Livery dilemma

[PC Steele]

My horse is at a lovely livery yard, due to his age and arthritis my vet told me early in the year that he would be better living out as he needs to be able to move around. So far so good !!!! He is really happy. Problem is I am still paying for part livery at £580 a month for a field horse. At first I was more than happy as I wasn’t sure if my horse would take to being in a field 24/7. However he is happy and also I feel now he could never go back to living in a stable for 12 hrs a day as he would seize up, so if that had to happen then that would be the time to make that awful decision. Everyone needs to save at the moment and this is one glaringly obvious area that I am ‘wasting’ money. WWYD? Give up the stable?

 

[mini_b]

If I had the opportunity to find retirement livery/grass livery somewhere that I was happy with, then yes I think I would.

Are you wanting to stay at this yard with a new ridden horse? You could always turn your lad away somewhere nice, then pay a deposit to reserve your box

 

[PC Steele]

I really want to stay at the yard as my horse is 25 and is very settled. I have got my own field and he has his Shetland friend for company.

 

[be positive]

You need a sensible conversation with the YO, I have had liveries in similar situations and would change terms if I could to help, I always had a spare box for emergency use so could have a grass livery or two without it being an issue financially but if your yard has limited space it may be more tricky to accommodate you and drop the monthly cost, start by talking and see what happens.

 

[KittenInTheTree]

All of our lot live out 24/7. We still pay to have stables for them. Grass livery is great until you suddenly need a stable again.

 

[MrsMozartleto]

It can be a pain not having somewhere inside should the need arise. Is there a field shelter that can be shut off to form a stable if it were needed?

 

[MissTyc]

Nearly £600/month for grass livery is a lot!
Definitely have a chat with YO as you should hpefully be able to come to arrangement, one way or another.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

You need to speak to your YO. My old YO offered grass, grass and stable, grass, stable and facilities options. So it suited everyone. But my new yard has a flat fee for everyone. Fairly good value for people like me who use the indoor/outdoor/farm rides and my stable. But very expensive for retired horses at grass. Some choose to pay anyway but most move off. Amber is not there for that reason but at grass nearby.

 

[Widgeon]

Nearly £600/month for grass livery is a lot!
Definitely have a chat with YO as you should hpefully be able to come to arrangement, one way or another.

Yes, I'd agree with this. That's an awful lot of money for grass livery with occasional use of a box. I'd have a chat with the YO too, particularly if you're considering finding a new ridden horse.

 

[Baywonder]

Yes, I too would speak to your YO. Most yards I have been on in the past have a box for emergency use.

Just ask - you have nothing to lose and everything to gain (mainly a more healthy bank account balance!)

 

[July dreamer]

If you were on part livery I assume the yard owner/staff were doing your horse daily - turn out/muck out/bring in/rugs etc and was bedding/hay/feed included? Now he's living out, maybe they check him twice a day and give feed/hay and poo pick but that's far cheaper/quicker than having a stabled horse. Definitely should be a reduction in price but difficult if the yard owner is relying on a certain level of income. But speak to them, perhaps they’re hoping you are just happy to pay the full amount!

 

[Gingerwitch]

Does the yard offer grass livery as a standard package or are you asking for special treatment ?

 

[shamrock2021]

You should ask if the yard owner is willing to do grass livery or retirement livery at the reduced rate.

 

[SO1]

What services are they including in the part livery. For example are they including feeding him twice a day, picking out hooves, rug changes, checking him, poo picking. Hay in the field if not enough grass. If the Shetland is not your pony but belongs to the yard are they also providing you with a companion horse as well. Also if they are living out they often need more land per horse as the land has to support a horse 24/7 than if they are going only part of the day.

 

[PC Steele]

All of our lot live out 24/7. We still pay to have stables for them. Grass livery is great until you suddenly need a stable again.

Yes I see that but I think £580 a month for a field kept horse is a bit steep!!!!!

 

[Ample Prosecco]

Turn out is the limiting factor on our yard. There are stables allocated for each field. And a waiting list. So my YO has no need to drop her prices just because individual owners don't want to use their stables or any of the facilities. Which I think is fair enough really. I wish she would, so my 3 could all be together. But I wouldn't expect her to really.

 

[PC Steele]

What services are they including in the part livery. For example are they including feeding him twice a day, picking out hooves, rug changes, checking him, poo picking. Hay in the field if not enough grass. If the Shetland is not your pony but belongs to the yard are they also providing you with a companion horse as well. Also if they are living out they often need more land per horse as the land has to support a horse 24/7 than if they are going only part of the day.

The Shetland is mine. Part Livery is everything included. You only pay shoes, wormer, exercise. So my horse isn’t using any bedding, doesn’t need hay in the field etc. I’m more than prepared to pay a decent amount but I’m paying the same as someone who’s horses are going through bedding, hay, need turning out, bringing in etc. Etc.

 

[brighteyes]

Send him to Happy Horse Retirement Home in Wales.

 

[Toby_Zaphod]

One of my horses is approaching the age when we may retire him, not yet he still enjoys his work & is full of beans. He's been a horse that over the years has wanted to come in after 5-6 hours out. We've thought about it & when he is retired he'll still be at the same yard, still with the same routine because that's what he knows & that's what he wants. Just how we feel about our boys, they'll have the same routine until their days come to an end.

 

[Gingerwitch]

One of my horses is approaching the age when we may retire him, not yet he still enjoys his work & is full of beans. He's been a horse that over the years has wanted to come in after 5-6 hours out. We've thought about it & when he is retired he'll still be at the same yard, still with the same routine because that's what he knows & that's what he wants. Just how we feel about our boys, they'll have the same routine until their days come to an end.

