pretty sure that when it was announced that KS was retiring, there was some news footage about him going to stud and the usual remarks about "nice work if you can get it!" as a stallion.

Was due to make something like £15m in stud fees. Maybe he fires blanks of not up to standard.
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KS has never been destined for stud. He's a gelding ;)
 
FfionWinnie said:
Miss L Toe I am not bothering to reply to you because you are just rude and unnecessary.



Yes I agree it would be common courtesy to inform the trainer properly but I'm afraid if anyone really cared for the horse there would be no need to insist he was sent to the new yard with a moment's notice. Sounds like tit for tat and a long standing communication problem.

My point was why would the trainer mind the horse being a dressage horse, where is the harm in a new career.
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The trainer doesn't mind the horse going to do dressage at all, from what I understand.

As for asking for arrangements to be made to have the horse removed asap. Again I can understand this. The horse was not being shipped off to some back street yard, but a 7 star establishment (just like Nicholls). Sometimes when relationships break down it's better to move on as quickly as possible.
 
FinalFurlong said:
but laura collet? no offence shes a great rider but why not a pure dressage rider? i
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To be honest, I don't think a pure dressage rider would get on him.

He's sharp, and known to dump his riders. I think an event rider would have more chance of staying in the plate than a pure dressage rider.
 
I am trying to work out the motivation of the owner in this situation, because he must know that the horse is unlikely to ever achieve a high level of success in either eventing or dressage.

Does anyone else think that he may be using his money to place KS in a very public situation for retraining and competing at the lower levels, in order to highlight the usefulness of failed racehorses as ordinary riding horses? Is he actually trying to improve the lot of failed racehorses as well as providing KS with a more stimulating life than being a PR tool and the racing stable nag?
 
cptrayes said:
I am trying to work out the motivation of the owner in this situation, because he must know that the horse is unlikely to ever achieve a high level of success in either eventing or dressage.

Does anyone else think that he may be using his money to place KS in a very public situation for retraining and competing at the lower levels, in order to highlight the usefulness of failed racehorses as ordinary riding horses? Is he actually trying to improve the lot of failed racehorses as well as providing KS with a more stimulating life than being a PR tool and the racing stable nag?
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I thought that. But I also wondered if he was trying to increase the popularity of eventing by introducing a horse very well known to the public? Though he would have no vested interest in this of course.
 
As I said in News, I just feel very sad for the horse to be relegated to trotting around a school each day. What a dismal boring life for a horse used to the bright lights.

As to why LC, well she is pretty low profile so won't be such a disappointment if he fails to make it, after all, he's not the best mover in the world and has got a cheeky disposition, I can't see him enjoying his new life at all.
 
I have to say I do feel sorry for these ex chasers going into dressage. How terribly dull for them after all that galloping and jumping.

I hope Kauto does get to go eventing - much more fun for him (I know, I know we can't assume they find any of it fun really but you get my gist!).
 
Maesfen said:
As I said in News, I just feel very sad for the horse to be relegated to trotting around a school each day. What a dismal boring life for a horse used to the bright lights.

As to why LC, well she is pretty low profile so won't be such a disappointment if he fails to make it, after all, he's not the best mover in the world and has got a cheeky disposition, I can't see him enjoying his new life at all.
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Really? Just . . . really?

P
 
Maesfen said:
Yes, really.
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So you really do believe that all there is to training a dressage horse is trotting around a school every day? You also believe that Laura Collett is quite "low profile?" Team and Individual Gold for Young Rider Europeans in 2009 and Team Gold for Young Rider Europeans in 2010 . . . I'd say she was quite accomplished.

He may not be the best mover, but he hasn't been schooled in dressage yet, so we don't know what he can achieve with the right (sympathetic) training. If you listen to a lot of the top eventers, they will tell you that some of their best horses should (conformationally speaking) never have made it to the top - training/schooling a horse has as much to do with working with the animal's brain as it has to do with working with its body.

As for KS being cheeky and sharp - I would image that a decent event rider like LC will be more than capable of dealing with him.

P
 
Maesfen said:
As I said in News, I just feel very sad for the horse to be relegated to trotting around a school each day. What a dismal boring life for a horse used to the bright lights.

......... I can't see him enjoying his new life at all.
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I don't agree with you that "just trotting around a school each day" is how he will spend his life with Laura.

I don't agree with you that the life of the Stables babysitter would be interesting for him, having to watch other horses be transported off to do what he used to do.
 
I don't think taking a very talented jump racer eventing would necessarily be the brightest of ideas: crosscountry nowadays is extremely technical with endless "questions" involving sudden turns, narrow fences, lots of reductions in pace, very different to the full-on gallop-and-fly style of riding.
 
Oh dear god. I hope LC doesn't get to read any of this!. All it shows is just how incredibly narrow minded some people are. And how LAZY!!! before dismissing 'low profile riders" and "trotting around in circles" why not bother to try a little bit of internet searching?. Tell you what, why not make it really contentious. Where are all the people who hate racing horses at all, who want to see the Grand National banned etc etc.?

