Livery bill shock (long rant alert)

timiton said:
Rent for the stable and grazing is £100 per month - Diy price. Then extras (minus farrier and jabs) have totaled to over £800. Add it all up and picture my reaction!
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Assuming 18 weeks, that's a little over £65 pounds a week, which is on the cheap side of average for seven day part livery including care, feed, bedding and haylage.

If it was three times more than you were expecting, it's your budgeting that's at fault, as you've only accounted for the DIY cost of £100 a month. Please do your sums very carefully when you move to DIY - if the basic livery charge is £100 a month, I'd budget a minimum of £200 a month by the time you account for feed, bedding and hay - and of course all your other extras (vet, farrier, worming, insurance, etc) are on top of that. Good luck - just face up to the figures; it's the only way to be sure you can afford everything!
 
Spring Feather said:
Not true. When I arrange for the vet to come to horses not owned by me, the owners are all registered with the vet; I have it in writing every time they want the vet to come out and I just book him and handle the horse for the vets visit. Depending on the client, the vet may send their bill to them c/o me or he will send it direct to their home address. At no point am I responsible for their bill. My contract states this also for emergencies that I am never liable for the vet bill of a horse not owned by me.
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You would be liable if you arranged the vet unasked (and in your case not in writing) and not in an emergency which is what is being referred to, you arrange a vets visit without the owners knowledge then you have the arrangement with the vet and not in an emergency you are liable for the costs.
 
timiton said:
Rent for the stable and grazing is £100 per month - Diy price. Then extras (minus farrier and jabs) have totaled to over £800. Add it all up and picture my reaction!
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Ok so we are talking £400 for 4 months Stable/Grazing Rent and £400 for 4 months goods and services?

so £200 per month total?

Seems reasonable to me.

Mucking out £5 per day
Turnout/bring in £2

That's £35 per week if just mon-fri which leaves £15 per week for feed/beeding and haylage - TBH it cost me more than that DIY!
 
If its £100 per month then the rest over 4 months that's fine. If its £100 per month + £800 per month id pass out but surely not?!
 
Batgirl said:
You would be liable if you arranged the vet unasked (and in your case not in writing) and not in an emergency which is what is being referred to, you arrange a vets visit without the owners knowledge then you have the arrangement with the vet and not in an emergency you are liable for the costs.
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The OP said that her horse needed it's jabs and teeth doing so the YO arranged for them to be done. Therefore it is indeed the responsibility of the OP to pay the vet bill as she knew the YO was planning to book the vet for her horse. To say to the OP that the YO is responsible for paying the vet bill for OPs horse is not true. The OP is responsible for that bill.
 
Bearing in mind you aren't sure of haylage costs, I think its your budgeting that's the issue, not the yard. Vet & dentist very much depend on what was agreed initially. Even the supplement depends on what was agreed to start. I've worked on yards where the deal was we made all decisions. One owner gave us free rein to buy whatever tack/rugs etc we thought horse needed & stick them on his bill. Although I do agree 4mnths is too long for a bill.
 
£1200 for four months of good standard of care part livery sounds very good value. This is only £300 a month. You can't get part livery in my area for under £450.

How can this cost be three times what you expected?

Your basic rent is 400 a month, and you had services and mucking out on top.
 
horsesatemychristmasmoney said:
is that not 800x4 though? have I mis read it?
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I read it as 4 x £100 for stable and field then £800 for all the extras so £1200 for 4 months.

If you have had services/full cover monday - friday then £300 a month is quite cheap.

We pay £8 per day for full cover so that is about £160 per month just for that. (I've seen it range from £6 -£15 per day round here)

Then there's feed and hay and bedding to add.

All the people I know that are doing horses on a budget are DIY and make it work around their work/school/college. They get very quick at mucking out and doing the basics and half and hour would be plenty of time.
 
All the people I know that are doing horses on a budget are DIY and make it work around their work/school/college. They get very quick at mucking out and doing the basics and half and hour would be plenty of time.
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This.

Pay the bill and move to the DIY yard. :)
 
OP my situation is a bit different to yours but I'm wondering what size bill you was expecting? Did you know the charges for assistance and feed/bedding/hay before you went there or just the DIY charge ?