Nothing like the pityful look of an old stable kept horse longing for a stable on a wet winter's night with old bones. Not knowing why he is now being left out after years of being in. And calling hopefully at the gate to anyone he sees.

 

[Gingerwitch]

The Shetland is mine. Part Livery is everything included. You only pay shoes, wormer, exercise. So my horse isn’t using any bedding, doesn’t need hay in the field etc. I’m more than prepared to pay a decent amount but I’m paying the same as someone who’s horses are going through bedding, hay, need turning out, bringing in etc. Etc.

Well move, why should yard owner change their business model. If I want Gucci shoes but will only wear them once would I expect a discount using the argument, I want them, it stops the shop selling at full.price because I choose not to wear them more often
Sorry this entitlement really grates and we wonder why (some ) liveries have a bad name

 

[HashRouge]

OP, is the yard otherwise full/ do you know if it has a waiting list? If you gave up the stable, would the YO have the grazing space to lease it to someone else but let you keep your field? Does the YO offer grass livery normally or is a special exception being made for you (this is my understanding)?

I think the problem you will have is that this is a livery yard rather than a grass livery facility and the YO makes their money on the services they offer and the bedding/ hay they provide. If you no longer pay for these things, the YO will be losing money, and if it is a good livery yard as you say, then surely they will have a waiting list of people who would pay full price. I imagine they'd be reluctant to let you keep the stable and pay less.

If it is feasible for you to give up the stable but keep the field, and the YO is able to get another livery in, that might be a workable solution. But you'd obviously have to be prepared for having no stable even in really bad weather. Might be ok if you have a field shelter but I'm guessing you don't? I have an elderly horse living out 24/7 (she's 27) but I do have access to a stable and bring in if the weather is awful, as she doesn't like really wet/ windy weather. I wouldn't want to give my stable up even though she's only in it every now and then. If your boy is really hardy, this might not be an issue for you as he may prefer being out even in bad weather, but it's definitely something to consider.

I do get your issue re costs - I pay just under £200 per month per horse for my grazing, stable, and services (YO checks every morning/ does rugs if needed/ and feeds some afternoons when I can't get down). I wouldn't be able to afford to pay £580! But I am not on a proper livery yard. I think you may need to either move yards, or just accept the costs. The YO may be flexible but unless I knew then really really well I'd be quite worried about asking in case it rocked the boat.

 

[ycbm]

Well move, why should yard owner change their business model. If I want Gucci shoes but will only wear them once would I expect a discount using the argument, I want them, it stops the shop selling at full.price because I choose not to wear them more often
Sorry this entitlement really grates and we wonder why (some ) liveries have a bad name

I don't think it is unreasonable to ask for a reduction of the cost price of the hay and bedding. That way, the owner loses no profit.

 

[KittenInTheTree]

Yes I see that but I think £580 a month for a field kept horse is a bit steep!!!!!

Then either discuss switching to a less expensive livery package with your current YO or up sticks and move somewhere cheaper.

Your original post asked whether you should give up your stable to save money, and that's the question that I answered: grass livery is great until it isn't. My answer was based on the horrid incident when our small companion mare came down with sepsis after being bitten by another horse, resulting in a bout of laminitis. She spent eight weeks stabled. We ended up with a second small pony to act as company for her whilst stood in. We still have him, he's a delight.

Frankly, I regard poo picking a field as equal to mucking out a stable in terms of time and energy, especially if the field is occupied 24/7. Done properly, with two animals, there's likely to be a couple of full barrows per day removed, but perhaps you are able to do this yourself, and could ask to switch to being DIY instead of Part Livery. Regardless, if this yard provides grazing so good that no additional hay is needed in the field in December, then I would expect to pay accordingly for that. Grass doesn't maintain itself.

 

[SO1]

What will you do if there is heavy snow. Will the horses not need hay in the field then.

Are you also paying the part livery rate for your Shetland field companion as well?

The Shetland is mine. Part Livery is everything included. You only pay shoes, wormer, exercise. So my horse isn’t using any bedding, doesn’t need hay in the field etc. I’m more than prepared to pay a decent amount but I’m paying the same as someone who’s horses are going through bedding, hay, need turning out, bringing in etc. Etc.

 

[WandaMare]

I wouldn t keep a horse with no access to a stable, Jan and Feb are tough months for older horses and you don’t know when they might need to come in. Lameness, illness, snow and ice...

 

[HashRouge]

I don't think it is unreasonable to ask for a reduction of the cost price of the hay and bedding. That way, the owner loses no profit.

I would imagine the owner does make slight profit on hay and bedding though. If they produce their own hay and/ or bulk buy bedding, I would imagine there is a mark up somewhere. No harm in asking of course.

 

[Gingerwitch]

I don't think it is unreasonable to ask for a reduction of the cost price of the hay and bedding. That way, the owner loses no profit.[/QUOTE
And if yard does an all in price, or someone with a 14 hh on a diet wants a discount as the don't use as much as everyone else. Where does it stop?

 

[ester]

Frankly, I regard poo picking a field as equal to mucking out a stable in terms of time and energy, especially if the field is occupied 24/7

Definitely, I'd much rather muck out than poo pick in winter.

 

[ycbm]

And if yard does an all in price, or someone with a 14 hh on a diet wants a discount as the don't use as much as everyone else. Where does it stop?

Well for me it would stop at "all or nothing". But the yard owner can always refuse, what on earth is the problem with a polite question?

Twice when I was in full livery I had a reduction for supplying my own food. Neither yard had any issue with being asked for a price reduction and giving one.