The horse is only 11! he has retired fit and well (now no one seems to be able to dispute that). Lets see how he progresses and wish both him and all associated with him every success. And lets stop second guessing the owners reasons. So what. We don't know, and it is his business.

and would rather STRONGLY suggest that a top level event rider is MORE than capable of dealing with a sharp out of racing TB. Where on earth do some of you guys think a lot of these type of horses end up? successfully? or are jockeys the only ones who can understand, manage and ride them. And no event rider is going to take an ex racer immediately around a 4* course. This might come as a massive surprise to some but these top 4* horses have taken a long time to get to that level, had years of training and have had to demonstrate the ability to keep going at that level. Neither can they run until they are qualified (unlike some of the bigger NH races I could mention) ..
 
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Cortez said:
I don't think taking a very talented jump racer eventing would necessarily be the brightest of ideas: crosscountry nowadays is extremely technical with endless "questions" involving sudden turns, narrow fences, lots of reductions in pace, very different to the full-on gallop-and-fly style of riding.
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It's taken 3 years of hard work of my sister to get her massively less talented ex-racer (NH horse) to be the XC god he is. His ability to think 'on the fly' is amazing, but it took him a while to get the new way of going...

Just a thought, really hope he doesn't start doing the RoR showing :eek: How could you beat him?! "So that was x, he's raced 23 times and won £10k, behind him we have Kauto Star...".
 
Personally I don't think his trainer or groom has any claim over his retirement, & it is wrong to try & pressurise CB by saying what he thinks should happen to the horse in public. KS is not his horse. His groom obviously does adore him (& was fantastic to see him ride him couple of weekends ago), but he was employed to care for him (& other equestrian disciplines can show as much care & attention to their charges). CB has paid all those years for the best care, but as he said Ditcheat is a long way from him & he wants him closer. KS is his horse, not the trainers, the grooms or the publics. He has always shown to be a great owner, caring for his injured racers when careers are over. Maybe he just doesn't want to risk KS over jumps anymore. He is being placed in a top yard, with a great rider. He will be pampered & stimulated (although not a dressage fan not for one moment do I believe he will trot round in circles all day). If PN had an issues he felt would affect KS's health/well being, then he should pass on the information & step back. Whatever CB decides to do, he should be left in peace to do so, because there is no doubt any decision will have KS best interests at heart.
 
cptrayes said:
I am trying to work out the motivation of the owner in this situation, because he must know that the horse is unlikely to ever achieve a high level of success in either eventing or dressage.

Does anyone else think that he may be using his money to place KS in a very public situation for retraining and competing at the lower levels, in order to highlight the usefulness of failed racehorses as ordinary riding horses? Is he actually trying to improve the lot of failed racehorses as well as providing KS with a more stimulating life than being a PR tool and the racing stable nag?
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I suspect that is exactly the plan. I suspect that if all goes well he will have lots of outings to RoR things and personal appearences - maybe a slot at HOYS/Olympia/etc doing a lowish level dressage to music. Raising the profile of retrained racehorses and dressage at the same time.

I think the reports suggest that the racing yard have been very unprofessional and contrary to their claims do not have the horse's best interests at heart, otherwise they would have kept quiet and worked with the owner and new trainer for a seamless well managed move rather than starting arguements on twitter.
 
Interested to read this thread as was somewhat taken aback by the Twitter backlash yesterday (although humoured by the people saying he looked 'lonely' and 'sad') and would prefer that those shouting about how cruel it is would take more of an interest in the hundreds of racers who leave the track for whatever reason without such a secure future. Personally, I think he is too young to be pensioned off nannying youngsters and do you seriously think he cares about 'bright lights' and how many people take his photo?!

I think it's great for a young fit ex-racehorse to get a chance at a 2nd career and if it raises awareness that racehorses can be retrained then even better. I'd say going to a talented young event rider is a perfect way to handle that transition for reasons already stated. And as for dressage being all about trotting round in circles all day well that did make me laugh. The discipline requires quick response, focus, concentration, strength and agility. Intelligent fit horses need something to occupy body and mind, not to be a trophy wife for the next 20 years.
 
I think it's terrible....my 4 ex racehorses never got this kind of back lash...they are obviously just as famous :p

In seriousness (is that a word?) I think it's an amazing opportunity for all and I wish them all the best! Think it's slightly pathetic little tantrums from people who don't even have a clue about re training racehorses or dressage, if you are reading this CS can I have master minded....pleaaaasssse! He will be loved and dressed in pink!!!
 
KristmasKat said:
I suspect that is exactly the plan. I suspect that if all goes well he will have lots of outings to RoR things and personal appearences - maybe a slot at HOYS/Olympia/etc doing a lowish level dressage to music. Raising the profile of retrained racehorses and dressage at the same time.

I think the reports suggest that the racing yard have been very unprofessional and contrary to their claims do not have the horse's best interests at heart, otherwise they would have kept quiet and worked with the owner and new trainer for a seamless well managed move rather than starting arguements on twitter.
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Looks like we are right

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/ra...tml?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490
 
FinalFurlong said:
I can see why Nicholls was a bit annoyed with Smith, he has been in that yard for nine years and to have him taken away with less than a days notice for a horse that has given him and his staff so much who love him to pieces (more than Smith) must have been heartbreaking

I do think its great he is going to another career though, i just wish nicholls would have been given maybe a weeks or even just a few more days notice. There is no better man than Yogi to asses him and as laura collet has pointed out he will be treated with the upmost care. I think kauto will tell them if he doesn't take to dressage, if he doesnt im sure laura, yogi and clive smith will think of something else. I just think nicholls should have got more of an input as him and his staff know kauto much better than smith.

I now wonder if nicholls and smith's relationship both personal and business is completely ruined?
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This
 
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