My basic costs are:
DIY livery 20 pounds per week
Haylage 25 pounds per week
Shavings 33 pounds per week
Hard feed 5 pounds per week

Assisted livery (all jobs done so I just ride/groom) 10 pounds per day so 50 pounds per 5 day week.

X17.5 weeks (4mths) is 2327.50 pounds total.
 
Spring Feather said:
The OP said that her horse needed it's jabs and teeth doing so the YO arranged for them to be done. Therefore it is indeed the responsibility of the OP to pay the vet bill as she knew the YO was planning to book the vet for her horse. To say to the OP that the YO is responsible for paying the vet bill for OPs horse is not true. The OP is responsible for that bill.
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Of course OP is responsible if she asked for it to be arranged but I would not be paying bills if you randomly arranged a visit on my behalf without my permission/request.
 
My understanding is she is saying £100 per month for stabling and field plus £800 a month for everything else excluding farrier & vet so £900 a month so £3600 for 4 months.

Ok so are you saying you are being charged £900 a month for part livery and this includes

rent for field and stables presuming group turnout, most places charge extra for individual turnout
hay, bedding and feed
services 5 days a week turnout and catch in, mucking out but presume not grooming, changing rugs, picking out feet etc?

If this is the case then you are definately paying far too much. Bearing in mind I am in the South east in a very expensive area of the UK and paying roughly £600 a month for full livery including exercise on the walker twice a day and grooming, feet picked, individual turnout etc and holding for vet farrier in addition to what you are getting for 7 days a week at a top of the range rehab yard with lovely big school. Admittedly I have a pony but who does not need much expensive hard feed perhaps compared to a big horse but still part livery for a big horse 5 days a week I would be expecting to pay about £450 a month excluding vet/farrier etc supplements etc.

I think they might be taking advantage of you, possibly because you did not ask how much things would cost before you joined the yard they presumed your family was very rich hence the reason you did not need to know the costs. In future you need to ask before you get into this situation how much everything will cost and get the bill itemised, most part livery yards have a set price for the basics and you know how much that is going to be each month and what that includes then you get charged for extra that you ask for such as holding for the vet/farrier grooming etc but you know how much each extra will cost before you make the decision to purchase that service or not.




timiton said:
Rent for the stable and grazing is £100 per month - Diy price. Then extras (minus farrier and jabs) have totaled to over £800. Add it all up and picture my reaction!
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Batgirl said:
Of course OP is responsible if she asked for it to be arranged but I would not be paying bills if you randomly arranged a visit on my behalf without my permission/request.
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Well I would because my horse is my responsibility but I would not be happy about any YO arranging a vet to come and do anything to my horse which I had not discussed with them except in an emergency. AFAICS this is not the situation here, the OP did know the horse needed the vet attention, she just didn't know when the vet was attending by all accounts.
 
LMFAO @ batgirl's mucking out policy! Great idea but the reason I am on DIY at the moment is because I got sick of finding my horse stood in her own filth at lunchtime when she was on part livery.
 
KristmasKat said:
LMFAO @ batgirl's mucking out policy! Great idea but the reason I am on DIY at the moment is because I got sick of finding my horse stood in her own filth at lunchtime when she was on part livery.
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Don't laugh your bum off, move yards or make an effective complaint ;):rolleyes:. All horse on my yard are mucked out by 11am unless turned out and arranged in advance. Not saying everyone has to do this personal preference, I wouldn't be on a yard if this wasn't the case, or like you I would DIY.
 
Spring Feather, the OP stated that they knew the horse needed teeth and vaccinations doing, but didn't state that they would be done ;) We don't know what sort of horse owner OP is (I'm not judging you OP) and maybe they was going to leave those things this year. If so, and a YO decided to call the vet and inform horses owner after treatment was carried out, I'd view the YO as being liable for the bill in that situation.

*disclaimer - it is not my opinion that its ok to not vaccinate or rasp teeth. This post is not designed to start a debate on that*
 
I don't think she has been very clear as she says £100 a month for rent of field and stable and then £800 for extras and I though that was per month as she talks about the £100 rent as per month, and that it was very shocking how much the costs were which is why I have presumed it was £900 a month as otherwise it would not be shocking!

Batgirl said:
She is paying £300 per month to include all fees by the sounds of it, VERY reasonable if you ask me :)

£100 x4
+
£800
=
£1200 for 4 months livery.
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I'd just count myself lucky that I was only being charged £300 PCM and that YO cared enough to muck and walk out horse on weekend when left in stable all day!
 
OP -

DIY is totally do-able if you're currently doing your A levels. When I was doing my A levels I had a total of 15 hours lessons a week. Even when you add reasonable studying time (which to be fair, I didn't do) that still allows more than enough free time to look after a horse.

There's no reason that general horsey chores (feed, hay, water, muck out, turn out and bring in, change rugs) need to take more than about 45 minutes - if I am in a rush and need to get done quickly, I can get done in 20 minutes.

And if you can't go down twice a day then make an arrangement with another livery to turn out/bring in one end of the day - or pay YO to do it, which is much cheaper than part livery.
 
@batgirl not laughing at you more laughing hysterically at the very idea! Unfortunately that old chestnut of "if you don't like it leave" and the lack of alternatives means that I'm going diy. It is a push with work but it is nice to have full control and to have things as I like them. My bed not being done until after midday wouldn't be quite so bad if it was done really well........ Or if that was my only whinge.........
 
timiton said:
I skipped him out but only have 30 minutes in the mornings (to fit in with my dad) so didn't have time to completely muck out.
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Prob a good time to get up to speed would be over xmas period? :)

I also have half hour at 6am on work mornings & I have to do 2:
Feed, change rug on 1, turn out 2, put out hay in their field.
Muck out 1 & skip out other, set fair both stables, put in hay for the night, do water & make up feeds for PM & leave ready also for the next morning.
Its feasible & I usally arive as the 6am news starts (if I havent had to defrost the car 1st!) and leave again as the 6.30 news starts....
Time & motion & plenty of prep at the weekend prior all helps ;) :)

I always do all the chores in the morning (this suits me) so that after work if its cold/wet/snow I can bring in very easily, or a friend can help out if weather conditions v bad, knowing they only need to bring in & leave & i can feed later :)
 
KristmasKat said:
@batgirl not laughing at you more laughing hysterically at the very idea! Unfortunately that old chestnut of "if you don't like it leave" and the lack of alternatives means that I'm going diy. It is a push with work but it is nice to have full control and to have things as I like them. My bed not being done until after midday wouldn't be quite so bad if it was done really well........ Or if that was my only whinge.........
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Fair do's :) Sounds sucky :(
 
Might come to you for a lesson The Xmas Furry sounds impressive, I'm struggling to get below 40 mins with one at the moment.
 
I pay £320 every 4 weeks for part livery - turnout, hay,feeding, muck out, bring in, clean legs, pick feet out - for 5 days. Other 2 days all I do is muck out and haynets. This also includes ad lib haylage, feed , ad lib wood fibre bedding. I pay for extras ie, supplements, farrier etc. Experienced yard manager and grooms, post and rail fencing, mare/gelding fields with max 5 in each field. Large school, cctv, purpose built yard - 14x14 stables with mats. Turnout EVERY day.

Needless to say it is full, no vacancies! All liveries are treated with respect and only time vet would be called without our prior consent is in an emergency. However, I have been on yards where questioning livery bill - or anything - is made very difficult. If you're not happy , move. It's meant to be fun.
 
SO1 but OP says 100 pounds pcm DIY then 800 pounds total for the rest. I read it as 200 pounds extra per month x4 months, i.e. 3x pcm what OP was expecting to pay.

This would be shocking if you hadn't asked for a breakdown of charges and had been told something at viewing along the lines of 'its 100 pounds pcm DIY charge, plus hay/feed/bedding and a small charge for services'.

This is the kind of thing a YO would say at first, giving more details when asked. The charge for supplies and services *is* fairly small if its 200 pounds pcm.
A statement like that could lead someone inexperienced with horses to believe that the DIY was the biggest charge.
 
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